Didn't TD already beat you to this particular line of attack diary today?

Produce evidence or quit propagating smears.

Katie Couric, is that you?

I've been out here talking up my candidate for free. Wonder how much Alegre gets?

Take ths shitty smear back to hll44 and taylor marsh mouth. If you can't back up your claims you shouldn't be posting here.

Well, it makes perfect sense.  Axelrod is a specialist in astroturfing.  This must be the new batch.  My guess is the last batch were the Hillary is an evil b*tch bunch.

We've moved from "Denial" into "Anger".

"Some are even saying?"

Wow.

diary reported to admins for unsubstantiated smear.

Why isn't he paying me?  

Because this diary is untrue.  Baseless rumor-mongering BS.  

the Dems have their convention:

Listen to Clinton give an awesome speech at the convention calling for party unity with Obama as our nominee.

See, that's classy. That's leadership. What you're talking about is childish and borderline selfish.

Are the Broncos playing??

OK look, here's my issue...

You clearly believe that Clinton still can win this nomination. Great. You believe that it involves her pushing for it all the way to the convention, which is not as great, but I won't push that one because you're implying that's unfair.

But if you're going to believe that, can you lay out a realistic scenario, complete with numbers, for how she can get the nomination?

I say numbers because having run the math myself, I don't see a realistic scenario. Near as I can tell, most diehard Clinton supporters seem to think the plan is win Kentucky and Puerto Rico, then a miracle happens, then she's the nominee.

But clearly I must be missing something in the math if so many Clinton supporters believe so strongly that she can still win this. So can you lay it out for me?

There have been at least two diaries posted today that laid out the numbers.

I'm sorry, but if you would like this contest to continue to the Convention than you simply care more about your candidate than getting a Democrat to the White House.

Because if this goes to the Convention, we lose.

I know you're a big fan of the "delegates can change their vote if they want to" argument for how Clinton can win.  But so help me, if (and I do mean IF) it turns out that Clinton delegates (pledged or super) defect from Clinton to Obama I do not want to come here and see you complain about it.

I am shocked that you can spend so much time arguing that everyone who have a voice in this election, and then argue those who are responsible for representing those voters at the convention should just toss that all out the window and vote for whoever they darn well please.

You, and I say this with sadness and sympathy, have gone off the edge.

I don't care if you support Clinton or Obama or Mike Freaking Gravel.  But don't you dare try and turn a desire for the system to be TWISTED into some principaled stance.

What are you going to do in three weeks when Hillary tells you it's over?

It must be...Thursday again.

I ask because your post ignores one of the basic tenants of competition.  During the contest you fight, fight hard then at the end of the contest you shake hands.  What you see is not some coordinated effort to placate you, instead its basic human compassion.  

Why continue to point out perceived deficiencies, character flaws, shortcomings or poor policy, when the contest has been decided.  

I don't mean the contest has been it has been completed, only that the outcome has been determined and now everyone involved is just running out the clock.  

Tonight the Spurs were ahead of the Hornets by 20 points with 3 minutes to go in the game.  Know what happened?  The teams continued to play hard and then at some point (2:30) the Hornets took out their starters, a sign acknowledging they understood the outcome was no longer in doubt.  At the two minuted mark, all the starters were on the bench, yes there were two minutes left but for all intents and purposes the game was over, even with time on the clock.  Why... the math and time.  

This race while not over has been decided, why, the math and time.  

Despite your assertions that we have some sinister purpose for trying to raise the level of discourse many of us will continue.  

For me the moment that came was the Brian Williams interview yesterday, I could see in Sen. Clinton's face, body language and tone of voice, the starters had come out of the game.  

Not because she quit but because she ran out of time.  

In competition even good teams loose, it's just a fact.  

It's up to HRC ultimately.  But unless something dramatic and unprecedented happens in the next few weeks leading to a reversal in positions, I cannot see how carrying this on to the convention serves Clinton's principles or political interests.  A floor fight would immeasurably strengthen McCain's hand.  The most likely scenario would be that it would lead to his inauguration, regardless of who comes out on top for us.  Either way, her career and what it stands for takes a hit.  The next likely scenario would be that Obama prevails in spite of an effort that would leave HRC marginalized within the party.  This would be terrible for everyone involved.  As things stand now, if Obama wins, HRC is positioned to accomplish great things either in his administration or in the Senate.  The scenario that seems most remote is an HRC presidency that begins with a fractured party.  We may disagree on the hierarchy of likelihoods.  But I do not see any possibility of a floor fight in Denver producing a democratic victory and a strong administration.  

