The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

(Cross-posted at Clintonistas for Obama)

I confess that I like to think of myself as a representative of the grownup wing of the Democratic Party.  I was for Hillary because I believed there were qualities in her that had been tried in fire, and I think passing through hard times and coming out the other end of it does something to people.  I was for Hillary because I like her experience and thought she brought the right mix of qualifications to a terrible moment in history.

I confess that I like to think of myself as a representative of the grownup wing of the Democratic Party.  When the numbers moved with force and finality in Obama's direction, and he had enough support from pledged and superdelegates to lay claim to the nomination, I did not pick up my marbles and go home.  I know that I live in a democracy, and I know democracy often has events that I don't like.  I did not go off and pout in a corner.  I did not hold my breath with a threat to let my face turn blue.  I accepted the defeat that I received and moved on like a good Democrat would, like a lot of good Clintonista Democrats did.

I confess that I like to think of myself as a representative of the grownup wing of the Democratic Party.  Barack Obama probably will choose someone who will make me yawn long and hard, but I am going to support him and his pick.  I still have my marbles (unlike some others who supported Senator Clinton), and I could pick them up and go home.  I'm not going to.  I could go and pout in a corner, but frankly, there's so many of my ex-fellow travelers there, there's no room for me, and besides, pouting isn't my style.  And I am disinclined to hold my breath until I turn blue, because as far as I can see, the people who chose to hold their breath that way have turned really, really red. So let me tell you,

Obama-Biden '08!
Obama-Bayh '08!
Obama-Kaine '08!

I don't care, because I confess that I like to think of myself as a representative of the grownup wing of the Democratic Party.  When I think of Barack Obama and November 2008, all I can say is,

Just do it, baby!

Tags: Barack Obama, Evan Bayh, joe biden, Tim Kaine (all tags)



Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

I'm with you, but I'm still hoping for:

Obama-Clinton '08!  

by LakersFan 2008-08-18 05:50PM | 0 recs
So am I...

And I'm NOT giving up on my dream just yet! ;-)

Still, I'll support the Democrats no matter who Obama picks as his VP. However, I'll just need time to "adjust" (meaning screaming off the top of my lungs before rushing to the restroom to lose my meal) if Kaine or Hagel gets picked. I'd just have to remind myself to stay focused on Obama & not think about VP Kaine or Hagel.

by atdleft 2008-08-18 06:01PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

Hagel?  If it's Hagel, I might just sit this election out.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 06:03PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

You and me both.

by spacemanspiff 2008-08-18 06:04PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

so now both of you admit to being PUMA's?

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 06:13PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

H'rated for calling psychodrew a PUMA.

by spacemanspiff 2008-08-18 06:20PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

you're the ones claiming you will take your ball and go home of you don't get what you want. so your HR only shows that not only are both of you a PUMA, you're a lying creep as well.

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 06:23PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

Where's the party unity when the VP nominee is a member of the other party.

I have very little patience for PUMAs, most of whom are Republicans anyway, but should Obama select Hagel as his running mate, he'll force to to cast my ballot with one hand holding my nose while the other votes.

by vermontprog 2008-08-19 01:41AM | 0 recs
oh, zsg

please trytobereal.

by JJE 2008-08-18 06:26PM | 0 recs
Re: oh, zsg

neither Jeff nor I have ever said we would not vote for the dem nominee. Both of the trolls above just did. Yet you try to defend their PUMA tactics. Humm, what does that make you then?

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 06:29PM | 0 recs
i think they were being hyperbolic

in expressing their dislike for Hagel.  Since he is unlikely to be the pick, they haven't quite reached PUMA level.  If Obama does somehow pick Hagel and they sit out the election, please seek me out and remind me to put "Defender of PUMA tactics" as my signature.

by JJE 2008-08-18 06:44PM | 0 recs
Re: oh, zsg


Do you actually think that Spaceman is a troll?  That is just completly fucking hilarious.

Hey Spaceman, Zero thinks you're a troll!

Serious Question...Is this snark?

