MyDD :: Judgment [UPDATE]

Judgment [UPDATE]

by cubstr, Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:22:01 AM EST

Much of Barak Obama's candidacy has so far been based on his perceived superior judgment, especially with regards to the Iraq war vote. While he is not shy about pointing out that he would not have voted for the war authorization act, it is important to note that he was never in any position to have to make a clear stand, backed up by a vote. This is Monday-morning quarterbacking, but it is a valid distinction. Point for Obama...but the general question of judgment is not so clear. This week's admissions by Obama's campaign still leave many questions still to be answered.

With regards to his involvement with Tony Rezko, on Friday the Obama campaign admitted that Rezko "might" have been responsible for bringing in as much a $250K to Obama's previous campaigns. While they obviously tried to bury this new revelation in the Friday news dump, it still raises the question about what they knew about Rezko's fundraising, and when they knew it. Obama himself cited this as a lapse in judgment as reported by AP:

"This is an area where I can see sort of a lapse in judgment, where I could have said 'No, I'm not sure that's a good idea." http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/O/O BAMA_REZKO?SITE=MALOW&SECTION=HOME&a

mp;TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

On top of that we have reports this week, however many years old they may be, of his Pastor's controversial comments on race and politics. But how many years ago these comments were made is a major point here. If Obama has been involved with this man for almost 20 years, how likely is it that he has no idea that comments like this were being made. On KO last night, he said that he had never heard those comments while he was "in the pews". Fine, no one should question the accuracy of that, but I have the feeling that many news organizations are now looking for tape of other statements that he made while Obama was "in the pews". Again, the question of judgment has to be brought up. I find it less than credible that Obama had no idea that someone who married him, baptized his children, and served as his spiritual guide and "brought him to Christ" had no idea about his other, more controversial views. If one assumes that he was aware, then where was his judgment? I applaud him for distancing himself from the latest set of controversial remarks that are at issue now, but why now, and why not longer ago? Obama knew over a year ago that these comments might come back to be an issue, but only now took a definitive stance on the Pastor's views, now that it is politically necessary to do so. I think that Lynn Sweet had it right in pointing out that Obama has political conversions when it is convenient for him. http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2008/03/ sweet_column_obamas_politicall.html#more

Update after the jump.

Wright laced into America's establishment, blaming the "white arrogance" of America's Caucasian majority for the woes of the world, especially the oppression suffered by blacks. To underscore the point he refers to the country as the "United States of White America." Many in the congregation, including Obama, nodded in apparent agreement as these statements were made.

http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2007/8/8/194812.shtml

Tags: Obama, Judgment, Rezko, Wright, Sweet (all tags)

Permalink :: 19 Comments :: Post a Comment

Re: Judgment (none / 0)

Well said.

I don't believe that Obama thinks the same way as Reverend Wright, but it does go to judgement that he knew even back on April 30, 2007 that Wright, himself, thought he would be a liability and that Obama would have to distance himself from him. Why would he proceed to put this man on his spirtual council?

This was something that could have been addressed at the beginning, and it would not be blowing up this late in the game.

Or maybe they thought it wouldn't be so bad when it did come out, which is asinine.

This genie cannot be put back in the bottle. The Obama Campaign has a lot of work to do in the coming weeks.

-----------
Blog: http://fitnessnerd.blogspot.com/

by FitnessNerd on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:28:28 AM EST

What short attention spans people have.. (none / 0)

This is absolutely ridiculous.. The mind reels..

>Much of Barak Obama's candidacy has so far been based on his perceived superior judgment, especially with regards to the Iraq war vote.

Universal healthcare IS a core Democratic value
Comprehensively cover 100%, not only the healthiest 80%

by architek on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:40:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: What short attention spans people have.. (none / 0)

Why is this comment ridiculous - every time people bring up the fact that Hillary has more experience, Obama says it's not experience that's important, it's judgement. Well, if people question his judgement in associating with Rezko and Wright for 17 - 20 years, that's a valid point.

by AnnC on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 12:23:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

His one claim to judgment fame.... (2.00 / 2)

doesn't turn out so good, either!

Let's start at the beginning...the one moment upon which he has built his entire campaign...his "good judgment about Iraq"...

(From No More Apples and Huffington Post)

"9/11 widow Kristen Breitweiser:

But back in '02, for those of us who dared to speak out against President Bush and his war in Iraq, we stood virtually alone. There was no resounding chorus of people calling "bullshit" on Bush's folly. No, back in 2002 you were called unpatriotic if you dared to question the president; labeled as helping the terrorists if you raised doubt about his divine call to action.

Now forgive me, but I do not recall the help (or the voice) of any Barack Obama from Illinois. Indeed, I cannot recall hearing or feeling the impact of any one speech from the Illinois Senator. Did he attend the rally on the mall in Washington? The marches and protests in NYC? Did he conduct national press interviews? Did he write any editorials? Organize any protest rallies? Mobilize the people? Did he write any petitions? If he did, I never saw any of them.

