Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

A few comments on Obama's Jefferson-Jackson speech in Indiana.   One thing I liked:

He has a youth service plan.  The description was vague and I'd like to hear the details.   But I've thought for a long time we need that, so that's potentially good.

For down sides, continue reading ...

Speech starts with the claim that "we" (always "we" when he really means "I") will usher in a new way of doing things in Washington.   There is no evidence from Obama's past as a U.S. Senator or as an IL Senator, that he does things any differently than anyone who came before.   So is this a lie or just wishful thinking?  

"Some have offered" gas tax break.  Maybe this is how he manages to claim that his campaign is not negative ... because he declines to name the person he is attacking.    

He says .30/day comes to $28 for the summer.   He denigrates that as useless, thus indicating how out of touch he is with real working people, where $28 can make a difference.

"I wish i could stand here and say we could fix energy problems with a holiday.   Wish i could bring back overseas jobs.  I wish I could claim I will pass every plan and proposal outlined in my campaign.  But you've heard that in every election.  Everyone goes back to washington and does the influence peddling."  [I have to ask Obama, 'so what do you plan to do, other than complaining?' ]

"Take a chance on a new kind of politics ... it's about who we are as Americans.   Are we going to stand up and reclaim the American dream?   That will take more than one election, more than one person, more than one party." [Right.  So again, what will YOU contribute, other than being one of many guys who have run on a promise to change Washington?]

"I'm the only candidate who has proposed a middle-class tax cut."  [That is a lie.   Hillary will reduce taxes for people making less than $250k/year].

Great country, and "the only way a black guy born in HI named Barack Obama can be running for President. " [Calling attention to his own race, but lord help anyone else who mentions it].  

Tags: Indiana, Jefferson-Jackson, obama (all tags)

Comments

72 Comments

I see you are a mind reader....

by kindthoughts 2008-05-04 06:48PM | 0 recs
and my alternative is what?

somebody who caved to Repubs last 3 years in votes like AUMF, bankruptcy and what not?

Somebody who had a perfect opportunity to stand up to Bush many times and did not?

by kindthoughts 2008-05-04 07:53PM | 0 recs
correction: last 8 years.

by kindthoughts 2008-05-04 07:54PM | 0 recs
Re: I see you are a mind reader....

Could you specify what part of the post you see as "mind reading"?  I reread it after reading your comment, and maybe the last point is a little bit guilty of mind reading. Is that what you meant?

by itsthemedia 2008-05-04 08:41PM | 0 recs
Re: I see you are a mind reader....

Actually, if we win as many seats in Congress as we are slated to and if Obama is as effective in using the bully pulpit to sway public opinion towards progressive policy proposals as he is in rhetorically convincing people to vote for him, I think that many Republicans will see the writing on the wall and sing kumbaya.

by DreamsOfABlueNation 2008-05-04 11:02PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

The actual quote was "I wish I could claim I will pass every plan and proposal outlined in my campaign, ON DAY ONE."  It was clearly a not so subtle swipe at one of Hillary's campaign slogans.

Personally, I like that he uses the word "we."  Because that's what he's been about this entire campaign, that it's not him that can change government for the better, it's all of us.  It will take immense political pressure to get any healthcare proposal passed, and that means all of us calling on our congressmen to do the right thing.

by shalca 2008-05-04 06:51PM | 0 recs
Like Kings do when they say

"We shall have our dinner now" and "We shall have to cut off their heads".

This is what is known as the 'royal we'.   There is also the 'editorial we'.   In both cases, it is a device for not taking responsibility for one's actions.

by miker2008 2008-05-04 07:08PM | 0 recs
Clearly not

When kings say "we," they speak for their kingdom.

When Obama says "we," he means him and everyone else interested in working to implement change.