"Some are even saying..."

On the same day Bush used the same construction.

You never fail to disappoint.

Aw,Jeez. I hope you're still flogging your thing for Hillary into next January. It'll be about as effective then as it is now.

I read all the comments and I think I can certify that if there are paid charmers, (how many would be assigned to MYDD, three, four) on this site, they aren't in this diary.

"McCain: US Succeeding in Iraq"

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/03/24/ mccain-says-us-succeeding-in-iraq/

I am living in a dive, my windows are at ground level (1 foot off the ground).  If I were in on this I'd be living downtown.

I am being nice (to rational people) here on my own time, while studying for a kind of important exam.

" As long as she's standing up for us - I'm standing up for her.  Get it?"

got it!

so when she stands down; will you stand down?

a good samarai goes all hari kari when the master is defeated.

Alegre, more dishonest and divisive propaganda, eh? Figures.

I ask you to be accurate in your sourcing, The Hillbuzz entry you cite as the source says it is according to FOX News, which says it is according to this article:

http://news.lavenderliberal.com/2008/05/ 11/obama-supporters-do-you-have-any-idea -how-predictable-youve-become-ps-nobodys -buying-your-latest-nicey-poo-ploy/

which you blockquote, but no where in the article is there any reference to bloggers being paid.

Alegre, used to write positive diaries about her candidate. Now it's nothing but baseless hit-jobs.

I heard Obama paid Steve Jobs and Bill Gates to install a micro-blogger-ass kissing-widget on every PC and Apple that automatically senses Hillary supporters, hypnotizes them and makes them feel giddy about Obama...

If he declares victory on May 20th I'll be the first to call bullshit on his stunt.

What if she concedes and endorses him on May 20th?

like Bill Clinton says...

if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

I am not quitting either. I hope she does take it to the convention, I want to go and have her become the nominee.

I will be with her on the floor and Alegre, I will find a way to get you to that convention floor as well - you deserve to go - IF she takes it this far.

I believe Hillary is smart enough to figure a few things out:

#1 She will take it to the convention floor IF she believes she really has a chance. Meaning - she has an idea of where the remaining SD's will go and what her chances are.

#2 If she believes her chances are decent, then I too believe she will take it all the way.

What the Obama supporters don't understand about this whole thing is that this is about making history. This is about believing you (hillary) are the best candidate to do the job.

I truly believe that if the situation were reverse and obama was 150 delegates behind - his supporters, those in and out of the party (Kennedy for example) would be shouting - "take it to the convention".  The AA community would also feel this way due to the history making aspect of his campaign as well.

So - I'm up for it. I've already got 10 days off for the convention and I really hope this is what we are doing in August.

We've been called Rovian.
Repukes.
Republicans.
Red-Staters.
Fascists.
Corporatists.
Racists.
Hate-mongers.
Liars.
Traitors...

I'm a bit tipsy, but let me say - I'm genuinely sorry you've been called those things. I genuinely wish you brought the same passion to Obama.

I've been on the receiving end of:

Drone
Obamabot
Kool-aid slurper
Robot
Misogynist

etc.

Alegre, I can say this - it seems like your heart is in the right place. And, since you're not being paid to blog, I can only say: God bless. I think Hillary is losing, but I hope your passion pays off for you. I hope you find what you are looking for, and get what you need. Hillary is lucky to have you. I hope you understand that we (Obama ppl) are not out to be your enemy. And god forbid, Obama is definitely not.

Best wishes.

The guy always tries to sweet talk his way into your heart.

Allegre... that's a really beautiful picture of Hill.  She is truly amazing.  There is no woman I know who could still be standing after all that has been thrown at her.  I believe she will be our 44th President and we need her desperately.  I am taking her lead and will march with her no matter how many keep piling on.

Thanks for the post.  Good words.

Go Hill Go!

The only time in modern History where a convention fight lead to a GE win was with FDR, and the Great Depression assured his win.

