Obama Mythology 101

Here are the facts, not the spin:

State Sen. Obama helped secure thousands in state money for a Chicago entrepreneur who had paid him as a legal adviser.

Robert Blackwell, the Chicago entrepreneur, also became an Obama donor.

Obama's Ethics disclosure forms do not make the link clear.

William Ayers Employed Barack Obama for eight years.

The Los Angeles Times broke the ethics story in today's paper  reporting that Obama used Illinois state letterhead to request a $50,000  tourism promotion grant for a longtime political donor and employer, Chicago entrepreneur Robert Blackwell, Jr. and his company Killerspin.  Obama  mailed the request within months after receiving a final $8,000 per month retainer from Blackwell's company Electronic Knowledge Interchange.

Blackwell  paid  Obama the retainer  to give legal advice to his growing technology firm.  The monthly sum from this Blackwell company  totaled $112,000.  Then, with support from Obama, other state officials and an Obama aide who went to work part time for Killerspin, this Blackwell Company eventually obtained $320,000 in state grants between 2002 and 2004 to subsidize its table tennis tournaments.

Killerspin specializes in table tennis, running tournaments nationwide and selling its own line of equipment and apparel and DVD recordings of the competitions.

Obama's staff said the senator advocated only for the first year's grant -- which ended up being $20,000, not $50,000. The day after Obama wrote his letter urging the awarding of the state funds, however, Obama's U.S. Senate campaign received a $1,000 donation from Blackwell.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/ nation/la-na-killerspin27apr27,1,7266833 .story?page=1&track=rss

Now about Willaim Ayers

In addition to this failure to ethically disclose an important donor, Obama has been breathtakingly  misleading about his relationship with William Ayers. In the past Obama described Ayers as an "acquaintance."  He also said in the recent ABC debate that Ayers is "Not someone I've accepted endorsement of, it's not someone I exchange ideas with on a regular bassis."Whopper!! Pinocchio!! William Ayers empoyed Obama for eight years as the Director of the Annenberg Challenge Board.

Thanks to Larry Johnson here http://noquarterusa.net/blog/2008/04/26/ why-is-obama-hiding-the-truth-about-will iam-ayers-follow-the-money/

 In 1995, the Chicago Annenberg Challenge was created to raise funds to help reform the Chicago public schools. Ayers co-wrote the initial grant proposal, lists himself on his own website as the co-founder of the Challenge; and he helped select the first director of the board of this program: Barack Obama. Obama served on the board for eight years until the Challenge ended in 2003. Bill Ayers was intimately involved in the Challenge over this same time period.

Senator Obama needs to stop pushing a message of `no politics as usual' and start answering questions put to him about his associates and financial connections honestly and forthrightly. These disclosures after his repeated mis-statements and lack of full disclosure on ethics forms and about his associations-- in debates or in the press-- is serving him poorly.



Display:


Re: Obama Mythology 101 (1.20 / 5)

OH NOES OBAMA IS A TERRORIST!!!!


by obamaforprez on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:20:39 PM EST

Corrupt corporate welfare expert... (2.00 / 3)

That should stand him in good stead if he gets the nomination, as far as the Republicans usual spin on their 'responsibility' goes.

No wonder they are rooting for him! They are going to tear him apart.


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:20:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Republicans are rooting for Hillary. (2.00 / 2)

In fact, I've seen triumphal diaries here about that. They're even running an ad in NC to take Obama and other Democrats down.

So basically, your comment is the exact inverse of observable reality.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:26:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Republicans aren't rooting for any Democrat (none / 0)

I think some of them finally realize that Obama would be a more repugnant presidential choice that Clinton.  How this perception could have evaded so many of them for so long only demonstrates how their eyes were closed by blind Clinton hatred.

Still, it seems to me that many of them (if not most of them) would still prefer to have Hillary dispatched in the primary and deal with Obama in the general election.  I don't think the GOP has a clear consensus about which candidate is more electible.  They figure they could defeat or lose to either one.  Regardless of which one is nominated, they will vote against the nominee.


by lombard on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:37:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Right. (none / 0)

The republicans just want to destroy the repugnant Obama - charming - out of patriotic concern. This is evidence that they're shaking in their Manolos about Hillary.

Funny thing, though, that red-state Democrats support Obama. What do they know that Hillaryites and republicans don't know?