Yet according to Barack Obama, because he spoke out in 2002 against the war in Iraq, he is better qualified to be president."

ALL TALK. NO ACTION.

by Shazone on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:31:21 AM EST

He lacks both judgement and character (none / 0)

His Iiraq war judgement was a fluke. If Rumsfeld has listened to Colin Powell earlier, Iraq wouldn't have been a mess.

But history is history.

So is Rezko and Wright connections over years. It is a mistake if the relationship was for only one transaction, it is a planned activity if the relationship spans years and multiple transactions.

That shows his character and judgement in associating with such people. Both are missing over the years.

by Sandeep on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 01:22:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Listening to Wright and reading (none / 0)

.... his Iraq IQ quiz which is dated in Feb 03, about invading Iraq, I wonder how much of Obama's judgment about the Iraq war was coming from spiritual guidance from Rev. Wright.

It would be interesting to hear/read some of his sermons prior to Obama's speech in 2002.

by Southern Mouth on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:41:13 AM EST

Comparing Judgment (none / 0)

While you may question Obama's political judgment in not repudiating the Pastor's comments earlier, I think the point remains that the consequences of this alleged lapse of judgment are miniscule compared to the lapse for which Clinton is most often faulted--her vote to go to war with Iraq.

Viewed objectively, Obama's inaction until recently in the face of the comments of his former Pastor caused no harm -- except whatever short term harm it may cause to his candidacy. On the other hand, the vote to authorize military force in Iraq was one of the biggest blunders in the foreign policy history of our nation. It will cost us trillions of dollars and tens of thousands of American and Iraqi lives. It will undermine our nation's diplomatic and moral status in the world, and it will strain our military's capacity to defend us from threats in other areas of the world.

If my politicans are going to be fallible, I would like them to make their mistakes in the private sphere and not in the exercise of their offical duties. Just as I thought that the focus on Bill Clinton's sexual escapades was a distraction from the positive impact that his Presidency had on our nation's well being, so too do I think that a focus on the details of Obama's religious community is a distraction from the transformative impact that he will have as the President of the United States.

by DreamsOfABlueNation on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:42:58 AM EST

Re: Comparing Judgment (2.00 / 1)

I guess I would have to say that judgment about an issue, no matter how consequential it may be (and the war vote is huge) does not exist in a vacuum. We have to look at the totality of one's record, and can't afford to point to one question of judgment as definitive. Just as Clinton made a mistake in voting for the war authorization (even though she won't admit it), Obama made judgment errors on more than one front. He has made this a centerpiece of his message, so it deserves to be scrutinized more closely.

by cubstr on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:50:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Scrutiny (none / 0)

I don't disagree that scrutiny to one's potential failings in judgment are fair game. I just ask that such failings be put into context, and that we not allow personal failings to be conflated with failings of the public trust. And where there are 2 candidates remaining, a comparison of their judgment is also appropriate. In that context, there is no contradiction in Obama's message that he possesses better judgment than his rival given that, taken as a whole (and she has erred on more than just the Iraq War), Clinton's failings have caused this country substantially more harm than Obama's. I think both would make terrific Presidents, but because I credit Obama on this judgment issue I think he would simply be better.

by DreamsOfABlueNation on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:04:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Comparing Judgment (2.00 / 1)

Obama's faulty judgment on Rezko isn't a recorded vote.
But most 6 year olds could have seen the conflict before Obama did.

Hillary/Obama08

by annefrank on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:53:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Judgment means nothing if you... (none / 0)

...don't take action and DO SOMETHING about it.BO made a speech and now claims to be ready to be commander in chief...but he did nothing more than make one speech (see comment above from one of the 911 widows) - actually he did something kind of quiet when you consider the other anti-war noise that was going on. And since then - now that he is a US Senator - he has consistenly voted to fund the war.Hey, I have lots of good judgment, but I always act on it.Good judgment that does not result in action turns into poor judgment, IMHO.

by Shazone on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:59:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Action (none / 0)

I see no issue with Obama voting to continue allocations to arm and protect soldiers in harms way. That is different than supporting the reasons for the war -- something that Hillary did in her floor speech before the Iraq War vote. It is disingenuous to say Obama did not DO SOMETHING to stop the war. All that can be asked of us is that we do all that is in our power to act against injustice. Given that Obama was not yet a Senator in the leadup to the war, all he could do was vocally protest against it. Clinton however, had it within her power to use the clout that she had in the Senate to galvanize opposition to the war. She did not do all that was in her power to prevent this injustice from occurring and indeed took affirmative steps to ensure that the war would commence. In that respect, I need to give a big edge in judgment to Obama on this issue. Given the consequences that stemmed from the vote, I think that this edge overshadows any possible failure in Obama's judgment related to the delayed repudiation of comments made by his former pastor outside of his presence.

by DreamsOfABlueNation on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 11:14:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Action (none / 0)

(From No More Apples and Huffington Post)

"9/11 widow Kristen Breitweiser:

Yet according to Barack Obama, because he spoke out in 2002 against the war in Iraq, he is better qualified to be president."

