MyDD :: America: A Progressive Nation, Not a Conservative One

America: A Progressive Nation, Not a Conservative One

by Jonathan Singer, Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 06:31:37 PM EST

I've written a couple of times already about the latest polling from NBC News and The Wall Street Journal (.pdf), but I wanted to mention one more set of data found in the survey, one that I think is more fundamental than any other. The pollsters who conducted the poll, one Democratic and one Republican, asked respondents the following question:

In thinking about the next president that we'll be electing, which of the following two statements comes closer to your point of view? (IF "BOTH," ASK:) I understand that you feel that they are both important, but if you had to choose the ONE statement that comes closer to your point of view, which would you choose?

Statement A: This is a time to have a president who will focus on progress and help move America forward.
Statement B: This is a time to have a president who will focus on protecting what has made America great.

In short, without using the exact keywords, NBC and The Journal asked respondents if they were fundamentally progressive (looking forward to create an America better than ever before) or fundamentally conservative (looking back to restore a great America that once was).

Back in November 2007, when the question was first asked to registered voters, the split was nearly even, with 50 percent implicitly identifying as progressive and 46 percent as conservative. By this past March, however, the spread became much wider, with progressives outnumbering conservatives 57 percent to 39 percent. That wide progressive advantage among American voters has held to today, with 59 percent choosing the progressive option and just 37 percent choosing the conservative one. So according to these numbers, America is a progressive nation, not a conservative one -- or, at the least, has the potential to be as such.

Tags: Progressivism, Conservatism, 2008 (all tags)

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Re: America: A Progressive Nation, Not a Conservat (none / 0)

Well.....

Us progressive 'leaders' and 'activists' need to get out there an demand the the vile, corrupt political/MSM/corporatist structure either change or get out of the way.

Time is running out on a society where no thought is given to tomorrow and a fat, big-mouthed bloviator like Tim Russert is eulogized for hour after hour on the TeeBee.

Time is running out on a society where the two front runners in the Dem Primary are labeled a 'bitch' and 'n#$%er'.

Time is running out on a society where less than 50% of the populace knows that one circuit of the Sun by the Earth is a....

Year.

Turn off the TeeBee, call your neighbors and get active.

We are headed for the Olduvai Gorge and once we get in there.

We will not come out.

by Pericles on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 06:47:29 PM EST

The US is a very conservative nation.. (1.00 / 1)

Compared to other developed nations, we seem to be clinging to our past, bitter about our increasingly marginalized status in the world and losing our edge in terms of health, education and future. America is increasingly stratified by class, studies have shown that of developed nations, the US is now one of the worst.

(Many who grew up when poor people had a far better chance of moving up still don't realize how bad it has become.)

Thats the reality.. The American Dream is dying. If we don't change our priorities, America will become a militaristic oligarchy. In many ways, it already is.

I don't see either Obama or McCain as changing that. They are where they are precisely because they won't rock the boat.

public option=not affordable for middle. It cant cover all affordably, google adverse selection for why

by architek on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 07:58:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The US is a very conservative nation.. (2.00 / 1)

The American dream never existed. The fairytale of pulling one's self up by one's bootstraps from the working classes into the ruling classes was always that--a fairytale peddled by the ruling classes to keep the workers docile and working toward a largely unattainable upward movement.

It's one of those things we keep clinging to because it makes us feel better about ourselves as individuals and as members of a nation. But it's really a giant self-deception. Sort of like the lottery.

should we go outside? / should we break some bread? / are you'nterested?

by Firewall on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 09:54:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The US is a very conservative nation.. (2.00 / 1)

Totally agree. The .0001% of people who were able to make it from nothing to millionaire (think the immigrant Andrew Carnegie and Bill Gates) somehow makes people think everyone can do it if they just try harder.

We need to revamp the education system, raise taxes on the wealthy, raise the estate tax, get rid of the AMT, increase science research funding, increase the pay for teachers, give soldiers free college, and make the word "progressive" back into a positive one. THEN we can see how many people will actually have a chance.

Conservatives have always played up the number of self-made millionaires in order to dupe the poor and middle class into thinking it was possible for everyone. With the way things are right now, it is not possible for everyone. (And technically, under capitalism, it will never be possible for everyone to be "upper class," but there could be more in the middle) The unofficial canonization of Reagan has not helped.