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:23:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

They don't "know" anything (2.00 / 1)

Red state dems are generally ultra-liberal is all.  I have lived in blue states where there are more dems and they range from conservative-moderate-Reagan type dems to limosine liberal dems.  Now I live in a red state and the white dems are by and large the elite type liberals...the moderates and conservatives are republicans.  


by emmasaint on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 09:11:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Very true (none / 0)

When a party has a majority of voters in an area, there is more diversity among the type of voters in the party.  When an area is dominated by one party, the minority party has more true believing activist types - the big tent vs. the smaller more cohesive tent.


by lombard on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 04:32:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

If that were the case, then why have (none / 0)

I received emails from the Obama campaign to go to other states to sign up "Democrats for a Day?"  I have been solicited TWICE by the Obama campaign to do this but NEVER by Hillary's campaign to do anything even close to that.  The Obama facade of legitimacy has collapsed.


by macmcd on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:55:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If that were the case, then why have (none / 0)

That Democrat for A Day stuff just ain't cool! maybe it is really Obama's motto. because he was only a Democrat for one day, the day he first campaigned for office.


Visit Pagan Power You know you want to!
by Pagan Power on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:49:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh teh noez! (2.00 / 1)

Building the party! Letting in and reaching out to people who haven't voted for Democrats in decades! Traitor! Treason!


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 09:24:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If that were the case, then why have (none / 0)

No offense, but some poster who clearly couldn't read made a diary a month ago trying to link the Obama registration efforts in Pennsylvania with this supposed "Democrats for a day" idea, when it was anything but.  A lot of people here see things that don't exist.


by rfahey22 on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 08:26:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

He already has the nomination. (2.00 / 0)

...if only you would open your eyes wide enough to see.


by dystopianfuturetoday on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:59:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He already has the nomination. (2.00 / 1)

Anyone with open eyes and an open mind knows that Obama has nothing. The nomination goes to one best able to defeat McCain. For some time now, that looks to be Hillary.


by Nobama on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:39:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He already has the nomination. (1.33 / 3)

The most hated politician of our generation is suddenly "electable". Right...


by Democratic Unity on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:48:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He already has the nomination. (none / 0)

Are you talkin bout Obama the Divider?


Visit Pagan Power You know you want to!
by Pagan Power on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:50:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Jeebus, look at the polling. (none / 0)

Even if YOU hate Obama for preempting Hillary's march to the nomination, it doesn't mean the country does.  Her negatives are high, not quite GWB levels, but high.


by corph on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 01:02:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He already has the nomination. (2.00 / 1)

Obama has nothing?

It is a fact that he has more pledged delegates, and it is certain he will get to the convention with a non-trivial lead in them.

It is a fact that he has won more states.

It is a fact that he has won more of the popular vote unless you start up silly season and give Obama no votes in Michigan.


by randomscientist on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:38:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You should refer to the Poll Watchers (none / 0)

in the upper right and left-hand corners of the home page here on MyDD for just exactly what Obama has.  ;-)


by macmcd on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:59:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You should refer to the Poll Watchers (2.00 / 1)

Where's the part where it says he has more delegates?


by Mostly on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:06:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You should refer to the Poll Watchers (none / 0)

If our nomination process were decided by GE polls, then you're right, he would be at a loss to Hillary based on whatever polls MyDD has chosen for its maps.

But that's not how it works.  Instead we have to work with the nominee that the process has given us (well, almost certainly).  If you care about the Democratic cause, you should probably try to make lemonade out of what you perceive as lemons.


by randomscientist on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:19:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He already has the nomination. (none / 0)

Yes he has more pledged delegates. Unfortunately for you, there are still more to be awarded AND having more pledged delegates is not what the RULES say in how to get the nomination. The RULES say, without Fl & Mi you must have 2025 total delegates. If they are included (which most people are saying they will in some way shape or form then that number needed will change of course. Most likely solution on those two states is supers are in completely and pledged are at half. Which is what the RULES said if the DNC hadn't made an exception to them for these states)

The number of states has nothing to do with either getting the nomination OR the Presidency! That is a Red Herring.

What we think is the popular vote is not governed by the democratic party rules. So of course Florida's should be counted. Michigan is more of a stretch but what is important is what do the superdelegates think.

When you look at which states (and territory) are left, she will be gaining a fair amount on him.


by del on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 10:48:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 2)

Wow, what a leap!

...So, you want to only propose a false choice of extremism......

I think lying, fraud and hustler are better descriptions than your terrorist.


by LindaSFNM on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:43:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 1)

hustler? Go ahead and play the racial code word game.


by cranberry on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:46:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 4)

Oh, that's ripe.  I see, the same old thing.  Lose an argument and play race card.  Thank you for enlightening us that only an AA can be a Hustler.  WOW.  lol


by LindaSFNM on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 03:29:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 1)

Somehow I can't imagine anyone calling Hillary Clinton a hustler.

