dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dead

oh the righteous indignation and guffawing by the right wing creeps towards this silly clinton mccain idea of a gas tax holiday...in this merriment are many so called progressives who sniff about how insignificant this measly amount of money is, how its a ruse, oh, yes, easy to mock and minimalize, which is what many of you progressives here are doing, the struggling blue collar workers, as a whole.

i recognize that many young working class peeps are for obama, as is my son, who lives on his own and he and his girlfriend are finding it tough nowadays...but he does yearn for change, i can understand that, and him being my spawn, well, i expect him to have a mind of his own, and he does....but most blue collar middle aged voters are not so sold on this change being offered.

while it might not be fiscally tidy, while it might be sneered at by folks who drive tanks posing as highway motor vehicles, drinking $5 coffee, the impact of gas, food, medical costs are killing lower class families.

i do not consider myself to be in the "lower class" particularly, i grew up on a tiny plot of earth as a farm boy, as backwards as possible, but through education and some luck i find myself living comfortably, not thrilled with my retirement prospects, i would love to have more money, but have some, more than most of my fellow citizens, but i am not that far removed from farms, small town life, hand to mouth existence, scraping by, growing your own food...and while it may be pandering to those who can afford to sneer, there are many people who hear and see who is mocking their plight, where a little less money at the pump sounds awful damn good, cause real wages are stagnant or actually dropping, so mock on elitists, while the proposal might suit your funny bone, those on the bottom might at least take pleasure that somebody, somebody, pay attention to them for a little while, and cease the endless facination with those well off and insulated from real life.

perhaps its just that i am particularly agitated this am by the phoney video smearing more clinton folks as mindless haters and thugs, the mickey kantor man on the grassy knoll video clip, such vileness from those promising change...if this is your idea of change, please keep it, i have a real life, a real son struggling to make it, even as i look at retiring to some comfort...but my heart is still with the working man...mock him at your own peril smug elitists, those who would concoct race lies...you may be writing the epitaph of the november election, when we get four more years of war, because of the idiocyntric behavior of a bunch of over priviledged elitists, well, we will know who to blame, at any rate, along with thanks for making racism the daily double of the democratic campaign..what a god awful mess

Tags: gas tax, pandering, working class blues (all tags)

Comments

67 Comments

Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

The reason we elitists sneer at the gas tax holiday is because it is brain numbingly stupid.  

If you want a stunt to give the non-elitist American $30 then just pass a tax credit.  That won't increase the price of gas or empty the Highway Fund.

Also, you should keep in mind that my fellow latte sipping, volvo driving elitists aren't stupid.  If you want to pretend this gas tax holiday idea then that is your right.  But please don't ask those of us who have actually read up on the subject to stop ridiculing you.  You deserve it.

by Blue Neponset 2008-05-03 03:51AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

nowhere did i bring up volvos...i was thinking more of the suvs hummers...lincoln navigators...not so much volvos, i know more peeps than volvo drivers like their pretentious coffee too

by blackflag 2008-05-03 05:14AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

I think you'd be very very hard pressed to find a real liberal that drives either a Hummer or a Navigator.  It's almost entirely conservatives (or the suddenly newly wealthy like actors and athletes) who drive those types of cars/tanks.

by ProgressiveDL 2008-05-03 06:20AM | 0 recs
Race baiting

the working class is comprised of all colors.

why are you only selecting "whites"

talk about an inflammatory title.

talk about playing the race card.

then clinton supports cry like a stuck pig when we call you out for playing the race card.

is this all Hillary has, racists Ronald Reagan voters?

by Al Rodgers 2008-05-03 07:45AM | 0 recs
Here's your Elitist in action.

She actually said, "do you have to put money in the machine to make it work"

by Al Rodgers 2008-05-03 07:50AM | 0 recs
Re: Here's your Elitist in action.

Thanks Al! I've been wanting to have that clip of the ELITISM of Clinton!

by Wary 2008-05-03 08:20AM | 0 recs
Re: Here's your Elitist in action.

This is stupid.  It's obvious she's in some sort of convenience store where she expects to pay at the front counter.

