With Friends Like These...

The media's latest Obama concern trolling: this USA Today piece on whether Obama can win over Hispanic voters (h/t Ben Smith). The money quote, and no doubt, future McCain talking point, comes from none other than Gov. Bill Richardson:

For Obama, the challenge is wooing a constituency that heavily favored his rival, Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, D-N.Y., in the primaries.

New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, an Obama supporter, says the Illinois senator "has all the right positions" to appeal to Hispanics, but says he'll have to work hard to win their trust.

"You can't underestimate John McCain with Hispanics," Richardson said. "He's got a good record on immigration."

Gee, thanks, Bill.

Yet another instance of an Obama surrogate doing him no favors. I hope at some point the Obama campaign will get serious about insisting on message discipline from the Democrats representing him.



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Re: With Friends Like These... (none / 0)

obama's campaign has been great on message discipline so far.


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 03:50:04 PM EST

I'll Bite, Todd. (none / 0)

The biggest problem I've had with Obama is the message discipline.  It's disgusting when you see otherwise intelligent people deliberately parroting lines you know are false and they know are false.  Why do they do it?  Because, for some stupid reason, they think it will make the world a better place.

It's the same thing that turned me off to the GOP in a big way.  Before 2004 I was known to cast a ballot for the occasional Repub.  I never will again.  I've seen way too many Obama supporters repeating the campaign's crap and pretending nobody notices to have a positive perspective on any of it.

In many cases, I agree with you.  In this case, you're wrong.  If Richardson's comments lead to a longer discussion about Hispanics, economic issues, and immigration--even if it's an angry discussion--that's a good thing.  Even in an election year.


by SuperCameron on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:00:14 PM EST

Re: I'll Bite, Todd. (none / 0)

"It's disgusting when you see otherwise intelligent people deliberately parroting lines...."
Intellegent?  Who; Richardson?  HAHAHA!
Purity! Or else!
by ChitownDenny on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:16:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'll Bite, Todd. (none / 0)

Errrm...I wasn't talking about Richardson in this case.  More like, you know, many Obama bloggers and tv surrogates.

I don't use some of the more offensive names that are used to describe this phenomenon.  For those of us outside the circle, it's...disturbing.

And regardless of what else you might think about Bill Richardson, he is an intelligent man, a competent Governor and knows one or two things about international negotiations.


by SuperCameron on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:21:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'll Bite, Todd. (none / 0)

People like you are kind of delusional.  Let me give you the news flash, people vote for appearance, not substance.  You advocating for sincere analysis from politicos is laughable because all that will happen is Obama will lose.

You want to know how he won the primary, his campaign was disciplined as hell for the most part, and put forth a cohesive image, where Clinton and her surrogates cam across like a bunch of cats trying to be herded into a pen.

The larger issue is that Dems have finally learned the lesson that have served the GOP, that staying on message is imperative if you want to win.

I would agree with you as a progressive advocate that message discipline is frustrating because it stiffles honest dialogue, but as others have said Obama is no good to anyone if he loses POTUS.  Right now, winning POTUS means overcoming substantial resistance about his experience and skin color and the best weapon to do that is to present a unified and cohesive front from his campaign and all of those that speak for him.


by tlhwraith on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 06:08:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'll Bite, Todd. (2.00 / 1)

If I wanted to think and talk like that, I'd just register Republican.

Don't think, just follow orders.  Speaking honestly does no one any good.....

At what point do you draw the line?  If history and modern science are indicative (and they are), you never will.


by SuperCameron on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 07:57:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'll Bite, Todd. (none / 0)

Having conversed with Gov Richardson many times, and seen him speak many more times, I find him to be appear very intelligent when delivering prepared remarks, and anything but when off script.  He displayed a phenomenal lack of understanding on a wide range of domestic policy issues and generally had me wondering how he won two elections for Governor.

But then he speaks, and delivers a fantastic stump speech, unless you see him more than once, and realize he uses the same lines over and over.


by mp on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 09:38:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: With Friends Like These... (2.00 / 1)

Another wonderful gaffe from Bill Richardson. This guy has had constant problems as a campaigner and with sound bites--and I can't believe people want him to be the Veep.


Hillary supporter for Barack Obama in 2008
by zcflint05 on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:03:25 PM EST

Re: With Friends Like These... (none / 0)

I can't agree more.  I hope this latest gaffe will ensure Richardson is kept off any VP short (or long) list.


by costanoan on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:27:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: With Friends Like These... (1.66 / 3)

Getting crowded under the Obama bus.

Get used to it and rise above it.  Candidates need to get used to members of their own party second guessing them during a campaign.  It comes with the territory and usually happens when the campaign is ignoring reality and refusing to resolve a problem with a large voting constituency.  

Instead of attacking, and "maintaining message discipline" Obama supporters should stop acting like their GOP counterparts and start taking an honest assessment of their campaign, the obstacles it faces and how to overcome them.


by Betsy McCall on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:08:45 PM EST

Re: With Friends Like These... (none / 0)

Riiiight.


