Big stuff Dean said at TBA conference. Ignored.

This will be the only Dean-comment related post promoted to the front page, so say your peace here. For the record, I don't think Edwards owes Dean anything. All he said was that he disagreed with Dean--how dare he! The person who really needs to be ashamed is the AP reporter who characterized Edwards' comments as "criticism"in the headline of the orignal piece.

As far as apologies go, Biden might be another story. However, as both a moderate and probably the only person in history to have been a Senator for the majority of his life, he seems to live for the Sunday morning talk shows. Such places are about the only forums in the world where this stuff matters. Anyway, we shouldn't have been spending so much time discussing this, since discussion on these sorts of topics are almost always self-defeating.

As far as what Dean actually said, I think these comments speak for themselves--Chris

Of course they had to ignore it. It was too important.  So they all jump on one statement which I will put in the next post.  Here is part of the transcript from TBA, when all hell broke loose because Howard Dean criticized Republicans.

        SNIP..." And it wasn't enough for the president to try to wreck the public pension system that we had.  It wasn't enough for him to try to turn over Social Security to the same people who brought us Enron -- his good friends and political contributors -- that wasn't enough.  Now we find out that under this president's watch, private pension plans have been grossly underfunded.  What does this president want?  Don't Americans deserve, after a long life of work, don't they deserve a retirement with dignity and security?  I think that they do.  (Cheers, applause.)  

         This week the Labor Department estimated that in 2004 underfunding of pension plans grew to $450 billion.  Sixty percent of companies take advantage of outdated accounting rules to avoid making annual contributions.  The president wants to take away our Social Security, and then he's going to take away the private pension plans too?  What does he think ordinary Americans live on after they get to be 65 years old?  We need a president who understands working people in this country, and we will have one after 2008.  (Cheers, applause.)

  However, I said that we were not simply going to criticize the president.  We were going to make some positive suggestions as well. Here's what I think Democrats need to stand up for.  We need to have pension portability so that pensions, as we move from job to job to job, the pensions follow us, they don't stay in the company.  (Cheers, applause.)  That great Democrat Jim Jeffords has been introducing this for 15 years.  (Laughter.) George Bush has had his chance to fix the pension programs in this country.  He has failed to do it.  We need a new president and a new Congress who will fix the private pension plans.  (Cheers, applause).  

         We ought not to allow people like Ken Lay to loot the pension plans of America while their companies are going down.  Pension plans ought not to be controlled by companies.  They ought to be controlled by the people who those pensions belong to, that's the working people of America.  (Cheers, applause).  Enron began around the time the president took office.  Forty thousand Americans lost their pensions; another tens of thousands, just last week when the courts took away    the United Airlines workers' pensions. This is a serious problem.  The president has had his time; he has done nothing.  Let the Democrats try to fix the pension program. We have a positive plan with portability and independent control outside these corporations who abuse the money.  This is stealing to let pension plans go down.  That money does not belong -- (cheers, applause) -- that money does not belong to these companies who are bailing themselves out of bankruptcies; it belongs to the people who they promised it to in their contract. It has been set aside. We want these pensions in America to be independently run so that they are not looted in the throes of bankruptcy while CEOs make $30 million and $40 million a year.  That is wrong.  (Applause.)  They have had their chance.

Tags: (all tags)



Here is what he said about voting.
Even in Edwards' statement at his One America blog today, he seems totally unaware of Dean's actual words or context. He seems to still be chiding, but it is better than saying nothing.    

There is simply nothing wrong with these words.  Even if the media says so, there is just nothing wrong with them. They are powerful words, and it is tiresome to see such nitpicking.  Dean was grinning the whole time, it was a powerful speech.  I just get so tired of this spin and ignoring of the good stuff.

SNIP..."I think, frankly, we ought to have voting on -- either make the Tuesday a holiday or else move it to another day where people don't -- (cheers, applause) -- can get out and vote.  

         You -- (applause continues) -- you know, the idea that you have to wait on line for eight hours to cast your ballot in Florida -- there's something the matter with that.  You think people can work all day and then pick up their kids at child care or wherever, and get home and then have a -- still manage to sandwich in an eight-hour vote?  Well, Republicans, I guess, can do that, because a lot of them have never made an honest living in their lives.  (Light applause.) But for ordinary working people, who have to work eight hours a day, they have kids, they got to get home to those kids, the idea of making them stand for eight hours to cast their ballot for democracy is wrong.  We ought to make voting easier to do.  Mail -- Oregon has got it right.  (Applause.)

