If we hated on McCain half as much...

we would be in good shape and we would be a much more unified group here. I took a look at the recommended list this morning and saw three diaries, three(!!!), attacking Obama for the same exact thing. Ignoring, for a moment, the relevance of these attacks, don't worry I will get to that in a moment, why in the world do we need three diaries that say the same thing on the recommended list? I get it. Obama is bad. He is the worst. You'd rather have four more years of Bush. Thats fine, I get it. Did we need it three times? And three times yesterday? And four times the day before?

(I would normally take a moment here to bitch about the one diary attacking Clinton on the recommended list...but there is only one and while I don't particularly care for the tone of it it isn't filled with have as much bile as most of the anti-Obama diaries here. That being said. It sure would be nice if we could cut the crap, advocate for our chosen candidate and maybe look for a Republican to hit if we need to hit something that badly.)

Now, as to the relevance of what these diaries are saying. It goes to his statements regarding people in small town Pennsylvania being bitter and holding tight to their guns, religion, and distrust of those who are different. Guess what, I don't know how many of the diarists who are discussing this comment have been to small town PA but it might surprise them to hear that it is all true. And the people who live there know it is true. In fact, they will tell you themselves that it is true.

Now, maybe some of them are going to be insulted by it being pointed out by a Harvard Educated Black Man, but many of them are also just going to be thankful that someone is noticing and willing to talk about it. They will even be more thankful that someone might try and do something about it. Because after eight years of Clinton and seven years of Bush their situation has not gotten better. It has gotten a lot worse.

All of that aside, are any of you going to have half as much hatred or disgust for the good Senator from Arizona? I somehow doubt it. He is going to make his comments about bombing Iran, his comments about keeping troops in Iraq and you are going to ignore it is my guess; especially once Obama is the nominee.

Are you going to be disgusted when he talks about making the tax cuts permanent? Nope, you are just going to be thankful he doesn't talk about how bitter the working class in this country is, and has a right to be.

Are you going to write endless diaries about it when he calls his wife a cunt in public? Nope, he isn't Obama after all so why would you make a big deal about it.

What is the point of all of this? Why do you hate a fellow Democrat so much? Is it because he is beating Clinton and that just isn't allowed? Or is it something else?

I really hope that the diarists here turn their attention to McCain once we have a nominee... but I have the feeling they won't. Not with the energy or the disgust they have shown towards Obama... heck, if Obama is the nominee I won't be surprised at this point to see hitjobs, posted right here on MYDD, tearing him down right through Election Day. It is really pitiful if that is true, but nothing surprises me anymore.  

Tags: 2008, clinton, general election, mccain, obama, president, Primary (all tags)



Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...
Those diarists are focused on only tearing down the frontrunner. I'm beginning to wonder who some of these people really are.
by mikeinsf 2008-04-12 08:22AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

I would suggest that you look at the hit diaries against HRC - Snipe fire.

Stop throwing stones from a glass house.

by indus 2008-04-12 09:44AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...
I don't live in that house. Never said a word about Tuzla. The only things I've ever gone after her on have been her campaign tactics and Iraq, both perfectly acceptable subjects to debate.
by mikeinsf 2008-04-12 10:19AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

The only things I've ever gone after her on have been her campaign tactics and Iraq, both perfectly acceptable subjects to debate.

I did not say that you said something regarding Tuzla. I was talking about other Obama Supporters. I have not said anything about this episode as well and am watching the conversation/debate going on.

This is also part of the debate. We still have to pick a candidate on the democratic side. The Front runner always gets scrutinized more. HRC
got the same deal in Dec/early Jan. All other democratic candidates was hitting her for comments she made.

So I think it is fair game till we pick a nominee

by indus 2008-04-12 10:26AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...
Sure. Whatever he says is game. Still, this one's silliest I've seen yet. I mean, really, two multimillionaires calling him "elitist" because of a statement that's essentially true? Basically, this is much ado over word choice. I think it's embarrassing.
by mikeinsf 2008-04-12 12:45PM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

They've lost perspective, but it'll come back. Right now, they're just dug in for Hillary, but hopefully if Hillary concedes (heck, maybe possibly vice versa) they'll realise that we're fighting for the same things, just for different people to do them.

If it doesn't, then insults about 'cults of personality' will begin to wear a little thin...

by grass 2008-04-12 08:28AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

Uhm, wages rose even in small towns in America and we had our lowest unemployment in history during the Clinton years. I have no idea why you think it got worse during those years - it didn't - other than you take everything Obama says as gospel truth.