Holy crap that's fucking funny!

by snark adam excuse 2008-08-18 08:24PM | 0 recs
Re: oh, zsg

P.S.  That applies to Drew also.  You need to get out more Zero.


by snark adam excuse 2008-08-18 08:26PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...


You figured me out!

All this time I have been spying for the Conflucians passing them all of the top secret MyDD and Clintonista for Obama posts!

All the posts where I swore that I would vote for Obama despite the primary BS and the posts where I reached out to the PUMAs and urged them to reconsider, all the time and energy I put into all that work, including my donation to the Obama campaign was part of an elaborate hoax.

Oh, you are too smart.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 06:45PM | 0 recs
God, you guys are so abused.

Sorry C4O crowd. The Grownup Wing still appreciates you here, though sometimes I don't know how you all can put up with this place. Thanks for staying.

by warmwaterpenguin 2008-08-18 07:06PM | 0 recs
Re: God, you guys are so abused.


We're used to the abuse.  I'm starting to think that Clintonistas secretly enjoy it.  ;)

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 07:17PM | 0 recs
Re: God, you guys are so abused.

Or not so secretly...

by LakersFan 2008-08-18 07:43PM | 0 recs
Is linfar still blogging?

I haven't seen her in a while... I hope she's okay.

(and also that she understands that she pushed a few people's MAJOR buttons... ;-) but mostly that she's okay

by BlogSurrogate57 2008-08-19 05:28AM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

The post does not deserve mojo, but I am unhiding it because zero was trying to make a point in his/her abrasive way, not just name calling for its own sake.

by itsthemedia 2008-08-18 08:13PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

Usually I understand where you are coming from.

This time, you are way off base.  There's no comparison between folks who won't vote for Obama unless he picks Clinton, and folks who won't vote for Obama if he picks a Republican.  You know that, and you are being totally disingenuous, and therefore harming your credibility here, if that's possible.

The folks who say they won't pull the lever for Obama if it's Hagel have about as much chance of that happening as we have of the original cast of 'Leave it to Beaver' making a sequel feature film, so their statement is a rhetorical one.  The 'pumas' (SOWs as I call them) on the other hand stand a huge chance of having their opportunity come to be reality.

Stop being totally ridiculous.

by emsprater 2008-08-19 06:02AM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

and this after he tried to defend China suppresing protesters and other human rights violations. Cannot say I am really shocked at your behavior now.

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 06:31PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

Oh please.  I did no such thing.

Link and quote or crawl back under your rock.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 06:49PM | 0 recs

Just keep reminding yourself in that case how horrifying a McBush Presidency would be. Do NOT do anything that would help McBush in any way.

Just join me in crossing fingers and hoping for a decent VP pick. So far, it doesn't seem like Hagel's on the short list... And Kaine's stock may be falling now. The coast may be clear. ;-)

by atdleft 2008-08-18 06:06PM | 0 recs
Re: Don't...

don't bother, as I suspected they are both anti-progessives as their "threat" if they don't get their way shows.

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 06:25PM | 0 recs
Don't be a moron.

Look at their online record particularly since the tough loss of Hillary's candidacy. These guys have done more than come around to Obama; they've fought to reach out to a demographic for which they are uniquely qualified: other Clintonistas.

Your ire over one hyperbolic turn of phrase is undue.

by warmwaterpenguin 2008-08-18 07:08PM | 0 recs
hey moran

I KNOW their 'record' of trolling and piling-on and being nasty in general and this exchange and their cowardly HR's only prove it. There have been many people they have harassed and stalked for much less then the following;

Re: So am I... (2.00 / 2)

Hagel?  If it's Hagel, I might just sit this election out.

Linfar's co-blogger opposing John McCain
by psychodrew on Mon Aug 18, 2008 at 07:03:01 PM PST
[ Parent | Reply to This ]

   Re: So am I... (2.00 / 1)

   You and me both.

   Obama/Clark (still dreaming)
    by spacemanspiff on Mon Aug 18, 2008 at 07:04:58 PM PST
    [ Parent | Reply to This ]

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 07:11PM | 0 recs
Re: hey moran <--Nice spelling

Who I have stalked or harassed?

