Are you at every negotiated meeting of this Bill? Did you move to DC from IOWA to take part or have a bug somewhere?
To some extent the administration has fought for this bill and in some areas they have not and have disappointed people, myself included. Again though, until the final bill comes out you have NO IDEA what is or isn't being fought for. I have no issues with criticism of the President... I have issues with people jumping the gun to crucify someone for something that hasn't yet happened, especially when some of those people criticized Obama Supporters for doing the same thing with Obama. It's hypocritical.
No... but calling them abandoned when the final bill is being negotiated is pure ignorance. THE FINANCE BILL IS NOT THE FINAL BILL.
Now, when the final bill has been negotiated, what was left out is of course fair game. My issue isn't with holding someone accountable, its blasting something that hasn't happened yet, especially when it comes from people whose track record on what type of people certain people are is terrible (See Warner, Edwards, etc.)
It's definately healthier... I just enjoy meat too much... and not just the OK meats... even the bad ones... the protested stuff (Like Foie Gras) ... dear god, some of that is oh so tasty. There is a Steakhouse in Chicago you can get a 55 Day Dry aged ribeye with Fois Gras on top... haven't gotten the courage to try it yet... seems a little too much even for me.
I agree with you... That's why I think its a midlevel priority. I think HCR and the Economy are the biggest... I think Afganistan and Immigration reform are the next biggest due to political reasons. Then after that falls DADT and DOMA somewhere with a host of other issues. They could easily do more... but they are overly cautious and afraid that spending the capital on DADT will cost them something that is a bigger priority.
Are you afraid of blowback... such was seen in 2004 with the rush to State Amendments due to the Mass Gay Marriage ruling in summer of 2004... if these repeals are pushed to quickly? Is the risk of the blowback worth the reward, even if that risk means a Constitutional Amendment banning gay marriage? Or is patience better and waiting 4-5 years until public opinion is strongly on the side of DOMA... something we have seen with DADT and with civil unions in polling as more Americans support gay marriage... in other words, the natural course appearing to be not IF gay marriage is nationally recognized but when?
I know Prop 8 changed a lot of people's mindset on this question, which is why I'm curious.
I ask out of curiosity, not out of any opinion or such. I have gotten different answers from different gay friends, and I am curious on the opinions of some of the gay MyDD members.
I would agree... the only think I can think of is they are afraid of pissing off someone in the HCR efforts and are being OVERLY cautious... probably the biggest issue I have with the Obama WH thus far... I wish they'd quit being so cautious... I think his campaign was always much stronger when they weren't playing it safe.
I agree 100%.. I'll bet everything I own that the WH feels that there could be a limited window of opportunity to get things accomplished... the problem for the gay community is that their civil rights are obviously not considered to be as big of a priority as Healthcare, Jobs, Afganistan and Immigration reform. Whether they SHOULD be is another debate... I definately would rank DADT and DOMA above Afganistan and below Healthcare and Jobs...
Look... It's bullshit. Everyone knows it.. DADT, DOMA, and all the rest is prejudicial bullshit.
I'm sure my next comments are going to to be flamed.... This is not a defense of Obama in these actions but rather perhaps an explanation on the whys. I'm not saying the why's should necessarily be acceptable to the gay community, but at least from the perspective of a straight male progressive, I know many who feel the way I am going to say right now.
Most straight progressives are supporters of gay rights. We want to see all the prejudicial bullshit overturned. But because those aspects of a progressive platform do not affect us every day, they are not on the forefront of our minds and the forefront of what we want passed. It's not priority #1, 2 or 3... in fact, its probably mid way down the priority list. There are just other things in many of our minds that are way more important to pass or get taken care of first, which means allowing a smaller minority to continue to be fucked over while working toward the goals that some of us feel are more important. Yeah, that sucks... I agree its total bullshit and I feel bad about feeling that way. But unfortunately, there is only so much that can be done at a time and if I have to choose between going after Health Care Reform first or the Repeal of DADT and DOMA, I'm going to choose health care reform everytime. I am assuming that is the thinking in the sometimes overly cautious White House... My guess is until some of the legislative issues that are more important to the administration and the party in general (because I also don't hear much of party leadership actively promoting and pushing for DOMA and DADT to happen now), that they are scared that pushing these repeals will galvanize the wingnuts further. Again, its bullshit and its unfair... but it seems to be the case.
And I also understand the sense of Urgency among the gay community and others whose most important agenda items are gay equality and marriage equality. Had Prop 8 not passed, I'm not sure the same urgency and anger would be there... I may be wrong and I'm sure there are those who will tell me I am... but I remember before Prop 8 a lot of people within the gay community preaching patience, especially after the 2004 election and all the amendments. However, it did pass, and I think many people saw that even in one of the most liberal states, these awful laws could be passed and that complacency cost them the right of marriage equality in CA. I completely understand the urgency... I think all of us feel it about different issues... I know I do about health care reform... we all want our slice of the pie now and people are going to be fucked over.
That's the problem I see in all this... The gay community has a lot of supporters... just not enough who feel that this is the most important thing to get done now, even if, from a human rights assessment, its one of the most important after healthcare. It sucks... it really does... but I also think its an honest assessment of the situation and why HRC said 2017... Because your issues are not at the top of the heap, you'll continue to get screwed.
I do think Obama could have mentioned Maine and DC... Again, I think that is the overcautious nature of the WH afraid of a 1994 midterm situation brewing.... I hope after Healthcare is done, they do look at spending the capital to at least repeal DADT (I don't think DOMA will happen without judicial intervention).... I have my doubts it will happen, because I think a jobs bill and immigration reform are higher priorities to Dem leaders... but I really do hope that something is done sooner rather than later.
That's all... as I said... not defending Obama, not saying the gay community isn't being screwed... just trying to explain the way a lot of us who are honest with ourselves feel.
Now THIS is a much better critical article than the Olympic piece. This actually addresses faults and some of the slow movement on campaign promises as well as the policy making of Emanuel, unlike the BS olympic piece with the Grateful Dead video which served no purpose at all.
I'm sure a couple will opt out... Those will be the states with the HQs of the big insurance companies. If those states are that stupid, so be it. If this passes, even those that opt out originally will probably have it back within 10 years.