Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer.

Palin must have been Rove's choice.

Pros

1)  She is pretty

  1.  She is a woman
  2.  She totally and completely neutralizes Obama's game.
  3.  She may very well become president from McCain death in 8 year time and she is unknown so she will get tons of press.  She is bright and shiny and Biden isn't.
  4.  She makes McCain look like the progressive with regards to women.
  5.  She is closer to working men and women than Obama.
  6.  She isn't a lawyer.  She was a fisherwoman.

Every attack on her comes with a built in counter attack

1)  No experience.  If Democrats attack her on no experience they risk being seen as blind to Obama's inexperience or hypocritical.  Alternately she is the only one of the 4 with executive experience.

2)  Corruption.  She tried to get bro in law fired for beating her sis.  Attack that and we will be having a chat about Rezko.  Protecting your sis is something most American's can relate to as different from trying to enrich yourself.

3)  Creationism.  If Democrats attack her on creationism they risk a religion war and depending on the composition of the undecideds that may be a problem.  There are lots of ways to say intelligent design should be taught that American's won't not be scared of.

4)  Abortion.  People are not generally scared of the person who wants very much to protect life especially if she has taken the hits herself which Palin has.  But in attacking a sincere position with pro-choice the question becomes how pro choice?  Many pro choice variants don't sell well either to the public or to the left wing of the democratic party.

There is no way to attack her without serious backlash.  Best to ignore.

Tags: Screwed (all tags)

Comments

91 Comments

Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

This is snark, right?

by lqbruin 2008-08-29 05:02PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

It should be.

Rezko has been beaten beyond recognition. It wasn't even a big deal when Clinton brought it up oh so many months ago. Palin has a CURRENT, unresolved abuse of power charge against her. I could go on ... But I think Team Obama should leave it alone for now. This pick will implode the ticket without Obama's help.

by Lolis 2008-08-29 05:31PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

Yep, I'm giving this two weeks or so until it starts to go sour.

by lqbruin 2008-08-29 05:41PM | 0 recs
"Misreading Women?"

Andrew SullivanI've had a few emails on these lines today:

 

No sooner did my best friend hear about the Sarah Palin pick did I receive an e-mail from her.  It said simply: "Sarah Palin is a Bad Mother!"

   I was at work but could not resist giving her a call to follow up.  She told me that she was watching CNN and heard that Ms. Palin had 5 children and that one was only 4 months old and born with Down Syndrome.  "How in the name of GOD, can she even think about leaving her child or taking her child on the campaign trail for 70 days?"  She was indignant.

   Let me tell you why My best friend Liz matters.  She is 37 years old and Catholic.

   She has three children under the age of 9 years old. She lives in Reston, VA (the suburbs of D.C.).  She is a registered Independent and has voted both Democratic and Republican.  She is a stay at home mother and was a RABID Hillary Clinton supporter.  She was considering staying home instead of voting this November.  I had been trying to convince her of the FOLLY of this stance.  Anyway...

   I guess that McCain feels that Liz is just the demographic that he could poach with the selection of Palin.  Instead, Liz tells me that there is "no way that those two people (McCain/Palin) should be in charge of her kids' future."  Today she decided to vote for Barack.

by iamold 2008-08-29 05:03PM | 0 recs
Re: "Misreading Women?"

If it was a male candidate, no one would bat an eye.

Story's a non-starter and not helpful.

by TCQuad 2008-08-29 05:31PM | 0 recs
Re: "Misreading Women?"

I agree.  It plays into stereotypes of female roles and the "incompetent father."  

by freedom78 2008-08-29 07:19PM | 0 recs
Re: "Misreading Women?"

But:she's not a male candidate. The media is known to be sexist at times. Voters are known to be sexist at times.

This is a non-starter as a campaign attack. It'd be really stupid for the Obama campaign to mention it.

The media narrative is already there. This is going to be an issue with some voters, simply because it's blown up so much, so quickly. I was out with people of both parties at a non-political event. Four of them mentioned this, unsolicited. It's out there, and some people are going to care a lot about it.

by Texas Gray Wolf 2008-08-29 07:38PM | 0 recs
It's not that Obama has no answer...

...it's that Palin destroys the answers that McCain had been building up to Obama for an entire month.  The theme of the convention was going to be that Obama isn't ready; now there's an easy counter.

by thezzyzx 2008-08-29 05:05PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

No there isn't.