One is a monarch, the other is a populist.  There is a clear difference.

by Dracomicron 2008-05-04 07:16PM | 0 recs
Oh god
firstly, give me a break. secondly, I am very much interested in change- I sure as hell hope, yes hope, he is not including me in his royal we- he still hasn't told me what change other than 'not a Clinton'- I don't like to be included in 'we's' I know nothing about.
by linc 2008-05-04 07:38PM | 0 recs
I am TRing you for

comparing Obama to some uncaring a monarch.

by kindthoughts 2008-05-04 07:58PM | 0 recs
I am uprating you
because I want you to know that you shouldn't take the internets so seriously.
by linc 2008-05-04 08:04PM | 0 recs
I am upratign this one

but the other one stays. You know your comment was no good.

by kindthoughts 2008-05-04 08:05PM | 0 recs
We are not amused. ;-)

by itsthemedia 2008-05-04 09:26PM | 0 recs
Re: We are not amused. ;-)
we are very much amused.  ;-)
s.
by synth 2008-05-04 10:01PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

By the way I heard Obama is heading to NC tomorrow and Hillary Clinton is heading back there tonight , she would hold two events there tomorrow.

These were all unscheduled I gather .

Maybe NC would be closer than we all think.

By the way another rumor I am hearing is Schuler will be endorsing her in NC tomorrow.

I can't confirm it , but its the buzz I am picking up among her supporters in Tennessee.

by lori 2008-05-04 06:53PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

Nothing is listed on Obama's page for tomorrow. Fox News said both are going to NC tomorrow.

Shuler should have endorsed last week when Easley went with her. I'm not sure how much coattails Shuler has though. He's a first-term Congressman who, thankfully, defeated the execrable Charles Taylor. It's nice to know that I can look down my street, see the top of Gregory Bald in the Smokies and know that a Democrat represents the turf on the other side. We don't have that option much in East Tennessee (although you have Rep. Boucher of VA nearby).

by elrod 2008-05-04 07:09PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

Yeah , VA politicians are the best.

Mark Warner was my first choice for president , then Bayh , then Clinton.

I hope he gets into the senate , I know he will.

by lori 2008-05-04 07:16PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

He says .30/day comes to $28 for the summer.   He denigrates that as useless, thus indicating how out of touch he is with real working people, where $28 can make a difference.

This is such transparently pathetic bullshit that I can't believe you were writing it with a straight face.  Send my your address and, if you vote for Obama, I will send you $28.  

Is that what your vote is worth?

by username3 2008-05-04 06:53PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

Moreover, there are much better ways to give voters $28 - such as a tax cut, instead of rewarding those who drive more over those who drive less.

by Falsehood 2008-05-04 06:57PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

People don't believe in tax cuts. By the tax time everyone has forgotten it and taxes never seem to go down. Money off gas prices is something that people actually SEE.

And, I'd point out, that this is a point Obama should grasp, because he seems to subscribe to behavioral economics.  

It's an important reason why the $28 can have a multiplier effect.  If people feel wealthier at the pump, they may spend more elsewhere.

by He Who Must Not Be Named 2008-05-04 07:59PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

How much do you think will trickle down from the gas companies? The tax break is going to be filtered thru them, do you think they will really pass it along?

by CHoustonTX 2008-05-04 10:57PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech
Already troll-rating on your first day??
My, my, my.
Looks like you are getting trolled, too.
My, my, my.
by johnnygunn 2008-05-05 05:55PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

Haha, I'm glad you caught that. I TR'ed him because I kid you not, he's TR'ed almost every post I've made today. I forwarded his name on as well.

by zcflint05 2008-05-05 06:24PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech
Here's some mojo.
I'll try to get you more.
by johnnygunn 2008-05-05 06:31PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech
Actually, I'm going to forward your name to the moderators.
You've been here one day and have already trolled a dozen people.
Clearly, you have no interest in dialogue.
You just want to use your baseball bat.
by johnnygunn 2008-05-05 05:58PM | 0 recs
18 cents a gallon

Federal gas tax is 18 cents a gallon. Do you think American would complain if gas went up 18 cents tomorrow morning? If you answered yes then it obviously does make a difference

by Wiseprince 2008-05-04 06:59PM | 0 recs
Re: 18 cents a gallon

Again.  If your vote is worth 3 months of $0.18/gal., send me proof that you voted for Obama, and I will buy your gas.

