I wouldn't be surprised if half the skinheads in America showed up in Denver to "protest" the nomination. I expect the outside to look alot like a Jerry Springer audience. No matter how much makeup you put on that pig to make it look like a puma, it's still going to smell like a pig.
Once the country gets a clear picture of where this "dissent" is really coming from and what's really driving it? (I'm looking at you, Larry) It could just work in Obama's favor. We've lost our tolerance for intolerance and racial hatred.
I saw something significant on the Daily Show last night -- Stewart was PISSED as were apparently his writers.
One thing overlooked in all the poll watching handwringing -- is it possible the smear campaign will re-ignite Obama's base?
Back in 2004, when the swiftboating of Kerry started, the Democrats were upset by it but the outrage was muted and the reaction slow and confused. A hell of alot of energy went into arguing/wondering about the truth and the source of the swiftboat attacks.
This is different. Going after Obama for being "popular" and "all talk" is not only ludicrous, it's obscene and outrageous.
We all need to get pissed and STAY pissed -- not at PUMAs, not at trolls -- AT THE MEDIA and at the McCain campaign. We need to be pushing back hard on the media for twisting the numbers and the facts, on giving McGrouch a free ride, on working to keep this thing closer than it wants to be.
IT'S THE MEDIA, DAMMIT. Call them. Write them. Send an email encouraging your friends to do the same. Call them on this crap.
How in the fuck can McCain be out there lying about off shore drilling, lying about Obama's platform, lying about the state of the economy and the media is talking about Britany Spears and empty Obama rhetoric?
Anyone who didn't see the Daily Show last night needs to watch it and get as pissed as Stewart.
If Romney is such a big damn draw here, how did McCain manage to scare the crap out of Romney in the primary by, literally, showing up the last week and doing a couple townhalls in places like Fowlerville? McCain ran no real campaign here. As I remember it, there was considerable last minute handwringing about what it would mean if Romney lost Michigan.
The only people in Michigan who recognize the name are over 50 and the only ones who have any great attachment to the name are voting McCain anyway and most of them never forgave George for being "brainwashed." It's not like the dude was beloved or anything and Mittens is hardly seen as a native son.
If you are working class or being screwed by the economy here, Mittens the Multi-Millionaire Mormon is as about as appealing as Dick DeVos. I imagine a couple dozen people in Grand Rapids will get the vapors and volunteer, but beyond that I just don't see the name helping the ticket all that much.
The stronger position on the ECONOMY STUPID is going to carry Michigan. VPs won't make a tinkers damn bit of difference. The key in Michigan? J.O.B.S.
With the registration efforts going on now, I'd worry much more about GOP dirty tricks on election day in places like Detroit, Benton Harbor, Flint and Saginaw. THAT'S the only way we'll lose Michigan.
I heard during the primary wars --
when your opponent is in the process of killing himself, don't try to murder him.
I've got to believe that while there must be a few yahoos in Podunk who are influenced by this garbage, the majority of undecided or leaning voters are seeing right through McCain's manure and are repulsed by it. You don't have to think too long or hard about "willing to lose a war to win an election" to see where McCain just discounted the will of the American people. (I like that in a GOP candidate, by the way)
Responding or even reacting to the political vomit from McCain is akin to answering the question "are you still beating your wife?" The only smart way to answer that question is to ignore it as beneath you.
I'm actually glad to see the new McCain braintrust turning to the Rove playbook -- it shows they are incapable of new or clever. It assumes the American people haven't learned anything in the past four years of sorrowfully studying their own navels.
In 2008, you have to be digging pretty far down in your bag of tricks to resort to the tactics of George Bush. And the more McCain postures like Mr. 22% the better that is for the rest of us.
I actually enjoyed reading (most) of this thread and thinking back on those days. It served to put today in perspective for me and it actually made me sort of proud or something that the experience didn't harden me into a inflexible ahole. (ahem. and you know who you are)
Reading and thinking about that stuff I'm surprised I can have such a positive commitment to Obama. My gawd I DESPISED the guy only a few months ago and for no reason other than the excrement of his worst supporters.
The difference right now and here is -- back on Kos in February the Clinton Haters were like a swarm of bees -- there were THOUSANDS of them, up all night, tapping away, never missing even a slight nod to hillary LET ALONE a smack at Obama. A reminder that it wasn't Obama trashing that brought down the house on you, it was merely writing anything remotely positive about Clinton.
Here, when folks gang up on a PUMA it's more like a lopsided bar fight. And no one is being trashed for saying good things about Clinton. They are being humped for writing crap about Obama. Big difference!
I just had a flashback and for the life of me wish I could track down the diary. It sat on the rec list for most of a day.
