By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger against McCain

Consider it a leading indicator, if you will: a new poll out from Gallup shows some interesting numbers from the Presidential race worth looking at in some detail.

A new Gallup Panel survey finds a majority of both Republicans and Democrats saying Barack Obama has a better chance than Hillary Clinton of defeating Republican John McCain in the November presidential election. The survey was conducted March 24-27, interviewing a nationally representative sample of 1,005 Gallup Panel members. Democrats were asked whether Clinton or Obama has the better chance of defeating McCain in November: 59% say Obama does; 30% say Clinton. [Emph. added]

Republicans agree with the Democratic majority's assessment, that Obama is a stronger challenge to McCain, by 64% to 22%.

What it all means, and more >>>

The most obvious conclusion from this poll is that Obama has put the Wright flap behind him. That conclusion is also supported by his now-steady lead over Clinton across polls - Gallup, Rasmussen - and to a lesser extent by his strengthening against John McCain (whom, also per Gallup, Obama has now caught, moving into a statistical tie of 47-46 with a 2% MoE, n=4,394).

This is in and of itself a heaping of bad news for the Clinton campaign. What's especially problematic, however, is that this lop-sided result comes at a perilous time for her campaign. Gallup adds some analysis:

[T]he poll shows there is a fairly widely held belief among party supporters -- including a plurality of Clinton supporters -- that the ongoing campaign is hurting their chances of winning in November. It seems unlikely those attitudes would improve much going forward, particularly if the tone of the Democratic campaign remains negative.

Specifically, 48% of Clinton's supporters say the ongoing campaign is hurting the party, while 40% disagree.

The danger for Hillary's campaign is clear: by two to one, Democrats already think her opponent would make the better standard-bearer. Almost half of her supporters think the campaign is damaging their party's chance for November. This creates a real risk - I would argue that it's already happening - that she will bleed support based simply on general election concerns. Anecdotal evidence of slowing fundraising doesn't help that narrative, either. Note that she continues to poll support substantially in excess (43%) of the number of Democrats who think she'd be a better general election candidate (30%).

That support may break away, and quickly. Better update your electability talking points concern spam, Clinton supporters :-)

Update [2008-4-1 8:5:24 by MBNYC]:: Dear Clintonists in the comments, here's the deal: this diary is a data-based study pointing out two internal weaknesses in Hillary's position. These are her weak standing on electability at 30% versus Obama, and the surprisingly large percentage of her own supporters who think her campaign is damaging the party, at 48%. In the real world, not Clinton hero-worshipping gaga-land, facts have consequences. You can repeat your incantations that it just ain't so, but absent actual data to make your points against a data-supported case, here in the reality-based community, you fail. The Mayan priests used to think they were praying up the sun every morning. Your prayerful chants are exactly the same thing, Clintonists. Empiricism trumps faith-based wishful thinking every time, my friends. Best of luck :-)

Display:


Tips :-D (2.00 / 3)

Euros and Pound Sterling preferred.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 09:51:06 PM EST

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger ag (none / 0)

Yeah right.


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 09:53:35 PM EST

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger ag (2.00 / 0)

reality is hard thing to grasp


My dream is Hillary will sponser a joint resolution to authorize the use of the United States Armed Forces against Trinity Church
by denounceandreject on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 09:55:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I bow (2.00 / 1)

to your superior debating skills, lori :-)


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 09:55:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I bow (none / 0)

There is no debate.

Sooner or later the realization has to come through that she is not getting out of the race any time soon.

I just think it is funny that on a daily basis the obsession of Obama supporting bloggers is to write her obituary.

Its becoming a bore.


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:01:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You're right, there is no debate. (none / 0)

That's because 'yeah right' doesn't count as such :-)


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:03:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Lori, that wasn't the subject of the diary (2.00 / 0)

The diary is about who can win. Now do you want a dem to win or not?

I'm shocked that so many republicans feel the same way. Actually, no. This was one of the many reasons why I supported Barack.


by Hopeful08 on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:16:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Naw, (2.00 / 0)

her staying in and systematically pissing off more and more Democrats is much more amusing, as is watching her numbers slide. By the end of it, I hope she still has a shot at keeping her seat in the Senate.


by rhetoricus on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:23:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

And, 4 out of 5 dentists.... (none / 0)

...prefer Crest...and other untruths perpetuated in the name of branding and the selling an image.

This diary, like the poll upon which it's focused, means nada. Zilch. Zero. Not a thing. The big donut. Zip.


by bobswern on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:55:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

ROFL (2.00 / 0)

No.. this is actually a scientific poll of real people.

A better argument would be to say that a snapshot poll now doesn't necessarily predict what will happen in November.

The poll does, however, counter the claim that somehow "a majority" that Obama is unelectable. That is clearly untrue.


by rhetoricus on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 11:24:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Ha! (none / 0)

In fact, it means so little that you've now repeated that claim what, hree times up and down the thread?

Here's a little hint: it's obvious you're not trying to convince anyone else. You're trying to convince yourself, and probably unsuccessfully.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Tue Apr 01, 2008 at 07:54:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I bow (none / 0)

Sooner or later the realization has to come through that she is not getting the nomination, and staying in the race is a waste of time and money.