Geez, people...

by username3 2008-05-04 07:25PM | 0 recs
Re: 18 cents a gallon

Yes, we understand that you are well-off enough not to worry about the price of gas. Also that you appear to be offering people bribes for their votes. I hope you are joking about that part, because it is illegal.

by itsthemedia 2008-05-04 09:34PM | 0 recs
Ok, you want to talk about

gas tax relief:

a) You know, right, that Obama voted for that in IL Senate.
b) Fed tax is 18.4 cents/gallon.
c) a 2001 Dakota has, what, a 40-gallon tank?
d) That's $7.36 saved per tank

People who drive one of those daily (farmer, landscaper, contractor, family chauffer) notice that.  

by miker2008 2008-05-04 07:26PM | 0 recs
a)

Yeah, he voted for it in the IL Senate, and was disappointed to find that it didn't work, and the vendors ended up raising the price to match what they knew people would pay.

A 3 month, $0.18 decrease in the price of gas, even if it makes it into the final price without OPEC or gas station interference, will not lift someone out of poverty.  It will help approximately 1/10 as much as the low-end distributions of economic stimulus package.

Obama has real plans to help people out... he's not going to settle for a quick fix that gives the oil companies more money in the long run.

And no, the windfall profit tax still isn't going to make it through Bush, even if it could pass filibuster.

by Dracomicron 2008-05-04 07:38PM | 0 recs
Hillary has not suggested a

gas tax break as a way to "lift people out of poverty".   Man, talk about misrepresenting someone's position.   How can someone have anything like a rational conversation with someone who can't even get the candidate's position straight?

by miker2008 2008-05-04 07:48PM | 0 recs
That's the point

The gas tax will have no lasting effect.  She's touting it as if it were a major issue, when it isn't.  $30 (which is a kinda generous average) will let you go out to eat or to the movies maybe once.  It isn't any improvement in people's lifestyle.  

In return she'll harvest the road repair funds just like she yanked from our military budgets in her 2.2 billion in earmarks last year.

And yes, that's the only way that her legislation will not get vetoed by Bush, if it could even get through a hostile Democratic congress.

by Dracomicron 2008-05-05 06:15AM | 0 recs
I really hate to say it, but ...

I agree with you.  :)

The gas tax relief is more symbolic than real.   Hillary's jumping on a McCain bandwagon here but to her credit she is adding the necessary feature that the cost will come out of Oil Company pockets not the Highway Fund.  

But hey, in her defense:

a) the gas tax relief is harmless.
b) the gas tax relief does not replace or invalidate her other clear and effective economic plans to help the middle class and the poor.
c) as so many Obama supporters have proven, symbolism matters.

by miker2008 2008-05-05 07:28AM | 0 recs
I don't think it's harmless

Even if she could convince Congress to pass it, it will never get past Bush while still maintaining the windfall profits tax.

The only way, barring a 2/3 majority vote (not going to happen no matter what), that the bill will be signed into law is if it is basically unfunded.

I live in Minnesota.  People here died when our bridges were ignored for decades.  We can't afford to underfund the infrastructure repair funds.  I will not budge on this one.

by Dracomicron 2008-05-05 07:53AM | 0 recs
Re: Ok, you want to talk about

Not really -- I can find the Gas-X at my local CVS.

First, that's either about 800 miles per $7.36, or you should find a more efficient vehicle.

Second, the only reason this farcical "debate" goes on is that I haven't questioned your assumption that the entire tax "vacation" is passed on at the pump.  See that I don't alter the deal.

by username3 2008-05-04 07:38PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

A friend of mine who is short of money agrees that "every little bit helps."

by christinep 2008-05-04 08:53PM | 0 recs
Sure

And I'm sure that having a broken axle from potholes in the road because there was no money in the budget to fix them will help even more.

by Dracomicron 2008-05-05 06:17AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

> Send my your address and, if you vote for Obama, I will send you $28.

You realize that vote buying is a crime, right?

by itsthemedia 2008-05-04 09:30PM | 0 recs
Send the cops to Clinton then

That's exactly what she's trying to do.