For future reference, 'thug' is a good one too - it's totally deniable but the people you want to reach will know what you mean.


by Mostly on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:24:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (none / 0)

Thank you for pointing that out as well. Whew this primary is showing the true colors of many folks that would call themselves liberals or progressive.


by cranberry on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:28:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (none / 0)

Is Larry Flynt black?


Visit Pagan Power You know you want to!
by Pagan Power on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:51:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 1)

You kidding?  of course he's not a terrorist, and before 9/11 Ayres also got a pass. bush protects that Cuban that shot down an airplane, with no apologies. but the world has changed, now we don't see terrorists as freedom fighters, we see them as being willing to kill innocents to make a point. His Ayres problem is that he may still hold some romantic notions about those 'old' times he mainly seems to dislike, and he may have given Ayers a pass because he's a professor, society has forgiven him and he has a job to prove it? And you can agree with him, anyone has that choice. the problem is that he isn't being entirely straight, he defended the guy as a professor, that was probably straight, but he also minimized their relationship, and that's politics as usual. His pastor (with friends like that?) also admitted he hasn't told the truth about his relationship with his church, but gave him a pass because we all expect politicians to lie. the problem with that is he loses he reason for running, why do we need an inexperienced guy if he's not above lying, if he will say 'anything' to get elected?  Hillary hardly ever fibs, cause she gets caught each and every time, and probably also because she usually has a great memory.  He lies more than she lies, so how is he going to change anything? That's the point Obamaforprez, no one thinks he's a terrorist, were just starting to find out how much an old-school politician he is. Get it?  


Hillary - alternative energy
by anna shane on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:05:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Bingo - (none / 0)

who knows?  He may turn out to be a good president - why not?  But please spare us he's not a politician but beyond that stuff - he most certainly is not.  He would not be where he is if he didn't play nicely with Illinois/Chicago politicians.  Does that make him corrupt?  No - but he knows the game and plays it well.    


by Xanthe on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:10:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

"When a true genius appears in the world, (none / 0)

 you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."  
Truer words were never written.  
Democrats behaving like trash has been the disturbing spectacle this go round.
by ReillyDiefenbach on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 12:16:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

If only you devoted your energy into (2.00 / 2)

defeating McCain. That would be great for the country!


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:23:11 PM EST

She is...she's supporting Clinton (2.00 / 6)

so we can beat McCain in November.


by CoyoteCreek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:26:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Yeah... (2.00 / 6)

...because Clinton has no skeletons in her closet, and we're all going to feel warm and fuzzy about her after her online hit squad tries to make Obama into a corrupt terrorist.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:30:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Such a silly response. (2.00 / 4)

Nothing to say to it.


by CoyoteCreek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:33:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Such a silly response. (2.00 / 3)

Of course not. Because you know I'm right.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:48:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: She is...she's supporting Clinton (2.00 / 3)

I disagree she is not supporting Clinton by smearing a fellow democrat who is leading in pledged delegates and states won. this is a shameless hit job. And lets not forget Hillary has skeletons in her closets as well ask Linfar about the 60s radical that Hillary was associated with in the past. this can go both ways and you would be foolish to think that it can't  


PUMA: Particularly Undeveloped Mental Ability
by wellinformed on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:34:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

These aren't smears.. (2.00 / 1)

 these are public records..


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:22:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

kinda like the AUMF vote (2.00 / 2)


-- be excellent to each other
by kindthoughts on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:51:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: These aren't smears.. (none / 0)

Yeah, but they are facts about the messiah. So they have to be smears.


Visit Pagan Power You know you want to!
by Pagan Power on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:53:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'm sorry. It's too late. (2.00 / 4)

My candidate lost too and I understand the disappointment but that's how these things go.

Unless we want Roe overturned. More wars. A bigger deficit. It behooves us to turn our guns on McCain.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:37:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

GETTING THE BEST CANDIDATE TO RUN AGAINST HIM (2.00 / 1)

IS TURNING OUR GUNS ON MCCAIN.


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:23:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GETTING THE BEST CANDIDATE TO RUN AGAINST HIM (2.00 / 8)

So you think 6 weeks of campaigning against him after a floor fight in Denver giving the nomination to the candidate who has less pledged delegates is the strongest position?

