MyDD :: Daschle Downplays Public Option

Daschle Downplays Public Option

by Josh Orton, Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 04:36:13 PM EST

Daschle, Dole Say Public Option Must Be Scrapped

ABC World News reported, "Former Senate leaders launched a bipartisan push for healthcare reform, but they took issue with a central feature of the President's plan, a public, government-run health insurance program." Bob Dole was shown saying, "If you want to stop this thing dead in its tracks, or dead on arrival, in my view, you put the public plan in it." ABC noted that even Tom Daschle, "once Obama's top healthcare adviser, said the public option probably needs to be scrapped." Daschle: "We've come too far and gained too much momentum for our efforts to fail over disagreement on one single issue."

"One single issue?" Oy.

The ground is starting to feel shaky on health care reform. Daschle was Obama's longtime rabbi on Capitol Hill - so if he's floating this view, it must not be dead in the White House. This is one to watch carefully...

Tags: Tom Daschle, Health Care, Barack Obama (all tags)

Permalink :: 64 Comments :: Post a Comment

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (none / 0)

Daschle is claiming on HuffPost to not be against public option.

by RickD on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 04:46:54 PM EST

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (none / 0)

ADMINS, SORRY TO BUST IN BUT MAKE YOUR BLOG A NON SHITHOLE KTHX

1) Re: Because [1.66], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 12:43:17 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

2) Re: You know I generally [1.83], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 11:58:26 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

3) Re: You know I generally [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 11:57:08 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

4) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.50], by orestes, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 11:47:00 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

5) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.50], by Dreorg, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 09:35:47 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

6) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 09:35:25 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

7) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 09:00:15 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

8) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 08:58:12 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

9) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 08:57:13 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

10) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 08:56:57 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

11) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 08:56:31 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

12) Re: GOP Posts Lowest Ever Favorable #s in NYT Poll [1.00], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 08:41:59 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 01:56:36 PM EST

13) New Hampster? [1.80], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 02:22:16 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:43 AM EST

14) Re: The Republican "Plan" for Healthcare [1.83], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/18/2009 12:48:54 AM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:39 AM EST

15) Re: The Republican "Plan" for Healthcare [1.80], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 11:28:06 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:35 AM EST

16) Re: Because [1.80], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 11:17:14 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:31 AM EST

17) Re: Gay Obots need to step away from the Kool-Aid, [1.80], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 11:12:42 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:27 AM EST

18) Re: Unfortunately [1.75], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 11:08:29 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:23 AM EST

19) Re: WTF is that? [1.80], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 10:57:40 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:18 AM EST

20) Re: This place is still good for a laugh. [1.80], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 10:46:02 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:14 AM EST

21) Re: read the diarists statement [1.66], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 10:32:26 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:10 AM EST

22) This place is still good for a laugh. [1.83], by sricki, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 10:39:53 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:04 AM EST

23) Re: You know I generally [1.83], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 10:22:05 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:12:04 AM EST

24) Re: The Time Is Now [1.85], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 10:16:17 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:11:26 AM EST

25) Re: Because [1.66], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 10:05:58 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:11:22 AM EST

26) Re: Because [1.75], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 09:49:39 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:11:17 AM EST

27) Re: Because [1.75], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 09:46:36 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:11:12 AM EST

28) Re: Because [1.66], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 09:40:05 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:11:07 AM EST

29) Re: Not reactive [1.75], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 09:36:02 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:11:03 AM EST

30) Re: WTF is that? [1.80], by Jess81, Rated: 1
Posted on 06/17/2009 09:24:58 PM EST
Rated on 06/18/2009 03:10:59 AM EST

When you start out making the "slippery slope" argument, where do you draw the line?

by Jess81 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:45:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (2.00 / 1)

Does it even matter? I mean seriously is anyone really hopeful that true health care reform is going to come out of this congress?

by political22 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 04:49:38 PM EST

That's the spirit! (none / 0)

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 04:53:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's the spirit! (none / 0)

Oh I'm so sorry. I forgot I was supposed to clap and cheer about the "plans" coming out of congress. My bad!

The point is their is no leadership on this issue whatsoever. The President is off town hall to town hall trying to get support. Not to mention he wants a public option, but hes open to doing it differently. There comes a point we he just needs to say this is the way it needs to be and get it done, if you don't then don't bother with it. I'm sorry I would rather stick with what we have (which is crappy at best) than just have another patchwork band aid that benefits a few more Americans which really benefiting the insurance companies.