If it goes to Denver, no matter whom the nominee is, we lose. Someone has to accept facts in early June, unless they want to ruin their legacy.

I wish Obama was paying me!

I could use some gas money.

As for your diary, it's the bottom of the barrel.

You're really taking this hard.

This smear job is pathetic.

I have lost all respect for you as a blogger.

Except for the giant burlap sack with a dollar sign, there is no proof that I've been paid to join and share my opinion here.

Truth is, I honestly just found this site a little while ago. This place has a cleaner interface than others and, to be honest, I'd rather be surrounded by Hillary supporters than exist in an echo chamber. I don't find pleasure in having my views automatically reinforced.

As an explicit disclosure of what I implied: yes, I voted for Obama. From what I've seen, he's the better candidate. I've thought that for most of the primary, but I don't want to have this debate here and now, since that's not the topic of this thread.

Obviously, since I'm a casual lurker here, I don't know what the Hillary supporters have been called, what names have been thrown, etc. I'm sure both sides have endured their share of hatred. I, personally, am an ignorant, unthinking, naive misogynist. I never knew.

However, there is one particular quoted passage in your post that I feel I need to respond to explicitly:

This, non-believers, is how stupid the Obamabots really think we are.

"Obamabots", which I'll assume is a term of endearment and not partaking in the name-calling you lamented earlier, enjoyed seeing their candidate pull through. They celebrated, much like a team's fans do when their quarterback takes a knee to start running down the clock. It's not over, per se, but the victory is palpable.  In those moments, you typically don't appreciate the feelings of the people on the other side and inevitably your celebration and proclamations of success are significantly excessive and occasionally offensive to the opponents.

Over time, people's jubilation becomes more controlled and they begin to appreciate the contest itself, beyond their particular side. They begin to realize that the people on the other side fought as hard, emotionally lived and died with the results just as much and were just as deserving, but through some confluence of work, preparation and serendipity the result they wanted came to pass.

Obama supporters, such as myself, aren't calling for unity because it's convenient or expedient. We want to bridge the gap caused by a heated primary, by the politics that made small differences seem like chasms and by the trolls who reveled in antagonizing each side with stereotypes and insults under the guise of supporting the opponent.

I think that unity is essential for defeating the Republican contender. There aren't any arguments that McCain represents Hillary's views more than Obama, nor any that McCain is the best choice for President based on the issues that are important to Democrats of all stripes. I think that my iPod would be a president than McCain, because at least we could randomize the playlist and be surprised by what is said once in a while. It's time to acknowledge that, if Hillary isn't the candidate (even if you think she should run until the convention, which is her choice), voting for McCain won't solve any problems. It'll only make life more difficult for the next four years.

Let's work together to ensure the issues we care about are acknowledged and the rights we hold sacred are preserved.

On May 20th, Obama may end up with the pledged delegate majority INCLUDING Florida and Michigan seated according to the results. If he has enough supers then or a couple days after, he will be able to declare victory outright, and no amount of "sexism!" screams will stop most of this party from getting behind the nominee. Alegre, TexasDarlin, and all ten or so more of y'all can form your own party for all I care. This has stopped being about the party or the country for y'all a long time ago. Most of Hillary supporters aren't like you.

Being a "fighter" is fine. But its not everything. There are times when there are more important things at stake. Now is one of those times. Let's beat John McCain!

be at bargaining by this point?

As a rule, you should always update a diary with an explanation about a recent important edit.  In your case, a baseless rumor and smear were perpetrated and highlighted within the very first paragraph, but then this portion was removed without explanation.  Care to comment?

There is a difference between fighting the good fight, and fighting the wrong fight.  Clinton never seem to fight for the Right things.  Fighting when she shouldn't is one of the things that cost her the nomination.  She always takes the aggressive and confrontational path, that is not the sign of a fighter, but of a brawler.  The only thing she is succeeding in doing, is creating more debt for herself, and extending a nominating process that did not need to be extended.

It is like a person in an abusive relationship, there is not victory in staying, there is no good fight there, you have victory when you walk away with your dignity and respect intact.