ALL TALK. NO ACTION.

by Shazone on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 01:15:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Choices (none / 0)

In an election where there are 2 viable choices it is not enough to assail the actions of one without comparing them to those of the alternative. While you are right to say that neither candidate is perfect when compared to my standard (i.e. doing everything in one's power to resist injustice), it is clear that Obama approximates this standard much more than Clinton, whose actions with respect to the Iraq War did not even come close. As your quote said, anyone who opposed Bush was labeled unpatriotic or a terrorist. How then can you deny the courage that it took for Obama--a candidate in a relatively competitive Senate race (his war opposition came before Ryan dropped out)--to take a principled stand against invading Iraq. Now, did he stand in front of the tanks Tienamin Square style, no. But I would not expect him to have done so. It is enough to say that his actions reflected better judgment than Clinton's, notwithstanding any additional actions you suggest he may have taken.

by DreamsOfABlueNation on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 01:26:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I agree - but this one claim to fame.... (none / 0)

does not a POTUS make. I wrote a comment in the Writers Strike diary that outlines several big things that I see as a pattern to Obama - making a statement and then doing nothing about it.

He's very very political (I know, you'll yell Clinton Triangulation!). He positions himself for political gain, but when the rubber meets the road, he is AWOL.

We can't have that kind of opportunism in the WH. George Bush has destroyed so much and we must have someone who not only expresses him/herself well, but will actually do something about the problems we face.

Barack Obama has shown me that he is not that person.

by Shazone on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 01:46:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree - but this one claim to fame.... (none / 0)

First, anyone running for President -- Democrat or Republican -- is very very political in the sense that politics influence their decisionmaking. If by political, you mean a candidate who acts against the best interests of the country in favor of furthering his/her own political fortunes, I would have to say that Clinton would fit this mold more than Obama (though I concede that both -- and indeed most politicians -- have done this on occasion to a greater or lesser degree). Since Obama opposed the Iraq War at a time when doing so was wildly unpopular it is hard to characterize his actions (however lacking you may find them) as political in this Machiavellian sense. Clinton however, who had access to the Administration's paper thin case that Iraq had WMD's can almost certainly be looked upon as having allowed the political sentiments of the day to cloud her judgment as to what was in the best interest of the country.

You characterize Obama's modus operandi as making a statement and then doing nothing about it. However, if you define "doing something" as taking Federal Congressional action then you are not giving Obama -- a first term Senator -- a fair shot at proving his ability to make change. While Obama was criticized for plagerism, he was correct to point out that speaking out against injustice can itself be an effective form of action--especially when the person doing the speaking is not yet in a position of government authority to personally effectuate the change he seeks. King's I have a Dream Speech galvanized opposition to Jim Crow despite the fact that King himself never cast a vote to end the institution.

by DreamsOfABlueNation on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 02:04:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Good points. I note your comment that... (none / 0)

...Obama is a first term senator and I am not giving him a fair shot at proving his ability to make change.

That's very important to me...you see, I don't think he's ready for primetime. The fact that he immediately began to position himself and his wife for this campaign on the first day in his Senate term tells me that his ego has gotten in the way of his (supposed) good judgment.

I loved Obama in 2004. But I never thought he would "be ready" in 2008 for POTUS. And I still don't.

It's not me that has not given him a chance to prove himself. It's Obama who decided not to prove himself, IMHO.

by Shazone on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 02:21:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Comparisons (none / 0)

Again, its not enough just to note that Obama is inexperienced--you need to size him up against the alternative. Obama is a one term Senator, yes. But Hillary has only one term more. Obama started his campaign early in his first term, yes (not the first day--note that he at first ruled out running for President). But Hillary has been making plans for her Presidency since she was First Lady. The fact is neither of our candidates have the experience of a John McCain, but it is not accurate to characterize Hillary as lightyears ahead of Obama in experience. I will concede a small edge to her given the fact that she was a very active First Lady, but the experience metric is very close especially when we count Obama's years of state legislative experience.

by DreamsOfABlueNation on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 05:27:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Obama never closed the deal for me (2.00 / 1)

based on his DECEPTION that has been prevalent throughout the primary.

Obama couldn't even say "no" to his good friends - Rezko and Wright.

But he minimized their impact on his life and career UNTIL he was a front runner and Wright was outed and Rezko was on trial.

More is dribbling out about Obama's relationship with Rezko and Obama's REFUSAL to meet with Chicago reporters to discuss Rezko....

http://www.suntimes.com/news/politics/ob ama/843582,obama031408a.article

Obama's naivete is astonishing!

Hillary/Obama08

by annefrank on Sat Mar 15, 2008 at 10:51:01 AM EST

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