He said, in response to being asked if Obama ever expressed the views - to Wright - that Wright expressed, NONONONONO.

That changes the context a bit. Off message would have been: YESYESYES

Due respect Todd, but its not like Hillary doesn't have off-message problems from people inside her camp. So deep inside her camp, they actually are married to her.  And thats not counting other mistatements by Ferraro, Rendell, etc. etc.

If the difference is "saying something dumb directly about the candidate they support", thats a slightly different story. I'd argue the major difference is that Obama has such comparatively stronger message discipline within ranks compared to Hillary who has been so all over the place with message that everyone knows about the internal civil.  Because of that, any off-message comment is enhanced for Obama.  Particularly so when its on a favorite issue of the media like Wright.

Wow! Now even the good Rev. is calling Obama out as a phony! Could Obama have a worse week?  First he gets crushed in PA, can't finish his waffle in peace and now this!?!?!?

Wright is not a political actor.  I'm sure he completely supports Obama, but obviously not to the point where he is willing to be "kept on a leash" to help the campaign however they deem best.  It seems like he's made a decision that it's more important to be true to himself, and I respect him for that.

"Off message" is just kind of a non sequitur in this context.  He's not a surrogate.

that you're misunderstanding him. He's a black preacher who preaches against injustice using the language of fire and brimstone. Politicians speak about injustice in different terms.

"This is for me a no-brainer," Gov. Strickland said. "If we're going to plan to win in November, we need to choose the candidate that has the greatest strength in the states that are necessary to get us the electoral votes we need." He added: "I hope the superdelegates are paying attention."

Today, the headline in the media is wright.

This weekend, another meltdown on Fox News.

Time for Obama to drop out so we can win this time.

Enough with the radicals. It is a sure loser in the general.

If Clinton ran a presidency like she's run a campaign, there would be no consistent message at all.  

Wright is not an Obama surrogate, he is Obama's former pastor.  He does not speak for Obama.  Obama runs a tight ship, and how he runs his campaign is MUCH more 'on message' than Clinton.

How about instead of trying to tear down Obama and provide the right with talking points, you start focussing on McCain's 'message'?  Or, are you, like Hillary, so focussed on 2012 that you're blinded by ruthless ambition?

You are exactly correct Todd.

Wright totally undermined Obama in two ways.

1)He delegitimized  Obama's condemnation of Wright's claims that the government created AIDS, etc. and

2) He painted Obama as a politician willing to say anything.

Those of you who cannot see that need to lay off the Kool-Aid.

On the other hand, Obama is still beating McCain in the polls, so there is every reason to believe it does not  matter.

I agree that the "he says what he has to say as a politican" idea doesn't sound all that flattering.  I can imagine the Obama camp wanted the Rev. Wright saga to resurface at this point.

Whoops, I meant can't imagine...

Anytime Wright shows up it doesn't help Obama.

We'll have to see if the Wright/Obama association drags down the democrats who endorsed him in NC.

Wright is a free person he need not do, or not do, anything to help or hurt Obama. You're acting like he and Obama are meeting and planning things out all the time. They aren't. He's Obama's former pastor and that's all.

I'd agree this is "off message" but Off Message for Clinton, not Obama.

Wright didn't undermine Obama or say that Obama agrees with his controversial statements. In fact, Obama when he made his speech cleary DIDNT throw Wright "under the bus" as others here, most notably Jerome, said was a mistake.

So, Wright saying he's not a politician, and that Obama isn't a preacher implies what, exactly? He didn't say "Obama didn't mean it" or "Obama wrote my speech."

So I think you're trying to summit a molehill here. And seriously, this is why Hillary is losing. She and her supporters spend more time searching for a gotcha on Obama than searching for a winning argument for her candidacy.

Ugh... What's the point anymore. Ironically, the people that so many claim will be easily led astray into thinking negatively about Obama by association are 20 times easier to reason with than some of the people on here. Not you, Todd, but just a lot of people in general.

you're doing exactly what Gergen, Tony Perkins, and the two Republicans on Abrams's show did: interpret Wright's comments in the worst light.