Or is it okay because she won't be able to deliver?

by Dracomicron 2008-05-05 06:17AM | 0 recs
If I thought I could get the

$28 without being deluged with hate mail, I'd take you up on your offer.  You must be one of Obama's rich West Coast supporters who can spend $28 at Peet's and not blink an eye.  

So am I, BTW, but I also speak occasionally with "the other half" who live in dirt-poor midwest and southern towns, and some of these people:

a) Drive old cars with crappy gas mileage (not Prius' like you and I).

b) Value $28.

by miker2008 2008-05-05 07:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

Obama did pass legislation with Lugar and Coburn, so that is working across party lines. I'm not sure how unprecedented it was.

The highlight was passing death penalty reform in Illinois WITH POLICE BACKING.

by Falsehood 2008-05-04 06:56PM | 0 recs
That is setting a pretty low bar. LOTS

of Senators pass bi-partisan legislation.  Ever heard of McCain-Feingold?

by miker2008 2008-05-04 07:27PM | 0 recs
Re: That is setting a pretty low bar. LOTS

Please, just let us know which version of Calvin-ball you're playing, so we can follow your rules...

by username3 2008-05-04 07:40PM | 0 recs
What's Calvin like on this? He

guy offers bi-partisan legislation as an example of Obama's promise to make sweeping changes in Washington.  Pretty pitiful.

by miker2008 2008-05-05 07:59AM | 0 recs
Ah yes

The campaign finance law that McCain has been in violation of at least once so far this season.

McCain doesn't have a lot of credibility there, especially after writing an exception into the law allowing him to use his wife's personal jet while campaigning.

Obama, on the other hand, got bipartisan support for his genetic testing law, which instituted the sorely needed guidelines for an emerging science.

by Dracomicron 2008-05-04 07:40PM | 0 recs
Re: That is setting a pretty low bar. LOTS

Which is why I said it wasn't unprecedented.

by Falsehood 2008-05-04 07:49PM | 0 recs
The "Complain" strategy

Barack Obama complains about Hillarys idea but seems to have none of his own. He says that the oil companies will just pass on the added weight to the consumer. Well, I would suppose the sae would be true about a windfall tax and anything else the government decides to do. Why do anything then, it seems like Barack is telling America that resistence is futile.

Secondly, for all the talk about bi-partisanship as a way to change America I must say this as an hoonest observation. John McCain has been at the center of most of the modern bi-partisanship agreements and he has the scars from his Republican base to prove is. McCain-Feingold, McCain-Kennedy, Gang of 14. To be fair Barack hasn't been in as long but how else should we judge his record in terms of bi-partisanship (the way his campaign has been run doesn't strike me as one who has found away around it)

by Wiseprince 2008-05-04 06:56PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech
"Some have offered" gas tax break.  Maybe this is how he manages to claim that his campaign is not negative ... because he declines to name the person he is attacking.  

I've never heard of anyone considering it negative campaigning to say how other candidates ideas differ from your own, and why he thinks they are wrong, whether he says who these people are or not. That's what he should be doing.

by Becky G 2008-05-04 07:01PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

I agree with you Becky. Criticisms of one's opponent based on actual policy issues are not negative campaigning, in my book.

by itsthemedia 2008-05-04 09:41PM | 0 recs
Well "your book" is not like that

of most Obama supporters, then.  Including Obama himself.  

He and his campaign -- along with the MSM who are in his pocket and getting thrills up their leg as a result -- have repeatedly attacked Hillary for "going negative" when he has pointed out the failings of his healthcare plan, his inexperience, and his voting record.

So which is it?  

by miker2008 2008-05-05 08:01AM | 0 recs
I hate deconstructing diaries, but here I go again

For down sides, continue reading ...

Speech starts with the claim that "we" (always "we" when he really means "I") will usher in a new way of doing things in Washington.

[Yes, he managed to give a speech without the help of a teleprompter, and thus, he misspoke. I would like to apologize on his behalf. It won't happen again]

There is no evidence from Obama's past as a U.S. Senator or as an IL Senator, that he does things any differently than anyone who came before.   So is this a lie or just wishful thinking?
[May be 1.5 million supporters might just hold him to his word?]