Your counter that she isn't ready buys into the theme that they both are not ready leaving Biden and McCain ready.

Biden isn't at the top of the ticket.

You miss how much this is gonna hurt.

by dtaylor2 2008-08-29 05:14PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

You don't get it.

Is she ready to be commander-in-chief or not?  If the McCain campaign's position is "yes, she is" then so is Obama.  If it's "no, she's not", then we have a problem.  It cannot be "no, not at the moment but at some point, we'll see.  Eventually."

Either way there's a contradiction.  The Obama campaign's position is that all of the above have the right experience, and this election is about judgment.  Simple.  No contradiction.

Now if they attack her on experience, they open themselves up to counterattacks, but that's McCain's theme, not theirs.  And no matter how McCain answers, he undercuts his entire rationale for running.  Either Barack Obama is ready to be Commander-in-Chief or his own VP candidate is unqualified.  The Obama campaign doesn't have to touch this one at all - they weren't running on superior experience in the first place.

by Jess81 2008-08-29 05:22PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

And just to put in terms you might understand more easily, this is like if Dan Quayle, Mr. Family Values, were caught in bed with a hooker in 1992.  The election would have been over right then and there: it wouldn't matter whether Bill Clinton attacked him or not.

Bill Clinton wouldn't give a fuck - that was the Bush campaign's issue, not his.  Bill Clinton's issue was change, compassion, and core competence.

By picking Palin, McCain has just undercut his main argument against Obama.  Doesn't matter what Obama says.

by Jess81 2008-08-29 05:28PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

Did you watch Obama last night?  38 million did, and Obama showed he was good and ready to lead.  He also stood up and showed some serious backbone, thankfully.  It will be okay.

by lqbruin 2008-08-29 05:44PM | 0 recs
You took the day off yesterday

from trolling and extended a so-called olive branch, which most of us knew was as phony as a three dollar bill.  Now you're back doing what you do best, stirring up shit.  Congratulations, dumbass.

by ReillyDiefenbach 2008-08-29 07:12PM | 0 recs
Re: You took the day off yesterday

Actually, I was foolish enough to take the olive branch at face value.  I live, I learn, even after all my years.

by whognu 2008-08-29 08:49PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

Yes, Biden isn't at the top of the ticket. Which means that if anything bad happens to Obama, the remaining ticket will have Biden's experience as an asset. And if NOTHING bad happens to Obama, the ticket will still have Biden's experience as an asset.

On the other hand McCain IS at the top of the ticket. Which means that if anything bad happens to McCain, the remaining ticket will have only Palin there.

And let me remind you that McCain is OLD and likely to die in office. If experience supposedly matters, then McCain showed utter disregard for the future of the country by picking an inexperienced VP to be his successor.

by Aris Katsaris2 2008-08-29 08:25PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

hmmm in 2000 it was widely shown that the TX governorship was more or less an empty suit position --- yet Bush rode that horse into the WH. most people will just hear GOVERNOR and that has in modern presidential politics been golden.

by swissffun 2008-08-29 05:19PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

Bush rode the anti-Clinton horse into the WH in 2000.  If Gore had "ridden the Clinton horse," Bush would have been another pathetic footnote in history.

by lqbruin 2008-08-29 05:47PM | 0 recs
Re: It's not that Obama has no answer...

Sorry to burst your bubble, but using GWB as an example in ANY context this year is not a wise idea.

by JenKinFLA 2008-08-29 05:50PM | 0 recs
Well, that didn't last long.

Welcome back the real dtaylor!

Love the pros d!

She is bright and shiny and Biden isn't.

She is butterflys and sunshine!

 She totally and completely neutralizes Obama's game.

Is she a strong weakside rebounder? Obama has the nice left handed bankshot so I don't know about his one.

She was a fisherwoman.

Ok. Ok. You got me! Can't compete with the Chicken of the Sea!

Seriously thoug, this has to be snark.

by spacemanspiff 2008-08-29 05:07PM | 0 recs
Olive branch....

Whatever happened to the olive branch of your last diary?  So much anger towards Obama and the Democrats now..not sure what's changed.

by mady 2008-08-29 05:08PM | 0 recs
Re: Olive branch....

don't see the anger to democrats in this diary --- projecting a bit just because this is written by a Clinton supporter?

by swissffun 2008-08-29 05:16PM | 0 recs
Re: Olive branch....