Wright did NOT says "just" a politician. In fact his construction applied to himself as well:

And he says what he has to say as a politician and I say what I have to say as a pastor, those are two different worlds.

so by the logic of your reading, he is saying that he himself is "just" a pastor, and will say what he must to pander to his supporters.

That interpretation doesn't hold up to scrutiny.

This is such a nothing issue, why reinforce the traditional media's distraction?

Eh, I'm an Obama supporter and I think Wright's comment is pretty bad.  Obviously he's not part of the Obama campaign, but they're remiss if they don't talk to him about his media appearances and coach him at least somewhat about what to say.

I mean, saying that Obama "says what he has to say as a politician" is pretty damning.  Not only does it call him a politician (which true or not, is somewhat damning for someone like Obama who's constantly striving to rise above politics), but it also says that he "says what he has to say", which very strongly implies that Obama's being insincere -- that's he's saying what he HAS to say, rather than what he MEANS.

I'm glad he comes off as generally reasonable in this interview, but that's an ugly quote for Obama.

Drip...Drip...Drip

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2 008/04/25/946650.aspx

Well, you know, he's got a point. Politicians and preachers have different jobs, and the jobs come with different requirements.

A preacher starts with the assumption that's he's in possession of the Right Moral Code, and that anyone who disagrees with him is Wrong. So we're going to expect a lot of hellfire-and-damnation in the rhetoric.

A politician in a democracy starts with the assumption that his opponents are basically decent human beings who have maybe been misled. So we're going to expect more conciliatory rhetoric.

Now, which of the two has the more accurate rhetoric? Is American racism a ongoing problem; a grievous affront to God that's going to result in horrible calamities? Or have we already made great progress towards solving it, and can we look forward to making more progress in the future?

Speaking as just a regular person...I don't know. I could go either way, depending on my mood. I think both sides are defensible, so I don't think we can accuse either of them of being phonies.

I do like the author's implication that Wright was "off-message", as if everyone in the world is required to use political-style rhetoric 24 hours a day. I bet he's a lot of fun at the dinner table:

"So, what happened at school today?"
"I had a race with Barry, but he finished way ahead of me."
"No, no, no! You're off-message! You'll never get elected to the student council that way! You should say, 'There was a race, and I came in second'".

so how can he be off message...LOL!

I just get the sense that Wright is pissed at Obama because Obama disavowed his comments so he hit back.

The reality is that Obama did NOT act like a typical politician after the Wright incident.  A typical politician would have thrown Wright under the bus and tried to destory him.  Instead Obama did tried to elevate the discussion by talking about race eventhough that may put him in a racial category as oppose to transcending race.

I get the sense that Wright is all about himself.  I think that Wright is selfish.

How, exactly does Obama not having the approval of Reverend Wright hurt him?  

I mean, it leaves him with some egg on his face, sure, but if people are uncomfortable with Obama because of his close relationship with the man - doesn't Wright distancing himself help him?  

I think you're kind of presenting it as a damned if he does/damned if he don't sort of situation here, and it's frankly ridiculous.  

What Hillary campaign sleezeball is making that charge?!

Wright could have done this interview better, but there's not much sense getting huffed up about it. Wright's a free agent, works for no campaign, and isn't a talking head or a politician. He's a pastor.

I doubt that Clinton or Obama's pastors would toe the line very effectively on the networks, either. Nor would I expect them to.

Obama tried to use the Wright controversy as an Alinsky "teaching moment" - not throwing Wright under the bus as per politics as usual but also renouncing the comments.  Obama was counting on his ability to convey a subtle position through the mainstream media.  At the time, I thought this was naive and likely to doom his candidacy.

