I Voted for Barack Obama Today

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Following up on Todd's post on voting for Hillary Clinton, I kind of feel like Alma Rangel to Todd's Charlie Rangel, or James Rubin to Todd's Robert Rubin -- or one of the many, many people in the country who are voting for Barack Obama while those close to them, friends or family or co-workers, are voting for Hillary Clinton. (I promise you we aren't just hedging our bets by splitting our vote!) Today I cast my vote for Obama in the California Democratic primary.

For me, my decision comes down to a couple of things. First, I actually like both Obama and Hillary Clinton, and I'd feel comfortable voting for and wholeheartedly supporting either in a general election. While there are some differences between the two on policy issues and more on political approaches, they are close enough for me to look to other issues. What's more, I think that both of them, either of them would be able to win in November. So the difference for me is between what that win could look like.

A few weeks ago I remember watching Charlie Cook speak on MSNBC, and he crystallized things well. At this point if you were to say that the Democratic nominee is going to get somewhere between 48 percent and 52 percent of the vote, it would be more likely to be Clinton. If you were to say that the Democratic nominee is going to get either below 45 percent or above 55 percent, it would be Obama. The way I would put it is this: I see Clinton as being slightly more likely to win that Obama, but Obama more likely to win big if he does win.

In a sense, Obama is the riskier bet -- but he also presents what appears to me to be the greatest potential for upside. Fundamentally, that's what I'm hoping to see. I'm hoping for that win that approaches 55 percent, with 260+ seats in the House and close to 60 seats in the Senate. And to me, the best opportunity to achieve the type of real change that we need today is to have a massive win that brings not only new voters to the Democratic Party but also old voters new to the Democratic Party (i.e. Independents and even Republicans who have voted in the past, but just not for the Democrats). This view admittedly relies a lot on intangibles -- anecdotal evidence, gut feelings, common wisdom, etc. -- but it also relies at least upon polling, both from the primaries and also from the general election, showing new voters (particularly young voters), Independents and Republicans coming to the Democratic Party to vote Obama or hoping to do so in the future. Yes, having a less known candidate who has more potential upside and downside is a riskier proposition because of the real potential of losing (and perhaps even badly). But it's a risk I'm willing to take.

The second driving fact behind my vote in generational, and not necessarily in the sense that I'm just voting with my age cohort (which overwhelmingly supports Obama), but rather in the sense that I think it's time for there to be a generational change in the leadership of this country. The baby boomers have had their two decades at the helm of power, two decades in which we've seen a lot of progress but also a lot of bickering over old divisions (primarily Vietnam). But perhaps it's time to see a new generation that isn't hung up on Vietnam and other related issues come to the fore and lead this country. Perhaps I am too hopeful on this front. But I'm just not quite at that point in my life where I'm willing to give up hope that trying something new has the chance of yielding new and different results.

I must reiterate that I would be content if Clinton were the nominee. I have a great deal of faith in her ability to win and, what's more, to be able to use her political skills and connections to get things done as President. No one in politics today plays the game as well as the Clinton team, and that's a really enticing prospect to me (even if a good part of me hopes that we can change the game). But in my gut, for the reasons mentioned above (among others), I know Obama is my preferred candidate and he will make a great Democratic President.



Display:


Charlie also pointed out (none / 0)

... that Obama was also more likely to deliver 42 to 45% of the popular vote than Clinton was.

Risk, reward, just like Bill said.  A "roll of the dice."


by dpANDREWS on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:32:15 PM EST

Re: Charlie also pointed out (none / 0)

This is pretty funny:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PzFOOcEQt P0
by del on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:47:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I agree--Obama is high-risk, high-reward bet (none / 0)

I am a risk averse person, so this worries me. I could see him finishing with 42 percent.

Hillary seems more likely to win or lose a close race with McCain.


Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.
by desmoinesdem on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:01:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

against McCain (none / 0)

if it is rapid GOP neocon war monger voter they will vote against both of them equally; but if it is a Republican or Independent that regrets their Bush vote and the Iraq war etc etc they will not vote for Hillary they will vote for Obama IMO;


by dearreader on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:15:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

yes, obama may draw more (none / 0)

Republicans and independents, and he would probably turn out more youth and African-Americans, but Hillary would draw more women, seniors, Latinos and working-class whites.