"Some have offered" gas tax break.  Maybe this is how he manages to claim that his campaign is not negative ... because he declines to name the person he is attacking.
[Since when is stopping such lunacy as these gas tax breaks "negative"? Besides, who the f**k is this Barack fellow to stand in the path of progress (of the oil companies)?]

He says .30/day comes to $28 for the summer.   He denigrates that as useless, thus indicating how out of touch he is with real working people, where $28 can make a difference.
[The windfall profit tax will not pass while this president is.. well, president. So, I wonder how the tax holiday of THIS summer will be paid for? Oh, and on a side note, no legislation will ever pass to stop gas companies from raising the price to recoup their windfall profits tax losses. So from the looks of it, gas tax holiday or no holiday, we're screwed. And on Planet Clinton, math is still magic]

"I wish i could stand here and say we could fix energy problems with a holiday.   Wish i could bring back overseas jobs.  I wish I could claim I will pass every plan and proposal outlined in my campaign.  But you've heard that in every election.  Everyone goes back to washington and does the influence peddling."   [I have to ask Obama, 'so what do you plan to do, other than complaining?' ]
[I would send you to his website, but, all you'll find is an empty suit from the men's warehouse hung on a teleprompter. Sorry]

"Take a chance on a new kind of politics ... it's about who we are as Americans.   Are we going to stand up and reclaim the American dream?   That will take more than one election, more than one person, more than one party."  [Right.  So again, what will YOU contribute, other than being one of many guys who have run on a promise to change Washington?]
[Well first, he doesn't take money from lobbyists! "But he used to". But he doesn't. "But lobbyists represent real Americans!" And he doesn't?]

"I'm the only candidate who has proposed a middle-class tax cut."   [That is a lie.   Hillary will reduce taxes for people making less than $250k/year].
[I need your help here (seriously), I thought she's only rolling back tax cuts on those making over $250K. The other cuts are simply an extension of what's in place. Am I right on this? (Also, I know she's going to be giving tax incentives and relief on healthcare costs)]

Great country, and "the only way a black guy born in HI named Barack Obama can be running for President. "  [Calling attention to his own race, but lord help anyone else who mentions it].
[I know! How bogus is that! Like, how dare they ask him if he's black enough in a nationally televised debate, and the dude has the audacity to actually give a humorous answer. The nerve! Oh, or, when Biden was asked about his questionably (racist) remarks about Obama (which weren't racist), I hated how Obama didn't throw him under the bus. What a dick!]

Final word: get with the program. He's our nominee (feather, penny, nickel, dime, and quarter in. Didn't touch the salt-shaker, didn't touch the salt-shaker. didn't throw hat on the bed! Okay. we're good.)

by lizardbox 2008-05-04 07:18PM | 0 recs
Re: I hate deconstructing diaries, but here I go a

a) Actually, I think you like it.

b) He did not misspeak.  He uses the "royal we" all the time.  Personally it annoys the heck out of me as it is disingenuous.  He's also the guy who has said "To know me is to love me" and who only got mad at Rev. Wright when Wright attacked him ... not caring too much when Wright attacked America, white people, and women.

c) [May be 1.5 million supporters might just hold him to his word?] -- Not sure I get this reference.  What 1.5 M are you talking about?

d) The windfall profit tax will not pass while this president is.. well, president.   -- Actually none of this will pass unless Republicans approve it.  I believe both McCain and Clinton are simply saying what they would support.  Or if Hillary co-sponsors the legislation then clearly she will put that element into it.

e) Obama's campaign staff is full of former and present lobbyists, and he's got a healthy list over at "K Street Endorsements" (google it).  So that's just a disingenuous piece of handwaving (at best) or a lie (at worst).

f)  On tax cuts, I'll admit I don't know all the details, but she will remove the AMT on those making under $250k (which is a huge tax cut for those affected).  

by miker2008 2008-05-05 08:11AM | 0 recs
Youth service plan

The idea is, you do volunteer work for a certain amount of time for charity or the Peace Corps or the like, and you get $4,000 for school.