         And we ought to have a law, like Oregon, that says you may not use a voting machine unless it can be recounted by hand.  (Cheers, extended applause.) "

by concerned democrat 2005-06-06 02:33PM | 0 recs
You want them to actually listen to what the man has to say??? And, like, actually report it???

What planet are you from?

You must believe in fairy tales like truth, honesty, integrity, Mom, apple pie, baseball (oops, scratch baseball), and the American Way.

Heaven forbid anyone in the media or that portion of the Democratic Party "leadership" that is so frightened of him (and us) actually pay attention to the truth and honesty and good idears that the man actually talks about. Heaven forbid that they take his actual statements and build on them to make their own points and score their own points against the Republicans. Even if they disagree with him it would be easy to say "Well you know I don't quite agree with Howard but the Republicans... X... Y... and Z."

Anyone ever teach these guys how to identify their real enemy and go on the attack against their actual enemy? Or do they think that we, the American People, are their enemy?


by Andrew C White 2005-06-06 03:12PM | 0 recs
I hear you, Andrew C. White.
The nerve of me.  LOL
by concerned democrat 2005-06-06 03:44PM | 0 recs
The Media is our enemy
That is what John Edwards and a lot of Democrats still do not understand. There is absolutely no difference between Tim Russert, Chris Matthews and Robert Novak. They are three peas in a pod.

The difference between M$M reporting on Clinton and Bush is astounding. The media hounded Clinton on Whitewater for four years and were Ken Starr sockpuppets.

Bush is leading the most corrupt administration in American history and they don't have a harsh word to say about anybody in his administration. They are barely critical of Tom DeLay, who is setting new standards for low behavior in Congress.

Bob Somerby has been preaching to the blogosphere choir for years, but the Democrats still don't get it. They treat the media like they were their good buddies and get burnt time and time again.

The media is our enemy. No matter what the offense, IOKIYAR.

by Gary Boatwright 2005-06-06 05:05PM | 0 recs
Re: The Media is our enemy

There are a significant number of
bloggers here in this space that
are working for the Time/Warners
of the world.

I am laughing my ass off today.
A very conservative firm in New
York took the cash position of
GOOGLE, and added their assets
discounting most of their good will
(a valuation based on their bitchiness
 because Google took pains to do
 a dutch auction IPO, whichi excluded
 Mr. Investment banker.)

Then they marked up all those
SPE transactions at Time/Warner,
and gave them the best possible light..

And Time/Warners valuation came
out to be 79 billion, and Google -
corporate valuation: 80 billion.

This is a permanent change of events.
No amount of skipping channels
when the commercials are on,
or fast forwarding past those
ever-increasingly obnoxious
previews in your DVD's
(here's a hint - instead of pressing
 menu, press STOP twice, then play -)
or their utterly obscene fascination
with controlling their editorial
staff to make sure the headlines
are all sensationalism, and keep
the advertisers frothy....

Will ever save this company. I promise
you. The entire entertainment-news-
media industry is a bad buy. You're
much better off these days getting
yourself a solid T1 with a good block
of static IP addresses and sitting
back and enjoying the fireworks
because it gets worse from here
for those guys.

The only thing I have to laugh about
is that they still have people assigned
to Dean. Right now, there's no
convincing news that he's come up with
a viable 2006 strategy. Thats the
biggest thing the dems want to
cover up. A bunch of local yokels
running, that have no experience -
not the way to win. As it stands,
The dems lose big time in 06. Someone
in the party needs to find a way to fix

You can't put lipstick on a pig.

by turnerbroadcasting 2005-06-07 03:46AM | 0 recs
only one thing to do
I'm sending the DNC more money.
by history prof 2005-06-06 07:19PM | 0 recs
A prof after my own heart.
Great idea.  
by concerned democrat 2005-06-06 07:34PM | 0 recs
Re: A prof after my own heart.
will send nothing to anyone until we
see the special interest groups
permanently disenfranchised.

Dean speaking up about the dem victory
on social security does NOT release
him from the fact that his campaign
went through 40 million like it
was water

No thanks. I vowed never to give
Dean another dollar until he shows
he can win. He has zero candidates
I'm interested in right now.

