MyDD :: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike

Update on DailyKos Writers Strike

by alegre, Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:30:34 PM EST

Wow - I never expected this kind of a reaction to my declaration of independence from DailyKos last night but it seems I wasn't the only one who's sick and tired of being sick and tired over the hate, ignorance and hostility directed at Hillary and her supporters. Now I won't link it here as I normally would because I don't want to drive traffic to the site, but my post made it up on to the Recommended list with over 60 recs, and well over 1200 comments posted (good, bad and meta). I hear they eventually had to shut off comments for fear of the site crashing because of it all.

First I want to thank everyone who signed on to our strike. This will only work though if we stick to it and stay away from DailyKos guys. No lurking. No peeking in. No tipping, rec'ing, commenting and for god(dess) sake - no diaries. They get no traffic from us. No ad revenues. Not until they stop the hateful attacks, misrepresentations of Hillary and her record, and outright lies about her long record of dedicated public service.

Make the jump for an update on our strike...

I think it's important for us to thank Jerome for providing us exiles with a calm and reasoned place for us to exchange ideas and discuss the important issues of the day. He not only left up my cross-post here knowing I was calling for a walkout from his friend's site, but he went and recommended my diary over there to tell everyone that he agreed with what I was trying to do - bring attention to the poisonous atmosphere in the hopes that DailyKos will one day return to it's roots by promoting all good and decent Democratic candidates.

The best way we can thank Jerome and the others here at MyDD is to keep it cool when we post here. Try out best to ignore the spammers and haters, and follow our candidate's example by sticking to the issues and staying out of the flame-wars.

Now I've gotten quite a few emails over the past 24 hours. Some are from the haters who say eff you I hope you all die but hey, I expected that. I won't bother posting them here but I think they draw a sharp contrast between Obama's and Hillary's supporters. I don't know about you but I would never think to send a nasty note to someone simply because I disagree with their choice of candidate. Apparently, his supporters saw fit to send me nasty notes though (one guy even sent several!).

But I've also gotten some warm and wonderful notes from people hoping to join our "strike". I thought it'd be great to share a few here...

A sincere thank you for s

Tags: President, Hillary Clinton, 2008 elections, dailykos (all tags)

Permalink :: 211 Comments :: Post a Comment

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 29)

Please remember to send Hillary whatever you can - this campaign doesn't run on love, sweat & muscle power alone!

https://contribute.hillaryclinton.com/fo rm.html?sc=ac0&rc=E5W3

Donate to Hillary Now!

by alegre on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:32:49 PM EST

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 9)

Alegre, another great diary, thanks. Please see my new diary "Obama's Dance with America" for an update on the Wright issue.

by CalGirl on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:34:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 7)

I will - add a link here and maybe you'll get some traffic there ;o)

Donate to Hillary Now!

by alegre on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:42:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 4)

Also here:

http://theflatlandalmanack.typepad.com/v ersus/2008/03/in-support-of-t.html (In Support of the Kos Boycott)

http://nuestravoice.com/?p=1619 (reference)

I have yet to see what [Obama] has done to take the highest office in the land. He is no Martin Luther King. --Helen Thomas

by ghost 2 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 03:55:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

So do Obama supporters leave Mydd or what? (1.33 / 3)

Is the New Hampshire of the blogsphere? Have you all found your voice?

by Chavez100 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 02:33:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So do Obama supporters leave Mydd or what? (2.00 / 7)

The point here is that the conditions over at Kos were getting ridiculous with regards to how people supporting a certain candidate were getting treated.

I cannot believe how many of my comments actually got troll rated over there just because they were pro-Hillary!

Censorship of political discourse is untolerable and I am thrilled that this movement is underway.

It is one thing if most Kos readers are in favor of Obama (strange considering it was an Edwards lovefest there only one short month ago!) but it is quite another to bash another Democrat in order to propel his candidacy.

Hillary Clinton is a Democrat! Her (and Obama's) supporters deserve to have a place at the table and a chance to discuss their choice candidate in a positive way at a blog like Kos, considering it is supposed to be progressives with the goal of ELECTING MORE DEMOCRATS.

Kos was not intended to be an extension www.barackobama.com.

I won't be back to Kos!

by jaydub799 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 03:48:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So do Obama supporters leave Mydd or what? (1.42 / 7)

I think you'll all be much happier here at MYDD. It's a Clinton love-fest all the time. It's best not to expose yourself to too much reality about your candidate. It's hard to keep drinking the kool aid when you can see what else is offered.

by godemsin08 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:27:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I take umbrage (2.00 / 8)

I am in the middle about Clinton and Obama. I see both of their strengths and weaknesses. But I have been appalled at the tone at DailyKos and by Kos' own willingness to do anything for his candidate, and to allow his site to devolve into a hate zone.

It might be misogyny on his part, or a willingness to look the other way when misogyny rears its' head. I don't know. But I find it SO disheartening for a so-called progressive Democrat to behave this way.

I don't see Jerome crossing the line the way Kos does. (I think Markos knows he went over the top about the video darkening, "racism" accusation, and that's why he got so defensive in his follow up posts. Save us from insecure tyrants who can't see their own mistakes, biases and failings. Sort of reminds me of, gosh, who was the guy? ...let me think.... oh yeah: W.)

I understand that it's impossible to police every diarist and posting, but some sort of regular statements about maintaining civil discourse, and refraining from hate speech, AND setting a personal example in one's own statements is not too much to ask. You don't have to be neutral, but you should make an effort to be fair and truly progressive.

We should be decrying baseless slurs against both candidates, and keeping the MSM as honest as possible. Because we'll need every last resource to beat McCain in the general.