It's one of the many reasons Obama gets a huge percentage of the college vote.  People want to work for opportunities, but the methods of availability of scholarships and such has become so arcane and difficult to procure that kids give up on submitting requests after awhile.  This leads to more student loan debt, which dogs them throughout adulthood (heck, Obama was paying back student loans as of five years ago).

by Dracomicron 2008-05-04 07:23PM | 0 recs
Re: Youth service plan

Sounds like a great plan.

by miker2008 2008-05-05 08:12AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

Speech starts with the claim that "we" (always "we" when he really means "I") will usher in a new way of doing things in Washington.   There is no evidence from Obama's past as a U.S. Senator or as an IL Senator, that he does things any differently than anyone who came before.   So is this a lie or just wishful thinking?

He uses "we" because he's trying to both win the Presidency and to convince the people that they can do great things to change this country.  Not too crazy an idea, unless you're a complete cynic.

And a President has substantially more power than a US or state Senator.  But since he has returned campaign donations from lobbyists while other candidates have not, I'd say there's some commitment to changing the Washington power structure.  

He says .30/day comes to $28 for the summer.   He denigrates that as useless, thus indicating how out of touch he is with real working people, where $28 can make a difference.

It is useless.  Those people deserve MUCH better than $30 over three months, despite some politicians assuming that that is the price of their votes.  Shameful.

"I wish i could stand here and say we could fix energy problems with a holiday.   Wish i could bring back overseas jobs.  I wish I could claim I will pass every plan and proposal outlined in my campaign.  But you've heard that in every election.  Everyone goes back to washington and does the influence peddling."   [I have to ask Obama, 'so what do you plan to do, other than complaining?']

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/energy /

Though feel free to continue with the "I haven't memorized Obama's policy positions, so therefore he must not have any" meme.  I gather that some enjoy playing that ridiculous game.

"Take a chance on a new kind of politics ... it's about who we are as Americans.   Are we going to stand up and reclaim the American dream?   That will take more than one election, more than one person, more than one party."  [Right.  So again, what will YOU contribute, other than being one of many guys who have run on a promise to change Washington?]

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/ethics /

And see above comment.

"I'm the only candidate who has proposed a middle-class tax cut."   [That is a lie.   Hillary will reduce taxes for people making less than $250k/year].

Since when does the middle class make $250K a year?  Sounds like something Bush came up with.

Great country, and "the only way a black guy born in HI named Barack Obama can be running for President. "  [Calling attention to his own race, but lord help anyone else who mentions it].  

You can mention it.  Just don't paint him as another going nowhere black candidate.  That's really not helpful at all.

by freedom78 2008-05-04 07:25PM | 0 recs
Obama's youth service "idea"

Clinton (Bill) had a service corp where young people could work in service to the country and the Republicans cut it and cut it away.  Hillary has been talking for over a year about helping young people pay for college in several ways.
Increase the Pell Grants
Go back to government sponsored very low interest loans and cut out the predatory lending practices that have caught up so many students.
If students work in service to the community  forgive loans up to 10,000.
If students go into high need areas like teaching or providing medical care to underserved areas forgive the loan a year at a time for each year of service.
Tax credits for families putting students in school
Lifelong learning and tehnical college opportunities for worker retraining and for students who do not choose regular college.  

There is more on the web site.  She also puts in full pre K early childhood education and revamps daycare in order to try to halve the acheivement gap among African American kids in rural and inner city schools.

Hillary has incentives for entering research and technology and for teaching math and science.  The whole push onn Education Policy is to help the economy grow, provide needed service to underserved areas and encourage young people to enter at least a period of public service.  So there would be a much larger pool of people working in health, mental health, safety, after school programs, education, recreation, environmental research and development as well as alternative energy.
Hillary's first 8 million jobs go to reparing the infrastructure and making all public buildings energy effiecient, in every town and community.

She had this stuff posted and in her stump speech for many months before Obama started to feel the need to add specifics in his speeches and debates.  The main reason their stuff sounds a lot alike is because his specific policies now on his website and in his speeches are either copies or pale, less comprehensive, interconnected versions of hers(with a few obvious exceptions!)

by itsadryheat 2008-05-04 07:29PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

"Calling attention to his own race, but lord help anyone else who mentions it"

I've had enough of this shit. No one has ever said you can't talk about race. Clinton has spoke about Obama's race, as has edwards, I believe.