No, not at all.  I have no beef with Clinton supporters at all, but we have a ticket and most seemed to make their peace with it, but the tone of this is very different.  That's all.

by mady 2008-08-29 05:21PM | 0 recs
Re: Olive branch....

i took it as a cautionary diary on all the jubilation that Palin is an automatic disaster. I think that's wrong. i'm also slightly offended that so much of the Palin bashing focuses on things that were not criticised in male candidates - after all, what foreign policy or national experience did Kaine or Jindal or Crist have? And the bashing of her being a beauty queen....    I think Obama set the right tone, and maybe his supporters should take the cue --- chill with the Palin bashing, and focus on valid criticisms, ones that don't underline potential problems that Obama has had to deal with himself.

by swissffun 2008-08-29 05:59PM | 0 recs
Re: Olive branch....

Two points:

1) Kaine and Jindal and Crist (and Pawlenty, and many others) were heavily bashed for having no foreign policy experience. In fact, a lot of people were salivating over Pawlenty as VP nominee because Biden would be so strong against him in the debate. Palin manages to be even worse on foreign policy than the rest, because of her extremely limited statewide (and lack of national) experience.

2) Agree, to a large extent, about the beauty-queen bashing. There is no way the Obama campaign wins with that line, and I don't believe they'll ever make it. However, the media's going to play it up, and it will matter to some people.

One major problem it poses for McCain is that there's already a narrative out there about McCain being sexist and very poor on women's issues. Nominating a woman who would absolutely not be on anyone's shortlist were she different by a chromosome, when there are plenty of well-qualified Republican women out there, doesn't help with that narrative at all.

by Texas Gray Wolf 2008-08-29 07:53PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

I personally prefer that the laws be executed by a lawyer rather than by a fisherman or fisherwoman, but I suppose I can see the alternative point of view.

If I was looking for salmon I would DEFINITELY go with Palin.  Although I seem to recall Hillary has some experience with Alaskan salmon...

by Steve M 2008-08-29 05:11PM | 0 recs
McCain/Palin will be a tough ticket to beat

But that's why you've got to work harder than ever before to get Obama elected.

by Zzyzzy 2008-08-29 05:11PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

"Creationism.  If Democrats attack her on creationism they risk a religion war and depending on the composition of the undecideds that may be a problem.  There are lots of ways to say intelligent design should be taught that American's won't not be scared of."

Now, this is ludicrous.  I'd venture to say that of the subgroup of dumbshits who think intelligent design should be taught in schools, 99.9% of them are never, ever going to vote for Barack Obama.  Palin's extreme wingnut positions will only alienate undecided voters.

by JK47 2008-08-29 05:13PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

hmmm guess a majority of Americans are 'dumbasses' then --- most polls clearly show that a majority believe in creationism.

by swissffun 2008-08-29 05:15PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

Let me clarify..

The mojority of americans are not dumbasses for believing in creationism.  The majority of american dumbasses believe that Creation "Science" should be taught in science class.  99.9% of these dumbasses will not vote for Obama.  No loss there.

by Why Not 2008-08-29 05:41PM | 0 recs
Re: Here's my link

That calls you on your BS.  "most Americans believe in creationism"

http://www.livescience.com/history/08010 2-evolution-teaching.html

Where's yours?

by LtWorf 2008-08-29 05:44PM | 0 recs
Re: Here's my link

you beat me to it....

Well done...

by JenKinFLA 2008-08-29 05:52PM | 0 recs
Re: Here's my link

The cheese stands alone:

The Following Users Have Recommended This Diary:
swissffun

by venician 2008-08-29 06:39PM | 0 recs
Re: Here's my link

I'm stunned...

I'm shocked...

Oh wait,

I'm not...

by JenKinFLA 2008-08-29 06:53PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

i completely agree that the immediate jubilation here is really disconcerting. the experience attacks are really dangerous. your take on the abortion issue is smack on --- she's walked the walk so to speak on that with her new son. she's definitely down-to-earth in a way the other 3 are not. her bio is going to be appealing, no 2 ways about it.

she's already seeming to be a media darling. we know how that works.

and lest we forget, Bush Sr was way behind after the Democratic Party convention in 1988, chose a bland bumbling senator as a pander to the evangelicals, and he won. she's got much more personality than Quayle. This is one to NOT underestimate.