Dude, I think the tinfoil from your hat is seeping into your brain.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 07:15PM | 0 recs
Re: hey moran <--Nice spelling

try google idiot before you go on with more of you general nastiness

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 07:20PM | 0 recs
blah blah blah

I'm still waiting for proof that I defended Chinese government repression of dissenting voices.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 07:29PM | 0 recs
"Google Idiot"?

Is that like Google Earth?  Will it show me your current location?

Whatever it is, it sounds like fun!

by Elsinora 2008-08-18 09:24PM | 0 recs
Cite the trolling.

Or shut your mouth.

by warmwaterpenguin 2008-08-18 07:26PM | 0 recs
Re: Don't be a moron.

You know, somewhere out there, there is a commercial showing a 'W' being flipped upside down to show an 'M'....

This needs to be made and turned web-ad on youtube.

by xodus1914 2008-08-19 10:16AM | 0 recs
Re: Don't...

I don't think he'll pick Hagel, either.  He has enough trouble with party unity right now.  But if he did put a Republican on the ticket, I reserve the right to re-consider my vote.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 06:50PM | 0 recs
there you go stalking and harrasing again drew

be proud of being such a moran, McLame will give you and spiff lots more McSame points.

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 07:31PM | 0 recs
Re: there you go stalking and harrasing again drew

Actually it's "harassing."

And I'm still waiting for proof...

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 07:34PM | 0 recs
Zero, you have shown in recent weeks a start

at not sounding like a ten-year-old with a keyboard.  Not many instances, but a few.  But your newfound habit of calling folks PUMA who aren't suddenly makes it sound like you are a McCain supporter trying to sound like an Obama supporter.

If you have any hopes of ever sounding like anything but a troll by everyone's definition, find something to talk about without sneering.  Preferrably something to talk in favor of.


by chrisblask 2008-08-18 09:45PM | 0 recs
and just for you, PUMA jpg

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 07:58PM | 0 recs
Re: and just for you, PUMA

FYI, it's not a good idea to link to self-pics.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 08:01PM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

I certainly admire Hagel's stance on the Iraq War.

In fact, I would say it makes him more of a maverick than John McCain will ever be.

And if for some reason Chuck Hagel is about to suck up his social conservativism and vote for Obama, I'll certainly respect him.

But I don't think I could pull a lever next to his name on it, ever.

by pomology 2008-08-19 09:21AM | 0 recs
Re: So am I...

I certainly can . . . if the name on the other lever is McCain.

by EvilAsh 2008-08-19 11:19PM | 0 recs
I'm hoping for Biden, or Clark; prefer Biden

   I'd be willing to bet that Hagel is top of the short list for SecDef, which suits me fine. I'd love to see Biden or Clark get turned loose on McSame's withered buttocks. I still love Hillary, but she's gonna be much more effective (and have alot more fun scrapping w/ Repugs) as Senate Majority Leader.

by Kordo 2008-08-18 08:01PM | 0 recs
I have had my favorites

I have had my favorites, most of them seem out of the running. Either by their choice or through he process of elimination.

I would vote for any Democrat this November, no matter who was at the top or bottom of the ticket. I picked Obama after he won Iowa, but have been impressed by a certain hard fighting woman who threw everything she had into winning the nomination.

And I like Joe Biden. He was actually my fourth choice(behind Warner, Clark and Obama).

Whoever it is, I hope they can bring something to the table as the VP on the ticket. Whether it's attacking McSame like an attack dog or a swing State, as long as it's something.

You Clintonistas have wrote some good diaries over here lately. Thanks.

by DaveDial 2008-08-19 10:06AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Are you really hinting that the grown-ups of the party were ex-Hillary supporters now for Obama? I get that gist from the diary. My view is that the grown-ups did not support her to begin with. Hillary was a war-monger and in the pocket of foreign interests, and likely to cave in to having the US bomb Iran.