I would like to see some Obama supporters acknowledge that there are subsets of the population where Hillary performs better.

I wish I had a crystal ball to know which of these coalitions was a better bet to win against McCain.


Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.
by desmoinesdem on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:22:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: yes, obama may draw more (2.00 / 1)

I think that you answerede your own question. The sub groups that would support Hillary are unlikely to vote in great numbers for the Republican candidate due their policies. However the Repulican and independent groups attracted by Barrack would not necessarily vote for her.


by waldo on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:35:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

Finally a front pager that makes sense!


by waldo on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:36:15 PM EST

Actually mulitple rolls of the dice (none / 0)

Roll once ... can he win.

The rest of the rolls keep coming if he does win.

For all the media love and all the great speeches, we still know very little about how Obama will govern.  We know very little about his political and governing skills.  We know only what he and his campaign has wanted us to know and much  of that is just campaign hype.

So if Obama does win that is one risk overcome.   But then we run the risk he isn't up to the job.  


by dpANDREWS on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:36:23 PM EST

Re: Actually mulitple rolls of the dice (none / 0)

That's a risk we have with Clinton as well. She's never been in any position resembling being president, and we don't know that she'll be up to the job.


DC Drinking LiberallyDC for Democracy

by KCinDC on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:47:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

we'd be rolling the dice on Clinton too (none / 0)

I have a lot of concerns about how she would govern--not questioning her ability, but whether she would push a DLC, triangulating agenda rather than a progressive agenda.

My hope would be that she realizes she has nothing to gain by playing to the pundit class calling for bipartisanship.


Join the Iowa progressive community at Bleeding Heartland.
by desmoinesdem on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:07:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I respect your opinion, even if I disagree with it.

As someone who proudly voted for Clinton today, I'd like to hear an Obama voter make an argument based on policy, beyond "they're the same on policies." Even people who are supposedly wonks--Kevin Drum, for example--end up voting for Obama because they're betting somehow that Obama will draw more votes. As far as I can tell the only reason for thinking this is true is that in some polls he does better than Clinton against McCain, by a small margin within the margin of error. Seems like a fairly slender reed to me.


by OrangeFur on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:36:49 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I think that Obama's tech policy, foreign policy, and process-related policies (transparency, ethics, etc.) are very much superior to Clinton's. This is not the place to make that case, but Stoller has written a number of pieces on Obama's tech policy. Yglesias has numerous posts arguing Obama's superior foreign policy (also, see my link in a comment below to a piece by Spencer Ackerman). And, on transparency, I don't think there is much need to make that case for Obama. Those are his pet issues.

I also prefer certain things about Obama's approach to many domestic issues (though I favor Clinton on a few issues, as well). This stuff gets into some nuances about economic and political theory, so I can't offer a succinct defense of his positions here. Also, Obama has articulated specific policies to combat urban poverty, while I haven't seen that from Clinton.

Lastly, I actually trust Obama's commitment to constitutional issues and civil rights more than Clinton. Obama is obsessed with process, it sometimes seems, which leads me to believe that he takes things like separation of powers and due process very seriously. Also, he taught conlaw and is close to Cass Sunstein and Larry Tribe, which is comforting.


by DPW on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:51:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hilzoy makes a pretty good case on substance... (none / 0)

...and style.

http://obsidianwings.blogs.com/obsidian_ wings/2008/02/obama-actually.html#more


by MNPundit on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:57:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I really like this post because it is saying what the person really thinks and is well founded.  Not your typical Obama diary.

I actually agree with most of this, except I would say that I think either of them will win, but agree that Obama is more likely to get the blowout.

But here's where I differ.

I think Clinton is more likely to win reelection.  There will be a lot of broken hearts when Obama doesn't transform America to some Eden.


by attorney at arms on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:37:04 PM EST

The whole point I got from the Obama campaign... (none / 0)

...was that his election was the beginning. If we want change, he will bring it--but that change can only occur when we (Americans) actually organize and work for it. He needs us to do the grunt-work because we're the only ones who can. It's going to be a lot of hard work and we'll have to do it together.