Today's Wright interviews demonstrate the folly of the Obama strategy.  Had Obama clearly and unambiguously denounced Wright (and not merely isolated statements), then Wright's retorts would be portrayed by the MSM as mere "sour grapes."  Because Obama is understood not to have renounced Wright (but rather taken a more nuanced position), Wright's comments will be presented as a more stinging problem.

In the world where Obama's comments about Wright were sufficient to allow broad electoral success, the Democrats would have taken the presidency in 1988, 2000 and 2004.  Instead, we lost in 1988 and 2004 and had the election stolen in 2000.

I will take the near certainty of a 280 - 300 EV victory with Hillary over the possibility of 350+ EV victory with Obama with an equally possible Dukakis-style loss.

I am getting so sick of hearing about this issue.  If you have to ask me what one thing Obama is guilty of, it would be political pandering.  It seems pretty obvious that Obama joined Wright's church to build up his connections within the Chicago black community.  As a Chicago newcomer, earning the support of the black church community and ministers would have been key to the electoral coalition he was putting together.

So yes, Obama was a member of the Church.  Yes, Wright said some ridiculous things (especially regarding AIDS).  However, "god damn america" , "9/11 was the chickens coming home to roost" and so many other statements he made are entirely defensible.  One, because the quotes clearly have a larger context that has not been reported widely.  And two, because most of what he said was entirely true!  God damn America for abandoning the poor.  I'll say it too.  

I do believe 9/11 was the chickens coming home to roost.  We supported, trained, and funded Islamic radicals in Afghanistan to combat the Soviet union.  The most extreme groups happened to be the most effective, so they received the most funding.  We allowed the Taliban to take over because their strict authoritarianism was more attractive to energy companies hoping to compete for a lucrative pipeline contract there.  

So yes, it hurts to say, but we were playing with fire, and we got burned.  Badly.  I lost my cousin on 9/11, and I'm currently typing this from my office about 2,000 feet from ground zero.  Just because we don't like hearing that our government's policies played a part in causing 9/11 doesn't make it a false or offensive statement.  The truth hurts sometimes.

I suppose with the primaries going hot an heavy some HRC people will make a kerfluffle about it for awhile then it will fade like all the other petty mudslinging.

I am not sure Wright supports Obama.  It's not hard to imagine how Wright would feel sold out and slighted by Obama constantly hinting he denounces the Rev. Wright.  I think it's also pretty reasonable that Rev. Wright is more concerned with his own national and lifelong reputation, which has been tarnished (including by Barack Obama who refused to stand firmly by him) than the political aspirations of a man who only tangentially represents the Black community (elitism, Muslim roots, health care plan that hurts Black families, etc.).

I don't know that in the long run, African Americans would appreciate some charlatan manipulating them into believing he will attend to their needs, simply because they share a skin color.  What would happen if Clarence Thomas ran for office?  Ick.  

Wright probably sees this more clearly and he doesn't seem like the type of man to back down from stating his convictions.  I would applaud Wright for calling out Obama on his hypocrisy and exploitation of the Black community.

I'm just too afraid to watch the video after what we saw of him on YouTube.  Can anyone summarize it for me?  Did he turn around mid-interview and flash the "Black Power" symbol?  I'm sure he must have derailed the interview to talk about reparations, forty acres and a mule, and how the Jews were behind 9/11.  I mean, he is a monster, right?

I'm surprised Moyers that the stomach to sit in the same room with him.  God knows that Clinton would have given him an open-handed slap in the mouth and stormed out...For the childrens.

This GOP ad attacking Democratic Candidates in NC has been up for a few days..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXxkctYRA ZQ

I have YET to read anything from the hosts of MyDD condemning this....

For the geezers who  were there..and a point of information for those who were not...Look for Rove after 3 min...(oh yeah,; screw Rove...Screw any and all that sit silent as Rove's message here in 2008 plays the same game)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BM0zJl9Bx k8

as a reminder...lest we forget

http://icasualties.org/oif/

Tap yer toes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGoEcIEv3 _Y

in skimming through your post quickly i saw that you talked about keeping this guy on a tighter leash. About Obama's "clumsy surrogates and advisers".