No issue will affect Americans in the next four years as this one: will the US or Israel bomb Iran or not? Any further wars or conflicts in the region will throw the US into a great depression. Not only will the poor and elderly suffer from inflation gone awry, but so will the middle class.

by shyboy 2008-08-18 07:01PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

If anything, this is a rebuke of the Democrats who are not supporting the nominee.  He's saying that the grown-ups don't pout and walk away when things don't go their way.

Nice of you to jump on that theme of party unity and bash the Hillary Clinton.  Real classy.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 07:05PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

since you just made that statement (that you would not vote for him if he picked the "wrong" VP) you are talking about yourself it seems.

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 07:21PM | 0 recs
I'd vote for him anyway but...

Hagel isn't just the 'wrong' VP; he's a Republican. Sitting out the election at that point might not be wise, but then again it might.

by warmwaterpenguin 2008-08-18 07:28PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Do you actually believe what you are writing or are you one of those trolls who has nothing better to do than cause trouble?

I said that I "might" sit the election out if our DEMOCRATIC nominee chooses a CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICAN as his VP.

You've officially gone Blue Neponset/Glaurung batshit crazy.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 07:41PM | 0 recs
so to you it is grown-up

to hide anything that you don't like to have others see in you? Yeah, very McSame-like of you and spiff

by zerosumgame 2008-08-18 07:49PM | 0 recs
blah blah blah

Still waiting for that proof, zero!

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 07:51PM | 0 recs
Anything else? She has some wrinkles...

You could criticize those too. Maybe hit the pantsuit. I disagreed with a number of Hillary's stances, though many of them (like the Iran toughness) were, in my opinion, playing politics and not her true position. And before you start ranting about that, our guy does the same thing; all politicians do. Hillary is a good democrat and a formidable progressive force in Washington. Don't bash her, don't assume the worst of her supporters, and just generally learn to be an ass, not an asshole.

by warmwaterpenguin 2008-08-18 07:12PM | 0 recs
Re: Anything else? She has some wrinkles...

Being burdened by what AIPAC wants is not exactly a progressive stance. Even Bush is way out ahead of her on Middle East peace. Pants suits or not, she was not any where near Obama's turn away from Neocon warmongering to diplomacy.

by shyboy 2008-08-19 05:24AM | 0 recs
Re: Anything else? She has some wrinkles...

Must be nice living in your fantasy land where making things up is just fine.

by Jjc2008 2008-08-19 06:52AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Yet another crock of crap from the Hillary haters wing of the party.

Obama has also stated recently that when it comes to Iran 'nothing is off the table'.

They have the same stance, except for Hillary's vote to label the Iranian Guard a terrorist organization, which they are.  Obama's lack of voting for that  label has harmed him with Jewish voters and some moderates who understand the issue, and he has to work to counter that by making such a statement.

Neither of them have called openly for bombing Iran,  although McCain has.  Obama did once call for bombing Pakistan, something Hillary never stated.

You just want to spout more anti Hillary garbage.

by emsprater 2008-08-19 06:10AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Yea, pretty much. But out of those three, only Kaine is really what Obama's message is about, the other two, Bayh and Biden just don't make sense at all. Regardless, as long as he doesn't pick Hagel or some other Republican, I don't really care.  If he does choose Hagel, or some other Republican, is he really betting that he can get me to vote for the first Republican in my lifetime? That will never happen. Maybe they have two separate punches for Pres and VP.

by Jerome Armstrong 2008-08-18 08:00PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Be careful, I was just called a PUMA for expressing that sentiment.

by psychodrew 2008-08-18 08:03PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

The name to be called would be a Democrat.

by Jerome Armstrong 2008-08-18 09:09PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Props for a brilliant response there.

by Cincinnatus 2008-08-18 09:58PM | 0 recs
If Hagel becomes the running-mate,

doesn't that automatically make him a Democrat, at least in name?  

I can see a lot of policy reasons to not want Hagel as president, but there would be a nice "rubbing-their-noses-in-it" appeal to him as a running-mate.  Probably the same way the Republicans see some appeal in parading Lieberman around as a possible McCain running-mate.

by Dumbo 2008-08-18 09:04PM | 0 recs
It's Not Hagel

People are getting all up in arms about something that hasn't happened and probably won't happen.