I honestly don't get the opposition either especially from the pro-business Republicans. Having universal health care would benefit their base of voters incredible. I mean where are our automotive jobs going no not Mexico or China they are going to Canada. Why because employer health care cost are nearly 10 times less there than they are in the United States.

I just think our Congress is a pawn of the insurance industry and we will never get true health care reform done its always a piecemeal plan and I can only imagine what Republicans and Conservative Democrats are going to "make" us accept in order to move it just a small step forward. I mean hell I feel safer knowing that we can now carry our guns into National Parks what all in exchange for setting caps on interest rates on credit cards. Oh wait we didn't get that did we.

by political22 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:29:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Don't hurt yourself jumping to conclusions (none / 0)

ABC News' Dean Norland reports: Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., said she has every confidence that the health care bill coming out of the House will have a public option.

"I believe for us to have substantial health care reform, this has to be a part of it," she said during a news conference Thursday.

"We will have a public option in the House that will be real. If it's not real, it's no use doing. And if we don't do a public option, I'm not sure we have as effective a public healthcare reform as we wish," she added.

Pelosi said the public option must be sound, self-sustainable and one that adds to competition.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:33:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Blind Allegiance (none / 0)

Do you believe that? I no doubt agree that they all have good intentions, but it ends up coming out muddled.

I am not trying to pessimistic I hope I am wrong. I prefer to take a much more cautious excitement approach to these "promises". I honestly think politicians would make great used car salesman. I promise it will work this time. I'll believe it when I see it.

Oh and as far as hurting myself jumping to conclusion eh at least I have health insurance. I hope I can say the same for all Americans, but only time will tell.

by political22 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 06:03:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well it's either believe that (none / 0)

I am not being "beyond pessimistic" I am being quite realistic. I keep forgetting that I should just stand and line and "hope" for the best. The Health Care debate is near and dear to me, but I don't trust Congress to do it. I am sorry but the progressives, especially in the Senate, give up way way to easily and this project really needs White House leadership and frankly town hall meetings is not leadership on this issue. Frankly everything I call my Representative or write them I get the yes Congressman/Senator such and such is very committed to the issue and will be evaluating the plans to see what is best for his constituents.

Yes I am all for countering false information being spread. Its such a falsehood to believe in this stuff and unfortunately it has a history of working.

I will say the day that I will trust Congress is the day that we have true comprehensive campaign finance reform and even stronger lobbyist regulations.

by political22 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 06:26:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hmmm... (none / 0)

Talk about going to the extreme.... You're putting a lot of words in my mouth.

I'll clarify for you though.

1) I never said getting active doesn't help, but it depends on what you call "activism". Your inference is and extreme stretch.

2) I never said I was "hopeless" I just don't trust Congress with crafting this legislation. I am sorry democrats DO NOT have true leadership in Congress to get it done the way it needs to. I'm sorry but Congressional Democrats cave time and time again.

3) No I don't go to blogs to say everything is "hopeless", because thats not what I did and I was commenting on the health care debate. Sorry that I offended your "activist" movement by being a realist on the health care debate. I mean serious Tom Daschle, who was the suppose to be the lead man on Health Care, says a public plan should be off the table I think thats telling about what Congressional Dems will do as well.

4) Being a realist and not trying are two different things. I am not being defeatist, which is what you are making me out to be. I guess you can take it that way if you choose. I like MyDD is provide a voice for liberal progressives, but that doesn't mean I can approach and issue from a realistic position rather than a idealistic position. I like to be idealist just as much as the next guy, but my problem is with the health care plans in general.

This is my problem. We have settled on the idea of just having a "public option" I am sorry we don't need to be wasting time preserving the "private" insurance companies which honestly tell everyone they can to bend over and just take it. If you think what even the President or Congress is doing right now is anywhere close to "real" reform you're not being realist. I am all for "activism" but signing petitions and calling our Congressman/Senators isn't going to help get real health care reform accomplished. Those that will listen are already doing their best to do that (like Sen. Sanders).

Like I have said before I hope I am wrong, but history tells a different story. When it comes down to whats best for the country vs. whats best for wall street (lobbyists) wall street almost always wins out whether Democrats or Republicans are in power. We have the party of middle right/left and the party of the far right.

Do I still support democrats and President Obama. Yes, of course! The alternative is much much worse. At least we are moving in the right direction. The debate itself is a start and that is important.

by political22 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 07:54:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hmmm... (none / 0)

I think stealing a line from the Shawshank Redemption "Get busy living or get busy dying" is appropriate here.