I think its necessary to note that Wright is neither an Obama surrogate or adviser. It's also worth noting that this guy has the right to free speech. While that might harm Obama (which I don't see why it should unless you're grasping at straws) I feel his thoughts and words aren't completely out of line. In fact i see them as CW.

...this is it.

The corpse of Hillary's campaign is drying a swarm of flies as starts to stink and swell up.

Better fetch the shovel and dig a hole before it pops.  

I think this shows the independence of Obama and Wright. They are not one and not are not in lock step. If I were Wright, I would be upset as well. In fact, the elite in the media, are proving him (w)right. We are destroying a career of great service for ratings and to meet revenue goals.

The media is not in favor of Clinton or Obama. They are not in favor of McCain either. They are in favor of conflict. Conflict equals ratings. Conflict means a prolonged democratic race. It's like having a best of 7 series go all the way for the network carrying the games. Extra games = extra revenue.

They will call May 6th Super-Mini Tueday or something like that and play this Wright clip all the way through.

Look at the reaction good Democrats have had to this game they are playing on us. Democrats supporting Obama dislike Democrats supporting Clinton and vice-versa.  We are falling for it because we've been programmed for too long to even notice.

I hope we wake up and stop destroying ourselfs before the Republican maching heats up their effort. Obama is already facing heat in Indiana and North Carolina from the Republicans, McCain personally in addition to Clinton.

Wake up peeps!

Let's talk about candidates and issues and elections and defeating McCain, etc, etc.

Wright is the former pastor at Obama's church, and is unaffiliated with any campaign. This is celebrity gossip.

Obama is on live with the Indiana Editorial Board on HuffPost.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/25 /watch-live-obamas-meeting_n_98665.html

Is that supposed to be some sort of defense? Talk about off-message.

What a pathetic GOP emulating troll diary.

Wright would be "off message" only if he were a spokesperson for Obama.

What his comments show to all but confirmed Obama-haters is that there is no political connection between Wright and Obama or his campaign.

Stop carrying McCain's water.

I don't see how this does anything but help Obama. Most people expect candidates running for president to be politicians. Pretty innocuous statement, IMHO.

Give me a break.  Wright is not an Obama campaign representative or a spokesperson.  He's a pastor of a church.  He's not part of the Obama campaign.

A big thank you to all of the Democrats who continue to push this false meme, and help undermine Obama's candidacy.  

Jeez!

Can I get a weigh-in from everyone who thought Obama's fancy race speech was going to make this issue vanish into thin air permanently?

I said it then and I'll say it again.  When these controversies break, you can't just look at their immediate impact.  Like diamonds and herpes, Obama revelations are forever.

What is off message about his comments?  Rev Wright is a pastor and Obama is a politician.  DUH!  Rev Wright is basically saying I am not responsible for what Obama says and does, and he ain't responsible for me.  They are two different people who don't agree on everything, and it looks like there could be a big parting of the ways soon by Rev Wright's comments.  

You can find good and bad things on just about anybody except on Cheney who is Darth Vader.

Of course the quote is taken out of context.. no surprise by the media...  but, it's no big deal...  The fact is, the media had access to the entire interview and if that's the most damaging soundbyte they can come up with, then he's in really good shape...

...and even that misconstrued statement could be corrected by Wright very easily at the press luncheon he's having this weekend...

I disagree with everyone who is so scared of him.  Putting him in the closet only feeds the fear.. having him out as a human being helps reduce the damage...

The issue isn't going away... check out the ads in NC, might as well hit it head on!!

My Sense:

A. Wright has every right to go on air and represent himself.  He ought not not do it for the sake of the campaign.  Life is bigger than politics, especially when you have been "30 secondfied" for weeks.

B. Saying that somebody is a politician is not throwing them under the bus.  In fact, at one time, it was a respected office.  Lets wait to see the interview to hear the comment in context.