Ignore is a great recommendation.

by swissffun 2008-08-29 05:14PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer
And Obama's news cycle, praising his FABULOUS speech, lasted 12 hours - and that balloon was deflated. Now the news is all the Republicans. The end of the bounce, I would imagine.
Rove has played this very well.
Now if Obama had chosen Hillary.....
by Marjoriest 2008-08-29 06:35PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

It would still be done genius...

The media is always looking for or inventing the next story...

by JenKinFLA 2008-08-29 06:54PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

[blockquote]4)  Abortion.  People are not generally scared of the person who wants very much to protect life especially if she has taken the hits herself which Palin has.  But in attacking a sincere position with pro-choice the question becomes how pro choice?  Many pro choice variants don't sell well either to the public or to the left wing of the democratic party.[/blockquote]

simple

Bring up her position about forcing young teens who are victims of rape or incest to carry to term.

The majority of Americans would be horrified by this

by colebiancardi 2008-08-29 05:15PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

This is the dumbest diary in the universe.

I have now found the universal reference for ultimate stupidity.

Thank you.  I now know my purpose.

by Stipes 2008-08-29 05:17PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

And now we know where dtaylor really stands. Fool me once.................

by venician 2008-08-29 06:35PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

Attack McCain.  Construe this as an impulsive act in hiring someone with no national/international experience (no I don't think it'll backfire) and reflective of McCain's poor judgment.

by Drummond 2008-08-29 05:25PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

Pros

  1. Not a qualification for office or relevant
  2. OK
  3. How?
  4. Bright and shiny isn't a qualification for office
  5. "He got someone worse than him" isn't a selling point
  6. That's from the whole "hasn't done a lot" thing.
  7. And? I'm not saying normal folks can't be governors or Senators or Presidents, but someone who's worked hard, gone to school and had achievements for themselves shouldn't have their hard work used against them.

Cons

  1. There's lacking experience and then there's lacking qualifications. She wasn't assessed by voters. We don't know how she'll react under pressure. She said she hadn't thought about the Iraq War (with a son going there?!?). That's not just missing experience, that's missing qualifications.
  2. There's a difference between defending your sis and exploiting governmental resources to punish your ex-brother-in-law. BTW, who wrote the letter of recommendation so her ex-brother-in-law could get the job in the first place?
  3. Creationists are Republicans. Or, at the very least, the vast vast majority of them. However, say you want to teach religion in school and a lot of people get the hinkies.
  4. She's got pro-life cred. That's good for her. But it's one thing to say "I couldn't get an abortion" and "you can't get an abortion".

by TCQuad 2008-08-29 05:29PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

Attack McCain.  "For months, John McCain has been saying that his time in Washington is the most important qualification to being President.  I guess he was just kidding."

by bosdcla14 2008-08-29 05:57PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

That is a much better angle.

But she is shiny so that is not how it will play out...

by dtaylor2 2008-08-29 06:02PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

What the fuck is this, Firefly? What makes a politician "shiny"? Did she fall in a vat of Mr. Clean?

by Cincinnatus 2008-08-29 06:33PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

I think dtaylor2 just gets distracted easily...

"oooh look, something shiny...!"

by JenKinFLA 2008-08-29 06:56PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

But it is precisely because Barack was "shiny" and "new" that he is the dem nominee

by Bornagaindem 2008-08-29 09:20PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

MMmmm, mmmm,,hmmm.

Man.

Just a thought. dtaylor was originally for Sen. Clinton. During the primaries her choice, I think, was busy looking at how to argue against Sen. Obama. You folks might not like what she has to say, but, she brings a fresh pair of eyes. Can show you Sen. Obama's  GE campaign from the outside looking in. I should think you would be asking questions. I am.

Dtaylor2, I would love to know what you are thinking.

I'm also interested in electing a female candidate for president.

I realize that right now folks are being a might bit snippy but I'm interested.

How're the poll numbers today?

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:13AM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

Would you come to 12 dogs and talk to me about strategy? I'm interested in what you have to say. And since I don't know these other fellas, I'm not exactly gonna quake in my boots if they don't talk to me or not.

But what you're saying makes sense.

I have a diary about getting a woman in the White House.

I realize that the GE is a priority but maybe you'd rather talk where you won't get "beat up on" for having an opinion.

I love a heated debate but I don't put up with BS.

I'm not here at mtDD all the time but will be here more often next week.

LOL You are real and not someone's alter ego, correct?
Gotta love the internet. Where else would you have to ask if a person is even a reality or not.