We want to see Ivana [Trump] because we are so desperate in Alaska for any semblance of glamour and culture. - Sarah Palin
by spacemanspiff on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:14:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: With Friends Like These... (none / 0)

and do what oh sage one?  Come out and say all the obstacles they have to overcome, in other words whine?

This is kind of what did Clinton in, too many times she whined instead of solved problems.  People don't want to hear about all the obstacles a politician has to overcome, they want to see them solve problems.

Obama is doing what he has to do and hopefully that includes reaching out to Richardson to tweek his message a little better.  If nothing else, Obama is killing MCCain with hispanics right now and Richardsons point is at best silly, and at worst, outright ignorant.


by tlhwraith on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 06:12:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Wesley Clark (none / 0)

was a mess this morning.  Out of all the things for the General to make fun of McCain about (e.g. cheating on his first wife, Keating 5, property tax deliquency), he chooses to bash McCain's military service.  I know the 'roots love this guy but this guy's appearance on Face the Nation didn't indicate that he's quite ready for primetime.

If McCain pushes hard on Clark's comment and Clark refuses to apologize, it'll put Obama in an awkward position.  Obama will probably be forced to repudiate Clark's remarks, which will make it look as if he's throwing a Clinton person under the bus.  The General should have known better.


by Blazers Edge on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:19:35 PM EST

Clark has attacked McCain (2.00 / 1)

on this before.

All Obama has to do is say that he respects McCain's service and change the subject.


by puma on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:42:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clark has attacked McCain (none / 0)

This one was picked up by Drudge.  

Great idea Wesley Clark, let's make the debate about military and executive experience because that is for sure what Obama wants to run on.  Oh wait ... Maybe he secretly wants to see McCain get elected.


by dMarx on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 05:12:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clark has attacked McCain (2.00 / 1)

Uhh, I'm pretty certain that's why Wesley Clarke is doing the attacking.  It's called a surrogate, that's what they are for.

Obama will continue to nicely acknowledge McCains service and let others, who have worn a uniform, take shots at McCain.

McCains military service is all he has left.  The whole "maverick" thing is already starting to get beat up on.  Why don't you folks let Obama actually run his campaign instead of the half-assed Monday morning quarterbacking.

What's your solution, let McCain run around with the whole POW thing unchallenged?  Lol, that is a sure fire way of giving him a teflon suit.  No, I think Obama will use Clarke and every other military person he can enlist (possibly even Kerry), to point out the fact that McCains military bona fides amounts to being a POW, he isn't a CMH winner, not some decorated war hero, just a pilot who had the tragic problem of being captured and was lucky enough to survive it.  McCain has used that experience as some moral high ground to claim some foreign policy/military strength over Obama, and that makes it fair game for scrutiny.  

I'm glad to see Wesley Clarke is willing to step up and do what some other Clinton inner-circle hasn't, work for the good of the party and help Obama win.


by tlhwraith on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 06:17:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: With Friends Like These... (none / 0)

bah. hes a 'misspeak' machine.


by alyssa chaos on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:22:36 PM EST

Re: With Friends Like These... (2.00 / 1)

I can't stand Richardson from his backstabbing stunt against the Clintons, but he's right.

Do NOT take the Hispanic vote for granted.  Many white Americans think that all ethnic groups, especially blacks and Hispanics, have the same mindset regarding politics.  We are different people with different issues and values.

All you have to do is look at South Florida, specifically Miami and you would know that blacks and Hispanics do not have a "friendly" relationship and work together on issues.  

Richardson is right.  Hispanics are conservative in social and moral values.  Obama should not dismiss them as he has dismissed the black vote or the Muslim vote.


by stefystef on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:36:09 PM EST

Obama's speech on Saturday (2.00 / 1)

to the Latino community was AWESOME!!!

He got a standing ovation and "Si se pueda"!

In contrast after McCain's speech, people were yawing.

The enthusiasm gap was HUGE.


by puma on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:45:29 PM EST

What a fool. (none / 0)

Richardson is politically stupid. He bails on Hillary and her latino supporters for Obama and now seems to find it ok to speak positively of McCain when it comes to immigration.  How stupid?


by nzubechukwu on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:51:10 PM EST

But Richardson is AWESOME - - (none / 0)

Remember how he HAD to be the VP . . . the week he didn't go back on his word to Bill by endorsing Obama?  (BTW - and he really controlled and delivered the Hispanic vote, right?)