Hillary and you, need to put down the selfdestructive fight and find the courage and strength to walk away.

the "Hillary Clinton: oppressed" line was guaranteed not to work from the moment the "inevitability" line was brought out at the beginning of the campaign.

You claim that you're the oppressed party, but look at all the things you've been writing about Obama and his supporters.

Calling yourselves the poor, blameless oppressed victims in this just...won't fly.

But we all know who willbe accepting the nomination. And it won't be the "lady in the pantsuit".

You go Alegre. Thanks for the passionate diary that resonates with the millions of Hillary supporters that aren't about to be bamaboozled!  

Since many of you did not see the original version of this diary, the admins has to step in and delete large portions due to the unsubstantiated rumors and smears being passed on within.  The diarist has not come clean with an explanation, so I'll provide you wit some context.  Here's part of what was forced out of the diary (as cross-posted at another site):

"Cross-posted at MyDD, where admin. saw fit to delete all references to those 400 bloggers that may or may not be on Obama's payroll.

I got an email from a friend and have tried to confirm this from other sources - no luck as yet but I thought I'd mention this to raise an important point gang... Rumor has it that Camp Obama's making a huge push to make nice with Hillary's online fans and convince us to abandon our gal before even a single vote's been cast at the convention this summer. Some are even saying he's gone and hired 400 bloggers. Check it out..."

It's another vast conspiracy for you isn't it?

Will you boo her?

Alegre, this is getting sadder to watch and I feel its only going to get worse for you.  Soon you will be writing another GBCW diary for MyDD and start another boycott of another progressive site.  You will slowly work your way down to the truly vile places such as Taylor Marsh, No Quarter and Hillaryis44.  And from there it will be downward further.  

Based on what you write it has become apparent there is no scenario where you will ever recognize Obama as the legitimate nominee and you will wear this as a persecution albatross around your neck for the rest of your life.  

There is no grand consipracy out there against Clinton.  None.  Zip.  She lost a tough campaign.  It happens.  She had every advantage imaginable and lost because she ran a bad campaign and her opponent ran a better one.  Its just that easy.

But let me repeat - no one is persecuting you or Senator Clinton.  No one.  

Sure, there is a small subset of anonymous blogger commenters on both sides who are complete jackals who in no way represent their candidates or are sanctioned by their candidates.  I am truly sorry if you have taken offense by what they have said but you know better than to make the connection that this is somehow directed by the campaigns themselves.

I have always said I admire (and am admittedly creeped out by) your complete loyalty to Hillary.  But you are taking more and more flak now because your arguments are getting more and more stretched, baseless and delusional as the days wear on.  Reason and sensible advocacy have left your diaries.

No one will deny that Clinton can fight on to Denver and beyond if she wishes and her most ardent supporters can cheer her on all the way.  Hell, if she wants to fight on her own after Denver, so be it.

But this site is for electing democrats and we are reaching the point where Hillarys continued run is BAD for the party as a whole.  Like it or not, the party is coalescing around Obama.  The end game is written.  Outside of the live boy/dead girl scenario Obama will be the nominee.  There will be no August surprise.  

So you will keep taking a pounding on this site (and it will get worse, trust me, its natural) as the races slip by and the primaries end.  This site is for electing democrats and if it stays true to that mission you will be pushed to either accept reality or disappear.

And honestly, I wish you the best and hope you come over when the race is run.  Its hard to watch someone go down that spiral when they appear to be a good solid person.  The other dead enders seem to be professional shit-stirrers, but you appear to be different than them.  You appear to be an honest broker of your emotions.  

But what happens next will be up to you and you alone - not Obama and his supporters.  You are welcmome on the team at anytime.  But I can assure you we will not beg or bend over backwards to assuage your misguided and delusional faux outrage at perceived slights.  Thats not a threat its a fact.  You will have to come to that choice yourself and meet us halfway.  The hand is extended always.

Ditto! I'll vote for Nader before I vote for Obama! I'm menopausal so I don't give a damn about Roe vs Wade. Let his generation fight the fight for their reproductive rights - they deserve it after trashing a pioneer in the fight to keep abortion legal. I don't give a damn about the party run by sexist men. Let them grovel because they finally realized that we are a force to contend with. Hell has no fury like women scorned! I remember something my mother said to a ex-boyfriend of mine as to why I would not come to the phone: "there's no deader love than a dead love" -He's lost me forever and a day!