It was on Kos, sometime in February probably, where an Obama supporter who had worked at a caucus (Iowa I think) was explaining why he did so well in the caucuses in a very upbeat "not trashing Clinton" manner. One central premise of her argument was (and I paraphrase, but do not exaggerate)
"And I think Obama would have done even better except Obama supporters have kids or go to school or have jobs and Clinton supporters are usually empty nesters who don't work or have any real responsibilities so it's actually easier for them to get to caucuses."
And a shitload of people piled on TO AGREE WITH HER.
Around the same time on Kos there was a diary about sexism (one of the first if not the first) and the comments were UNBELIEVABLE right down to commenter after commenter declaring sexism a dead issue, yah know, because it really doesn't exist anymore. And come to think of it, it never was really all that bad anyway. ON A PROGRESSIVE BLOG.
I couldn't believe the agreement to crap like Hillary killed Vince Foster, rehashing of Travelgate for Christ sake, Hillary should have single-handedly unionized Wallmart when she had the chance, Hillary was no feminist because she didn't divorce Bill fo cheating on her....
And if I had to vote on lowest moment ever -- beyond the darken picture stupidity it would have to be the various permutations of Crygate. IT showed me how many people out there have serious mommy issues.
It received a hair short of 1600 comments most of them not at all HELPFUL (more proving my point than anything else) and I pride myself on having written on of the first if not THE first McCain threat diary.
Rereading it just now I'm struck by this passage --
"I've lost count of the number of times I've been hurt and insulted by the rhetoric coming out of the Obama campaign, aimed at Hillary that ricochets and hits me. Experience doesn't matter. Unconventional experience is not real experience. If your husband is a dumbass so are you. You've f$cked things up so bad only young people can fix them. You're stupid because you watch the Hallmark Channel. You don't understand the real issues. Your marraige says more about you than your own accomplishments. If you cry you must be weak. If you cry you must be unstable. If you cry you must be putting it on to get attention. If you show emotion you can't be trusted. Your ambition is unattractive. Your ambition is suspect. You've worked hard and accomplished things, but those accomplishments are now irrelevant. All tough women are ball-busters."
That pretty much encapsulates my "Kos Experience" for the month of January 2008.
I went on to stop posting or visiting over there, not as part of any mass defection, but because I was afraid the crowd would drive me off my party and my ideology for good. In other words, if this was the new progressive Democratic movement it's time for me to find a new label for myself.
for the record, the minute Clinton put her candidacy on hold I intended to vote Obama, and since that time I've come to love the guy ad I'll work my tail off for him. And, oddly enough, I'm currently now as cheesed off at the unfair and twisted crap being thrown at him as I was back in February for what was being written on Kos about Clinton.
As someone plenty old enough to remember elections pre-internets, these forums are a beautiful thing. You get to vent your spleen, learn, share, bond and feel very sorry for those who can't seem to exploit forums as a place to GROW as so many have through this historic season.
Somewhere someone taught some folks that there was some honor, or courage or purity in putting your hands over your ears and screaming as loud and as abrasively as you can. Frankly, I just think the internet allows those folks with the social skills of possums a place to interact with others, however embarrassing that should be for them.
and yes, if I ever voted Repubican my hand would fall off, now or then.
If I met a person on the doors who stated they were voting for McCain because they support Hillary Clinton I'd do my best to steer them back to policy questions, but at the end of the conversation leave it at that. I sure wouldn't see the need or the point in going back to them again and again to try to dismantle their rationale. And I wouldn't want to make them any angrier. I'd do my best to keep everything pleasant and leave them to their own decision with a polite "good luck to you."
Now, if that same person kept showing up at my Obama houseparties or the local Democratic HQ, railing about the "stolen primary" or trashing talking our "empty suit" nominee I'd feel perfectly comfortable giving them a big boot in the ass or shouting them down. Why? Because they were delibrately trying to be disruptive and undermine the WORK I was trying to do.
That's the difference between the "big tent" and internet sites like this one. I'm not in charge of who gains admission to the big tent, but, um, for the time being OBAMA is because he happens to be the current ring master. You don't like the show? LEAVE but don't expect no pushback if you keep trying to disrupt it.
What scald me most about the naysayers is they are not offering solutions or standing up for some particular change of policy, they seem to only want to piss on the parade. Their purpose here seems to be to erode support or enthusiasm for Obama to make some sort of "statement" or effect some undefined "change" in how the system works.
I see no platform, no concrete goal, no movement to bring things closer into line with a particular ideology -- just a bunch of disorganized voices screaming about an outcome with no realistic concerted will to change that outcome or the process that produced it.
So yeah, you come into my space and take a crap in the party punch bowl I'm going to be unpleasant to you, just as I would expect to be treated with hostility if I went over to a GOP fund raiser and started spouting off there.
I fail to see anything particularly "progressive" or "Democratic" about showing up here to spout slanderous accusations about the most electable progressive Democrat left in this race.