The DNC decided FLA and MI were not going to count. Hillary Clinton, the Hillary Clinton accepted that, she publicly declared they were not going to count, that they were cosmetic contests. She changed her mind when she saw fit, but that does not change reality, I'm afraid.

Did you see how uncomfortable she was when Wolfson was talking , the camera cut to her face and she was basically rolling her eyes , frowning.

Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, we know you guys hate Barazile. Get over it. Stop trying to blame hillarys loss as everyone else's fault. And the rule ARE the rules.

Another Donna Brazile hit job?

Wolfson is acting a fool on TV everywhere he goes. You

can not be serious. Only Terry is looking worse than Wolfie when

he gets the chance to speak.

I'm guessing you are.

Rules are the rules, and thankfully we are getting closer and closer to Hillary gathering up her dull pantsuits and exiting the "nomination" stage.

Michigan and Florida gamed the game and lost.  Yes, they lost.  They should have played fair.  Doesn't anyone know what fair means???  

Donna Brazile and the rules committee [including Harold Ickes, a Clinton supporter!] and perhaps all of the candidates as well, clearly had no idea that their sanction of 100%--which was obviously a far harsher sanction than was called for in the rules--would have such an impact on this race.

That says so much about their incredible lack of foresight, as well as their arrogance of power.

They were so focused at the time on establishing their "rules is rules" mantra, that they didn't heed the possibile backlash that could result from doubling those sanctions, much less allowing THREE of the FIVE states to violate the rules, while they doubly sanctioned TWO of those states.

It's really an exercise in futility to continue to CLING to their "rules is rules is rules" mantra now that it has caused such a problem for the Democratic Party.

The rules say 50%--Donna clings to 100%. She's cutting off her nose to spite her face. Those 2.3 million voters will never forget or forgive. The Democratic Party will be forever tarnished as the party that DISENFRANCHISES DEMOCRATS.

It's truly stupid. It's almost as stupid as not counting the Florida and Michigan votes in the popular vote total. Those votes are counted and officially tallied and recorded by the Sec/State of Florida/Michigan. They count. Officially. So include them in the pop. vote total.

If the delegates get sanctioned at 50% and the entire popular vote total is included in the tally, then at least they will have come to an agreement on Florida.

Michigan is harder. Obama took his name off the ballot of his own volition. He shouldn't get one delegate out of it, as far as I'm concerned. Any delegates can vote for Obama at the Convention, pledged or otherwise, if they feel like he got a raw deal. But frankly, it is the height of arrogance to take your name off the ballot and then argue that you earned delegates!

Where does it say in the "rules is rules" booklet that a candidate whose name is not on the ballot gets to earn delegates?

Show me.

I disagree with the substance of the point in the diary. The rules do not dictate any one punishment for violating the set primary date, it RECOMMENDS halving the delegates the state is awarded but also explicitly says greater or lesser punishments are acceptable as the DNC choses.

The DNC (rightly or not) chose to allow several states to move their dates forward to provide a more diverse contest in the first few races, and chose to consider Michigan and Florida's breaking of the rules to be more damaging to the party and punish it more severely. The time to complain about this was at the time the decision was made, and in fact Sen. Clinton and her senior staff all explicitly and unequivocally supported the DNC's decision, until months later when it was politically expedient not to.

I don't hold it against Sen. Clinton's camp for taking this position, given the fact it represents a move based in what is effectively desperation, but informed members of the population at large who follow politics as closely, and have access to as much information, as we do should be able to separate fact from spin.

The rules mandate that states in violation of the DNC primary date rules at least lose their SDs and half of their delegates, plus additional sanctions as the DNC deems fit.

The DNC may have been foolish to assign additional penalties, but they were well within the rules.  Your diary is inaccurate.  Sorry.

Poor Donna she is as much to blame as Dean for the mess we find ourselves in. I don't think the DNC realizes how much credibility or much of the high ground they have ceded and  lost over this issue. We'll see how all the complaints and calls to the DNC pan out. I personally have called and asked for her removal. I know I am not alone.

but she doesn't care.  I want her off the news network unless she fesses up that she's an outright Obama partisan.

The rules don't matter when its Obama.  The fix is already in for him.  this is the way dems lose over and over again--putting their personal ambition above that of the country--like Brazile.  

"After the West Virginia primary last night, CNN paid pundit and covert Obama supporter Donna Brazile"

If she is covert how do you know?

Judging by her sense of humor this superdelegate is playing her hands close to her chest. In an interview with satirist Stephen Colbert Brazile she said "Look, I'm a woman, so I like Hillary. I'm black; I like Obama. But I'm also grumpy, so I like John McCain".

And heck, "CNN paid pundit"?  Talk about reducing a long C.V. How about mentioning, for example that she was campaign manager of the 2000 presidential campaign of Al Gore.

The most interesting thing I heard her say last night was she corrected Anderson Cooper about the upcoming backroom deal which will happen on the 31st.  As Donna rightly pointed out, nothing in the Democratic Party meetings is done in secret and cameras will be allowed in the room.  If nothing else, perhaps some of the people here will finally learn what the rules are, the whole rules, and not just the paragraphs they like to cherry-pick.

C. 1. a. Violation of timing: In the event the Delegate Selection Plan of a state party provides or permits a meeting, caucus, convention or primary which constitutes the first determining stage in the presidential nominating process to be held prior to or after the dates for the state as provided in Rule 11 of these rules, or in the event a state holds such a meeting, caucus, convention or primary prior to or after such dates, the number of pledged delegates elected in each category allocated to the state pursuant to the Call for the National Convention shall be reduced by fifty (50%) percent, and the number of alternates shall also be reduced by fifty (50%) percent. In addition, none of the members of the Democratic National Committee and no other unpledged delegate allocated pursuant to Rule 8.A. from that state shall be permitted to vote as members of the state's delegation. In determining the actual number of delegates or alternates by which the state's delegation is to be reduced, any fraction below .5 shall be rounded down to the nearest whole number, and any fraction of .5 or greater shall be rounded up to the next nearest whole number.

And here's the rule that says the DNC can impose additional sanctions or come up with an alternative resolution.

C. 5. Nothing in the preceding subsections of this rule shall be construed to prevent the DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee from imposing additional sanctions, including, without limitation, those specified in subsection (6) of this section C., against a state party and against the delegation from the state which is subject to the provisions of any of subsections (1) through (3) of this section C., including, without limitation, establishing a committee to propose and implement a process which will result in the selection of a delegation from the affected state which shall (i) be broadly representative, (ii) reflect the state's division of presidential preference and uncommitted status and (iii) involve as broad participation as is practicable under the circumstances.

Fortunately, neither Donna nor Wolfson gets to decide how the two states are seated.

Obama has said they would be seated. I think the main argument is against giving Michigan delegates only to Hillary, as if there were no Obama supporters in the entire state. Talk about disenfranchising!

I know some argue that Obama took his name off the ballot, and that's why he should get zero. But is this about him, or the voters?