Barak Obama gets cash wired
to his account. I pay the fees.
Dean gets a polite smile
and a memo from my desk saying,
show me the candidates.

by turnerbroadcasting 2005-06-07 03:51AM | 0 recs
Chris, I do differ on one issue with you.
I think the issue is not so much that Edwards did not "agree" with Dean....I think it is more that he responded based on the media interpretation.

Even in his response posted at One America, he does not seem that aware of Dean's TBA speech.

Everyone can disagree, but they should not do it publicly like that.   They showed Edwards saying it on CNN today, and it did sound odd.  

I think it was more that he allowed the media to frame it and took their word for what Dean said.
We can not do that anymore.  

by concerned democrat 2005-06-06 08:01PM | 0 recs
Re: Chris, I do differ on one issue with you.
Thats because Edwards makes every attempt
to cozy up to broadcast media news-entertainment
that he can. He wants to keep his own
South Carolina base dumbed down like
Fox News style morons.

Q: Why did BMW build their new auto plant
   in South Carolina.

A: Near unlimited supply of crash test dummies.

People that assume the news-entertainment-media
darlings have the power to do what they do
actually create the problem we all have
to solve. Its just the assumption that
those corporations have the power,
reinforced by guys like Edwards - that
makes it so difficult for McCain Feingold
to mean anything.

McCain promised to take on campaign
reform and he delivered, and now its
up to us to complete the work.

Edwards? No thanks. Its special
interest CITY

by turnerbroadcasting 2005-06-07 03:55AM | 0 recs
Turner, I must give you credit.
You simply dislike everyone equally.
An equal-opportunity disliker.
by concerned democrat 2005-06-07 09:06AM | 0 recs
I was going to use another five-letter "T" word, but you spared me the effort.

Lovely how this thread got derailed from the important content of Dean's speech -- rather like letting the MSM continue to do their malicious, insipid coverage.

But that might explain the nom de plume,  "turnerbroadcasting"...

by RayneToday 2005-06-07 09:29AM | 0 recs
Re: Turner, I must give you credit.
That's not exactly true. turnerbroadcasting likes Oryx and Crake.
by Gary Boatwright 2005-06-07 12:59PM | 0 recs
Hallelulia & Amen - Pass the Ammunition!
COBRA travels: PENSIONS must travel with the employee! This is real good Democratic Platform material! Keep this going. Don't let this one die.
by GreyLion 2005-06-06 08:12PM | 0 recs
Link to videos and transcripts from TBA conference
Take Back America conference 2005

If you missed it on C-Span, you can catch up here.  

by concerned democrat 2005-06-06 08:39PM | 0 recs
It's a Basic Power Struggle
The Democrats who voted for the war are trying to keep in control of the Party.  They want to make sure that the "radical" elements pushing for crazy ideas like peace and national health care and maintaining an uncompromising position on Social Security don't get into power and ruin the America that Bush has built.  
by steve expat 2005-06-06 09:29PM | 0 recs
Re: It's a Basic Power Struggle
its not about the war, its about the


by turnerbroadcasting 2005-06-07 04:01AM | 0 recs
Re: It's a Basic Power Struggle
PS. This doesn't necessarily make our boys
over there stormtroopers. Yet.
by turnerbroadcasting 2005-06-07 04:13AM | 0 recs
Edwards response on his website
Whether you argee with Edwards or not, but his response at his blog is very effective and is a good indicator for democrats to realize that yeah leaders make mistakes (both Dean and Edwards could've been more tactful) but there is no point in playing to the media's theory and starting trashing our own, as some dem bloggers are doing.  

I encourage everyone to read John Edwards' statement, which stop the silliness of Dems trying to get each other:

"We Agree: Working Americans Let Down by the Republican Party"

"What a flap has arisen over a disagreement about the way something is said! I was in Nashville over the weekend, thanking the good people of Tennessee who supported the Democratic presidential ticket this year, when I was asked whether I thought that it was fair to say that people who were Republican hadn't done a good day's work.  Of course, I didn't think so, and I said that.  I don't think our DNC chair, Howard Dean, would put it that way again if asked either.  I disagreed with him, and I said so.  And, I want to be clear, I would have to say so again if I were asked again. I said a lot of good things about Howard's outreach program and invigoration of the internet as a communication and fundraising tool, but no one wrote about that.  Instead the headlines blared that I disagreed with Howard. And then the flap arose: A chasm! A split! A revolt!