I can't imaging any superdelegate who hasn't join Team Clinton agrees with that.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:35:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

RUN AGAINST HIM (none / 0)

You're not helping Obama by trying to claim he can't stand up against McCain because of Hillary. That makes him look like easy prey, he can't take down a girl who hardly says anything about him at all, how's he going to run against McCain? And then you're positioning him to blame her for his GE loss, not smart, wait till you lose before you spin your loss, that would be my advice.  Obama has noticed, and he's trying to stop whining although it's hard for him, Marueen was traveling with him and noticed he's weary and wants it over.  the nomination is just the first part, after that comes the GE and then at least four years of it not being over, this isn't the time for him to show he can wimp out. If you want to support him, pretend he's liking the campaign, loves debates, wishes it could go on and on cause it's so much fun and he has more than enough energy for it, loves American people so much that campaigning is far better than taking a smoking break.  But, I think he's been trying that, and he's just too tired. he didn't think running for president would be soooo hard. Poor dear!


Hillary - alternative energy
by anna shane on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:13:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: RUN AGAINST HIM (2.00 / 1)

Oh stop the "can't take down a girl" BS - do you think you're helping your candidate with this tripe?


by interestedbystander on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:28:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: RUN AGAINST HIM (2.00 / 1)

"he can't take down a girl"

Please. Clinton is hardly a "girl" in the demeaning and dismissive way you mean it. She is a smart and savvy politician, who has lost the nomination do to a number of factors, including timing, historical baggage, and strategic errors.

Are you really ready to belittle your own candidate just to take down the other?


John McCain
by Mandoliniment on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:17:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: RUN AGAINST HIM (none / 0)

Can you please stop being sexist please? tyvm


by Aris Katsaris on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 07:38:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: RUN AGAINST HIM (none / 0)

Was this comment meant for someone else? Because it doesn't address anything I was talking about.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 08:00:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If only you devoted your energy into (2.00 / 1)

Sort of like all the Obama supporters here who write diaries about how bad McCain would be as a choice .......

oh wait, they write those diaries about Clinton.

Sheesh.

What was that Michelle Obama said about running your own house?


Hell's bells, even the GOP didn't have to crucify Eisenhower's record in order to make Reagan their 'saint'. We can have two great ones, you know?
by emsprater on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:42:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

you think (2.00 / 1)

Obama is in charge of everyone of his supporters?


-- be excellent to each other
by kindthoughts on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:52:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

as with Obama himself... (none / 0)

...we'd love to turn our attention to McCain, but all the bitter dead-enders who can't accept the fact that she lost, and that she lost not because she is a woman but because she not only voted for Bush's war but also learned nothing from that vote (see Kyl-Lieberman, also "Iran, obliterate) keep up their campaign of smear and innuendo and often flat out racism (the "uppity" diary, the "secret Muslim diary, and this choice item from today that posits that Obama's victories are illegitimate because black people voted for him:
 http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/4/27/1450 17/355
by BlueinColorado on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 03:52:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as with Obama himself... (none / 0)

Congratulations for calling all those who support Hillary (what , 48+% so far of the folks who have voted in Democratic primaries, and an even larger margin of actual Democrats) "bitter dead enders".

That will garner your chosen candidate lots of support from us 'bitter dead enders".

I'd give you my real feelings about you and your commentary, but I am afraid that polity demands that I not curse you  while on a work computer.


Hell's bells, even the GOP didn't have to crucify Eisenhower's record in order to make Reagan their 'saint'. We can have two great ones, you know?
by emsprater on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:23:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as with Obama himself... (2.00 / 1)

Your response is dishonest.

I did not call "all those who support Hillary" bitter dead-enders. I was very specifically referring to the nasty obsessives ("uppity") who continue to post rumors and innuendo on this site in a continuing effort to undermine the candidate who is, by any realistic measure, the Demoratic nominee.


by BlueinColorado on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:28:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as with Obama himself... (none / 0)

You certainly must not be referring to any of the Clinton supporters commenting on THIS particular thread then, because rather than rumors and innuendo, as diarist states these are FACTS:

1. State Sen. Obama helped secure thousands in state money for Blackwell, legal adviser.

  1. Robert Blackwell also became an Obama donor.
  2. Obama's Ethics disclosure forms do not make the link clear.
  3. William Ayers Employed Barack Obama for eight years.

After May 6, we shall have a new presumptive nominee.


by wasanyonehurt on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:00:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: as with Obama himself... (2.00 / 1)

How is that going to work?  Is Hillary Clinton going to win North Carolina?  And by enough votes to narrow Obama's lead?


by Mostly on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:29:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (1.83 / 6)

Ms. Farley,

What are you smoking?  Your accusations are ridiculous and rather offensive. Why are you hell bent on this guilt by association with William Ayers and Obama?  As a former AP reporter you should be ashamed of yourself for spewing such trash.


by cranberry on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:23:30 PM EST

There are links supporting (2.00 / 4)

this diary.