When did you go into an AM/PM and have to put coins into the coffee dispenser?

by wblynch 2008-05-03 11:14AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

i prefer the politically correct term "fair trade coffee"

look it up sometime.....its as pro-labor and human rights as it gets (can your democratic party handle that).

by citizendave 2008-05-03 08:57AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

Minor, short-term fluctuations in price does not impact consumption of gasoline.  This is known to economists as price-elasticity - and gasoline is very inelastic.  It is the textbook example of it.

Clinton does not pay for the tax-break by emptying the Highway Trust Fund.

Tangent: something you might want to think about - if your longterm strategy is to reduce gasoline consumption and increase reliance on other fuels, or more fuel-efficient vehicles, you had better think of a new way to fund HTF, which, even with all the gas we consume now, is not adequate.

by bobbank 2008-05-03 06:29AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

Since the spirit of the law is a use tax, we will simply transfer the tax to some other medium. The most direct form would be Tolls and Congestion Fees, but those are terrible politics. People respond better when their taxes are hidden in the price tag of goods they already buy.

by Lost Thought 2008-05-03 06:33AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

The price-elasticity of gasoline is not perfectly inelastic.  As a result, a drop in price will increase demand.  When short term supplies can not be increased as a result of an increase in demand that means prices have to change.  You cling too tightly to the idea of price elasticity.  

Also, as I have shown you in other threads, consumption of gasoline has decreased over the course of a year.  That means people have already adjusted their behavior as a result of the increased  price of gas.  That also means the price elasticity of demand is becoming more elastic not less.  As a result, short term price changes will affect demand more and more as prices increase.

Further, people can chose to purchase less gasoline without buying a prius or moving closer to their jobs.  They can telecommute, or take public transportation.  They can make fewer trips to the supermarket.  They can choose to fly to DC for vacation instead of driving to Vermont.  They can make sure their tires are properly inflated.  The totality of these little changes will affect the demand of gasoline.  

Question:

If gas prices drop by 5% in one day does that have no effect on the demand?  If your answer is yes then you are claiming the price elasticity of the demand for gasoline is perfectly inelastic.  If the answer is the demand for gas increases by 0.5%  (or some other small number) that means the price has to change to account for the fact that the short term supply of gasoline is static.  

You are clinging too tightly to price-elasticity.  Every economist I have read agrees with my basic position on this issue.  How can you reconcile that fact with your idea that the short term demand for gasoline is unaffected by price?  

by Blue Neponset 2008-05-03 06:56AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

That's a lot of false information in there.

I am contemplating writing a diary that has actual data from the U.S. Department of Energy in it, because much of what you've just said is either false or badly misunderstands the facts.

by bobbank 2008-05-03 07:45AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

I stand by my comment.  If you can knock some holes it my thinking please do.  I would enjoy discussing it with you.

by Blue Neponset 2008-05-03 08:03AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

I am working on it at the moment.  It takes a lot more time to perform real analysis then to simply re-iterate ideological talking points. :)

I am crunching data from DoE by hand.

by bobbank 2008-05-03 10:12AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

As promised:
http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/5/3/18303 9/0215

I look forward to discussing it with you.

by bobbank 2008-05-03 03:21PM | 0 recs
Let's not lose the forest for the trees

There may be some errors in the post you're responding to, but on balance it's clear that Hillary's gas tax proposal is a terrible idea.

There is no reason to believe that if it were enacted the oil companies would lower the pump price.  There isn't any more supply to be had - the producers are maxed out.  Why aren't they going to raise the price to the profit-maximizing level?  I understand Hillary says that this will be prevented by a deus ex machina - the FTC will watch the oil companies carefully to make sure they don't raise prices.  But ng they were, how likely is it they'd be caught?  Please remember who has appointed the majority of FTC members - the current President.  This is the kind of nonsense politicians always try to use to square a policy circle - like promises that we can raise hundreds of billions in revenues without raising taxes by improving IRS enforcement.  

So it's an open question whether the price would come down at all - even for a short time.  But to the extent it would, why is it foolish to believe, as Heckman and others do - all quite skilful economists - that demand would very soon impel the oil companies to push the price back to our current equilibrium point.  I see no reason.