Now, please, show us the polling that says people in these towns are "bitter" - most Americans (82%) think America is on the wrong track. But I'd like to know where the idea of bitterness comes from. Can you please prove to me that the majority of people in small rural towns feel "bitter".

Now, how do you account for the racism, and the fundamental religionism among people who are prosperous? Lotta money in the GOP and a lot of those people are quite racist and quite fundamentalist.

Face it - Obama said something ugly and contemptous and he's quite righteously getting his butt kicked over it.

by Little Otter 2008-04-12 08:28AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

Well, the use of the word righteously is interesting here..  as though people feel a moral calling to criticize him...  

If you believe what he said was incorrect and you are rightly calling him on it that would be something else...  But that people on this board feel the need to express some righteous indignation is itself another problem.

by JenKinFLA 2008-04-12 08:32AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

Hey, I don't know where you live but I know where I have lived for the last 9 years. Thats right, small town Pennsylvania (Western PA and Central PA) and guess what; people here are bitter. I don't need a poll to tell me that because I spend time with these people everyday. Many of them are bitter and many of them have a right to be.

So before you throw stones like "you take everything Obama says as gospel truth," maybe find you should find out a little bit about who you are talking too.

Maybe you should spend some time in those places and talk to some of the people there. Do I think Obama should have phrased things the way he did? Probably not, but that doesn't make them less true and it doesn't make it less absurd that there are THREE diaries devoted to it on the recommended list.

by JDF 2008-04-12 08:32AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

Ahh, so you know bitter people therefore everyone is bitter. Classic.

by Little Otter 2008-04-12 10:11AM | 0 recs
This sudden allergy to the word "bitter"

is hilarious.

You're so transparent.

by Bee 2008-04-12 10:17AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

"many of them" does not equal "everyone"

But at least now I know how well you read.

by JDF 2008-04-12 12:38PM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

Well, at the moment, there is a contest for the nomination...  One can only hope that this vitriol will get focused on McCain once we have a nominee...

by JenKinFLA 2008-04-12 08:28AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

I think a lot of them will either leave or go so far overboard in their vitriol immediately following the resolution of this race that they will be banned.

by rfahey22 2008-04-12 08:35AM | 0 recs
The one diary attacking Clinton...

may not be as bad in your opinion but in the light of Obama's recent comment about small-town Americans it certainly focuses a bright light on the absurdity Of Obama supporters calling Clinton arrogant.

by JimR 2008-04-12 08:50AM | 0 recs
Re: The one diary attacking Clinton...

I disagree with your understanding of what Obama said, but I certainly understand how it could be seen that way.

That being said, I spend an awful lot of time in small town Pennsylvania and there was nothing he said that isn't true...there was also nothing he said that many people in those towns won't admit is true.

And Clinton is arrogant, there is no way around that. So is Obama, and so is anyone who would run for President. Lets not pretend otherwise.

by JDF 2008-04-12 08:54AM | 0 recs
My company is in...

Shippensburg, PA and I know a few people who would not agree. So tell me, why do people in large cities or the suburbs turn to religion? Are they bitter also? Why are some of them against gun control? Or illegal immigration? Do you think they don't exist?

by JimR 2008-04-12 09:07AM | 0 recs
Re: My company is in...

Your questions make many false assumptions. Most importantly that everyone who does the same thing does it for the same reason. As to your question about large cities, my guess is that if you went to Philadelphia or into the city of Harrisburg you would find a lot of angry, bitter people there as well. Your post also assumes that I think EVERYONE, in these small towns, is bitter and angry.

If you want to have a discussion about it at least do it with reasonable questions.

by JDF 2008-04-12 09:18AM | 0 recs
Your interpretation of what he said

is ridiculous, and transparently partisan. Pennsylvanians need neither cable tv pundits nor Hillary partisans to interpret for them what Obama said. People know what he said - he said truth. Distorting it into a fatal gaffe is absurd, desperate and embarrassing. The thought of Hillary Clinton, of all people, accusing Obama of elitism is laughable. And it's appalling that so-called Democrats are using this rancid right wing smear against other Democrats. You should all be red-faced and ashamed of yourselves to be lining up with the likes of Grover Norquist.

Rave on, Clintonites. It's all you have left in your quiver. Barack will be just fine, and we'll be much better off for it.

by Bee 2008-04-12 09:04AM | 0 recs
That's right,

he doesn't need any of us. Btw, we'll be just fine as well.

by JimR 2008-04-12 09:10AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...