You either give up or make your voice heard. Call your Senator, email... write letters to the editor, etc. This was never going to be easy... anyone thinking so is a fool. We all need to keep fighting. yes we may lose... but we may also win. I'd rather go down swinging.

by 30000Fine on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 12:04:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's the spirit! (none / 0)

You are right to be concerned, but you should not be so concerned that you become pessimistic. There are signs that this could work out in reconcilliation. But, there is a lot of work that needs to be done. If you have not done so, please call your Senators and House of Representative member. That's what we can do to help this. Also the WH has a number you can call to voice your opinon and a website to tell your healthcare storya nd you can mentnion your story and why you want a public option there.

by bruh3 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:43:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's the spirit! (none / 0)

Lets just say the I wish that the Senators and House Members in my state were a little bit more progressive.

by political22 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 06:05:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's the spirit! (none / 0)

It does not matter if they are progressive.Pressure works regardless.

by bruh3 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 06:31:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's the spirit! (none / 0)

It wont happen in reconcilian because it cant. The senate rules prevent this policy such as this from being implemented. Cannot be done through reconciliation.

Fact is, I am betting we are going to get something without a public option. I suspect something similar to the Co Op offered in the state of Washington. Forget single payer and the public option, it aint gonna happen.

by BuckeyeBlogger on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 07:25:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They changed the rules (none / 0)

Thats not what Conrad said 4 days ago. He said it couldnt and wouldnt be passed by Reconciliation. They wouldnt even have the votes. Nor was that the intention of reconcilation. Personally, I dont agree with changing the rules if indeed thats what they did or try to do.

by BuckeyeBlogger on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 08:41:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: They changed the rules (none / 0)

That's strickly his opinion. No one else has corraborated that view.

by bruh3 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:37:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Conrad said they didn't want to pass it (none / 0)

by reconciliation because it would sunset if it did.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:42:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's the spirit! (2.00 / 1)

If only I had two senators. I called my SENATOR and my congress member, and Al will be strong on the public option when he's sworn in.

Howard Dean is my go-to guy

by lojasmo on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:28:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (2.00 / 3)

I admit my hope is dwindling. We could end up with the worst possible outcome. A corporate giveaway to companies that are the source of the financial crisis we face in healthcare. Bill Clinton states that we will see healthcare cost rise to 20 percent of GDP. There is no way that the source of the solution regarding addressing that issue will come from private insurance. This is truly sad. It's clear who is in charge of DC. It's not the American people. This should not even be a close call giving the polling numbers this week.

by bruh3 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:05:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Boy that was helpful! (2.00 / 2)

So you're not the head of HHS, but nothing stops you from wrecking Health Care anyway, huh Tom?

Can't any Democrats freaking stay on message? Oh wait, that's only if it's a republican message...

by Rooktoven on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:00:05 PM EST

Democrat Leaders Have No Guts (2.00 / 1)

Bill Maher is right, Obama must become more like George W. Bush. I also believe that Democrats must become more like Republicans. Democrats must learn how to become better bargainers. They try to seek accomodation and compromise too soon and end up not achieving anything. In contrast, Republicans fight hard for what they believe in, and usually win. Reagan and George W. Bush got most of what they wanted even when they did not have the majority of Congress. Democrats lose and blame it on that they had only had 59 percent of Congress. History suggests that most legislation is passed within the first two hundred days of a new presidency. The best opportunity for Obama for meaningful legislative change is running out.

I predict that Congress will pass individual mandates with no public option and hail it as historical universal health care legislation. In reality, most of the uninsured will ignore the new law and not buy health insurance. However, in the short run, some of the uninsured will be scared into buying health insurance. This increase in demand will cause health insurance premiums to soar as they did in Massachussetts. The end result will be that the number of uninsured will drop only slightly.

Dizzy Zzyzzy

by Zzyzzy on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:05:37 PM EST

Re: Democrat Leaders Have No Guts (none / 0)

This is not about accomodation or capitulation. This is about knowing who is buttering their campaign coffers.

by bruh3 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:06:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democrat Leaders Have No Guts (none / 0)

Partly true, but of course Obama was one of the most successful fundraisers of all time. Most of his donations came from the base of the party. I think its mostly the fear of losing the center.

Unfortunately, Democrats try to find the center, Republicans try to change the center.