The key to the whole situation is that over the three-month holiday you can't expand the supply of oil.

by TL 2008-05-03 08:11AM | 0 recs
Stupid delete key

The post above is meant to say:

There may be some errors in the post you're responding to, but on balance it's clear that Hillary's gas tax proposal is a terrible idea.

There is no reason to believe that if it were enacted the oil companies would lower the pump price.  There isn't any more supply to be had - the producers are maxed out.  Why aren't they going to raise the price to the profit-maximizing level?  I understand Hillary says that this will be prevented by a deus ex machina - the FTC will watch the oil companies carefully to make sure they don't raise prices.  But law would they be breaking?  And, even assuming they were breaking a law, how likely is it they'd be caught and that the sanctions would be enough to impel them to cut prices?  Please remember who has appointed the majority of FTC members - the current President.  This is the kind of nonsense politicians always try to use to square a policy circle - like promises that we can raise hundreds of billions in revenues without raising taxes by improving IRS enforcement.  

So it's an open question whether the price would come down at all - even for a short time.  But to the extent it would, why is it foolish to believe, as Heckman and others do - all quite skilful economists - that demand would very soon impel the oil companies to push the price back to our current equilibrium point.  I see no reason.

The key to the whole situation is that over the three-month holiday you can't expand the supply of oil.

by TL 2008-05-03 08:13AM | 0 recs
Re:
Frankly, I think the gas tax thing isn't going to work, although the windfall profits is a good idea, with or without the gas tax, I think Exxon should be sharing some of that 11 billion they made last quarter.
Both require legislation that simply isn't going to get passed by this Congress.
by skohayes 2008-05-03 03:54AM | 0 recs
my npr station

had interviews with sheldon silver and barney frank on yesterday.

both spoke plainly about how the suspension of the gas tax through the summer months will accomplish nothing....not to mention all the economists (including hillary's biggest cheerleader...paul krugman).

so please stop with the latte sipping, volvo driving, etc etc , so-and-so's being unsympathetic to our blue collar comrads.

i take my espresso black.

by citizendave 2008-05-03 04:01AM | 0 recs
Re: my npr station

oh my barney frank & sheldon silver...yeah, the blue collar workers respond well to those guys, sure, you just dont get it

and again, whats with the volvo outburst here...i think i have discovered it, the key to avoiding obama crazies, watch out for volvos with starbucks sipping drivers, run, run forrest run

by blackflag 2008-05-03 05:17AM | 0 recs
Re: my npr station

So you agree, that all the economists believe this is a pointless exercise and that Hillary is just playing politics for votes, because it polls well and can be given in a nice sound bite?

I see little difference between this and voting for the Iraq war because the president was so popular at that point.

by grass 2008-05-03 05:33AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

The gas tax holiday is a terrible idea, Clinton knows it is, and she is not just pandering but being stunningly cynical and demagogic.

Here's a clear statement from 150 economists, including some prominent ones from the Clinton administration and some Nobel Laureates:
http://www.politico.com/static/PPM43_080 502_list_gastax.html

by politicsmatters 2008-05-03 04:26AM | 0 recs
strange things afoot

You know, for a while I have been wondering why there has been some coordinated effort to prevent economists from telling people the truth about this tax and it's (non)effects on demand.  Heck, I learned about price-elasticity from Stiglitz' text book!  When Krugman came out ignoring it as well, I started to get the sense that there was a script folks were reading from.

Once I saw that 'statement' (Where were these 150 economists when we needed a statement about balancing our budget??), I realized that there was definitely a coordinated effort to make a spectacle of this.

What I don't quite understand is why.

by bobbank 2008-05-03 06:35AM | 0 recs
Why?

Because you are wrong.

Just because short term demand doesn't change at the same rate as prices do doesn't mean a change in price has no effect on demand.  

Once again, if the supply can't increase and the demand does what changes?  Answer: the price

by Blue Neponset 2008-05-03 07:00AM | 0 recs
the reason it's a dumb idea

Is not that it's an insignificant amount of money. It's that it is counter productive. Prices would probably rise to even higher than where they would normally be.