John McCain says he would stay in Iraq for 100 years? That's crazy talk!
by kosnomore on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:56:23 PM EST

Good Lord (none / 0)

Hit him for the flip-flopping, Bill! If Obama's smart maybe what he'd really insist in this case is that Richardson just shut the hell up. I really don't think it's possible to prevent this guy from saying stupid things.


by Mullibok on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 04:57:11 PM EST

Lil of topic... (none / 0)

Hillary for V.P because just in case Obama looses, the Political Gods will not be able to say I told you so.


by nzubechukwu on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 05:09:11 PM EST

Re: With Friends Like These... (none / 0)


Bill Richardson wants the Democrats to know that they cannot take the hispanic vote for granted and (hint hint) need Bill Richardson on the ticket.
by dMarx on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 05:16:28 PM EST

get a grip... (2.00 / 1)

Jeez what a load of crap. Richardson CORRECTLY  warns Dems not to underestimate the good will McCain has with Hispanics, and you bash him for it?

in this case "message discipline" seems to be code for "see no evil, speak no evil, hear no evil."

really stupid. we need to be aware that Mccain does have a good rep with Hispanics, altho my HOPE is that the other ReThugs have ruined it for him.


the time to rise has been engaged.
by catchaz on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 05:32:08 PM EST

Re: get a grip... (none / 0)

What good will is it you speak of?  HAve you looked at the polls lately, not exactly a lot of love for McCain with latinos.

Let's be clear, latinos chose Clinton over Obama, the logic doesn't hold true that they'll choose McCain over Obama.  

I'm getting so tired of people trying to compare apples and oranges.  The same "woe is me" crap about all the Clinton people going to McCain is just like this, uninformed bull-sh**.  I live in a largely hispanic neighborhood and while they aren't all in love with Obama, they know full well what's coming down the road with McCain, and it isn't good!

Finally, the problem here isn't what Richardson said, it's that Democrats still aren't getting it.  We are a bunch of whiners!  It's all well and good to champion a cause, but we have made an art form of cutting off our nose to spite our faces.  Great case in point, the whole muslim fiasco when that Muslim representative (Ellison?) criticized Obama for not being responsive enough to Muslims.  What positive does he think will come out of airing dirty laundy?  Does he think that American muslims are going to flood to MCCain because Obama isn't kissing their butts?  Puh-lease, Mr Bomb, Bomb, Bomb, Iran?!?!?!  There's a good way and a bad way to get issues addressed, and putting a member of your own party in an impossible situation only guarantees one thing, they will lose.  So who thinks that while Obama has to on an almost daily basis convince people he isn't Muslim should make a special effort to court the Muslim community, really?


by tlhwraith on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 06:25:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: With Friends Like These... (2.00 / 1)

Isn't Bill Richardson just pointing out the obvious? That McCain is more attractive to Latinos because of his past position?

If surrogates acknowledge reality and sound more balanced they can be more effective than one that sounds like a patrisan robot repeating talking points given to them by the campaign and refusing to acknowledge anything even slightly good about the other candidate.

McCain DID have a good record on immigration, then he abandoned it to appease the wingnuts like Tancredo. Latino voters need to be informed about. Richardson should admitt that he had a good record but that he doesn't anymore.


by liberalj on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 06:37:19 PM EST

Re: With Friends Like These... (2.00 / 1)

LiberalJ - couldn't agree more!  To be even MORE honest we all should admit that the Big Business side of the GOP has been better for immigrant's rights issues than the Democrats.  Carter + Clinton = 12 years of not much change on immigration while Reagan and Bush both pushed for legalization of the more and more undocumented here.  Please don't think I like Bush - but he did push for the reforms....

It's the neocons that have drummed up the anti-immigrant fervor that exists now in GOP - and it's a GREAT time to gather them back to the Democratic camp. We need to drive the conversation rather than allowing the GOP to.

From a Mexican-American Democrat for some 20 years.

Al


by al91206 on Mon Jun 30, 2008 at 02:11:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: With Friends Like These... (2.00 / 1)

Obama's organization seems to have a problem with National Dem figures.

People like Richardson, Clark, and other Dem heavyweights are not yet on the same page with Obama's team.

Many are narcissists and prima donnas, many will want Obama to come to them personally and plead with them for their support, many will have their own agendas (Blue Dog Democrats) and will want to cut a deal.

As the months pass, Obama's team would be wise to set up clear and consistent and well-understood rules as to who is supposed to say what, and who is supposed to text or eMail who before they ever speak for Obama.

That has not yet happened, and it must happen soon.  Otherwise this weekend's wild news cycle is just going to repeat and get worse.

Obama has to pick a VP, Obama has to say who are the go-to policy persons for his campaign, he must hand out a list of potential Cabinet candidates and he must make clear who is his A-team and who is not.

The Media, not Obama, handed Richardson legitimacy, same for Clark, and now Obama's campaign has to scramble.

Weak, clumsy, and it's made Obama look like a rookie in his first innings at the Big Show.


by dembluestates on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 08:35:13 PM EST

Todd, I'm glad you wrote made this (none / 0)

FP post. I saw this piece of gem from Bill Richardson. However I was afraid to post it, lest the ABC (Anybody but Clinton) crowd chew me out and call it swiftboating...


by louisprandtl on Sun Jun 29, 2008 at 11:29:29 PM EST

Re: With Friends Like These... (none / 0)

Is this the same Bill Richardson that beleives gays CHOOSE to be gay? Poor Bill, he really, really needs a job.


by glennmcgahee on Mon Jun 30, 2008 at 07:29:08 AM EST


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