I will vote for whoever our Democratic candidate is, happily. I'm not walking away and giving McCain an easy ride the the WH, and I hope anyone who has said otherwise comes to their senses.

Our planet can't tolerate another 4 years of Republican selfish & shortsighted administration.

by sarany on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 08:18:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I take umbrage (2.00 / 1)

I would like to take umbrage with one comment from the diary....

"I think they draw a sharp contrast between Obama's and Hillary's supporters...."

I tour a lot of the blogosphere on any given day, my mainstays are here (lurker for quite a while), Kos, TPM, Huffingtonpost, Politico, as well as some MSM blogs...

To be honest with you, I have seen vitriol on both sides. For as many insults and arrows I have seen flung at Clinton supporters, I see them flung back at Obama supporters... I once mentioned that I admired the way his campaign was being run and got called a "kid in search of a messiah"...although not quite as nicely. For the record, I'm a 40 year old heretic, so that could not be further from the truth.

The knives cut both ways.

I'm voting Democratic in November... who the top of the ticket is will not impact that decision. John McCain is simply that unacceptable...

I am hoping against hope that I have a lot of company... The party will need all of you.

Like the nominee, don't like the nominee... Our nominee is still better than John McCain...

by JenKinFLA on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 11:24:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Great take (2.00 / 1)

And I agree, it's been both sides that have done it. Including, to my regret, me at times.

I think there should be a difference between a site dedicated to trash one candidate, like NoQuarter/Taylor Marsh, and sites that lean(heavily or not) towards one canidate.

I will say that MyDD and Talk left lean Hillary, while DailyKos and Open Left lean Obama. Heavily or not.

Wait, am I supposed to be posting here? I lean heavily towards Obama....but will vote for Hillary if she somehow wrangles the nomination. Ahh Hell, I ain't on no 'strike'.

Boycott?

I lean towards a boycott. heh-heh

I used to enjoy Alegre's diaries, they were one of the few good diaries about Hillary that allowed me to believe that supporting Hillary was ok if she won.

I don't like links to NoQuarter. They have gone way too far over there and look like some kinds of lunatics/freepers.

And that's what I don't get. Doesn't anyone know the difference between disagreeing and degrading? Differences on issues and innuendos that constitute charachter slimes?

Ahh well, consider this my middle of the road MyDD mini-diary.

by Dave Dial on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:36:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So do Obama supporters leave Mydd or what? (2.00 / 6)

I disagree with your "Clinton love fest" assessment of MyDD. I was an Edwards supporter who is leaning Obama, but I couldn't take the hatred being spewed at Kos. And the poster above is right, the Obama darkening claims that Kos front-paged was the jumping the shark moment for me. That he hasn't had the class to apologize for those accusations just affirmed that I had made the right choice.

I see a fair amount of pro-Obama diaries here, though there is no doubt there appears to be more Clinton supporters. However, the invective here is considerably less than at Kos on both side. There are notable exceptions: I've seen overt racists here trashing Obama, and I've seen some of the same, non-thinking juvenile attacks on Clinton that dominate at Kos. But for the most part, it's been a far better place to visit.

by bouvougan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 09:53:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Actually, the opposite is true... (2.00 / 3)

It is the Obama supporters on DKOS who appear unable or unwilling to engage in substantive discourse on the democratic primary process. All I care about is electing a D in November. I am not firmly in either candidates's camp and will support either in November. However, the hatred and vitrol that masquarades as commentary on DKOS became too ugly to tolerate. The most vile rhetoric was directed solely to Clinton and her supporters by the legions of mob mentality Obamabots who lack even basic critical thinking skills. Avoiding hate is sane, not Kool Aid.

berkshiretrueblue Commited to helping elect a Democrat as President "Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo" Ambroise Bierce

by berkshiretrueblue on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:25:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So do Obama supporters leave Mydd or what? (2.00 / 1)

Of course not. We need the comic relief of Hilarry "pie in the sky" delusionists at MyDD to offset our real world planning over at dkos with the REAL candidate for Change who reminds us that Yes We Can make things happen through unity and hard work and that is winning in EVERY category, not the "Change Candidate" who changed her mind on associating herself with positive change who's only "inevitable" attribute is that she is going to use her 35 years of corruption... I mean, "experience"... to try and steal the Democratic nomination which she has NO WAY of winning legitimately. Won't happen, but it's EXTREMELY fun reading people's distorted views here that try and shine a successful light on what will go down in history as one of the biggest Democratic campaign failures in American history. In terms of all time failures, we're talking: 1) 2000-2008/George W. Bush, 2)2008/Hillary Clinton's run for Democratic nomination (didn't even get to run for POTUS). Aaahh MyDD, how I enjoy thee. =D

*VOTE DEMOCRAT! - HRC or BHO* Obama '08 - Full of reason / Hillary '08 - Full of treason (Gallup Poll, March 26 2008) / McCain '08 - Diaper's full of Bushit.

by VT COnQuest on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 03:37:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 10)

You know I really do like your positive work Alegre. Best wishes and all.

Because I wont trade humanity for patriotism!

by Drewid on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:36:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Thank you, Alegre! (2.00 / 10)

Thanks SO MUCH for all you've been doing to raise awareness about who Hillary Clinton really is and what she really stands for! You deserve ALL the attention your good work is finally getting! And thanks to what you're doing now, Kos will FINALLY be held accountable for what it's done to trash good Democrats like Hillary!

Solidarity forever! The strike is going on!