Dizzy Zzyzzy

by Zzyzzy on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:16:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Democrat Leaders Have No Guts (2.00 / 1)

True. The problem is also that the center they are working from is 1993, not 2009. The only way that they can see the polling numbers regarding the public option, and still act as if it's not a good idea, is that they are willfully ignoring the data in favor of DC groupthink and/or have a financial interest in not pursuing the policy. There is nothing substantive behind anything they say at this point this issue. We are not discussing deny choice. We are not discussing forcing people to do anything. The only thing we are saying is that there should be options available to people that want it that are not presently on the market. From a strictly choice perspective, theirs is the anti-choice argument.

by bruh3 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:20:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Pelosi says otherwise (none / 0)

http://blogs.abcnews.com/thenote/2009/06 /pelosi-house-bill-will-have-public-opti on.html

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:27:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (none / 0)

Well, we dodged a bullet with not having Daschle in as HHS... Tom was certainly one of the most cowardly majority/minority leaders we ever had, even making Reid look strong in comparison... but, seriously, this is the quickest, lamest cave, ever!

"This was never part of our arrangement, Specter" "I am altering the deal! Pray I don't alter it any further!" "This deal keeps getting worse all the time!"

by LordMike on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:19:50 PM EST

See this is what seperates us from the GOP (none / 0)

Tom Daschle says we should scrap the public option and everyone prepares for defeat...if this was the Republicans, they would be ignoring Daachle and promoting their own leaders who say otherwise.

Conveniently forgotten here is that Pelosi reiterated today that the House will not pass a bill without a public option.

All we need is 50 votes for a public option in the Senate, because once the House passes it, the Senate probably won't, it goes to conference and that's when we push the House bill.

The public option isn't dead because the House won't pass something without it.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:31:35 PM EST

Never liked Daschle much (none / 0)

His lobbying always left a bad taste in my mouth.

You can't stop the signal.

President "That One"

by Dracomicron on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:31:43 PM EST

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (2.00 / 3)

We have seen this movie before. Democrats will make one concession after another in an effort to achieve bipartisanship... at which point, the Republicans will all vote no anyway and claim the Democrats were never truly interested in working together. Hooray for compromise!

All the people who were fretting over the loss of Daschle at HHS because "he might be the only one with the know-how to push health care through Congress" can probably stop fretting now.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:37:21 PM EST

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (2.00 / 1)

Ezra Klein made that argument. It's bizare it's like we are supposed ignore the prior behaviors to pretend that politicians will change their approach to politics. I said Daschle was a milk toast when he was announced, and he is doingnothing now to convince me he is anything a target sign for the GOP.

by bruh3 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 05:45:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Daschle is a whore (none / 0)

Daschle's Firm And Group Have Ties To Private Health Care Industry.

What's surprising is that he was this close to being the HHS secretary!!

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 06:43:02 PM EST

Re: Daschle is a whore (none / 0)

Why is it a surprise....Geithner is in bed with Wall Street.....

by BuckeyeBlogger on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 07:26:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Daschle is a whore (none / 0)

No, that's why I have drastically reduced my expectations. all this bipartisan crap is nonsense, in the end big money always wins. I have diary on the rec list read it if you want to, it just lays out the state of things as it is.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 07:32:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I want what works (none / 0)

What I like is working with in the rules as defined. What I like is to see them pass something that actually can work and last. If they ram something through without having the other side buy in to it, without labor agreeing, without the shareholders (the american people ie consumers agreeing), it will simply be washed away in a few short years. Might doesnt make right, right makes right. We need cost control and reduction first.

by BuckeyeBlogger on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 08:43:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I want what works (none / 0)

Tell me right now, what is Obama's position on healthcare? Frankly no one knows because he has been so cautious that he refuses to draw a line in the sand and stake his ground. In the end what we are seeing is a progressive dilution of the bill which will not make it any less costly but definitely less effective.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 08:49:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I want what works (none / 0)

Well, there are numerous, reputable papers on how to control and lower costs. One by the American Agenda for Healthcare. I want to see a bill that includes their recommendations. I want to see a bill that doesnt take 400 pages to read. I want to see these nimrods in congress produce a bill that addresses cost controls first, becuase without cost control you cant reasonably cover anyone.

I also am dead set against mandating coverage. I think it simply unconstitutional to require someone to pay for something such as healthcare that they dont want and there is no constitutional authority to require. We need to lower cost and offer insurance to those who want it, but mandates dont solve the problem

by BuckeyeBlogger on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:01:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I want what works (none / 0)

As of right now the bill as is being discussed by Baucus, Conrad and Grassley, proposes cost reduction from shaving medical benefits to low income families and also taxation of health benefits. Whose idea of healthcare does it resemble? John McCain.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:09:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

That was DOA (none / 0)

Conrad already made it clear neither of those two things are going to happen and Vice President Biden said the administration opposes that.