You want her first-born child, too?


by CoyoteCreek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:27:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: There are links supporting (1.66 / 6)

So what? She is trying to create a scandal out of nothing. Again, as a former AP WRITER who attended USC School of Journalism(one of the top journalism schools in the country) what she is doing is a disgrace to journalism and absolute disgrace.  You have to wonder by her comments if she is a racist.  Isn't the purpose to elect democrats not team up with republicans to tear down democrats?


by cranberry on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:32:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

YOU are trying to create nothing out of a (2.00 / 2)

scandal..


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:24:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: There are links supporting (2.00 / 2)

Barack Obama can't run away every time someome poses a legitimate question.  He's tried it many times, "Oh they're playing 'GOTCHA' games!  They're trying to make a scandal!"

How many more rounds of excuses before we get this charaltan to answer some friggin' questions?

And why is his fan base so opposed to examining this man more closely?

"Don't look at his record!  Don't look at his history!  Don't look at the peculiar things he says!  Don't look at his bizarre social life!  Just VOTE for him cause he's all about HOPE and CHANGE!"

... Yeah, okay.  


2004 swing state margins: PA-2%, OH-2%, IA-1%, WI-0.5%, MI-3%, FL-5%, NM-1%; Alienating 50% of the party is a luxury we can't afford.
by BPK80 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:09:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: There are links supporting (2.00 / 1)

How many more rounds of excuses before we get this charaltan to answer some friggin' questions?

Ummm... He sat down with two Chicago newspapers for 90 minutes each and let them ask all the Rezco questions they had to their satisfaction.  

Please don't spread disinformation.



Lost rate and rec for issuing a '1' to a trollish comment. The troll, not so much.

by map on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:17:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh please (1.00 / 2)

Don't look at his bizarre social life!

You will elaborate, won't you? I can't wait.


by BlueinColorado on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 03:55:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Dood, come on! (2.00 / 0)

Don't leave me hanging! I collect crazy. You gotta tell me what crack pot crap you have about Obama's social life. Please!


by BlueinColorado on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:58:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dood, come on! (none / 0)

See Tony Rezko, William Ayers, Nadhmi Auchi, Jeremiah Wright, and others.  His social dalliances may not turn heads in Hyde Park or Union Square but most of the nation has its eyebrows raised.


2004 swing state margins: PA-2%, OH-2%, IA-1%, WI-0.5%, MI-3%, FL-5%, NM-1%; Alienating 50% of the party is a luxury we can't afford.
by BPK80 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:05:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Social Dalliances (2.00 / 0)

I'm sure there's lots of 'tut-tutting' as well.  I feel like I've wandered into a Jane Austen story.


by Mostly on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:45:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dood, come on! (2.00 / 0)

social dalliances

I'd ask what you're implying, but I'm not sure you get it yourself.


by BlueinColorado on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 07:05:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dood, come on! (none / 0)

Of course I wouldn't understand the meaning of my own words because I am an uneducated change-hating Clinton voter from Pennsylvania.  

I would add a snark tag except that I have no confidence in my ability to spell "snark" correctly.  My gosh, I'm so apt to misuse words.  I really need to go back to the third grade and get an education.  


2004 swing state margins: PA-2%, OH-2%, IA-1%, WI-0.5%, MI-3%, FL-5%, NM-1%; Alienating 50% of the party is a luxury we can't afford.
by BPK80 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 11:41:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dood, come on! (none / 0)

You forgot "bitter".


by BlueinColorado on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 12:06:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dood, come on! (none / 0)

And you forgot to put your period inside the quotation marks, Smarty-pants.  :-P


2004 swing state margins: PA-2%, OH-2%, IA-1%, WI-0.5%, MI-3%, FL-5%, NM-1%; Alienating 50% of the party is a luxury we can't afford.
by BPK80 on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 12:18:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: There are links supporting (2.00 / 1)

Just because the writer does not agree with or support Obama, does not make her a racist. She believes Clinton is the better candidate. Race has nothing to do with it.


by bird5 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:23:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: There are links supporting (none / 0)

I think the racism charges come from previous diaries, some of which were deleted and I believe the diarist banned once, not this diary specifically.


John McCain wants to make abortion illegal
by Lost Thought on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:01:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: these 5 just gave mojo (2.00 / 0)

Those would probably be people that remember the racist diary she was banned for.


by interestedbystander on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:31:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Please add me to your list. n/t (none / 0)


by bookish on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:40:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: There are links supporting (2.00 / 2)

Since when is it unprofessional for a journalist to point out facts? I realize that stuff like that might not work too well on MSNBC but to be an actual journalist it should be what they do.