Make history with Hillary today! :-)

by atdleft on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:54:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Thank you alegre for your outstanding work! n/t (2.00 / 6)

Follow the development at RezkoWatch

by DemAC on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:05:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 5)

Great diary...I couldn't sign the diary at dkos but I'm on strike with you. You've always been the positive voice for Hillary and I'm glad others have noticed your line on the web. We can't allow ourselves to be abused, even if the msm seems to think that abusing women and Hillary is somehow right and fair.

by seattlegonz on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 02:07:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 2)

by seattlegonz on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 02:07:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

DailyKos Writers Strike Isn't Reducing Traffic (2.00 / 1)

The changes from 7 days ago include 6% more readers and 14% more recommending readers of 17% fewer diaries.

Yesterday:

474 Kogs posted 474 diaries of which 442 were recommended at least once by a cadre of 4040 recommending readers and viewed by 10666

One week ago:

568 Kogs posted 568 diaries of which 514 were recommended at least once by a cadre of 3494 recommending readers and viewed by 10032

"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.

by Lefty Coaster on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 04:50:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

DailyKos Writers Strike Isn't Reducing Traffic (2.00 / 1)

Traffic at D-Kos increased again on Saturday compared to one week ago. Viewers were up 3.79% over one week ago, and recommending readers were up 8% over one week ago.

Yesterday 420 Kogs posted 420 diaries of which 395 were recommended at least once by a cadre of 3707 recommending readers and viewed by 9473

One week ago:

Yesterday 480 Kogs posted 480 diaries of which 441 were recommended at least once by a cadre of 3412 recommending readers and viewed by 9127;
I looks like the strike is good for D-Kos but not in the way the strikers wanted.

"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.

by Lefty Coaster on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 04:02:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 0)

has it occurred to you that the media is picking up on this not because they think dkos is nuts, but because they are in wonderment at how divisive this pointlessly quixotic campaign has become, and how hurtful it will be to Dems if Hillary takes this all the way to the convention floor?

It's all about McCain/Bush now...

by thereisnospoon on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:08:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 5)

First, this won't go to the convention floor. It will be over by early June, just after the revotes in Michigan and Florida. Second, the claim that Hillary is damaging the party by not stepping aside is nonsense. There is no candidate who would have stepped aside in the position she's in right now.

If Edwards was in Hillary's place and still had a shot at winning, do you think he would quit? Not hardly. And as an Edwards supporter, I would be upset if he did. Dodd, Biden, Kucinich, any of them would still be in this race if their candidacy was in the same place as Hillary's. To demonize her and claim she's hurting the party for not stepping down is ridiculous.

by bouvougan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:03:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 1)

The point is she doesn't have a shot at winning. Even Bill said she really didn't have a chance if she lost TX or Ohio. Spin it however you want, but she lost TX. It is a two-step process, she won one step narrowly, lost the other widely and lost the total marginally.

Nowhere have I seen anybody show how she can reasonably win more pledged delegates. Any other path to the nomination ends there for her, at the nomination.

She can not win the GE after that. Obama supporters will not cross over to her after what many of them will see as an illegitimate win, only if she shows up at the convention with more pledged delegates ... partly because Obama will have dropped out by then! Even the most biased observer has to see that.

So, 1. Why is she still in it again?
2. Mathmatically, how can she win more pledged delegates?

-Beeker Hussein Dynasty

by BeekerDynasty on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 11:51:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 1)

You are spinning if you think she didn't win Texas. Bill was talking about winning the primary vote, and she did that. It's about perception, and there is vitually nobody outside the Obama blogoshere that would agree with the claim that Obama won Texas.

Her path to the nomination is over if you assume it is simply the pledged delegates who will decide. But it isn't. The super delegates will determine the winner, and no matter what you or Nancy Pelosi might think or wish, they will vote for who they think can win in November, not just the pledged delegate winner. If Clinton ends the primary season with convincing wins in PA, FL, and MI, she stands a very good chance of being the nominee. Losing any of those ends her chances.

by bouvougan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:09:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Obama meltdown... (2.00 / 1)

That's Hillary's only hope. She is hoping that Rezko, Wright, something else...totally destroys Obama and she starts winning by 70-80%. It's totally wishful thinking but Hillary does have the right-wing smear machine working for her at this point. It's going to be a tough couple months for Obama.

by JoeCoaster on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 02:05:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama meltdown... (2.00 / 1)

Like I said ...the right-wing smear machine is working for Hillary at this point. Good to see you.

by JoeCoaster on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 03:02:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I honestly feel so much better.. (2.00 / 2)

by just avoiding the hate and vitrol that passes for "prograssive" blogging at DKOS. I applaud your bringing attention to this matter and showing how to respond to those who choose not to address the hate their site is advocating. There is NO reason to engage or confront the haters on that site. It's only logical to take rational discourse elsewhere. I had already made that decision but your efforts amplify it's effect and I think that is very important for the future.

berkshiretrueblue Commited to helping elect a Democrat as President "Hypocrisy: prejudice with a halo" Ambroise Bierce

by berkshiretrueblue on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:31:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

As someone who has been (1.66 / 3)

on DKOS since 2002 you need to be called out:
You are lying about a "writers strike"

You are not a writer at DKOS. You are not one of the Front Pagers who are the only people who can truthfully cliam to be "writers" at DKOS.

You are a commenter. That is all.

You have succeeded in misreprenting what you are at DKOS.

by fladem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:27:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (none / 0)

I'm in Alegre. I didn't have a myDD account until just now, when I was linked to your diary by an anti-Hillary dKos diary. Now I have one and it's nice to read some sanity again! Kos's site has been garbage for a while, but it really hit the sewers when Kos himself started peddling the "Hillary made Obama blacker" BS. Last straw. Good to have a new site!

by heineken1717 on Mon Mar 17, 2008 at 03:15:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 3)

"hey get no traffic from us. No ad revenues. Not until they stop the hateful attacks, misrepresentations of Hillary and her record, and outright lies about her long record of dedicated public service."