I think that Americans (and maybe all humans) overestimate probability. The chances of any of us dying by a terrorist attack is miniscule, almost zero. Yet many of us are willing to give up huge amounts of our liberty and freedom to try to take the chance from .00001% to 0%. I'm willing to accept a certain amount of risk if it means I get to live a freer, more fulfilling life.

by ProgressiveDL on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 11:16:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'd like to think this (2.00 / 1)

Normally, this great nation fears change. That's why we so rarely have had transformational presidencies -- Abraham Lincoln, FDR, JFK, and (ugh) Ronald Reagan were some notable political transformations.

A great President is able to create a transformative moment in our nation's history, and provide for a more humane society -- which is why Lincoln and FDR have always been regarded among our two greatest Presidents.

It takes an incredible salesperson to make this kind of change. Barack Obama has the potential to be this kind of salesperson, which is why I voted for him in my state's primary.

by Brad G on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 06:48:18 PM EST

Ronald Reagan was arguably more responsible (1.66 / 3)

than any other President for starting us on the road to ruin.

Look at charts of national debt, income, health status, infant mortality, etc.

Infant mortality in many parts of the US is now going UP.

That should be distressing us. In any European country, it would be the subject of extreme national debate.

Here in the US, barely a peep out of the news media on the subject.

public option=not affordable for middle. It cant cover all affordably, google adverse selection for why

by architek on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 08:02:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Maybe Barack Obama is a good salesman (1.50 / 2)

How come I don't feel enthused..

Because the US Presidency is arguably one of the 10 most difficult and important jobs in the world.

Bush is a 'good salesman'. That was his big selling point.

As they say, a village in Texas is missing its idiot.

How come Obama never published a single paper while "he was editor of the Harvard Law Review"?

Does that make you wonder, just how real everything else is?

Have you ever seen the movie "Being There"
with Peter Sellers?

public option=not affordable for middle. It cant cover all affordably, google adverse selection for why

by architek on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 08:08:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You're such a bad McTroll (2.00 / 1)

you didn't even realize Architek was a Clinton supporter.

should we go outside? / should we break some bread? / are you'nterested?

by Firewall on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 10:21:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: America: A Progressive Nation, Not a Conservat (2.00 / 1)

" In short, without using the exact keywords, NBC and The Journal asked respondents if they were fundamentally progressive (looking forward to create an America better than ever before) or fundamentally conservative (looking back to restore a great America that once was). "

- Interpreting those statements the way you did is a stretch.

Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.

by lori on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 07:02:30 PM EST

Re: America: A Progressive Nation (2.00 / 2)

As I've looked a polling on specific issues over the years I've noticed that most people agree with liberal positions almost all of the time.

A Liberal Definition by John F. Kennedy:

Acceptance Speech of the New York Liberal Party Nomination

September 14, 1960

What do our opponents mean when they apply to us the label "Liberal?" If by "Liberal" they mean, as they want people to believe, someone who is soft in his policies abroad, who is against local government, and who is unconcerned with the taxpayer's dollar, then the record of this party and its members demonstrate that we are not that kind of "Liberal." But if by a "Liberal" they mean someone who looks ahead and not behind, someone who welcomes new ideas without rigid reactions, someone who cares about the welfare of the people -- their health, their housing, their schools, their jobs, their civil rights, and their civil liberties -- someone who believes we can break through the stalemate and suspicions that grip us in our policies abroad, if that is what they mean by a "Liberal," then I'm proud to say I'm a "Liberal."

by Beren on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 07:27:01 PM EST

Re: America: A Progressive Nation, Not a Conservat (none / 0)

America (Americans) may be predominantly progressive, but the reigns of power are overwhelming in the hands of plutocrats and conservative ideologues. Optimistically, maybe something approaching half of democrats are truly progressive. Everyone else in the government and all of the corporate executives controlling all of the money are 100% in the bag for the moneyed interests. Accordingly, it barely matters at all what the people think or want.
.

by gak on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 07:31:34 PM EST

Yes.. (1.00 / 1)

Exactly.

People are in denial, because its an unpleasant truth.

I had hope for this election cycle, but not any more.

public option=not affordable for middle. It cant cover all affordably, google adverse selection for why

by architek on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 08:04:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yes.. (2.00 / 1)

by Beren on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 08:49:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This Is Great! (none / 0)

Honestly, I blame Obama at least in part for this. I think his enthusiasm, hope and inspiration pull people across the aisle -- as opposed to him reaching across it, or worse yet stepping into the center.

by xeju on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 09:05:40 PM EST

Re: This Is Great! (2.00 / 2)

You're right. Democrats are supposed to kowtow to the right in hopes of attracting the center.