C. I imagine Wright believes what he said, and he has good reason too... Why should we expect him to back down.

Overall I don't think this should be treated as a political moment, even though it will be, but as an interesting lesson about divergent views in our society.  The Wright uproar has revealed a lot about racism in this country.  It will be a topic of discussion for years to come.  And, I think that discussion will be fruitful as the shock wears off, and people begin to ask where the comments came from.

Note to all, obama is a politician.

that maybe Wright is a private citizen who is not on Obama's "leesh" and can do whatever the hell he wants?

Also, HOLY SHIT. THIS JUST IN. Obama is a politician. OMFG.

Seriously, it is you (and Joe Scarborough apparently) who are reading way too much into this "Obama is a politician" line from Wright. People know that, expect that, and like Obama not because he is "not a politician," but because he is a different kind of politician. Yes, Americans sometimes experience something called "nuance." And yes, being a different kind of politician means condemning Wright's comments but sticking by the man, unlike what Clinton or any other "normal" politician would do: throw him under the bus as many times as it took to get poll numbers up.

this is definitely going to be a long general election if we make a mini-scandel out of everything any opponent/candidate says or does.  We shouldn't forget the big picture stuff.  Eceonomy, Healthcare, Foreign policy, etc. etc.  Everyone is guilty of doing this but you have to wonder whether you can really blame Charles Gibson and George Stephanopulous for their questions when these and other posts are eerily similar.

My feeling is that, whatever the origin of his philosophy or his rationale for making certain choices, that Rev. Wright is rather honest and unapologetic about who he is.

When he says that Barack said what he needed to say, as a politician, he speaks the obvious, frankly.  I doubt that, as a pastor, Rev. Wright would agree with Barack's supposition that Americans can only atone for our "original sin" by nominating him, for example.

I wrote a diary in which I said that Barack's speech contained a mixture of insight, falsehood, and was mostly filled with clever political ruse.  I believe Rev. Wright's remarks essentially echo what I wrote.

- However, Todd has missed the underlying point -

We are headed into another Carolina election.  As I predicted Tuesday night, the Obama campaign would begin to wage its reprehensible war of racial muckraking again.  A public appearance by Rev. Wright is mere stage-setting, while principle actors like Eugene Robinson and James Clyburn begin to unload the opening salvos in what will be a final attempt to completely dismember the honorable track record the Clintons have on behalf of the AA community.

It just occured to me, with Wright making his way back to the MYDD frontpage, how silly and baseless Ferraro's comments, and billions of pixels wasted defending them on this site really were.

I mean, what's the argument against Obama at the moment being pushed by the outlets and the Clinton camp?  That some mix of Wright, elitism, and Working-Class White racism is going to sink Obama against McCain in the fall.  Personally, I think this argument is just a bogus as the "he wouldn't be where he is if he wasn't black" line, but it is kind of funny, in an anthropological sense anyway, that hundreds of pages of insightful and not so insightful analysis has taken place on this site arguing strongly in favor of both of these theories.  And all within a month or two.

Funny.  Funny strange though, not funny "Ha Ha".

In response to the assertion that Wright was "going off-message" by calling Obama a "politician"....

I think it's worth noting how Moyers frames the question.
Watch at the :40 second mark of the clip - Moyers, in the middle of framing his question, says -

"...in that speech in Philadelphia HAD to say some hard things about you..."

Putting the question in that context - that Obama "had" to be harsh with Wright's quotes - seems to guide the answer that Wright gives a certain way. For example, I wonder what Wright would have said if Moyers had said -

"...in that speech in Philadelphia CHOSE to say some hard things about you..."

Seems like that would have made a big difference, no?

In other words: he (Obama)'s no better than all the rest of them.

There ya go...

No matter how you frame it, more discussion about the Rev Wright situation has more negatives than positives for Obama.  No matter what any of us believe there are still those out there who think this is Obama's achilles heel.  It is just one more distraction that he put on notice during his appearance on the Colbert Report.  Funny how his "distractions" are always blamed on other people though.