How will you know when the hateful comments have stopped ?

If you follow history with a long enough arc, things always get better, and the truth always prevails...Gandhi

by SevenStrings on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:34:05 PM EST

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 7)

we'll settle for the attempts to find out RL information about us to stop ;-)

by campskunk on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:38:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (none / 0)

ummm...

Shouldn't you be spending a spy over there every day or so...just to keep tabs ?

That is how the cold war was fought...

You need boots on the ground !!

If you follow history with a long enough arc, things always get better, and the truth always prevails...Gandhi

by SevenStrings on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:43:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (none / 0)

...sending a spy....

If you follow history with a long enough arc, things always get better, and the truth always prevails...Gandhi

by SevenStrings on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:44:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Easy... (2.00 / 1)

Make history with Hillary today! :-)

by atdleft on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:43:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Easy... (2.00 / 8)

Markos knows where to find us. He can always post something here on MyDD letting us know he's taken care of his site. After all, didn't he start his whole entire blog enterprise by commenting here? ;-)

Make history with Hillary today! :-)

by atdleft on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:45:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Easy... (none / 0)

That is a passive approach.

I would have advocated a more active approach.

An active approach is much more fun !!

If you follow history with a long enough arc, things always get better, and the truth always prevails...Gandhi

by SevenStrings on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:51:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Well, that's been the whole problem... (2.00 / 11)

We rewarded Markos with page hits & subscriptions. And what did he do with them? He allowed the rabid, extremist Obama fans to trash not just Hillary, but all of us & all of Hillary's offline supporters as well. Hell, a few of them even resorted to THREATS TO FIND OUT OUR PERSONAL INFO & OUT US. Sorry, but the thuggery must end. The only way this ends is for us to stop rewarding Markos.

No more page views.
No more comments.
No more diaries.
(AND DEFINITELY!!)
No more subscriptions.

Until Markos & the rest of Kos admin takes care of these extremists, it's no more of that site for us.

Make history with Hillary today! :-)

by atdleft on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:00:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well, that's been the whole problem... (2.00 / 0)

you know better than this. DailyKos has always been anti-Hillary. Anti-Clinton, really. Certainly anti-DLC and anti-McAuliffe.

Obama supporters didn't take it over. We joined up with Obama to stop the Clintons.

p.s. How did DOMA and DADT work out for you?

It's all about McCain/Bush now...

by thereisnospoon on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:10:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well, that's been the whole problem... (2.00 / 4)

Now you're making stuff up. Bill Clinton was deeply respected at Kos before this election cycle. He was the "big dog" and many rightfully credited him with turning the tide in the Democrats favor in the 06 elections when he scolded Chris Wallace on FOX. Only Al Gore was respected more at Kos than Bill. Hillary was criticized for her war vote, but overall was also viewed favorably.

by bouvougan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:09:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well, that's been the whole problem... (2.00 / 2)

Well said and true, bouvagon. Hey,the term Clenis even is in dkosapedia.
Well maybe Zbig can be a featured speaker at YearlyKos now.

by durendal on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 07:41:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well, that's been the whole problem... (none / 0)

it's not Kos. It's all the Kossacks. 88% of us

It's all about McCain/Bush now...

by thereisnospoon on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 02:58:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well, that's been the whole problem... (2.00 / 1)

Do you still believe women are responsible for date rape, DA?

by truthteller2007 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 08:25:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well, that's been the whole problem... (none / 0)

Can someone point me to this "seeking real life info" thing? I didn't see it happen and I'd like to see examples. Is this one random threat or some credible concerted action?

by mattw on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:41:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Well, that's been the whole problem... (none / 0)

I really don't want to stir up a hornet's nest...but, I keep seeing references to users at Dkos trying to find out RL info about other users. Thus far...all I have seen are people saying it happened....I did not see it, and I have not seen it linked to. Did it happen? More than once? More than one user advocating such a horrible thing? When? Can you link to it?

I am not saying it did not happen (I have seen users resort to such nastiness before...but, only directed at another individual user and even then it was smacked down with a quickness)....but, the way it seems to be being presented is that it was a tactic embraced and accepted by a whole group of supporters. Is there any evidence of it.

Thanks in advance.

Fight the good fight.

by Kysen on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 08:47:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 3)

I hope that all bloggers will show that they are above name-calling and they can engage in respectful dialogue with people with whom they disagree.

We care about politics because we know politics matters for people's lives and opportunities.

by politicsmatters on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:35:37 PM EST

I was banned for DKos a while ago (2.00 / 7)

hey

Congratulations!!

by venice1789 on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:36:01 PM EST

Re: Arbitrary admin action (2.00 / 10)

Many Hillary supporters have been arbitrarily banned and censored. The "recommends" Alegre's diary received was significantly understated, since the ability of many Kossacks to recommend pro-Hillary diaries was removed by zealous pro-Obama administrators.

I'm United Methodist. I already have a Messiah.

by KnowVox on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:03:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

WTH are you talking about (2.00 / 1)

Since when has anyone now been allowed to rec diaries? They took comment rating ability away from many users, of all camps.

Because I wont trade humanity for patriotism!

by Drewid on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:13:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Miss Laura's Christmast Eve Hissy Fit (2.00 / 8)

Took the ratings abilities away from about a dozen pro-Hillary members of the community.

That's just the tip of the iceberg.

Well we're here to apply a bit o' heat to that iceberg.