Its fine to talk about how America has given an opportunity for a black man or a woman to become president. What is not fine is saying that Obama has had it easy being black, that he wouldn't be a candidate for president if he weren't black. That this election is some kind of affirmative action scheme.

Clinton talks about her gender all the time as do her supporters ("It'll take a woman to clean up after bush"). No one calls her out on it. So stop saying that every time Obama mentions race he is being a hypocrite. Its just annoying.

by BlueGAinDC 2008-05-04 07:34PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

"It's fine to talk about how America has given an opportunity for a black man or a woman to become president. What is not fine is saying that Obama has had it easy being black"

No one has said that.  Ferraro received a firestorm of criticism, a "special comment" by Olberman, and a whole lot of virtriolic hate mail for saying something Obama himself had already said (quoted on his campaigns web page):  "If i were white, I'd just be one of 20 freshman senators."

"Clinton talks about her gender all the time as do her supporters ("It'll take a woman to clean up after bush"). No one calls her out on it. "

Wrong.  What she actually says:  "It will take a CLINTON to clean up after a Bush."

by miker2008 2008-05-04 07:45PM | 0 recs
so what?

we now have to have a vicious circles of Bushes and Clintons.

George - Bill - George - Hill - Jeb - Chelsea - ....

by kindthoughts 2008-05-04 07:56PM | 0 recs
You must be a republican since

only republicans attack Clinton with the same vehemence that they attack Bush.  

This Clinton-hating aspect of the so-called Democratic "left" has been a puzzling and disturbing aspect of this whole campaign.   You and so many other Obama supporters have just picked up the rightwing hate speech against Hillary and used it full force against one of your own.

Is it that YOU are republicans in disguise, or is it that your candidate is a republican in disguise?  Or is it that your candidate will simply do anything to win and tearing down loyal and highly effective Democrats is fair game?

by miker2008 2008-05-05 07:24AM | 0 recs
Correction:

"only republicans attack Clinton with the same vehemence that DEMOCRATS attack Bush."

by miker2008 2008-05-05 07:25AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

Of course he copied almost everything from Senator Clinton.

Proof (via Chicago Tribune):

On foreign policy alone, some 200 experts are providing the Obama campaign with assistance of some sort, arranged into 20 subgroups. On the domestic front, more than 500 policy experts are contributing ideas, campaign aides said.

by lizardbox 2008-05-04 07:39PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

The diarist is right when she says Obama has a good services plan, however the plan is not only limited to youth. Anyone will be able to volunteer for America. Some highlights are:

  • Expand AmeriCorps from 75,000 slots today to 250,000
  • Double the Peace Corps to 16,000 by 2011
  • Expand and improve programs that connect individuals over the age of 55 to quality volunteer opportunities
  • Tax credit for college students worth $4,000 a year in exchange for 100 hours of public service a year
  • Create an energy-focused youth jobs program to provide disadvantaged youth with service opportunities weatherizing buildings and getting practical experience in fast-growing career fields
and there's more...

When Senator Obama refers to We it is We the People he is speaking of. Change begins with us. We can make a difference. Learn more about Senator Obama's plan for public service by visiting: http://www.barackobama.com/issues/servic e/

by grasshopper 2008-05-04 07:46PM | 0 recs
interesting

Obama has let go of his post-racial politicking once and for all. But the rest is the same high on fluff low on specifics.

by tarheel74 2008-05-04 07:57PM | 0 recs
Re: interesting

Clinton's supporters (or possibly republicans in disguise) repeat over and over that Senator Obama doesn't give specifics, which is too bad because the Senator's proposals are comprehensive and well thought out. Just because you refuse to acknowledge them doesn't mean they don't exist. What specifics are you looking for? There are a lot of Obama supporters here who would be happy to answer policy questions.

by grasshopper 2008-05-04 09:10PM | 0 recs
Ok, how does he propose to

change forever and completely the culture of politics in Washington?

by miker2008 2008-05-05 08:13AM | 0 recs
Oh good. That's an easy one!