It's time to restore balance and fairness to our economy,... It's time to stop giving tax cuts to corporations that ship jobs overseas... - Barack Obama
by Lefty Coaster on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:55:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

If that were true (2.00 / 1)

How come he lost to Hillary in all the large states, the top nine in a row and ten if you count Pennsylvania.  That means a lot of electors to the electoral college.  And please don't tell me he won Texas because Hillary won the popular vote in Texas which is all that counts.

Where you got 2 to 1, I have no idea.

Please note that you weren't savaged for you preposterous statements.  This place has both sides and a lot more respect for each other is shown.  This is not what see on the www.newDailyKosObamaver.com.  There is no Obama Gestapo here.


by cpa1a on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:05:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If that were true (2.00 / 0)

"How come he lost to Hillary in all the big states"

Oh. I don't know. Because that's not true?


Your old role is rapidly aging. Please get out of the new one if you can't lend a hand, for the times they are a changing.
by Travis Stark on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:14:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Where the 2:1 comes from? (2.00 / 0)

Seriously? From Gallup. Read the diary.

Yeah, and "Obama Gestapo" gets a zero. The real Gestapo murdered the relative of a friend of mine. Big difference from blogdom, being hung on a meathook in Plötzensee and all that.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:17:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Memo (2.00 / 0)

1) Excerpting the Limbaugh effect, Hillary did not win the popular vote in TX (which is a red state anyway, so doesn't Hillary say those don't count?). That's why other measures exist in Texas, to counter the kind of fraud the GOP pulled en mass on Hillary's behalf in both OH and TX.

2) Your claims about the "large states" mean nothing unless you compare how they match up against McCain.  For example, polls are now showing substantial buyer's remorse in California, and Obama faring much better against McCain.


by rhetoricus on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:20:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger (none / 0)

Unfortunately, these polls have nothing to do with electability.  We also thought Dukakis, Mondale, and Kerry were just peachy.


by dwmorris on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 09:58:25 PM EST

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger (2.00 / 0)

I agree Hillary is in trouble!


My dream is Hillary will sponser a joint resolution to authorize the use of the United States Armed Forces against Trinity Church
by denounceandreject on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 09:59:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Ah. (2.00 / 0)

A thirty-percenter. Please re-read the part of the diary that shows Obama catching McCain :-)


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:01:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Irrelevant (none / 0)

The polls showing Obama "catching" McCain are irrelevant.  He has not been subjected to the Republican attack machine, which is still waiting in the weeds.  Trying to extrapolate this data into a meaningful commentary on what will happen in the fall is a fool's errand.


by dwmorris on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:36:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Irrelevant (2.00 / 0)

oh those scary republicans... what are we going to do!!!!


My dream is Hillary will sponser a joint resolution to authorize the use of the United States Armed Forces against Trinity Church
by denounceandreject on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:38:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Irrelevant (none / 0)

In your case, probably continue to make inane comments.


by dwmorris on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:42:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Irrelevant (2.00 / 0)

Oh please. That is Croc. Obama is in a fiercely contested campaign against two fronts and McCain is leading by only 1%!!


McCain: The Past, Obama: The Future
by KathyM on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:42:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Irrelevant (none / 0)

Not so.  McCain's engagement of Obama thus far has been minimal, and the bloodletting on the Democratic side has been held in check by the expectation that all parties, relatively speaking, play nice.


by dwmorris on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:52:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

March Poll Crap Is for Rhetoric Only... (none / 0)

Face it...truth be told...a two-day...two-week...or two-month swing means little this early in the year.

As Bill Clinton reminded everyone in just the past day, at this point in the race in 1992, he was third, behind Perot and Bush Sr.

This people is a bunch of nuthin', and everyone here knows it, too!


by bobswern on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:43:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger ag (none / 0)

Come convention time the people who have access to the state by state polling data with cross tabs will know who is stronger against McCain.

Its not likely to be Obama

which is why they are trying to plant the idea that he is stronger now...

They are afraid.


by DTaylor on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:01:35 PM EST

Come convention time... (2.00 / 1)

...this will be long over.


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:04:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Huh? (2.00 / 0)

SUSA has already done that and Obama is stronger against McCain.  Have you seen the polls in places like Colorado, NM, Virginia, Nevada?

Who's afraid?


by Hopeful08 on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:20:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger ag (none / 0)

I suppose I would have said they're equal against McCain, because there's no way a Dem should lose this thing and McCain is going to have a lot of trouble distancing himself from Bush.


Torture me once, shame on you; torture me and get away with it, shame on us all.
by freedom78 on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:09:39 PM EST

Lies! Lies by the Obama camp! (2.00 / 2)

We all know that Wright has ruined Obama, and if  1005 "likely voters" haven't figured that out, then we haven't played the Wright sermon excerpt enough, or written enough screeds on Obama's obvious unelectability. We must step up our efforts, and work on Democrats tirelessly until August, then Republicans until November if need be, and prove to them once and for all that Obama is damaged goods! That is far more important than beating McCain.