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:21AM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama

Yep, John made a smart pick. She's a born again and the mother of a handicapped child.  She'll win those pug women who were upset about the sexism but didn't agree with Hillary's ideas.  In a way they're doing to him what he did to Hillary, running another minority candidate who is hard to attack.  She gets sympathy on many fronts.  Barack has his work cut out for him, and to start with he needs to ignore her, not shoot from the hip.  Funny how good advice is turned into something unpleasant.  You have to look at her and figure out how to run against her.  Ignoring her will at least keep him from making mistakes.  I'm not sure there is a good way, the more he talks about her the more those pug women will come out to defend her. He's been checked, but he's nor running against her ,he's running against John and he ought not be distracted.  She doesn't need more publicity.  

by anna shane 2008-08-29 05:59PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama

This is the head line at No Quarter where anna is a front page poster:

Bring it On Barky

by venician 2008-08-29 06:47PM | 0 recs
not enough hate?

so you can encourage him to speak first and think later because I don't think NQ is racist?  Is it really a headline, bring it on barky, or did you make that up?  

by anna shane 2008-08-29 07:44PM | 0 recs
Re: not enough hate?

It's the title of a front page "story". But you know that already.

by venician 2008-08-29 09:19PM | 0 recs
Re: not enough hate?

are you really that dumb?  

by anna shane 2008-08-30 11:19AM | 0 recs
Are YOU?

<quote>no (0.00 / 0)
there's a difference between being pro-Hillary and anti-Barack.  If you're anti-Barack you are necessarily for his opponent.  But, all is not lost, you can call him out on where you think he's all wet.  
</quote>

http://alegrescorner.soapblox.net/showDi ary.do;jsessionid=A2C8A3138503A98411DC7B 3752707D46?diaryId=866

by Reaper0Bot0 2008-08-30 01:43PM | 0 recs
Re: Are YOU?

now what can you find in that to cite hate?  Now I'm just confused.  All wet is hardly hate speech.  hate speech is suggesting that Hillary wanted the nomination over his dead body.  There is a big difference between acknowledging a person's right to critique a candidate but not their right to blog for McCain on a Democratic site.  

by anna shane 2008-08-30 02:19PM | 0 recs
Re: Are YOU?

Sigh and yet another Democrat gets run out the door.

Anna Shane is one of the Clinton supports ya'll are supposed to win over not verbally "beat about the head".

Sheesh.

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:24AM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama

She's already inciting a backlash among moderate Republican women. She plays well to the conservative base, there's no question of that. But moderate Republicans are going to have a lot of problems with this choice. There are many qualified, experienced Republican women who McCain could have chosen. That he picked just about the least experienced one says a lot about him -- and none of what it says is good for his chances.

by Texas Gray Wolf 2008-08-29 08:00PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama

maybe, I hope so, but I don't think so.  I think he's already sewed up the conservative base who want to defeat Barack, anyone could see that one coming, those guys stick together, unlike us, where some of us get chewed up and spit out for not useful purpose.  I think he just picked up some more support. I know pug women and I know some born-agains, and nothing rational will make them think this is anything but god-given. she has a handicapped child, she didn't abort, how's that for what they believe in.  We don't agree, but they sure do.  

by anna shane 2008-08-29 08:40PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama

Those people were already going to vote for McBush. Picking her only emphasises the weakness in his foundation. If he has to pick a rabid evangelical he knows he hasn't unified his own base.

by venician 2008-08-29 09:22PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama

he polled that 80 percent of registered pugs will vote for him. He knows that he needs more and he doesn't expect to lose any with her.  He expects to get a great number of evangelical women who think terminating a pregnancy for any reason will vote for him and then pray that he dies.  

by anna shane 2008-08-30 11:22AM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama

"He expects to get a great number of evangelical women who think terminating a pregnancy for any reason will vote for him and then pray that he dies.  "

This is a fuzzy sentiment.  I mean really, good Cristian women praying that the top of the ticket of the party they support should die.  Doesn't seem very Cristian to wish on anyone, let alone the leader of your own party.

All of this and McCain is expecting this to happen?

Maybe I'm missing something here.

by Why Not 2008-08-30 10:14PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

She was also a monumentally shitty mayor who ran the economy of Wasilia into the ground.  She built a sports arena that was a blatant vanity project, then screwed up the land deal, costing her small town a cool $1M.  She's an incompetent joke, and this will be revealed in due time.