Donate to Hillary Now!

by alegre on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:15:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Miss Laura's Christmast Eve Hissy Fit (2.00 / 3)

Alegre,

I think it was many more than a dozen. I can still log in but cannot comment or rate. So you don't know that I've lost my ability to do so. You can still read my diary page, and subscribe (though I can't post new diaries). I think I've met several dozen in just my wanderings around the internet. They wanted TR me but I didn't break the rules (not that it stopped them). Eventually, they just gave up and got one of the administrators to suspend my posting privileges. But I can still log in and see who is talking about me. And three months later, they are still talking about me. Weird.

by Little Otter on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:25:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Wrong about Arbitrary admin action (2.00 / 3)

Many on BOTH sides lost their ability to rate COMMENTS to cut down on flame wars, but those users can still Rec. Diaries.

So your claim about the Recs. Alegre's diary received is just plain wrong:

"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." - Benito Mussolini.

by Lefty Coaster on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 05:01:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wrong about Arbitrary admin action (2.00 / 0)

And this continues to be the case — indeed, immediately before I read this message last night, I was over on dK, where I was reading someone whinging about haiving lost their ratings privileges... for having TR'd Peter Daou, it turned out.

by Ray Radlein on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 09:35:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Got any (none / 0)

site for this.

by fladem on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:29:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Arbitrary admin action (none / 0)

Ratings privileges were pulled from supporters from all camps (including the Edwards camp). It was based on comments rated/uprated, not on who one supported. For example...both TomP and Geekesque lost their privies around the same time. At that time I know FOR SURE that neither of them were Hillary supporters. There were a couple LONG threads about it when it happened...but, if you read through them you can see that all 3 camps got hit pretty equally.

Personally, I find it ridiculous that ANY of the supporters had those privileges removed. But, that's just my opinion.

by Kysen on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 08:52:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 10)

alegre even got a mention on huffingtonpost- AND drudge. you KNOW you're notorious when drudge picks up on your story.

by campskunk on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:40:38 PM EST

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 8)

Heh - I saw that and thought of updating with a link to the HuffPo bit, but when you click on "read more" it takes you to the dkos post.

I don't want people going there - no way.

Donate to Hillary Now!

by alegre on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:58:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 1)

Ah, then the cause must be worthy... if Drudge is picking up on it.

No chance you are overreacting, making broad-based, anti-Democratic Party statements if Drudge is picking up on it.

Maybe, just maybe, it's a primary race in which invective is getting way out of hand. But luckily, you've found a home here, where us Barack Obama supporters (also known as those who understand math and believe that destroying the Democratic candidate who is most likely to end the day with the most delegates is a HORRIBLE way to go) get to be on the recieving end of the invective. (And no, it's no better to Bash on Hillary, but we've reached a point neither side sees their bashing as bashing...)

The choir is so much fun to preach to! Nothing worse than getting challenged!

Someone tell the Strom Thurmondgeist to stop haunting the Clintons: upending chairs, opening creaky doors, possessing during USA Today interviews.

by Lettuce on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 07:38:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 3)

Kind of ironic isn't it for an Obama supporter to be talking about Drudge, when the Obama idiots at Kos and the Obama camp itself accepted the claim that the African Garment photos posted by Drudge came from the Clinton campaign.

by bouvougan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:16:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (none / 0)

Um... that's not irony. That's a strawman.

Irony would be if that very same Obama photo turned out to be what motivated America to elect him President.

You might be thinking "hypocrisy" but that wouldn't work either because I don't like a thing Drudge does, whether its for my candidate or not. The guy openly trades in lies, yet is taken seriously by a ridiculous number of the MSM. I never understood it, and I don't understand it now.

So, did I think Clinton leaked the pic to Drudge? Sure, but only because of her prior use of Drudge leaks, which I didn't like then, either. But even if she did or didn't leak it, it doesn't matter to the main issue: I don't think any Democrat should have anything to do with Drudge because he, like Fox News, exists solely to harm the Democratic party. I think anything we do that aids Drudge in any way is akin to doing heroin. Feels good now, kills us later.

Which is why I think crowing about Drudge and Armstrong (should those names really be together) backing up your attacks on Kos for gasp disagreeing with you is a bad idea. Whether or not you post on Kos makes no difference to me.

The fact that I spend more time here, rather than Kos, precisely because I enjoy poking at complaints about Kos and Obama... now that's irony!

Kinda.

Someone tell the Strom Thurmondgeist to stop haunting the Clintons: upending chairs, opening creaky doors, possessing during USA Today interviews.

by Lettuce on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 03:39:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

the "anti-democratic party" part... (none / 0)

...isn't coming from the hillary side. it's coming from the close-minded, our-way-or-the-highway approach by the obama supporters that prompted this action. we're upholding democratic principles by standing against misogyny and the DLC-type centrism of the "common ground with republicans", "democrat-for-a-day" obama campaign.

by campskunk on Mon Mar 17, 2008 at 10:13:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 11)

I'm standing here with you, thank you for your leadership. The strike goes on!

Elect Hillary!

by owl06 on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:42:04 PM EST

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 7)

Good job

Wisdom Is The Reward For Listening Over A Lifetime

by gunner on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:45:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 7)

Great job Allegre. Proud of you from your DKos diaries and even prouder now. I love how they are twisting themselves in knots over there over the Obama/Wright stuff but forgot that even going there and commenting helps their page counts...will try to remember.

by ericrsiny on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:42:21 PM EST

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 7)

Yeah - with us gone here's hoping they turn on each other and the place implodes ;o)

Donate to Hillary Now!

by alegre on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:59:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Please Still Participate in the (none / 0)

Kos-MyDD Tourney Pool - Think of it as a Presbyterians vs. Baptists Soft Ball Game. http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/3/15/2342 26/587#1

Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.

by CardBoard on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:44:43 PM EST

I offer my services for Hillary (2.00 / 10)

Give it up for Hillary - Donate
Hillary's Bloggers

by NewHampster on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:50:35 PM EST

Re: I offer my services for Hillary (none / 0)

Ok, That is pretty funny

Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.

by CardBoard on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:55:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I'm all for positve (2.00 / 3)

...although slipping into negative as a defensive posture comes naturally. I'll work on that.

by Coldblue on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:52:29 PM EST

Work on it (2.00 / 9)

We all need to because this strike is not about hurting dKos or the trolls over there.