For the third time (Today, I think)....

ALEGRE IS A PAID BLOGGER!

YAY!!!

As long as HILLARY CLINTON is still running for President, it is ALEGRE'S JOB to write these kinds of blogs.

The better job she does of it, the more likely the chance they will renew her $4500/3 month contract.

That is how this works.  It's been covered heavily on (mostly) right-wing  websites already.  Hillary Clinton's campaign loves this shit. I don't blame her, because it works, sortof.   It keeps the shrill shrill.  Look at the replies in every thread this paid blogger makes.

Again, I'll use the analogy of human flashing banner.  That is all Alegre is (not in life, but in this medium).

Alegre does her job well. I'd hire her.  

divide us more, or encouraging the divisions.

To be frank, I was not really into politics prior to about 6 months ago and I am not about to participate in this little infighting drama some of you guys seem bent on playing out, this just does Not interest me!

Maybe this will sound cliched, but, don't we have enough Real problems to worry about?

Also, Alegre, please don't call yourself a blogger if you don't bother to write in complete sentences.  I'm no writer myself, I'm sure I am barely comprehendable.  But, I also don't try to pass myself off as some kind of "serious writer."  I'm not trying to be rude, I just can't read what you write sometimes, and honestly, that hurts your credibility.

divide us more, or encouraging the divisions.

To be frank, I was not really into politics prior to about 6 months ago and I am not about to participate in this little infighting drama some of you guys seem bent on playing out, this just does Not interest me!

Maybe this will sound cliched, but, don't we have enough Real problems to worry about?

Also, Alegre, please don't call yourself a blogger if you don't bother to write in complete sentences.  I'm no writer myself, I'm sure I am barely comprehendable.  But, I also don't try to pass myself off as some kind of "serious writer."  I'm not trying to be rude, I just can't read what you write sometimes, and honestly, that hurts your credibility.

"Like many of Hillary's supporters I can't afford to attend a convention like this.  Hotels and airfare are beyond my reach so I'll be watching it on the teevee from home.  But I'll be there with you all in spirit."

I'm an Obama supporter and frankly, I doubt you are poorer than me.  I've read 90% of AA's are now voting for Obama.  Do you really want to argue that Hillary has some kind of monopoly on voters that are poor and can't afford to travel?

Hillary, but why do you have to rain on my parade?

I wish people would stop trying to mislead others by claiming that Hillary Clinton has or will lead in popular vote. Since you cannot add up caucus states you cannot tell how many people supported each candidate in the election process.

Also, if you're going to count Michigan and Florida in your vote totals, shouldn't Vladimir Putin have several million votes? After all, not everyone campaigned and was on the ballot in those states.

I believe the name calling has gone both ways.  Please don't suggest otherwise.  

Would you like us Obamabots (I believe you use that term with some sort of disdain intended), would you like us to continue hurling nastiness your way?  I believe it is expected of the winning team (or at least the one that thinks they have won) to be magnanamous and reach out with a gesture of goodwill.  Is that not how it is supposed to work?  No point in dragging the nastiness out any longer than it has to.

This is a meltdown if epic proportions.

So you say Obama supporters have disrespected you and your candidate.  And now you think our effort to "make nice" with Clinton supporters is laughable.  Well, what do you want us to do?  Apologize for everything any Obama supporter ever said?  Acknowledge that Clinton ran a good race, trading victories with Obama all the way up to the last contests, but just came out with less delegates in the end?  Personally grovel for you and all the other Clinton supporters to vote for Obama?

What do we have to do now for you to think we are genuine, and that we honestly want you all to stay in the Democratic Party with us and work for our nominee against McCain?

What do you want us to do?

"Hillary and I are cut from the same cloth gang.  There's no quit in me either"

You are no Hillary.

She would never say as you did what "pretty much sums it up for me..." "It was as if The Big Giant Head at Obama Central texted new marching orders to the cell phones (or perhaps directly into the brain-chip implants) of all Obamaniacs simultaneously".

"So much so that I was forced to choose between my sanity and blogging over at dKos"

If she was already blogging as dKos Hillary would not have quit, she would have carried on fighting at dKos.