She's a shallow, cynical pick and she will crash and burn.

by JK47 2008-08-29 05:59PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

Actually, it was closer to $1.7 million.

by kjblair2 2008-08-29 06:31PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

So they elected her governor.

by Marjoriest 2008-08-29 06:37PM | 0 recs
It's Alaska

She ran on a "reform" platform against Frank Murkowski in a crowded primary.  Then she beat Tony Knowles, who had his own issues.

Palin came in as a reformer, not a competent manager. And she passed an ethics bill. But she soon fell into the typical Alaskan corruption tradition by supporting the Bridge to Nowhere pork (though she claims to have opposed it) and by lying about firing the Public Safety Commissioner. Her approval rating dropped from 90% to 67%. It's still high, but Alaskans measure corruption in relative terms.

by elrod 2008-08-29 09:01PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

I've noticed more and more insane posts on MyDD as I've been gone for a few days. It appears the Republicans have sent over more and more trolls to try to stir up the hornets nest.

Don't be fooled. Any woman who supported Hillary is not going to be stupid enough to buy this charade. They couldn't have picked a female I could identify less with. What a joke.

And don't get me started on believing that Republicans picked her because they're pro-women. I work in a completely republican-male dominated industry and that idea is hysterical to me.

Wow - I'm really not sure where they're going with this one but I think it's a major miscalculation on their part.

by Dari 2008-08-29 06:03PM | 0 recs
You just don't get it. Trolls usually don't.

All of your arguements sound like they come out of the R playbook, without checking for typos.

In no particular order,

1. She is entitled to do what she chooses with her own body, but the fact that at 45 she chose to conceive and carry a child and that that child had Downs' Syndrome was her choice. Nothing in that gives her or you any right to force the same choice on even one other woman anywhere. She can do what she wants with her life, but not with mine.

2. Creationism. Oooooooh. Big boogie? Nope. There was huge criticism when the two went to Saddleback because of excessive intermixing of government and religion.  And if she wants creationism in the public schools, she will also have to have her children, if they go to public schools, listen to the Hindu story, and the Buddhist story and all sorts of other stories which are not hers and which she won't want, because not only does the Constitution prohibit intermixing of state and religion, it provides no preference for HER religion, so they will get all of them if they get any of them.

3. Corruption. Wrong again. What voters do not want to see is a state official using her official state power to abuse those against whom she has personal grievances. It doesn't matter what the grievance was. And the story of what allegedly happened is not a proven one. For example, while the Gov's sister charged her ex used a taser on their son, another story in the AK press is that it was not on at usable power and the kid wanted to try it to see what it felt like. I'm not getting directly into that but you better do a whole lot more homework before trying that.

4. No experience. Wrong again. If you criticize O for having twelve years in the state legislature and getting good things done and three years in the senate when beginning,  as having no experience, she started running for VP form a website when she was less than a year in the governor's chair, and before that was on a state panel while mayor of a small town where one of her self noted signal achievements was getting a bike dealer to donate a helmet with a face guard on it. Her defenders claim she can be commander in chief because she visited Iraq once and because she is technically the commander of the Alaska National Guard, without observing if it has once been called up or done anything other than spend a little money during her Gubernatorial service. Her foreign policy experience as listed by her supporters is that trip to Iraq,  and what they say is unspecificed dealings with Russia, because of where she is. Nothing is mentioned about the jobs exporting deal she made wiht Canada, of course.

You also say she's pretty, bright and shiny. One word for you. OINK.

She's not a lawyer, but allegedly a fisherwoman. Was she doing that while in the statehouse by any chance, and who was minding the store.

this is just an unusually sexist troll diary, and a total waste of time. Must be a republican troll because progressive trolls are not this oink-worthy.

by Christy1947 2008-08-29 06:13PM | 0 recs
Re: You just don't get it. Trolls usually don't.

"You also say she's pretty, bright and shiny. One word for you. OINK. "

There is nothing chauvnistic about that. I heard that sentiment from a couple of women too. They are very impressed when they heard her speak in the clips they show on tv and they have no intention of voting for McCain. They are going to be voting Obama in Novemenber.

by Pravin 2008-08-29 06:18PM | 0 recs
Re: OINK

It is when you list them that high on your list of good things about her. Women, at least those my age,  even when we were her age and younger, seek to be considered on the quality of their thought and performance, not whether they are cute or well dressed or 'charming' or whether they have runs in their stockings. Even before the poster's other comments, the order of listing makes clear that the quality of her thought and performance is not on his mind.