This strike is about helping Hillary. We are bringing awareness to the MSM about the double standard which exists in progressive land. I think they've fallen for the juice the bloggers created and maybe we can show them that we're not all on the same side in this thing.

Give it up for Hillary - Donate
Hillary's Bloggers

by NewHampster on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:58:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 7)

I'm weak with the peeking. But I'll grow stronger. No one wants more than I to show them I won't take it anylonger. Use me, then lose me.
That's my motto.

by Scotch on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:55:28 PM EST

Scotch Maybe this will help (2.00 / 7)

sorry for th huge image, sort of.

Give it up for Hillary - Donate
Hillary's Bloggers

by NewHampster on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:59:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Scotch Maybe this will help (2.00 / 5)

Do they have patches to put over the eyes. That is the only part of my body that is out of control in this.

by Scotch on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:07:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 6)

Heh - don't ask!

Donate to Hillary Now!

by alegre on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:56:06 PM EST

Kudos to you Alegre! Yours were some of my (2.00 / 7)

favorite dkos diaries. I went over there today and rec'd your last post (not sure it was the diary but at least it was your most recent) and I've sworn off the place. Like any other addiction, it will easier and easier to do without as time goes by.

Reasonable people can disagree.

by mnicholson0220 on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:59:26 PM EST

I know it's hard at first... (2.00 / 5)

But really, it'll get easier over time. Just start by deleting Kos off your favorites list. Take down the bookmarks to Kos. Once you don't have those shortcuts to the site, it will get MUCH easier to avoid that place.

And then, remember to support REAL progressive/Democratic blog communities that are fair to Hillary and to our cause. Continue coming back here to MyDD. Go to TalkLeft & Democratic Daily. Visit NoQuarter & Taylor Marsh. Over time, you'll forget about that Kos place. ;-)

Make history with Hillary today! :-)

by atdleft on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:05:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I know it's hard at first... (2.00 / 3)

I slit my computer screen with a knife. That also works.

by Scotch on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:09:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I know it's hard at first... (none / 0)

Yeah! Who needs opposing points of view. The choir enjoys the preaching more anyway.

Someone tell the Strom Thurmondgeist to stop haunting the Clintons: upending chairs, opening creaky doors, possessing during USA Today interviews.

by Lettuce on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 03:41:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I know it's hard at first... (none / 0)

You're really peeved by this, aren't you? All these comments... :-)

Follow the development at RezkoWatch

by DemAC on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 06:45:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Get the word out to Tina Fey (2.00 / 3)

It would be great if SNL picked up our strike. Though, I would be satisfied with the Daily Show.

by dbrown04 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:14:13 AM EST

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 4)

Cheers to you Alegre!

They didn't seriously make fun of Chelsea on the front page... did they?

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:16:32 AM EST

I agree with this post (linked) (none / 0)

http://tpmcafe.talkingpointsmemo.com/tal k/2008/03/prohillary-blogger-goes-on-str .php

Had HRC handled her campaign as she handled most of the Texas debate, there would be no hostility.

by obsessed on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:16:38 AM EST

There is no excuse for hostility (2.00 / 8)

No excuse. Hostility towards Hillary and her supporters cannot be explained away like that.

by catfish1 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:35:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: There is no excuse for hostility (2.00 / 6)

there is no excuse for dehumanized & insulting fellow bloggers just because they support HRC.

by JoeySky18 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:13:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Alegre Can You Ok Clinton Supporters (none / 0)

to join in the tourney pool?

And Here is some virtual marching for you all-

Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.

by CardBoard on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:19:22 AM EST

Re: Alegre Can You Ok Clinton Supporters (none / 0)

Man those Never Work

Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.

by CardBoard on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:19:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Alegre Can You Ok Clinton Supporters (2.00 / 4)

please see my reply here: http://www.mydd.com/comments/2008/3/15/2 34226/587/3#3 it's just bad timing. each hillary supporter is free to do what they want, and neither alegre nor i not anyone can "okay" participation in this, but most of us who've been through this for a while don't want to play with the people over at dKos, since they've been doing tacky things like being verbally abusive to us and snooping around trying to find out RL information about us. it just spoils the camaraderie, y'know what i mean?

by campskunk on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:51:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Alegre Can You Ok Clinton Supporters (none / 0)

I updated in reply...working it out so you all won't have to go to Kos, Kos is in the name...but March Madness is bigger than this campaign

Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.

by CardBoard on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:52:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Alegre Can You Ok Clinton Supporters (none / 0)

I know all you Clinton folks already have Yahoo id's though...so at least you don't have to sign-up.

Bring Back MyDD - Just say No to Rec'ing Candidate Diaries.

by CardBoard on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:59:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

A deep bow of gratitude (2.00 / 4)

to Alegre and all the other former DKos posters who finally said "Enough!"

My own GBCW diary was on March 6 and I've felt cleaner and happier ever since.

Message to Alegre: I haven't been able to log on to the Yahoo group. It doesn't want to digest my password or some such thing.
Please don't think I'm not participating due to lack of interest. I'm with you all the way!

by Radiowalla on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:20:16 AM EST

Re: A deep bow of gratitude (2.00 / 1)

hmm. you may try signing up with another email account if your first one doesn't work. can you log in to yahoo?

by campskunk on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:46:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I'll keep trying (2.00 / 1)

I'd like to be there but I can't seem to break down the door.