Instead, how about: Nonsense!
We are both talking about the Republicans and their failure to address the needs of working people. We both agree with this basic truth: This Republican president and this Republican majority are not doing what they should be doing for working people in this country. That's a core belief we need to fight for.  And what's more, we agree that we - all Democrats and all working people - should be complaining, criticizing, and generally speaking out about this critical failure of the Republican party and offering our positive vision for America.  And we have.

Howard and I have been saying the same thing about this for years.  Hear that? The same thing. For years. Have I ever put it some way that Howard wouldn't agree with?  Probably. And he put it in a way, once, just the other day, that I can't agree with, since I come from a place where hard-working people, who are better served by the agenda and passion of the Democrats, somehow still vote Republican.  But Howard and I are committed to a 50-state strategy that will reach out to those voters, in North Carolina, and in Kansas, and in Tennessee, across this country and tell the truth about what is happening in this country to their jobs, to their health care, to their forests and streams, to their vision of what this country is and should be.

This President is not fighting for our jobs. His administration has on numerous occasions said that the out-sourcing of American jobs is good for this country.  Well, it may be good for Wall Street, but it is lousy on Main Street. If he thinks that jobs moving overseas is good for us, why would he ever fight for American jobs?

Our labor laws have seen weak enforcement during the time we have had this Republican administration in place.  Companies that skirt this country's labor laws have gotten a slap on the hand, and even that has come too slowly.  Efforts to allow workers to choose whether to unionize have not been protected in the way that they should, and the mutually beneficial bargain between labor and management that made this country the greatest economic power in the world has been broken, all while the Republican administration and Republican majority stand idle, with their hands dug deep in their pockets.

Those working people I grew up with that I talked about earlier live where I lived, in our rural communities, which is exactly where this Republican president wants to cut broadband extension, firefighter grants and investment and market access programs that will protect our rural jobs.  The manufacturing extension program, which helps small manufacturers everywhere stay profitable - and therefore open, gets little support from this President.  How are our towns going to remain vital with policies that ignore them?  Where will the sons and daughters in our rural communities have to go to find jobs?

And this President has made choices that, if enacted by the Republican majority in Congress, will deny the opportunity to learn the skills for a new job to an untold number of Americans.  Vocational and adult education would be cut by 89%.  He wants to drastically cut adult education and retraining programs that allow American workers to better their skills either to get ahead or to get a new job when theirs leaves for overseas.

And if you happen to be a working man or woman in the United States military, this Republican president doesn't support loan forgiveness for your student loans or top quality health care when you get out of the military.

The safety net is eroding.  The ladder has been pulled up.  This is not new.  For more than two decades, the Republican Party has talked about an agenda that addresses concerns of working people while they have passed an agenda that serves the goals of the wealthiest among us. Howard and I know that these are the wrong choices for America.  We won't always use the same words.  But we will always fight the same fight: for the dignity, the respect, and the rights of those who built this country, the working people in America."

One America Committee

by DarkMiles 2005-06-06 11:55PM | 0 recs
Re: Edwards response on his website
what is this one america noise.
some person who gets paid to
"be a media strategist" decided
the blogosphere would go primary
to the internet medium, and so
the edwards folks put up a blog
post about their recent, inane, media-centered

What is edwards saying about stem cell

How about brownback blocking the
nomination of a bush nominee?

Will there be a senate filibuster,
of the Stem Cell Research bill,
Mr. Former Senator with Presidential

I hate to say it but Edwards has
always just been so empty to me.
The guy is just, so, so nice
and so, so useless...

Do you think I care about another
well staged act of media circus?

by turnerbroadcasting 2005-06-07 04:16AM | 0 recs
A shit sandwich in a perfumed package
The 100% Madison Avenue candidate. All package and no substance.
by Gary Boatwright 2005-06-07 08:47AM | 0 recs
Turner, you are doing it again.
If you are not spewing hate toward one Democrat, you are spewing on another.

Did you get lost and can't find your way home?

by concerned democrat 2005-06-07 09:49AM | 0 recs
Edwards says that Dean was right (see Kos today)

Edwards says that Dean was right (mostly) and that HE (like Dean) was misquoted.

See Daily Kos today!

by MS 2005-06-07 09:50AM | 0 recs
Biden not the only half-life senator
You're forgetting stalwart of the Southern Caucus, Richard Russell of Georgia. (Those were the days when the Democratic tent was really big!)

Russell was also the Governor of Georgia at the time of the real-life case on which 'I Was a Fugitive from a Chaing Gang' was based.

by johnsmith0903 2005-06-07 11:05AM | 0 recs


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