It's a good thing Obama didn't get the memo.

As much as I would love to attribute it to his unshakable belief in open liberalism, a lot of it has to do with the fact that his financial base is independent of the fat cats. He doesn't have to go before them as Kerry did with begging cup in hand and proclaim that he's not a "redistributionist" Democrat.

by Beren on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 09:18:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This Is Great! (2.00 / 3)

Yay! Someone elucidates my point exactly! I want Obama to pretend to triangulate if need be, but I want him to actually be pulling people toward liberal positions in reality.

by ProgressiveDL on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 11:18:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Old news (2.00 / 1)

The public has always believed in the New Deal. The Republicans have managed to roll it back by exploiting cultural and racial issues.

As for Obama--no one knows what he believes. He's never had to demonstrate it. I'm not optimistic.

by Upstate Dem on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 09:51:55 PM EST

I'm not optimistic. (2.00 / 1)

Then you're pessimistic.

Both are highly overrated.

by Beren on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 10:41:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

One man's forward (none / 0)

is another man's backward.
Bush effected change. All bad.
We need to preserve what is good, and fix that which is not.

by nellre on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 10:03:23 PM EST

Re: America: A Progressive Nation, Not a Conservat (none / 0)

To All Clinton Supporters Who Threaten To Vote McCain:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLQGWpRVA 7o

by cenns on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 10:40:59 PM EST

Clinton Supporters Who Threaten To Vote McCain (none / 0)

That would be about two dozen.

by Beren on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 10:43:49 PM EST

You are over interpreting the word progress (none / 0)

America is always for progress and it's always for movng forward.....

Progress does not translate into progressive. It would be nice....but it's not true.

If they had asked this question during Reagan's term, we would probably get the same breakdown.

by debcoop on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 10:53:23 PM EST

Sort of (none / 0)

The thing is, in the lexicon of many politicians, "progressive" means somewhere between liberal and socialist. I gladly call myself a progressive because I want a ceiling on wealth and a higher floor. I don't want the ceiling and floor to be the exact same, just closer. Some European countries do that extremely well.

by ProgressiveDL on Sat Jun 14, 2008 at 11:20:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Liberals and Progressives (none / 0)

The right wing deliberatly turned "Liberal" into a dirty word in the minds of most Americans. So much so that now liberals themselves prefer to be called progressives. It was neither logical nor was it true but the result of their machinations is that "Liberal" stands discredited. Will they attempt to do the same to progressive or better yet, can they make "progressive" policies anathema to the general public?

by cacamp on Sun Jun 15, 2008 at 01:22:09 AM EST

This poll question is meaningless (none / 0)

What?!! This poll question has nothing to do with the meaning of progressive of conservative. How people answer it tells us nothing of use.

What determines one's political viewpoint is fundamentally about how they view the role of government in people's lives. Progressives fundamentally view government as an instrument of equality/justice. Conservatives view government as an instrument of moral authority.

Regardless, I do believe that the American people are fundamentally progressive.

by wolff109 on Sun Jun 15, 2008 at 01:24:53 AM EST

Re: America: A Progressive Nation, Not a Conservat (none / 0)

What a fantastic poll question!!!

The truth about McCain

by nstrauss on Sun Jun 15, 2008 at 02:59:11 AM EST

Progressive and Conservative are empty labels (none / 0)

and stupid ones!

Landslide of lies

by engels on Sun Jun 15, 2008 at 01:40:51 PM EST

A "Wealth Tax?" (none / 0)

ProgressiveDL: I gladly call myself a progressive because I want a ceiling on wealth and a higher floor. I don't want the ceiling and floor to be the exact same, just closer.

Les: How would you propose doing this? The truly wealthy do not need income, so income taxes wouldn't take their wealth away from them. Do you propose that all "wealthy" people would have to report to the IRS by itemizing all possessions, including houses, furniture, cars, etc. so that you could tax all of these items? And, how much above "the same" would you allow the "wealthy" to keep? Are you seeking a classless society?

Just curious.

by LesGovt on Mon Jun 16, 2008 at 08:10:32 AM EST

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