And 'truth' when it comes to questionable comments is the last refuge of a knave. Every sexist and racist and ageist and anti-Gay is certain he or she is telling the truth so it is OK. It's not ok.

by Christy1947 2008-08-30 09:45AM | 0 recs
Re: OINK

I am not bothered by your opinions on sexism because your view that as a woman you are the arbitrator of sexism is itself inherently sexist.

The use of the word shiny should have tipped you off.

She is not actually shiny.  So why did I use the word shiny?  It wasn't an accident.  

If you want to be judged on the quality of your mind then your mind needs to be quality.

I support Hillary Clinton because her mind is quality.  I reject your commentary because at least on this issue yours isn't.

by dtaylor2 2008-09-01 12:37PM | 0 recs
Re: OINK

Disagree, disagree, disagree with you dtaylor2

"bright and shiney" is a phrase to describe someone who's not been "pockmarked" but the political grime. Looks innocent.

Not arguing wheither she is or not just arguing the perception.

Actually, I'm also trying to remember where I heart that phrase used...

and I remember! Grey's Anatomy, character Meridith Grey. She was always using the phrase.

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:33AM | 0 recs
Re: OINK

"...where I heart that phrase used..."

should read

"...where I heard that phrase used..."

I wasn't trying to be clever with the spelling.

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:35AM | 0 recs
Attacking McCain is the key

I dont care for dtaylor's history here. But he is actually right on this issue.

I do think Democrats need to realize that just as Palin is going to be unashamed of her ideology and sell it well, Obama needs to get his head out of his ass and take his good convention spoeech tone and use it on the campaign trail. He should not be shy about attacking McCain during debates about how his iraq war has bankrupted the nation in more ways than one.

THE ELECTION WILL BE WON WITH OUR PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE AGAINST THEIRS- NOT THE VP CANDIDATES.

by Pravin 2008-08-29 06:15PM | 0 recs
Dtaylor is a man

Oh that's fucking beautiful. A guy telling women like me about sexism while practically jerking himself off about the thought of McCain choosing a female - any female - as VP.

Thank you for that information.

by BrighidG 2008-08-29 06:40PM | 0 recs
Re: Dtaylor is a man

I reject your sexist view that as a woman you are the arbitrator of sexism.

by dtaylor2 2008-09-01 12:40PM | 0 recs
Wrong, but what's your point anyway?

I don't understand the point of this diary at all.  I mean, if Hillary Clinton had been the nominee, you could have written a completely identical post, except, obviously, for number 2 (she's a woman, the one thing she has going for her, and the reason she was picked).

I mean, if this were Hillary/Bayh, would Palin suddenly become ugly?  Would she NOT make McCain look less extreme by comparison?  Would Hillary Clinton magically become less rich, or not a lawyer?

Fundamentally you make no sense.

by Jess81 2008-08-29 06:24PM | 0 recs
That's what I would do
just ignore her and attack McCain.  Her lack of quals will provoke a backlash (along with Obama's pick of Biden, this unqualified VP selection by McCain has caused me to switch from McCain to Obama/Biden), and the Dems don't need to touch it for that to happen.  
Dems should counterattack on the experience issue if there are any more attacks on Obama on the experience issue, but my guess is that McCain doesn't believe it is a winner anymore (otherwise Palin would not have been selected.)
Other than that, I think it is a waste of energy to attack Palin, when McCain can be attacked.  VPs don't usually change the game, and this is no different.  Bentsen could win it for Dukakis, and Quayle (much more qualified than Palin) could not lose it for Bush I.
by Clintonite4McCainA 2008-08-29 06:32PM | 0 recs
Well that's how it goes

Lieberman is still my ideal kind of guy, very hawkish on foreign policy, liberal on domestic policy.  But in politics, you never get anyone who fits you perfectly, so you have to compromise.

I prefer Obama on domestic issues over McCain by a lot, and Palin's selection makes that even more so.  I prefer McCain on foreign policy by a lot over Obama, but Biden, while I still disagree with his foreign policy approach, is someone that I consider reasonable.  

Regarding leadership, McCain takes a real hit in my view by picking Palin.  There is nothing to consider her even somewhat qualified to be President.  Nothing.  And given McCain's age, his VP selection is one of extreme irresponsibility.