There are no benefits to choosing Hagel.  He's already having to work to unify the party.  Why would he then blow it by choosing a seriously anti-choice, conservative from the opposing party?

Hagel's opposition to Iraq simply isn't enough when there are enough good names within the party, especially when voters are saying the economy is weighing on them more than the war. VP Hagel? Ain't going to happen.

by mikeinsf 2008-08-18 09:51PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

What? And miss voting in the greatest American election yet: Obama-Hagel versus McCain-Lieberman. Well, I'd love to see it, even if it will never happen.

by shyboy 2008-08-19 05:28AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Kaine represents what Obama is about in rhetoric and image only.  He has no record to speak of in Virginia and has been unable to find commonground with the GOP here in Virgnia.  He's main accomplishment is risidng Warner's coattails into the governor's mansion.

by realistic democrat 2008-08-19 08:04AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Hear, Hear!

It seems that I am agreeing with you more often these days.

It must be getting close to the election.....

by xodus1914 2008-08-19 11:03AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party
How grown-up! Agree with me or I will say you are pouting or turning blue in the corner.
I will bet you never were for Hillary. Obama is such a poor substitute for class, brains, toughness, experience and knowledge.
by Marjoriest 2008-08-18 08:08PM | 0 recs
So let me get this straight...

PUMAs are voting for the man who said, "Why is Chelsea Clinton so ugly?  Because her father is Janet Reno" and who dumped his first wife because she was crippled in an accident--because Obama has no class.

PUMAs are voting for the man who was ranked fourth from the bottom of a class of nearly nine hundred and who can't figure out how to use the internet on even a basic level--because Obama has no brains.

PUMAs are voting for the man who compromised every one of his seemingly deeply held beliefs in order to be accepted by Bush, the Republican party, and the rabid hatemonger preachers he once denounced--because Obama has no toughness.

PUMAs are voting for the man who claims that being shot down in a plane in 'Nam is the only qualification of his that anyone needs to consider in his race for the presidency--because Obama has no experience.

PUMAs are voting for the man who doesn't remember his own positions on issues he's voted on multiple times, who thinks Czechoslovakia is still a country and that the surge made the Anbar Awakening possible--because Obama has no knowledge.

Yes, suddenly, it all makes sense...

by Elsinora 2008-08-18 09:38PM | 0 recs
Your problem

is that you are trying to "get it straight", when they think crooked.  Don't bother.

by mikeinsf 2008-08-18 09:54PM | 0 recs
You give them too much credit.

They don't think at all, crookedly or otherwise.

by Elsinora 2008-08-18 11:45PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

It would be so ironic if Clinton supporters, many of whom were women at the forefront in the early battles for reproductive freedom, vote for a guy who wants to take the country back to the 1950's.

by RandyMI 2008-08-19 09:16AM | 0 recs
Lots of grownups in these comments.

Don't feed the trolls, kids.

by warmwaterpenguin 2008-08-18 08:25PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party
My prediction for the Weepstakes.
Whomever Obama picks won't be good enough for the liberal blogosphere and whomever McCain will be considered unbeatable.
by spirowasright 2008-08-18 08:27PM | 0 recs
You are Nostradamus, sir!

by Dumbo 2008-08-18 09:05PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

i'm from the wing that wants to be heard by our leaders. I'm of the sort that democracy isn't for wimps and that when our leaders let us down, we have to tell them or they won't know and they'll think it's okay. I'll vote for Barack but I refuse to believe that me or anyone else exercising free speech will hurt his changes, i suggest the contrary. I've heard too many public figures I respect that weren't connected to either campaign say the unbeatable ticket has Hillary on it.  So, sure I'll vote for Barack whomever he decides to pick, but if he doesn't pick HIllary and he continues to tank, I'm not going to blame myself. Many have told him, he should listen.  This is far from being about Barack's comfort level or respect to elected leaders or any such stuff, the world is in dire place and what it of utmost importance is that we win.  He needs to do what he must to win, he owes it to all of us.  