Keep up.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:15:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That was DOA (none / 0)

Really? Can you please post a link? Because as of yesterday Kent Conrad was saying this:

Conrad said the committee is looking at reducing the amount of federal subsidies for lower-income individuals to purchase insurance, but other Democrats are pressing for different cost-cutting alternatives and finding revenue sources outside of the health care arena, as Obama has proposed.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:33:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Interesting (none / 0)

if you only left out the last half you didn't bold, you might have had a point, but as such you left in the part about other Democrats not wanting to find cost-cutting elsewhere AS OBAMA PROPOSED.

but other Democrats are pressing for different cost-cutting alternatives and finding revenue sources outside of the health care arena, as Obama has proposed.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:40:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Interesting (none / 0)

You made the very dishonest argument that Conrad was against cutting proposed benefits. Here's more from yesterday:

But many Democrats, particularly in the Senate, have balked at the idea, saying they prefer a tax that has some hope of winning Republican support. In legislation that could be unveiled as early as this week, Senate Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus (D-Mont.) is expected to propose a new tax on the health benefits that millions of Americans currently receive tax-free through employers.

Economists say taxing employer-sponsored benefits would help trim runaway health costs and force society to broadly share the burdens of reform. The idea also has bipartisan appeal. Former president George W. Bush and Sen. John McCain (Ariz.), the 2008 GOP presidential candidate, championed a form of the tax; so did Obama advisers Jason Furman and Ezekiel Emanuel before they joined the administration.

"The Democrats are trying to figure out whether they can do health-care reform by themselves without Republicans, or whether they need to adopt some Republican ideas to get a health-care plan," said Chris Edwards, director of tax policy at the libertarian Cato Institute. Taxing health benefits "could be the center of a bipartisan agreement," he said.

In other words the senate bill as it is being shaped now wants to cut subsidies to families and impose a tax on healthcare benefits both of which Obama was against.

But again you did not post a single link to substantiate your lie that the senate bill is not considering these two things. Seriously does it not bother you that you make stuff up without any factual basis? The WH is on the defensive on all of these but it is still not willing to draw a line on the sand and make a stand. Sheesh I'm tired of arguing with liars. Its like the invasion of little Roves.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:55:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Never said he was against it (none / 0)

said he admitted it wasn't possible...don't twist my words around. I said it was DOA, I never said Conrad was against it.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 10:15:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I am waiting for you to substantiate your claim (none / 0)

You said this:
Conrad already made it clear neither of those two things are going to happen

And I said post a link. I am still waiting. Whereas even today AP reports this:

Key Senate Democrats, bidding for bipartisan support on health care, pared back subsidies designed to make insurance more affordable on Thursday and floated a compromise that rules out direct government competition against private insurers.

Despite the cost-cutting, the proposal backed by Sen. Max Baucus, chairman of the Senate Finance Committee, requires most individuals to purchase coverage {that I believe is called a mandate} and forbids insurance companies from denying it on the basis of pre-existing medical conditions.

The brief outline did not specify how the government's costs would be covered, although Baucus and many Republicans favor a tax on certain employer-provided health benefits. The Montana Democrat has said he intends to hold the cost of the legislation to about $1 trillion, well below the $1.6 trillion estimate the Congressional Budget Office made of an earlier set of options.

I am still waiting.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 10:24:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Where the Vice President says (2.00 / 0)

Biden refuses to rule out new tax on health care benefits
Posted: 05:10 PM ET

(CNN) -- Vice President Joe Biden said Sunday that the Obama administration opposes taxing the medical benefits employers provide workers to pay for health care reform, but he refused to rule it out entirely.

"We do not think that is the way to go; we think that is the wrong way to finance this legislation," Biden said on NBC's "Meet the Press" program. Pressed on whether President Barack Obama would veto a bill from Congress containing such a mechanism, Biden said Obama would consider the measure in total before making a decision.

This is called self-immolation. Once again junior, I have no dog in this fight but I want the WH to deliver on its promises because people are hurting. The Senate bill as it now stands really stops way short of meaningful reform (it does increase subsidies to low income families from the present but not enough IMO). The WH is yet to draw the line in the sand and make its stand on this issue.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 10:45:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Nah (2.00 / 0)

I hardly come here these days. It just happened to be my first free day in a long time and also I saw the WH was so incompetent in getting its message out that even W has crawled out of his hole in Houston and was giving lectures about healthcare. I guess if they have not realized that they have to make a stand and expend some political capital then they will just bear the consequences of a legisative defeat, whatever that may be. But they can always count on you as their cheerleader, right?