Then they'll be begging for Hillary to come in on her white horse.

/snark


by rhetoricus on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:09:53 PM EST

Thanks for the snark note. (2.00 / 3)

It sounded so much like real comments I've seen.


Your old role is rapidly aging. Please get out of the new one if you can't lend a hand, for the times they are a changing.
by Travis Stark on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:16:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not according to the nurse in the doctors (none / 0)

office today, who knew that Hillary said Medicare was in the most danger...Or in my GPs office, either.

And fees for doctors not settled for more that 6 months this year...

They all know that everyone is trying to do her in, they know the DC crowd is tryiing to starve Medicare...what does St. Obama say?

They don't trust him and are mad as hell.

As am I, when I couldn't find a Medicare doctor who would accept new patients...wouldn't even take my CASH, because they don't want me filing which would have them on the radar about not accepting more people....

A POX on the Democratic POOBAHS who sat there in Congress this year and only got 6 mothhs freeze on what doctors get paid---before they try to lower it again! Meanwhile, the hospitals get MORE--sure, they're big companies!!  Question: who will send you to the hospital if you can't see a doctor??

And that's why older people are for Hillary...they know what's important...not some "charm boy" without experience, no real track record or COMMITTMENT to anything...


by Gloria on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:16:54 PM EST

The plural of anecdote (none / 0)

is not data. Do you understand that, or does it not matter to you?


"This election is not about ideology, it's about competence." -Michael Dukakis
by MBNYC on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:19:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re:Watch it Gloria (2.00 / 0)

DO not refer to a 47 year old man as a "charm boy" it is highly offensive.  I know that you might be from a different generation but you better watch it.


by Hopeful08 on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:21:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not according to the nurse in the doctors (2.00 / 0)

Also if you want to talk about commitment, you shouldn't use Clinton and commitment in the same line.


by Hopeful08 on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:23:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

"Charm boy?" (2.00 / 0)

Obama is a "charm boy"? Yeah.. that says about all we need to know about you.


by rhetoricus on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:27:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Know what's a problem with the insurance system? (2.00 / 0)

Employers that don't pay their employees' insurance premiums for months at a time.


Your old role is rapidly aging. Please get out of the new one if you can't lend a hand, for the times they are a changing.
by Travis Stark on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:27:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Not according to the nurse in the doctors (2.00 / 0)

**Good grief!  Now you're blaming Obama for the dismal state of our health care??????  Do you think this problem started recently?
REALITY CHECK, Ladies.  Seriously.  You need to REALLY spend some time doing research instead of absorbing unquestioningly everything the Hilster tosses your way.  You sound like you've been around the block; remember what happened last time that Hil "took on" health care?   It's a HUGE problem, but put the blame where it belongs, and fight for a better future.  (I am NOT saying it's Hillary's fault.)
If the choice is between hope and fear, always choose hope. BC
by greylox on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:34:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger ag (2.00 / 0)

Obama is fighting a two front war and hes only down to McBush by 1%!!! That's what I call real strenght!

Why is McBush not able to pull away when he has a free hand and no challengers??

http://www.gallup.com/poll/105907/Gallup -Daily-Obama-Keeps-Lead-Over-Clinton-51- 43.aspx


McCain: The Past, Obama: The Future
by KathyM on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:44:19 PM EST

This poll doesn't mean a damn thing... (none / 0)

...and, anyone with an IQ higher than the temperature--or anyone with any knowledge about politics--knows this, too.

As I mention upstream in these comments, and as Bill Clinton reminded everyone today, at this point in the calendar in 1992, he was third in the polls, trailing Perot and Bush, Sr.

Everyone who knows ANYTHING about politics knows this, too. So let's just cut the propaganda crap, please. This poll means absolutely nothing, and y'all know it.


by bobswern on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:48:35 PM EST

Re: (2.00 / 0)

B-b-b-but, I thought the superdelegates were all going to uniformly see how unelectable Obama is and hoist Clinton upon her throne.


by XoFalconXo on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:48:53 PM EST

Re: (2.00 / 0)

They are waiting to see Hillary's battle plans for Trinity Church; she has a chance to redeem herself after her Iraq war vote.


My dream is Hillary will sponser a joint resolution to authorize the use of the United States Armed Forces against Trinity Church
by denounceandreject on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:51:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Clinton & Obama Agree...Supes Should Use... (none / 0)

...their own judgement.

Oh...and the so-called "unanimous NC" delegation story from yesterday? Can anyone say: "vapor?" WTF happened there? Dayum....talk about propaganda! Sheesh!


by bobswern on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:52:40 PM EST

Re: By two to one, Democrats say Obama stronger ag (2.00 / 0)

Ideally, as you suggest, we would see an erosion in state by state polling among soft Hillary supporters who see her strength as a general election candidate eroding.  We will be watching closely for such a trend in Pennsylvania, North Carolina and elsewhere.


by Shaun Appleby on Mon Mar 31, 2008 at 10:55:44 PM EST


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