What part of that do you not understand.

The arguments being used by Hillary supporters on this tax holiday are reminiscent of GOP talking points.  

by highgrade 2008-05-03 04:52AM | 0 recs
Re: the reason it's a dumb idea

"The arguments being used by Hillary supporters on this tax holiday are reminiscent of GOP talking points"

You mean the kind that seem to keep getting them elected to the WH?  

by AnnC 2008-05-03 05:09AM | 0 recs
Re: the reason it's a dumb idea

So the end justifies the means?  It is OK to lie to the non-elitists if it get the dumb shits to vote for the Democrat in November?  

by Blue Neponset 2008-05-03 05:18AM | 0 recs
Don't you get it?

To beat the Republicans you have to be the Republicans.

Ooooh Lordy.

by grass 2008-05-03 05:35AM | 0 recs
Re: Don't you get it?

You are wither with the Clintonistas or you are against them I guess.

by Blue Neponset 2008-05-03 05:59AM | 0 recs
Re: the reason it's a dumb idea

Disagreeing with other people by pointing out facts is just the kind of elitism that is going to ruin the democratic party.

by yhf1979 2008-05-03 09:17AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

Your bogus premise aside, why are you stating this is about white workers?

Blacks, Latinos, Asians, and Native Americans don't drive cars to work?

by emptythreatsfarm 2008-05-03 05:53AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

Excellent point.  It seems Clinton supporters only care about how gas prices affect uneducated white voters.  

by Blue Neponset 2008-05-03 06:00AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

To too many people "working class" is a code word for "white people". Minorities are always either rich or poor, and many people don't see them in their mental image of the American Dream

by Lost Thought 2008-05-03 06:28AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white worker

Let's see. i put up a diary asking Obama to emphasize lower taxes and I didnt seem much support from many on MYDD. That's why I say this gas tax thing is pure pandering. If you really want to give tax relief to citizens, come up with lower taxes for the middle and lower classes and make it a loud statement as part of your campaign. But when people bring that up here, you tend to get branded as bringing u'p right wing talking points. All of a sudden, Hillary is a heroine for suggesting something that will take valuable senate time for some measly minor savings that we are not even sure will take place?

Thanks for making MYDD more of a more racist place with these idiotic diary titles. If half the Democratic Party is like you, I have no wish to be part of this party. The main reason why I decided to be part of the Democratic Party was the socially progressive bent. I see a lot of ugly racially bullshit rhetoric here lately.

by Pravin 2008-05-03 05:56AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white worker

The good news is that the DFA is the Democratic Party of tomorrow.  The DLC is (hopefully) on its way out.

by ProgressiveDL 2008-05-03 06:23AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white worker

Hopefully yes.

It's a wonder why people here don't get that all else aside a vote for Obama is a vote against the DLC.
And thats a good thing.

I honestly don't see how it survives in 2009, unless of course they get a new chairman named .........

by GeorgeP922 2008-05-03 08:26AM | 0 recs
Hillary's phony populism

George Bush bought himself a cowboy hat and a made for TV ranch and overnight the Yale rich kid became a good Ol'boy. Now after the Clinton administartion brought us the energy market deregulation that made the current energy price fiasco possible, pushed through NAFTA, put a happy face on globilization and approved selling Magnaquench to the Chinese you want us to believe that Hillary is now a blue collar champion.

She sheds a tear for the company (Magnaquench) in Indiana whose sale to the Chinese was only possible because President Clinton signed off on it and she now proposes a cynical political stunt that won't do a thing for working Americans.