Visit Pagan Power You know you want to!
by Pagan Power on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:55:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: these 5 just gave mojo (none / 0)

And one bonehead gave you a troll rating for pointing that out.


Visit Pagan Power You know you want to!
by Pagan Power on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:57:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 3)

Look, Ayers as recently as 2001 said he was glad he had set bombs, and only wished he had done more.

That is, he is an unrepentant terrorist.

Let me repeat: unrepentant, unrepentant, UNREPENTANT.

I hope one of these styles will catch your attention.

I don't know how anyone with integrity would not shun such a person. I can't imagine myself even shaking his hand if I knew who he was and what he stood for. And it means nothing to me that others would choose to do so -- that would be a sign only of their own failure in moral integrity.

At bare minimum, Obama did a lot more than merely shaking his hand. He worked alongside Ayers for many years. He is, apparently, by the account of his own campaign, "friendly" with Ayers. The kickoff event for Obama's run for the state Senate was held at Ayers' apartment.

Why it isn't fair to hold Obama to account for such an association is beyond me.


by frankly0 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:36:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (none / 0)

He takes the declaration of independence more seriously than most but the founders would certainly have understood where he was coming from. They were labeled as terrorists by the crown.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:38:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 3)

Please.

The Weather Underground was involved in bombings that killed people, and paralyzed others. They went underground because of the infamous Greenwich Village townhouse explosion, in which a bomb, filled with nails, and intended to be set in a non-Commissioned Officers' dance, instead exploded while being assembled, killing 3 members of the Weather Underground.

This is the kind of ugly act that the Weather Underground was engaged in. And Ayers was one of the top leaders of that movement.

Excuse me if I find that act vicious and unconscionable in the context of a stable democracy. Pretending that it was somehow the equivalent to what the founding fathers did is simply beyond the pale.

Anybody who can look at those acts and say, as did Ayers, that he only wishes he had done more, has had any sense of morality so corrupted that he should be treated as pariah. I simply don't care what he has done that might be a positive -- you don't get around what amounts to involvement in murder by performing some good works. That some politicians in Chicago, and many academics across the nation are just fine with Ayers, even in the face of his lack of repentance, says at least as much about their moral integrity as it does about Ayers'.


by frankly0 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:01:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (none / 0)

I know exactly who they are.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:05:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 3)

You sure don't act like you know who they are and what they did.

Founding Fathers they are not.

They were grandiose and vicious two-bit terrorists who murdered innocent people.


by frankly0 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:08:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 0)

I do. In fact I've read books and seen movies about them.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:10:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

KILLING INNOCENT PEOPLE (2.00 / 3)

is NEVER justified..


Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%
by architek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:25:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Well shit they never targeted civilians (1.50 / 2)

but if you're going to say that then you absolutely can't support Clinton.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:26:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

so riddle me this (2.00 / 1)

why were some pardon by Bill Clinton then?


-- be excellent to each other
by kindthoughts on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:54:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: so riddle me this (2.00 / 2)

They were pardoned after spending some time in jail. They paid their debt to society, unlike Ayers and his wife.


by bird5 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:09:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: so riddle me this (none / 0)

No, they didn't - he let them out of jail.  Turned them loose.


by Mostly on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 06:05:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: so riddle me this (none / 0)

Amazing -- so Clinton overturns the convictions of convicted murderers with a pardon, and that's okay -- but Obama merely spends some time in the vicinity of someone who was never convicted of murder, and that's not okay.

Is the shameless hypocrisy of Clinton supporters never gonna end?


by Aris Katsaris on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 07:53:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: he saw movies! (none / 0)

I have more information about them than the people complaining apparently. In fact I was at a screening of the recently released documentary (few years ago) in Chicago and Ayers was there answering questions.  


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 08:07:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 2)

Apart from an apparently accidental premature detonation of a bomb in the Greenwich Village townhouse explosion which claimed the lives of three of their own members, no one was ever harmed in their extensive bombing campaign, as they were always careful to issue warnings in advance to ensure a safe evacuation of the area prior to detonation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weatherman_(organization)
We care about politics because we know politics matters for people's lives and opportunities.
by politicsmatters on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:14:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 2)

this is a mind boggling comment to me. The Brinks robbery--weather underground--somebody died for sure.


by linfar on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 03:57:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

That's true (none / 0)

though it wasn't a bombing, and the two members that were convicted in that particular heist are the ones that your candidate's husband pardoned.


by bookish on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 02:09:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: thrsr 3 genuises gave mojo (none / 0)

I just gave politicsmatters extra mojo for distributing the truth instead of trying to promote a smear job and mis-information. On the other hand, I'm very tempted to TR you for trying to distort and smear community members simply because you disagree with them.