Anyway, I'm glad to see you here, campskunk. I feel like we've been through the mill together.

by Radiowalla on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:49:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I'll keep trying (2.00 / 3)

i'm a mod on the yahoo site, and we need more people- we only have 260 or so now. i will do what it takes to get you in. yeah, we have been through the mill ;-)

by campskunk on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:56:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A deep bow of gratitude (2.00 / 1)

Here's my thing: When you left, the reaction to your GBCW was profound. There was a great deal of consternation at how things could have gotten to the point where so valuable a voice as yours felt unwelcome. There was at least one Rec. List diary about your diary, exhorting the better angels of our nature to keep us from letting such a thing happen again. (There was also one "good riddance!" asshole in your diary, whose comments were quickly bombarded with TRs, thereby reminding us all that we were, in fact, still on the internet.)

By contrast, after Alegre's diary, there have been two different reactions: The first is laughter. Two days of full-throated laughter. And the second reaction has been one of righteous anger from people who have had experience with actual strikes.

Both of those reactions are due to the central framing of this action as a "strike" rather than as a "boycott," of course. Folks who have been pepper sprayed or had their limbs broken, or who have had to cancel Christmas and postpone that dental work young Billy needed because they went on strike back in the day have not, as a rule, looked favorably on calling this action a "strike." And folks who haven't been in that situation merely find the conceit to be a humorous overreach, along the lines of those right-wing bloggers who seem convinced that their sitting at the computer and typing is somehow akin to bravely fighting in Iraqistan.

So while calling it a "strike" may have been a great move publicity-wise (I honestly don't think that it would have gotten as much media attention if it had been labeled a "boycott"), I don't think that it has been very helpful in terms of actually communicating a genuine message or bringing about any kind of positive change; and by working to drive MyHRC and DailyBOs further apart, it has been actively counterproductive (IMHO), given the fact that, one way or another, we're all going to have to work together after Denver to help save the world from four deadly years of McBush.

by Ray Radlein on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:08:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A deep bow of gratitude (2.00 / 2)

I think the point is that the over-enthusiastic Hillary haters are not able to dialogue, and the administrators need to be aware that they are losing good people--HRC supporters, Obama supporters, and those in the middle. They need to decide whether they want a big profitable website with a bunch of crazies, or whether they want to be taken seriously by serious people. In the long run, their traffic will decrease if they choose the crazy route, and this is their wake-up call. I do like the way Alegre framed this. Other people said GBCW, and they sounded like lonely, pathetic and conceited victims, no matter how well written the diaries were. (I'm not saying that about Radiowalla's diary--I didn't read it.) Alegre said, I'm leaving and I'm taking a bunch of people with me. So much more empowering and productive.

by hearthmoon on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 11:34:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Radiowalla's diary (2.00 / 2)

I don't think it sounds lonely, pathetic or conceited, but you can judge for yourself:

Thu Mar 06, 2008 at 07:34:49 PM PDT

At long last, I've had enough.

It's way past time for me to move along.

In November of 2003, I signed up for an account here and since that day DailyKos has been my primary online source for political information. More importantly, it has been a place to voice my frustration with the calamity of the Bush administration and to express my support for the Democratic party as it attempts to reclaim power.

An unexpected side benefit has been the feeling of solidarity and community with fellow posters. I have truly enjoyed the exchanges with so many of you and have appreciated the insights and especially the good humor you have shared with me.

Now, however, my visits here have become less and less rewarding and I find myself more often than not frustrated, befuddled and angry after visiting here.

Radiowalla's diary :: ::
Without belaboring the points, this is why I have decided to bow out:

-Lack of civility to fellow Democrats who may support a less popular candidate. For months now, I and a few stray stalwart Hillary Clinton supporters have struggled to maintain a voice here. Quite a few have bailed out long ago or been banned and only the most tenacious have had the stomach to continue. This intolerance has been disappointing, but certainly not the deciding factor in my decision. I've soldiered on in spite of this because I am not afraid of standing up for my views.

- Kos' front-page post accusing, without a shred of evidence, the Clinton campaign of doctoring a photo of Obama in order to make him look "blacker" and, hence, more "sinister," was a signal to me that it is time to leave. When the owner and creator of this influential blog showcases unsubstantiated smears of a leading Democrat, it is cause for alarm. I asked myself, "What does it mean to be a member of this community?"
"Does my participation here lend support to this smear?" "By posting here, do I lend my good name, albeit a fanciful Username, to this noxious smear?"
-A diary today advocated violence at the Democratic convention in Denver. That was the tipping point for me.
What have we become if we speak of burning down our own convention? I want no part of it and I will not associate myself with such outrageous tactics. Here it is in all its splendor If Hillary Gets To Claim MI And FL, Denver Will Burn

Threats of violence, lack of civility, highly-charged candidate diaries, ....I just can't go there anymore.

It's sad for me, but I think I'll be doing my high blood pressure a big favor. I doubt I will ever find a blog as active and inspiring as this one once was, but times have changed this site and one has to adapt or move on. Since I am unwilling to adapt, I have to move on.

Namaste.

by Radiowalla on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:52:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Radiowalla's diary (none / 0)

Well it doesn't sound pathetic or conceited, it gives some very good reasons for leaving. It does sound lonely though.

by hearthmoon on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 02:59:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 5)

Excellent continuous work. Thank you.

by environmentally blue on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:27:47 AM EST

Off topic - What a waste of a great voice (2.00 / 3)

Mariah Carey trying to do rap. sounds like every other one.

and she has such a wonderful voice.