You don't get it.

You say that if anyone has been to smalltown Pennsylvania, they would know that all of Obama's particulars are true.

I have researched rural outmigration for years. And I realize that most of the things Obama said were true. It is not the particulars, however, but the framing that casts Obama in the light of noblesse oblige.

I am reminded of a photo from the WPA during the Great Depression of Rexford Tugwell of the Resettlement Administration touring the Dust Bowl.  In order to receive federal assistance, most farmers were forced to sell their lands at fire sale prices to the government and relocate to "approved" areas.

Tugwell is standing among farmers wearing white slacks.
White slacks.

And, of course, Tugwell was blissfully unaware of his choice of attire, while those pants were the first thing that the farmers saw.


Obama's response yesterday in Indiana confirms in my mind that he has a very similar, intellectual's perspective. And it really doesn't matter how right he is.  It will only get worse between now and November and the Dems will get trounced.

by johnnygunn 2008-04-12 09:03AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

You bring up another thing I am sick to death of. The idea that being an intellectual is a bad thing. You know what, after eight years of Bush if this country isn't smart enough to see that electing an intellectual would be a good thing than this country can't be saved and doesn't deserve to be.  

And you know what I'll admit here and now that I am an elitist. So save yourself the trouble of pointing it out.

by JDF 2008-04-12 12:42PM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

Adali Stevenson was an "intellectual". Basking in being "smarter" than the supposed unwashed and unworthy will earn electoral defeats similar to his. To be perfectly honest, Obama's canidiacy reminds alot of Stenvenson's.

by zcflint05 2008-04-12 01:28PM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

I am of the opinion that this 'bitterness' controversy is going to end up killing Hillary and McCain. If you haven't seen the video of Obama's 3 minute response, check it here or below about 4 posts back. What is happening is that Obama is now going to crystallize 81% of the country's feelings of discontent with the last 30 years of politics and politicians. I say 81% because that is the percentage of people who believe the country is on the wrong track according to a recent CBS poll.

by Cristalgirl 2008-04-12 09:03AM | 0 recs
Re: If we hated on McCain half as much...

Its so sad to watch McCain win this election. Sad for all of us

by dead goat 2008-04-12 09:34AM | 0 recs
Proof is certainly forthcoming every day

that some of us don't deserve an honest and thoughtful man for president.  Some of our fellow citizens prefer a steady diet of lies.

by ReillyDiefenbach 2008-04-12 02:14PM | 0 recs
where the difficulty is

for me is the feeling I am being sold a bill of goods, only to find out the candidate is really not changing anything.  

Don't get me wrong--I detest McCain and know he will be bad for our country.

But I hate being told the guy is bringing change, only to see him backtrack on everything, throw people under the bus, pander to republicans. Try to get out of his own statements, try to change the subject, and mount ineffective attacks against republicans.

by 4justice 2008-04-12 10:51AM | 0 recs
and whats teh obama supporters alternative?

Penn powered, AUMF voting, bankruptcy bill supporting candidate, who talks about runnign under sniper fire?

by kindthoughts 2008-04-12 11:05AM | 0 recs
Re: and whats teh obama supporters alternative?

Maybe bankrupties wouldn't be nessesary if Barack would have voted yes on capping credit card interest rates? Maybe big oil wouldn't be a problem if OILBama didn't raise it's head, or if Obama wasn't paid for by Exelon a few years ago? Of course, there's also nothing like pandering for a few gay votes and then tossing them under the bus when the conservative blacks coming calling too.

That's "change we can believe in".

by zcflint05 2008-04-12 01:37PM | 0 recs
none of this

convinces me to vote for hillary.

by kindthoughts 2008-04-12 01:42PM | 0 recs
"Sugar we're going down swinging......"

at each other.  

by aurelius 2008-04-12 11:55AM | 0 recs
At first

I was thinking of sitting this election out because of all the reasons I can't stand BO...now I'm thinking of sitting it out because I can't collectively stand our party.  This has just all gotten so depressing.  He comes the coronation of John McCain.  At this point I'm just "clinging" to the hope that the business that I am working on will pay me enough to move out of the country by November.  Maybe there is some sanity on the other side of the pond.

by aurelius 2008-04-12 11:59AM | 0 recs
Re: At first

I suggest Merida, Mexico. It is far enough away from the bull that goes on in the rest of Mexico and is really starting to thrive. I am looking at property there as we speak.

by JDF 2008-04-12 12:44PM | 0 recs


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