John McCain wants to make abortion illegal
by Lost Thought on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:14:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Thank you. (none / 0)


John McCain wants to make abortion illegal
by Lost Thought on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:33:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

That will be so helpful... (none / 0)

in the GE-he only associates with the MOST careful terrorists who use super safe bombing techniques.

I really don't get the rabid nature of Obama supporters-it's not about how you can justify anything he does, it about how those things will be used by the Republicans in a nation so easily manipulated by cries of patriotism and terror and who loves America and waves a bigger flag. in the real world this stuff matters and is used against politicians of which Obama happens to be a rather untested one.

Oh well, so we lose another election, that's one thing but if Dems get painted as some radical party that doesn't love America, that has long term effects. We had such an opportunity this year and now we're setting up a battle that has disaster written all over it.


berkshiretrueblue Commited to helping elect a Democrat as President "Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo" Ambroise Bierce
by berkshiretrueblue on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 10:20:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

And Hillary's husband pardoned two (none / 0)

members who killed a couple of Nyack police officers. Either her running mate is as guilty of bad judgment as Obama, or there's no foul here. Can't have it both ways. Hell, at least Obama didn't absolve anyone of their crimes.


by bookish on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:44:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

He was most fortunate in (none / 0)

that his father was who he was.  Class counts - even in terrorist acts.


by Xanthe on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 05:12:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (none / 0)

You have a very twisted sense of patriotism.


Visit Pagan Power You know you want to!
by Pagan Power on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 07:25:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (none / 0)

William Ayers is not on the ballot.

Let me repeat: not on the ballot, not on the ballot, NOT ON THE BALLOT.

That was fun.

Don't you wish this blog was set up for color so we could to it in red and stuff?

You know who Susan Rosenberg is, don't you?

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/Story?id=4 330128&page=2


by BlueinColorado on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 03:59:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Mythology 101 (2.00 / 1)

Why are we still trying to fight this battle, 40 some odd years since? Ayers may have a very shady past, but guess what, almost everyone who lived through the 60's has skeletons from that period.

The fact remains, he is NOW a respected member of the community. I doubt his students see him as a terrorist. I doubt the kids whose schools he (and Obama and a whole host of other people) improved consider him a terrorist. Does every person who served on that Board over the years deserve your scorn? Are you ready to say every person who has worked with Ayers to improve Chicago is inherently unfit to be President?

You are condemning charity with your argument. You are saying that arguments from the 60's are more important than helping the less fortunate now.

I hope you are pleased with yourselves.


John McCain wants to make abortion illegal
by Lost Thought on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:09:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

LOL - what an appropriate name (none / 0)

for the associates of Barack Obama....

"Killerspin"


by CoyoteCreek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:24:08 PM EST

BO has also been breathtakingly (2.00 / 2)

misleading about his relationship with Tony Rezko.

In the January debate with Clinton he told America that he "had only done about 5 hours of legal work" for Rezko - certainly suggesting that he barely knew the guy.

Well, that was a lie, too.


by CoyoteCreek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:26:13 PM EST

Re: BO has also been breathtakingly (1.80 / 5)

Hmm. Well, I suppose we should drag Watergate back up, or hey! Even better! How about the fact Clinton bullied an eleven year old girl and accused her of faking having been raped.

That's not misleading for the purpose of political gain at all, either. Right? Should be fair to bring up and use against her, according to the logic I've been seeing you employ.


Hooray for John McCain!
by ragekage on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:31:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: BO has also been breathtakingly (2.00 / 1)

Since we have people who love to run by and troll rate sometimes, I feel it necessary to point out that last statement was snark.


Hooray for John McCain!
by ragekage on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:32:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Sorry, I don't follow your logic. (none / 0)

My comment relates to something your candidate has done/said recently and is in keeping with a pattern of comments he has made - all of them, "incorrect" and not true.

How does Watergate relate to Hillary Clinton by way of analogy?


by CoyoteCreek on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 12:54:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I think he meant (2.00 / 0)

Whitewater.

Shouldn't we Obama people be dragging up every single plausible and implausible Clinton scandal, considering this diary and other smear jobs like it?

And if not, why not?


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:00:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think he meant (2.00 / 1)

No. Actually the righties can bring up Watergate as well.


John McCain on social security.
by heresjohnny on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:30:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think he meant (none / 0)

Clinton's persona has been national and well known for over a decade.  People know who she is, flaws and all.  

