Jerome, Obama is the presumptive Democratic nominee.  The numbers just aren't there for Clinton to win the nomination unless she captures nearly all the superdelegates.  In that regard, she is tearing down the Democratic brand by attacking the assumed nominee.  She should run a Mike Huckabee campaign through the rest of the primaries.  I promise that McCain will use her in advertisements in the GE.

What is it with Obama detractors? Why do Jerome, and the majority of posters on this site, have to constant repeat the refrain:

Your candidate is as bad/dirty as mine.
So much with the new politics.
So much with hope.

Something psychologically interesting is going on here. Talk about a Obamania! There's an opposite effect more prevalent round here called Obamaphobia and its tied up with disgust, fear, guilt over these new tactic he brings, new constituencies he appeals to.

Some people are 'clinging' to the past

Clinton is lending credibility to, and thus strengthening, specious arguments. Yes, Republicans would have run all these attacks anyway. But now they can run the same attacks with "Even liberal democrat Hillary Clinton says...", or "Bill Clinton's right: We need a real leader, not a fairy tale", or "Some of us have a plan to lead on day one, and some of us don't", or "Democrats agree: Obama just isn't prepared to be president".

Meanwhile, we're running out the clock on time to reunite the party and start puring funds into the general. Our presumptive nominee is still spending more time, money, and effort defending himself from his kamikaze primary opponent than engaging his very real general election opponent. Meanwhile, Clinton's tactics are driving up the Democratic defection rate, particuarly among her own supporters. Whatever else one may say about defection numbers, they're undoubtably much higher than they were just a few months ago.

Lastly, while I disagree strongly with this post, it is at least sane. Welcome back.

Nice diary . . . I just wish partisan Obama fans at KOS . . . and partisan HRC fans here would listen to you.

I have pretty much given up on writing Obama diaries. The real battle is DEM v. McCain.

I never believed Chris Matthews thought that Hillary really wanted McCain to win if she loses. Both Obama and HRC WILL rally the base.

Although this is a calmer post than those that marked your return, a simple question Jerome:

"but if Clinton wins by taking the hard road, then more power to her." Please present your scenario where this is possible at this point?

I believe there is such a thing as Republican tactics and Democratic tactics.  Republicans will question your patriotism.  Republicans will try to play different ethnic groups against each other.  Republicans will insinuate that one hates the troops if they do not support the war.  Republicans will use 9/11 as a political tool.

There are certain things that Democrats just do, ways that we just don't campaign against each other.  Clinton has not gone that far, but she is guilty in my eyes of reinforcing rightwing frames in her attacks on Obama's overblown "bitter" comment and by questioning his readiness to be president while simultaneously saying McCain is ready.  That is why Obama supporters get angry at Clinton and her supporters, and hyperbole like "She's a Republican" comes out.

I'll vote for Clinton if she's the nominee, but no one is going to tolerate a MI/FL solution that overturns the non-MI/FL results.  So for her to manage that otherwise she'll have to get 90% of the uncommitted superdelegates and stop the steady flow of them towards Obama, otherwise he WILL pass 2024 delegates by the end of May.

However you cut it, Obama stands a very good chance of being our nominee, and you can't be so cynical as to believe there aren't attacks that should be out of bounds for Democrats to use against each other.

isn't merely encouraging the effort to push Clinton out of the party; he's an active participant, and given his prominence, you could say he's leading it.

It's as if Kos, Reich and their ilk are trying to get Clinton voters to support McCain in the general. I, for one, will remember Kos's post when the term "McCain Democrats" enters the lexicon.

...that this is fake outrage.  

Jerome: like you, neither Obama nor Clinton was my first choice and, like you, I'm willing to support either one of them who gets the nomination.

That said, I'm personally disgusted by the campaign tactics that Reich is referencing.   I don't see why people can't be outraged by something just because you don't see it as that big a deal.

"Please present your scenario where this is possible at this point?"

That's easy:

If the Super Delegates do what you think is right, Obama wins.

If the Super Delegates do what I think is right, Clinton wins.

Jerome you miss the point. When Clinton trumps up the elitism charge, and it is trumped up, she is not just attacking "like a Republican." She is attacking all Democrats, because this trumped up elitism charge is where Republicans turn to every time a Democrat tries to have an intelligent conversation with the public. Lowering the level of discourse in our country is a Republican tactic, and I could go on for pages on what I think it's done to damage our nation. Even in desperation, Hillary shouldn't have gone there.