One thing about Obama that a lot of people forget regarding experience, is that he has spent 18 months on the campaign trail.  This guy is a very different candidate today than in January 2007, and while I still am uncomfortable with his level of experience on foreign affairs, he is better versed there than he was 18 months ago.  Palin doesn't have that.

by Clintonite4McCainA 2008-08-30 04:34AM | 0 recs
dt

seems you are back to being "concerned".

I am taking a few days to digest this vp pick. It is good to see the netroots digging into her past.

I think she will be a flop but I am also a little nervous as to how it will play out.

by kevin22262 2008-08-29 06:35PM | 0 recs
You are incredibly sexist

You do not care one whit about this woman, her stances (anti-abortion, anti-science, anti-gay rights) or her beliefs (Dominionism).

All you care about is what is between her legs. Not her ears. As long as she has a vagina and Obama doesn't it's all good for you?

Do not ever call yourself a feminist or a progressive because you are neither. You are myopic, sexist person who cares about little but your own hurt feelings.

You and everyone like you are disgusting.

by BrighidG 2008-08-29 06:38PM | 0 recs
Re: You are incredibly sexist

hmmm Bitter? Much? Yes.

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:38AM | 0 recs
Attack McCain

Attack McCain's judgement, Begala takes a crack. He barely mentions Palin and sticks to comparing her to McCain's alternatives.

by souvarine 2008-08-29 06:59PM | 0 recs
Number 1

She's pretty!

Worked so well for John Edwards

by notedgeways 2008-08-29 07:57PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and

No offense, but I wouldn't trust your political instincts to run for town dogcatcher.

by rfahey22 2008-08-29 08:03PM | 0 recs
Obama has no answer.

"Pretty"? "Bright and shiny"? Glad to see the sort of things you consider qualifications.

McCain with his choice has totally invalidated the only actual argument he had, that of greater experience. It was the only remaining argument he had and he totally blew it, proving himself an irresponsible hypocrite.

by Aris Katsaris2 2008-08-29 08:16PM | 0 recs
Re: Obama has no answer.

I don't think that dtaylor2 is saying that she would vote for Gov Palin. I think that she is saying OTHER people would vote for her because of the "...bright and shiney...", she's just like us argument.

Ya'll it's not about whou YOU vote for.  It's about who you convince all those other voters to vote for. And yes, some who see this and yes some who see Gov Palin will  say "...bright and shiney..."

dtaylor brings an 'outsider looking in" perspective from a place where she doesn't want to stomp on you when she finds your weeknesses.

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:44AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama has no answer.

"...weekness..." should be "...weakness..."

sigh typo mean time for a walk.

Back later.

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 10:46AM | 0 recs
It's an unserious pick

Conservative evangelicals might be thrilled. But conservatives on foreign policy are horrified. Read Charles Krauthammer's reaction for an example. He calls it suicide.

You don't understand that experience alone isn't what's lacking with Sarah Palin. She just has no national profile whatsoever. She has no opinions on major national or international issues. Nobody knows her vision for the country.  She doesn't even have a position on Iraq.

Experience per se is a canard. Engagement with national issues, though experience, analysis, activism or study is what makes somebody qualified. Palin doesn't measure up.

by elrod 2008-08-29 09:07PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone and Obama has no answer

good post - it will be interesting to see if she is up to the challenge.

Compelling personal story , no experience, definitely not a Washington insider hmmm sounds a lot like Obama to me. But he is somehow ready and she is not. Oh I get it -no Y chromosome.

by Bornagaindem 2008-08-29 09:31PM | 0 recs
Blah Blah Blah

I concede her time (All 600 days of it) as governor as experience, but to make the claim that being mayor of a town of 9,000 people has anything to do at all as "experience" is laughable. Even more absurd is the idea that at the very worst, Sarah Palin and Barack Obama are equally inexperienced.

Obama is freaking Daniel Webster compared to Sarah Palin. He served 7 years in the Illinois Senate, representing a district 1/3rd smaller than the entire State of Alaska. Everyone here knows what types of bills and such he has helped to get passed in the US Senate in his time there. He was a community organizer, editor of the Harvard Law Review; it's deceitful to act as if they are both on par and down right deranged to say, as I saw some GOP black ops people say tonight, that she is more experienced than Obama.

by JENKINS 2008-08-29 10:13PM | 0 recs
Re: Palin cuts to the bone

Hello again,

Have you read this diary?

http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/9/9/12554 5/4318#24

What are your thoughts?

by 12 dogs and a blog 2008-09-09 11:03AM | 0 recs

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