Save your Republican talking points about latte sipping liberals. It's going to take more then photo-ops of Hillary downing a shot of whiskey for Americans to buy into another phony populist who is in the pocket of lobbyists and has been raking in the dough from oligarchs and dictators the world over.

by hankg 2008-05-03 06:01AM | 0 recs
nothing's changed

continued mocking.  Well that's fine, but what are your ideas to help the working people?  Just criticise every proposal that comes out?  With this kind of attitude, its no wonder that working people never get a break.

crickets.

by 4justice 2008-05-03 06:14AM | 0 recs
Re: nothing's changed

Some of us have suggested tax relief for middle income and lower income americans. But not at the gas pump because of a few reasons recounted in a million other diaries on MYDD.

by Pravin 2008-05-03 06:19AM | 0 recs
Re: nothing's changed

Sure because it is HRC idea.  If BO proposed this you all would be going on about how this is the greatest thing on earth.

david

by giusd 2008-05-03 06:28AM | 0 recs
Re: nothing's changed

Actually, isn't it a John Mccain idea?

by yhf1979 2008-05-03 08:05AM | 0 recs
Re: nothing's changed

You get troll rated for a freaking trollish comment. You have no evidence whatsoever that I do this as an Obama supporter. I have said in many diaries what my ideas were regardless of the candidate. I have targeted Obama for his lack of clarity on Capital Gains.

I am sick of replying to the same bullshit in a 1000 diaries. If you want to make conversation managable on this blog, go read them and respond to those specific comments instead of making idiotic blanket statments.

by Pravin 2008-05-03 01:30PM | 0 recs
Unbelievable

How could anyone think that this would be good idea?  I mean really.

So saving 10-15 cents a gallon will help Americans how????? Gimme a break.

And there are people who actually think this is a fantastic idea?

now this is coming from someone who drives a Chrysler 300 ...although I do prefer the chai lattes...

by april34fff 2008-05-03 06:32AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

Obama is wrong again.There is more to a gas tax holiday than ivory tower economists think.The savings to truck drivers will be about 700 dollars not an insignificant sum.Plus the summer driving season is a large boost to the economy in tourism.The psychological impact of seeing less at the pump will spur more tourism.Elitist and city dwellers laugh at family vacations where you drive.Some people can't afford plane tickets to exotic destinations and every penny counts.So the snobs that have been losing elections for forty years are out in force to help the Dems lose again.

by grab6 2008-05-03 06:35AM | 0 recs
I love the smell of

Class war in the morning

by Lost Thought 2008-05-03 06:50AM | 0 recs
Re: I love the smell of

Yup and we know which class is winning.Hint its not the middle to lower class.

by grab6 2008-05-03 06:55AM | 0 recs
Re: I love the smell of

Except for the blacks, who have such an easy time in this country

by Lost Thought 2008-05-03 06:58AM | 0 recs
Re: I love the smell of

Wow go right to racism.The people it would help would be AA and other minorities.But the limo libs like to piss on them because we know letting them pay more at the pump is just good medicine in a macro economic sense.So your answer is to make it harder on the lower classes for their own good.LOL  

by grab6 2008-05-03 07:17AM | 0 recs
I was simply pointing out the racism in this diary

dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dead

by Lost Thought 2008-05-03 07:21AM | 0 recs
Re: I was simply pointing out the racism in this d

I agree it should say workers not white workers

by grab6 2008-05-03 07:32AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

You want to spur tourism? How about enacting a law where peopel do not have to pay ridiculous prices at these tourist spots. OK, so we can't do that. But bringing up tourism is silly considering the gas tax is such a tiny component of a tourist's expenses even if they go as a family and economize.

by Pravin 2008-05-03 01:32PM | 0 recs
yawn

it's amazing how mathmatically challenged this country has become.  

by brettjay 2008-05-03 06:55AM | 0 recs
Obama totally misses the point
The fact is that $30 extra that families could save is 3-4 days worth of meals at the end of the month for many families while they wait for their paycheck.
When people try to minamize the impact of even that small amount of money it make them sound as though they are out of touch.
by J Rae 2008-05-03 07:12AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama totally misses the point

But wouldn't it just be better to give people a direct $30 check, if that was your goal?

by Lost Thought 2008-05-03 07:22AM | 0 recs
hillary panders AGAIN

Your comment shows how out of touch you really are. Since when can $30 feed a family for 3 or 4 days?

by venician 2008-05-03 07:36AM | 0 recs
Since when can $30 feed a family for 3 or 4 days?

when their menu consists of spaghetti and peanut butter sandwiches and some meals are skipped.