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 11:01:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Translation (none / 0)

"I finally found an excuse to say 'I told you so'"

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 11:22:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Nobody takes Biden seriously anymore (none / 0)

Joe is to President Obama what Ed McMahon was to Johnny Carson....comic relief, someone for the audience to laugh at.

by BJJ Fighter on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 02:04:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Never said he was against it (none / 0)

Write back when you can actually substantiate some of your claims, because educating you is getting old and tiring.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 10:26:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

After you (none / 0)

lied and said I claimed Conrad was against taxing benefits when I clearly said no such thing, we're done with the conversation. I guess the line in the sand isn't deep enough for you, but I've been around this site long enough to know even if the line in the sand was satisifactory, you'd find soemtihng else to complain about.

I fully expect once healthcare reform passes, you'll disappear until Obama does something else complain about

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 10:56:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: After you (none / 0)

blah blah blah, I am still waiting for that elusive link.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 11:02:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

nrafter gave you a link (none / 0)

you decided it wasn't enough for you and called him junior (wtf was that about?)

Since you decided that the Vice President stating that the administration opposes the bill wasn't enough, I can't convince you that they already made a stand, and most likely neither can they.

I'm sure you're enjoying this though.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 11:28:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: After you (none / 0)

You will never get one.

by bruh3 on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 02:04:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: After you (none / 0)

Why should anybody "substantiate" anything to you, who so clearly lied about Conrad's position?

Howard Dean is my go-to guy

by lojasmo on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 08:26:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I want what works (none / 0)

Tax on health benefits is a poorly conceived. And will do nothing more than piss of the electorate...

by BuckeyeBlogger on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:19:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I want what works (none / 0)

Especially the now announced Baucus plan which provides no public option but requires a mandate. The worse possible scenario from the insurance industry's lapdog.

by bruh3 on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 02:04:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I want what works (none / 0)

Mandates dont work, Look at every state that has tried and failed. They do nothing to lower costs, and nothing more than hurt small businesses....the folks at healthcare now who are supporting single payer have pointed out that mandates fail to do anything but make matters worse.

by BuckeyeBlogger on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 08:39:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Just because he didn't draw a line in the sand (none / 0)

doesn't mean he doesn't have a position.

Keep Yelling, Nobody's Listening -SallyCat

by DTOzone on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:11:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

No fingerprints=no accountability (none / 0)

Obama is trying the same stunt with Health Care that he pulled with the Stimulus bill: hand it over to the Congress, and ask them to do the work. In other words, no leadership and no direction....whatever crap comes out of the process, he can declare victory, since he won't be identified with any specific goals.

But the product you get from asking 535 people to craft policy is just a patchwork quilt, full of compromises. By contrast, the economic stimulus in China is a massive, coherent effort to rebuild and modernize infrastructure. Ours is just a collection of pork barrell items, which amount to walking-around money for the appropriators.

When Max Baucus announces that it's time to "go back to the drawing board", it's probably an even worse sign than Daschle's pronouncement.

by BJJ Fighter on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 02:01:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I have a post coming on this (none / 0)

a little later.

The White House should have smacked down the Daschle-Dole proposal already.

Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.

by desmoinesdem on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 08:39:45 PM EST

Re: I have a post coming on this (none / 0)

I am not even sure what the WH position is now.

by tarheel74 on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 08:45:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I have a post coming on this (none / 0)

And Baucus's plan if the reports are true.

by bruh3 on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 02:06:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (none / 0)

We are now at the point in the discussion where the horse has been beaten to a bloody pulp.

CONTINUE!

1st Law of Obamadynamics: For every action, there is a greater than equal criticism. In advance.

by QTG on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 08:52:18 PM EST

Re: Daschle Downplays Public Option (none / 0)

If we cannot get healthcare with a public option or something close to it this year, we will never get it. Take that to the bank with a package of pickles.

by Kent on Thu Jun 18, 2009 at 09:20:33 PM EST

Re: For the record; We have 5 Republicans (none / 0)

Do you have the source? If this really is true, then there is no excuse why we cant get this through.

by Kent on Fri Jun 19, 2009 at 02:35:11 AM EST

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