Senator Obama is an advocate for transparency in government. He believes that by engaging and empowering the electorate, the old ways of Washington will not stand. By promoting volunteerism, for one example, Sen. Obama gives us all an opportunity to make our country better for ourselves and our children and have a vested interest in the fate of our nation. If we know we have a voice, if we can see that we each have impact, we become the change. Washington can not get away with politics as usual with an engaged electorate. The fourth branch of our government is we the people, not they the special interests, the insiders or the corporations.

by grasshopper 2008-05-05 08:44AM | 0 recs
Sounds great, but I still don't see

how it's going to work.   What you said isn't very specific.  What will he actually DO?

Is he going to change the constitution to allow direct democracy rather than representational?

Is he going to give every senator and congressman a mydd.com account so they can read for themselves what we think (god help them).

Is he going to have a million-man march, a million-woman march, a million-child march, different for every ethnic, age and gender group, per month?  

Is he going to hold town hall type meetings and gather feedback from citizens.  If so he'll have to change his own style as during the campaign he has preferred one-directional communications:  big speeches with no time for questions.

by miker2008 2008-05-05 09:20AM | 0 recs
Point by point

Is he going to change the constitution...?
The constitution does not need to be changed, our representation does. If people are involved and paying attention, incumbent reps will no longer be a lock.

Is he going to give every senator and congressman a mydd.com account?
Sen. Obama will take advantage of technology and does currently solicit options and advice from experts and ordinary citizens. He has proposed that talks involving major legislation (healthcare, energy policy for example) be broadcast online and on CSPAN. He believes we must restore government accountability.

Is he going to hold town hall type meetings and gather feedback from citizens?
Yes. You can currently give feedback on his website. Additionally  Sen Obama has proposed:

  • Holding 21st Century Fireside Chats: Obama will bring democracy and policy directly to the people by requiring his Cabinet officials to have periodic national broadband townhall meetings to discuss issues before their agencies.
  • Making White House Communications Public: Obama will amend executive orders to ensure that communications about regulatory policymaking between persons outside government and all White House staff are disclosed to the public.
  • Conducting Regulatory Agency Business in Public: Obama will require his appointees who lead the executive branch departments and rulemaking agencies to conduct the significant business of the agency in public, so that any citizen can see in person or watch on the Internet these debates.
  • Releasing Presidential Records: Obama will nullify the Bush attempts to make the timely release of presidential records more difficult.

Sen. Obama has done numerous townhalls and spoken to many small groups answering individual questions. Here is a recent one: http://link.brightcove.com/services/link /bcpid900881681/bclid900480414/bctid1520 957291

by grasshopper 2008-05-05 10:42AM | 0 recs
Obama's service plan

You can read about Obama's comprehensive service plan for the country, which includes creating service-learning for youth, here:

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/servic e/

by The Distillery 2008-05-04 09:22PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama Jefferson-Jackson Speech

"There is no evidence from Obama's past as a U.S. Senator or as an IL Senator, that he does things any differently than anyone who came before."

Actually refusing money from federal lobbyists and funding your campaign through mostly small donors is a relatively novel and welcome change to politics as usual.

by DreamsOfABlueNation 2008-05-04 10:58PM | 0 recs
Obama has a lot of former

lobbyists on his campaign staff.  He also has a healthy list of endorsements from "K Street" firms.  

http://www.rollcall.com/politics/kstendo rsements.html

Also Obama's history in IL Senate shows that he 'caves' rather easily to the corporation pressure that is endemic in Washington.   He proposed a bill to protect citizens from nuclear waste in IL.   After Exelon, a campaign contributor and huge nuclear power company, spoke to him about it, he completely gutted his own bill taking out all the truly protective features.

He has also changed his mind about supporting Iraq war, saying in 2004 that his position was similar to Bush's.  

This, my friend, is EXACTLY what Washington politics have always been about.   And he's right in the mainstream there.

by miker2008 2008-05-05 08:17AM | 0 recs

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