Well, the old fashioned term for what Senator Clinton is now doing is Clintonian triangulation.

And some rank-and-file Democrats who use the term "triangulation" as a pejorative think it is in part about embracing Republican policies.

Nothing new here. The term triangulation was first used by a top Bill Clinton campaign person more than a decade ago.

You said that Obama would do anything to win the nomination and so would Clinton but I disagree. Everyday you have proof that Obama, while more aggresive than before, will not stoop to Clinton's level.

It was obvious during the debate when he could have attacked her for Bosnia but he quasi-defended her. There have been many opportunities to go for Clinton's throat but instead he's taken the high-road.

This is a major reason why many former Clinton supporters are not supporting Obama - including Robert Reich, who I was able to have dinner with a few years back and did everything possible to attack policy but never the person. Even when talking about Bush. He's not known to attack people and is known as a loyal person. Why would he be supporting Obama over Clinton then? What does that tell you?

---
perezpolitics.com

You know, I agree with you, Jerome, I wouldn't call it Republicanism or call Hillary Clinton a Republican.  However, she is using campaign tactics that are traditionally Republican.  But I do agree with you that Obama is not guiltless here.  Although his mailers about her healthcare plan were factually correct, their imagery was a traditionally Republican one.  The difference is that now, she's grabbing on to these "values" memes as opposed to attacking him on actual economic issues.  It's like that Dave Chappelle joke about the scantilly clad woman, "you may not be a whore, but you sure are wearing the uniform."

I do disagree that this is the worst that I've seen the campaign commentary.  I honestly felt most disgusted during Clinton's "CinC threshhold" meme, where she implied that either she or McCain would be better prepared than the other democratic nominee.

Robert Reich is right!

The elitist argument against the Dems is a tired old Republican line.

saying this for a while.

she has no realistic path to the nomination. we have been saying this since March 5th. we say it and clinton supporters say

YES SHE DOES.

we say back it up with the math, and they stick their heads in the ground. those who try do things like giving Hillary a 20 point win in PA? 30 in WV and PR!? COME ON! and then they give obama like a 5 point win in NC? 5 in Oregon? COME ON

there is a reason NO front page poster on ANY pro-hillary site has done ANY sort of detailed math like Obama posters do. you realistically cannot give her the nomination without doing things like

1) seating FL and MI as is and giving nothing to Obama, (if he had the power to stop re-votes why in the world would he ever allow THIS?)

2)20+ wins? has she EVER done that in a state after Obama has campaigned in it? and what happens when Obama scores his wins?

3) she has NO realistic path to the nomination, I defy anyone to do the math, they won't even those that semi try
give us a try up to a point, usually PA or IN, then they just stop using numbers, and say well wins here here and here will do this, but use no numbers to show it.

I am tired of this, no one wants to do the Math to show how she can win, they don't want to admit Obama will be the nominee, but then they are surprised as hell when the party questions Hillary for attacking the nominee of the party.

does no one remember that since BEFORE Texas and Ohio it was said she needs 60 point wins, that didn't change, it didn't go away because HRC supporters don't want to admit it, she didn't get 60% and Obama will win NC, her margins needed now increased.

and HRC supporters don't even care about delegates anymore, THE way we have done this for YEARS, where was the outrage in '04 when we had the nominee by Feb 5th? or the year before that?

Hillary can't win by delegates so now its a mad dash to find a new way to measure the race so we don't have to admit she lost. HEY I know Popular vote! what about those caucus states we don't know votes for? SCREW 'EM.

but yes maybe Obama will implode, thats why we now get stuff like Hillary blowing up that bitter stuff, or now this crap about did he flip her the bird?

if HRC supporters can't accept it it's not the responsibility of the party to humor them at our chances expense, she can't win, no one can provide ANY meaningful analysis of how she could. so now we are suppose to sit back and let her attack the presumed nominee for 2 months while you all hope he implodes so supes will run to her, while her supporters do all they can to help it happen?

yeah right.

Any who tells you BO wouldn't  have used the cling thing in ads against Hillary if things were reversed is either a fool or a liar.

Look at how he's campaigned so far.  One negative mailer and radio spot after another.

Chicago smack down politics as usual  Reich should be ashamed of himself..