SOMEONE WANT TO COUNT THE RACISTS ON THIS BLOG?
OOPS I MEAN PATRIOTS.

AND CAN SOMEONE COUNT THE ONES WHO ARE GOING TO VOTE FOR GRANDPA? WHEN HILLARY GETS OUT?

ah yes..Obama IS a politician.
That is what Rv. Wright said. Obama has been elected to office and is seeking a higher office. The scope  of the general public is much wider than the scope of any congregation.
Is it the logic that a politician can not speak the truth?

I really miss any point that this says Obama lied.
If so, what was his lie?

Is it two months ago already?

Oh for all those throwing up their hands crying
"Oh but the Republicans will us this." ah yes they will.
If Clinton is the Nominee the GOP will use this..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exsmFDYyK 4U

I think it's hilarious how Obama supporters blame this on Hillary.  So Hillary called up Wright and got him to go on Bill Moyers and say that Obama is your standard BS artist?  Uh, Hillary had nothing to do with this.  She didn't sit in that pew and listen to the ranting for twenty years.  Wright wasn't her spiritual adviser and mentor.  that judgment Obama keeps claiming to have?  not so much.  Now I'm not christian, nor am I religious (and someone like wright's the reason why), but that church seems like one scary place and I wouldn't sit and listen to that bile for more than a minute.  I always imagined church was about peace and love and helping your neighbor not half baked conspiracy theories, anti-american propaganda and lets not forget about the trip to Syria with Farahkhan and turning the church magazine over to a Hamas leader.  Is that the kind of religion the rest of you Obama supporters practice?  that's perfectly fine with all of you?  because if that's the case, you're like no Democrats I know or care to associate with. and it's more like the hateful religious practices of the wingnut bigot machine.  the disconnect with progressive Democratic values and Obama on every level is overwhelming.  right wing framing on healthcare and social security?  check.  Lieberman like obsession with process and the evils of partisanship?  check.  scary religious practices?  check.  vote Hillary!  vote Democratic!

While supporters of McCain and Clinton have done their best to paint Jeremiah Wright as an Obama surrogate, he is not and never has been one. Wright speaks for himself. He cannot go "off-message" because he's never been responsible for disseminating Obama's message. Obama's political enemies would certainly like people to believe that Wright's message is Obama's message -- but they make this case entirely by way of the "association fallacy".

I don't think Wright, to use the dead horse cliché of the year, threw Obama under the bus. But let's suppose he had: Although it might be personally painful for Obama, I don't see how it could do anything but help him politically by underscoring the fact that Wright does not speak for Obama, and that their differences on the issues of controversy run deep.

It's unbelievable that some in the Democratic party are culpable of giving this controversy legs.

We are in a country where people have made decisions or statements that have actually killed people in wars and police brutality(witness the latest NYC controversy) and we are worried about Wright?

Why couldn't the conservative democrats get this outraged over the lies made by the war machine every day?

And another innocent black man dies and gets no justice in NYC. And Wright lived in a worse era and actually served in the marines despite being treated like a second class citizen or seeing other friends or family being treated like that by white Americans and yet, he doesnt ahve the right to say GODDAMN AMERICA???

Is Obama supposed to abandon someone like that over this? Whenever the so called middle america person badmouths half the country(namely Democrats), is that person not saying Goddamn to half of America?

A perfect microcosm of the pathetic exchanges that keep taking us away from what we most need as a nation.

Obama has the great potential to help heal our deep divides. We are in a crisis of spirit as well as a political and economic crisis.

Yet so many do what they compulsively seem to have to do to
rip apart the best hope we have in a sea of morally bankrupt
vacuous media pundits and bloggers who work out their own
frustrations and fears ....to achieve what?

And what stuff are you working out Todd?

MP

Wright does come off as a personable, intelligent, likeable, unfrightening man with Moyers.  But any suggestion of black militancy, which any Wright appearance raises, just hurts Obama.