Get i?  

by anna shane 2008-08-18 09:42PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

No reasonable person will blame you either. If you're voting your conscience you've done your duty.

by Cincinnatus 2008-08-18 10:00PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

"i'm from the wing that wants to be heard by our leaders."

Me to anna..
That is why I am a part of this taking place in Denver..

by nogo postal 2008-08-19 05:32AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

I'm not talking about the people who will stay with the party, anna shane.  You and I both know that promises to vote for McCain are rife at Alegre's Corner, the Confluence, No Quarter, and Hillaryis44.  

I am sorry we lost.  I am sorry the rules didn't seem fair.  But any therapist worth her salt knows its important to develop a new narrative when the facts change.

by Beltway Dem 2008-08-19 10:50AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

not rife, not at all rife, but trying to influence is rife.  Barack needs good advice more than cheerleading and if he can't take it, he needs to get out of the kitchen. This is too damn important to lose because we don't want some man to feel diminished.  I've said it before and I'll say it one more time, he needs to get over himself.  There is more at stake than respecting some newly minted presidential presumptive nominee's person right to chose the vice president he feels comfortable with. That's a load of crock. He needs to pick the one he can win with, and there is nothing else to consider.  

by anna shane 2008-08-19 01:12PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party
That's what Kerry thought about Edwards. That one didn't turn out so well.
It's not just popularity or comfort, it's the willingness to back the top of the ticket 100% of the way 100% of the time, with little to no thought about your own goals.
That's a whole lot easier to do when the VP and the top of the ticket have complimentary styles and ways of doing business, and it's damn near impossible if they don't trust each other.
If Obama DOES pick Clinton and they don't blend seamlessly, any gains will likely be wiped out with stories of infighting, backstabbing, and disarray within the campaign. Obama supporters will blame Clinton for screwing up the smooth-running Obama campaign, Clinton supporters will blame Obama for not adjusting to Clinton's way of doing things.
Not to mention Bill Clinton, who can't seem to get over the primaries. I have no idea what he would do on the stump.
by EvilAsh 2008-08-19 11:40PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

and look at Kennedy and Johnson, that one worked.  I think both Barack and Hillary are grown up enough to put the primary past them. I suppose these times are dire enough for us to all compromise to get a ticket that can win.  This is practically Barack's mantra, compromise for consensus. It's his campaign message.  

by anna shane 2008-08-20 05:19PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Alegre has a "wing" now?  She's moved up from "Corner".

by mikeinsf 2008-08-18 09:56PM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

I made reference in my diary to what goes on in the corner over there.

by Beltway Dem 2008-08-19 06:39AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Apologies, Beltway, my dismissive comment was in reply to Anna Shane's comment above, not your diary, which I had recommended.

by mikeinsf 2008-08-19 09:27AM | 0 recs
The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party?

I call you the unprincipled wing of the democratic party! You don't put your long held principles of what the democratic party USED to be defined by just to win - you excuse all of his flip flops on democratic values and accept his running as a republican lite, pandering to the vile wing of the republican party simply to get elected.....

Please enlighten me on how he's going to pay for all of his promises when he just flip flopped, once again, on raising taxes on the rich to pay for his promised commitments to democratic values.

The man has no moral values... he's just full of words and air....  

by suzieg 2008-08-19 01:27AM | 0 recs
Since you brought it up

I'd like to think of you as a representative of the grownup wing of the Democratic Party but insulting those in the Democratic party who don't agree with you and making assumptions in reference to the reasons why they don't, is not "grownup" IMO.

by soyousay 2008-08-19 04:15AM | 0 recs
Re: Since you brought it up

Yes, I am sure you would like to think that.

by Beltway Dem 2008-08-19 06:38AM | 0 recs
Re: Since you brought it up

I'd give you kudos for acknowledging this but you've already giving yourself plenty of kudos :D

by soyousay 2008-08-19 10:53AM | 0 recs
Re: Since you brought it up

I am honest about my faults and my strengths.  I don't like false humility, and I don't like hubris.

by Beltway Dem 2008-08-19 10:55AM | 0 recs
humble pie

Did you or did you not claim to be the "grown-up wing of the Democratic party?"