Give it up for Hillary - Donate
Hillary's Bloggers

by NewHampster on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:50:24 AM EST

Re: Update on DailyKos Writers Strike (2.00 / 9)

Although I'm fairly new to "political blogging," I just want to say I'm so glad I stumbled across this site before DailyKos when I went looking for a place that was open to having thoughtful discussion about this Primary that wasn't entirely pro-Obama. And since I saw all the many comments here about that site, I figured I'd save myself the frustration of even checking it out.

But I also wanted to commend you, alegre, for your unyielding commitment to getting the truth out. I recall posting to one of your diaries when I realized your name was starting to sound familiar, and "saying" something along the lines of having a feeling I'd be seeing/reading a lot of you on here. And I'm glad that's proven true...because despite the time I've put in to researching the candidates, I know I'll always learn or realize something new when reading your diaries. So as someone who's also taken the difficult step of standing up to injustice and unfairness in other areas, I just want to say bravo to you for standing up for "the cause" of this election season. Simple awareness of a matter can sometimes go a long way toward remedy, and your action is obviously already bringing awareness to this situation--so don't doubt the very real impact that actions such as yours can have. Again, bravo to you, and thank you too--I look forward to reading far more from you!

HRC: "...not a vote to rush to war--it...puts awesome responsibility in the hands of our President, we say to him 'Use these powers wisely and as a last resort.'"

by ChargedFan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 12:51:53 AM EST

That's beautiful (2.00 / 7)

Alegre has never wavered in her support of Hillary.

I'm amazed at what I learn from her but most of all I who have blogged alongside her am so thankful for her support after SC when we all were down. Or during the stretch of 11 losses when Alegre was our rock.

Alegre has done more for Hillary than she will ever know.

Give it up for Hillary - Donate
Hillary's Bloggers

by NewHampster on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:02:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's beautiful (2.00 / 3)

yep. Alegre is a tireless supporter.

by JoeySky18 on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 01:14:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's beautiful (2.00 / 2)

Thanks, NewHampster! I also have been amazed by what I've learned from her and other diarists here. I'm not sure if I'd honestly found this site yet at the time of SC, although I do wish I'd found it before I did (and am grateful for a link on Hillary's Hub to a diary that brought me here). Every group needs their so-called "rock," and I'm getting the sense there are a few such rocks here as I'm starting to recognize more and more of your names!

And for what it's worth, I've already been able to use the information I've learned here and elsewhere to turn a few other PA voters from Obama's camp (or who were teetering) into Hillary supporters. So, cheers to alegre and to all of you who have steadfastly continued getting the facts out there that hopefully will ultimately lead Hillary to victory...and our country in the right direction!

HRC: "...not a vote to rush to war--it...puts awesome responsibility in the hands of our President, we say to him 'Use these powers wisely and as a last resort.'"

by ChargedFan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:14:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's beautiful (2.00 / 2)

I don't much care for the positive connotation you imply for your statement "never wavered in her support for Hillary." I think that's what is wrong with people for both candidates. They don't waver, no matter what intervening information they are presented with. I think George Bush personifies the personality of somebody who never wavers in his support of what ever idiotic idea somebody convinces him of.

I would hope we would all be subject to wavering. I know I've wavered a lot in the course of this campaign, mainly because my overriding goal is to get a Democrat elected. To do that I have to assimilate a lot of information and determine in my mind which of the two candidates left will be able to beat McCain in November. So ever since Edwards left the race, I've wavered between Hillary and Barack, knowing that policy wise there is almost no difference between them, but there is a huge difference between them and four more years of Republican rule.

In the back and forth I've had in my comments, I've found the lack of wavering and inconsistency of thought one of the hardest things to overcome with advocates of both candidates. As an example, I had exchanged some comments with an Obama supporter and provided video of Jesse Jackson Jr. racializing the nomination battle immediately after Hillary's win in Massachusetts. He claimed Bill Clinton was the first to inject race in the battle, and that moment was the "deal breaker" for Clinton with him. But even after seeing evidence that it was the Obama campaign's co-chair that was the first, he "didn't waver" in his support of Obama. He simply wasn't able to assimilate the new information and change accordingly. We all need to waver when the facts and evidence show that our previous position is no longer valid.

by bouvougan on Sun Mar 16, 2008 at 10:37:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: That's beautiful (none / 0)

Well, I actually have to agree with the concept of your message. I came into this believing I would back Hillary--and in fact have actually been waiting for the day she would run--but was still determined to check all candidates out because my underlying goal and concern of this election was first and foremost to get the Republicans out of the White House, and I realized there were many who would never support Hillary. Once she was running, she gave me pause for doubt over one of her policies in particular. In fact, it's something that could very much affect me personally, in a negative way, so I was more open to other candidates.

And for a time, largely because of that and believing Barack just hadn't yet had the chance to put his words into action, but that surely he would be able to if given the chance, I actually switched to supporting him. (And I've emphasized in many places from the start my underlying goal of keeping the Democrats united so we could get a Democrat in the White House--that being the end goal.) But in the end, despite perhaps the personal hardship she could create for me, I believe her to be the best possibility for not only winning the General Election but leading our country forward. And it largely centers not only in what I see positively in Hillary, but an issue that gave me very large concern about Barack.

(For what it's worth, for me, actions do speak louder than words, and my belief that he just hadn't yet had the opportunity to put his words into action was proven false, in my opinion. For me, personally, it was discovering he had failed to take any actions relating to Afghanistan, even though he's been in a position of leadership to do so through his Chairmanship of the Subcommittee that provides oversight to NATO and Europe's involvement in Afghanistan--and further realizing, as reported by NATO, that European countries such as Germany ha