Food stamp allowance is about a dollar a meal per person.


In January 2008, the Food Stamp Program served 27.6 million people, supporting food purchases of low-income households. That is over 10 million more persons higher than in 2000, when program participation nationally reached its lowest point in the last decade, and represents an increase in participation by more than 50 percent in only 6 years. Experts estimate that four out of ten eligible people are not in the program.

by doberman pinche 2008-05-03 08:07AM | 0 recs
Re: hillary panders AGAIN

Lower income people feed their families on less than that. Some people actually grow their own food to feed their families. Who's out of touch here?

by LakersFan 2008-05-03 08:14AM | 0 recs
Re: hillary panders AGAIN

Easy, you buy thrift store flour and grains. Buy bulk beans from from wherever you can. The hardest part is getting affordable calcium, most people don't/can't.

I've tried it (for experimentation purposes only), it sucks, but you can survive on it. And as mentioned above, people on foodstamps do. Or at least should. It disturbs me when I see people spending their food stamps on Pepsi and Coke (which is possible at some stores)

by Lost Thought 2008-05-03 08:28AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama totally misses the point

then why should lower income workers who drive be the only ones who get this money?

jeez. if it's that big a deal, pass an incentive totaling $30 for the lowest income workers in this country. All of them, and especially the ones whom take mass transit.

by alex100 2008-05-03 07:57AM | 0 recs
Re: Obama totally misses the point

I must say, this is the best point of this diary.

This silly idea would only benefit drivers.

What should I say to the people I see walking to work on the side of a 50 mph highway which will have no maintenance this summer

by GeorgeP922 2008-05-03 08:30AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

In reading through the comments it seems to me Obama supporters would rather attack the temp gas tax than to acknowledge a real need of a windfall tax.

Frankly, I find it disingenuous to attack 50% of the plan that the republicans (McCain) are pushing.  To get what many Democrats have been trying to get for years.  

A windfall tax on oil companies!!

by jelyfish 2008-05-03 08:12AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive

The larger problem with Obama's stance is that plays right into the narrative that he's an academic and elitist. He is making an academic argument against the gas tax. Fine. However, when heard by the working class it sounds like something someone with a stomach full of arugula would say. $20.00 pays for 5 gallons of milk for your children for people on the margins. That's the prism that you have to start looking at some of these things through. And the price of food has shot up immensely so if truckers are paying less for fuel then it could save the consumer some money at the grocery store too.

by Ga6thDem 2008-05-03 08:18AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive

Sounds like Bush voters you are describing.

If a "working" class voter is too dumb to understand watered down economics, then our country is in huge trouble and we probably deserve more republicans.

The more and more I read this board, the more it is reinfocrced by the DLC'ers that a progressive America can never be achieved.

by GeorgeP922 2008-05-03 08:33AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive

Have you considered the fact that comments like yours (calling the working class idiots) is exactly why we lose elections? I guess not. It's all about "vote for my guy or you're an idiot" right?

by Ga6thDem 2008-05-03 08:42AM | 0 recs
Dismissive elitists

It seems Obama has a problem connecting with regular folks.





by Nobama 2008-05-03 10:17AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

Maybe the intent is to establish windfall profits taxes on the oil companies that don't expire after Labor Day?

Is there anyone here that doesn't want to end the insane Bush subsidies to oil companies and establish a windfall profits tax?

Gotta start somewhere.

Besides all that, she did this to take the wind out of McCain's sails.  Pretty clever.

by wblynch 2008-05-03 11:18AM | 0 recs
Re: dismissive liberals to white workers: drop dea

I won't argue that there aren't families to which $30 isn't a big deal, because there are.

What I will argue is this:  these families deserve a LOT better from the United States than $30.  And $30/family in a very irresponsible fashion...well, that just doesn't make any sense.

I'm voting Democrat because I think this party is the best able (and willing) to take serious steps in the long process of ending poverty in America.  But as far as that process goes, $30 is really a drop in the ocean, and Americans earning ALL wages should be insulted that two of our Presidential candidates think that their votes are worth $30.

by freedom78 2008-05-03 10:12PM | 0 recs

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