by soyousay 2008-08-19 11:09AM | 0 recs
Re: humble pie

That I am indeed.  I have been entirely disgusted by the childish behavior of a certain group of Clinton supporters.  I have held my tongue for three months, but I think it's fair to speak my mind since they have felt the freedom to speak theirs.

by Beltway Dem 2008-08-19 11:38AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Whoever he he choses will be better that Gore's choice in 2000

by Lefty Coaster 2008-08-19 04:48AM | 0 recs

I wonder if there is common ground that we can arrive at that will satisfy us all, even with Hill not on the ticket. Btw, I'm an ardent Clinton supporter.

First, Sen. Clinton lost the primary fair and square. FL and MI will be seated and their votes counted. Her name will be in roll call and none of this will amount to Hill getting the nod. She lost. I hate that she lost. So it goes.

Second, on the issues (much to the chagrin of the lefter leaning constituents of our wonderful party) Obama hi-tailed it to the center and is closer to Hillary than ever, albeit a bit watered down. The hope around here is that once elected Obama will rush back to his more progressive stances. My only snotty remark: I wouldn't bet the farm, Martha. Obama is pragmatic and though he may throw some bones, he'll "triangulate" much like Hillary would if she were prez.

Lastly, my main point, and one I think the faithful need to concede is that Obama is untested, light on campaign experience and so far is unwilling to run a campaign that differentiates itself from Kerry or Gore.

Given the SAME STUPID TACTICS the right has been using for years, it amazes me that our team has not figured out how to neutralize the character assassinations. I think Hill would have been a tougher candidate than Obama in the general. So far, I've been given little "hope" that Obama has the testicular fortitude to shoot McCain out of the sky, drag him through the mud and shut him into a room of sub-40 polling.

To the reconciliation: Obama gets our votes, Hillary gets our support and we all win.

As an ardent Hillary supporter I really wish my peers can get over it much like Hillary has and suck it up enough to vote for O.

by JerryColorado23 2008-08-19 06:45AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

for a diary about alleged grown-ups there sure are a lot of cowardly little children posting and HR'ing  posts that show you as what you really are. Oh well it is MyDD so Todd will give you all gold stars LOL

by zerosumgame 2008-08-19 06:45AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Just quit hijacking the thread and harassing people and you won't be HR-ed; simple as that.

by Tenafly Viper 2008-08-19 09:06AM | 0 recs
This diary is, if nothing, else

amusing.  The notion of defining yourself as "the grownup" by calling names, essentially say "nananana're the baby for not doing what the bullies say"  is at best laughable.

In a democracy, most grownups KNOW that their votes are their own; that the right to dissent is what makes democracy great; and that playing "Follow the leader" is a child's game.

by Jjc2008 2008-08-19 06:55AM | 0 recs
Re: This diary is, if nothing, else

I never call names.  I set parameters.

by Beltway Dem 2008-08-19 10:47AM | 0 recs
Re: This diary is, if nothing, else

I don't see anybody trying to suppress votes here. Another thing you have in a democracy is the right to speak your mind, and that's exactly what's happening here.

by Cincinnatus 2008-08-19 10:55AM | 0 recs
Re: The Grownup Wing of the Democratic Party

Hmmmmm.. cle=its_his_party_08

by nogo postal 2008-08-19 07:19AM | 0 recs
The top three

Kaine is intriguing, but he's not well-liked in Va, I don't see who he would appeal to and Obama is already "the outsider". Biden is already qualified to be president, let alone Veep. However, he has a big mouth and is liable to put his mouth in it a few time between now and November. Bayh, I think, is the perfect mix. He can actually make his home state competitive, has experience as a state-level exec. and a senator, is a team player and his presence could add extra incentive for the Clintons to help out. I don't know if he can bring along anyone outside his home state, but at least he might put a bulls-eye on Indiana.

by RandyMI 2008-08-19 09:13AM | 0 recs
Re: The top three

I think the combination of names would be unfortunate.  Bayh sounds like, bye.

by Beltway Dem 2008-08-19 10:46AM | 0 recs


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