No one really knows anything about Barack Obama except that he's a svelt man who gives soaring rhetorical speeches about pretentious nothings.  As we examine him more closely, we see that the "messenger of change" outfit was an illusion and the man behind it is a very shady politics-as-usual piece of the decadent Chicago machine.


2004 swing state margins: PA-2%, OH-2%, IA-1%, WI-0.5%, MI-3%, FL-5%, NM-1%; Alienating 50% of the party is a luxury we can't afford.
by BPK80 on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:14:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think he meant (none / 0)

I know you all think Richard Mellon Scaife has suddenly turned into a Hillary fan but you are sadly mistaken.  The VRWC wants her so bad because they have not even begun to attack her, and they know they can attack hard.  

Here's a short list off the top of my head:

- Watergate firing

  • Communist ties
  • Wal-Mart experience
  • Healthcare debacle
  • Clinton Wealth (2000-2008)
  • FALN connections
  • Weather Underground connections

And the truth is that Hillary knows no defense for this besides "fight." She is not conciliatory and for political reasons cannot be contrite.  

And, she's given up on more than half the country supporting her.  Soooo, we will be stuck again fighting for Pennsylvania and Ohio rather than trying to fight for fundamental progressive change.  Sorry folks, Hillary is a d-i-s-a-s-t-e-r.


by zadura on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 03:01:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think he meant (2.00 / 1)

My point is that Hillary Clinton has not, in fact, survived the worst that the Republican attack machine (and its pilotless drones online and on talk radio) can dish out. We will learn what the worst really means if she is nominated. The Commie law firm will be only the beginning. Many tempting targets--from Bill's little-examined fund-raising and business activities during the past seven years to the prospect of his hanging around the White House in some as yet undefined role for another four or eight years to whatever leftovers from the Clinton "scandals" of the nineteen-nineties can be retrieved from the dumpster and reheated--remain to be machine-gunned. The whole Clinton marital soap opera, obviously off limits within the Democratic fold, will offer ample material for what Obama calls "distractions." To take the most obvious example, the former President's social life since leaving the White House will become, if not "fair game," big game--and some of these right-wing dirtbags are already hiring bearers and trying on pith helmets for the safari. Is this a "there" where the Democratic Party really wants to go?

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/he ndrikhertzberg/2008/04/after-pennsylva.h tml


by BlueinColorado on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 04:21:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hell, they've been waiting for 8 years (none / 0)

to resurface Mark Rich. And if you don't think they're going to tie every single one of Bill's improprieties (or appearance of) to her, you're living in a fantasy world. If Hillary has been doing favors for Obama by dredging up non-issues to confront him with, he hasn't been doing the same favor for her, so if she somehow obtains (not wins, obviously) the nomination, she'll get a face full of it during the GE.


by bookish on Mon Apr 28, 2008 at 02:20:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Sorry, I don't follow your logic. (2.00 / 0)

Indeed, Whitewater. Damn all these stupid "gates"


Hooray for John McCain!
by ragekage on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:04:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Sorry, I don't follow your logic. (none / 0)

I suppose the big difference could be that Rezkogate has never been thoroughly investigated, while Whitewater has been, with nothing found nor any charges filed.

So, go ahead, Spend your time looking the other way about your chosen candidate's possible achille's heels while focusing on the other candidates well known and investigated to the nth degree past.

Your time will be so well spent.

And, as an added perk, your efforts will be so helpful in defeating McCain in the GE.


Hell's bells, even the GOP didn't have to crucify Eisenhower's record in order to make Reagan their 'saint'. We can have two great ones, you know?
by emsprater on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 01:56:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Sorry, I don't follow your logic. (none / 0)

No, the media's given upon Rezko, they don't think there's anything there, buddy. Sorry.

I'm saying this is exactly why there shouldn't be another debate, and you're tactically agreeing with me there. Kudos to you, sir. Obama is much better served getting out and meeting the people of Indiana one on one.


Hooray for John McCain!
by ragekage on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:06:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Sorry, I don't follow your logic. (none / 0)

The media gave up on Whitewater long before the GOP did.  It was , at best, a concocted invented scandal for the benefit of the folks Obama now says has 'good ideas'.

I could agree with you about the debate issue, especially if I were an Obama supporter.  It is best to keep him on a short leash so he doesn't open his mouth too much, never know what might come out these days.


Hell's bells, even the GOP didn't have to crucify Eisenhower's record in order to make Reagan their 'saint'. We can have two great ones, you know?
by emsprater on Sun Apr 27, 2008 at 02:39:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Sorry, I don't follow your logic. (