Clinton could certainly do some good, in increments. Because that's how she thinks. And there are times and places for increments--but she's made it clear that while she wants my vote, she doesn't want my help. With HRC I get the sense she wants to say "leave it to me!" and me to get our of her way.

Perhaps it's counter-intuitive to the conventional wisdom, but I think Obama's approach is the one more likely to create a permanent shift.


by MNPundit on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:01:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Well, why don't we just have Charlie (none / 0)

choose the winner now? What's the point of going through the election and wasting all that money? :)


by highgrade on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:37:51 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I'm surprised that neither you nor Todd gave much attention to foreign policy. Spencer Ackerman made a strong case today against Clinton on these grounds.

http://www.washingtonindependent.com/vie w/clinton-maneuvers

Still, you and Todd both did a nice job of laying out your reasons.


by DPW on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:39:20 PM EST

rolling the dice... (none / 0)

Eliot Spitzer, Deval Patrick.......
And how have they fared in their first year in office?

Yes, this would be a big roll of the dice.  And Obama could win in a landslide and his approval rating could be 35% on May 1, 2009.


by mikelow1885 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:39:45 PM EST

Add Corzine to that list (none / 0)

You know - I'm as progressive as they come - on nearly every issue.

But I've become a little disenchanted with this so-called new generation of progressive leaders.  

What gives?  I don't have the answer to this one.


by Turnpike Kid on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:08:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I voted for Obama (none / 0)

in California today too.

I agree with many of your reasons.


by puma on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:41:56 PM EST

Re: I voted for Obama (none / 0)

Ditto, Obama in Cali.

I think he has coattails. Bring out that many people and you're set to win big. Also Obama V. McCain matchups have Obama winning, Clinton V. McCain have McCain.

I'll take the big win and the coattails.


by Tatarize on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:26:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Fix the link please!!!! (none / 0)

You posted a diary on Denver Post and its endorsement to Hillary at Breaking Blue. The link you provided lead readers to an article with a huge picture of Bush. What is going on? It have been days!

I understand you support Obama. Now please fix the link.


by praxis1 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:44:16 PM EST

Now this I expected (none / 0)


by souvarine on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:45:08 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

Wow...

If I were betting I would have said Todd went Obama and you and Jerome went Clinton... Way off I guess... oh well I could still get Jerome right.  

Good vote BTW!


by yitbos96bb on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:49:54 PM EST

Fox and right wing frames (none / 0)

"First is that I know she will be a partisan warrior. I'm not ready to give up the fight that they started but that we've been waging over the past several years; I'm not ready to give in to the Broders and Brooks's who insist both parties are equally culpable in the havoc that the Bush administration and a Republican congress has wrought and that unity, in and of itself, is the answer."

-- Todd Beeton

Being a cynic I expect both candidates to validate right wing frames.

But Hillary a partisan fighter? Yeah. Going on Fox when every Dem candidate so far has put them in place for being so virulently partisan. And is Karl Rove going to be the moderator of this debate?

I guess she needs to dip into the Murdoch well once again since Jan was a relatively slow month.

I am deeply concerned about Obama's "unity" message. We've seen how bi-partisan compromise has worked out  in the past - accept the right wing position and sell out the progressive. But this takes the cake - Fox does not even pretend to be fair and balanced. At the end of the day all one needs to do is look who are some of Hillary's key advisors - Penn, McAuliffe, Emmanuel. And Obama's advisors are equally part of the beltway cocktail circuit.

Between triangulation and post-partisan what is a progressive voter to do?


by ab initio on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:56:18 PM EST

Interesting (none / 0)

Todd's reasoning for Clinton was based on policy and experience and your reasoning for Obama was, oh well, on hope (hope that he will win us big).

I guess I would at this point invest this country in bonds rather than in stocks.  The market is too volatile.


by gort256 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:56:46 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

Dear Jonathan Singer:

Although I voted for Hillary today, I very much respect your opinion and the careful calculations you used to determine who might win.  I feel that many Obama supporters (at least the ones near me - NY) are more emotional in their decision. For example, I wear a Hillary pin constantly and I have been booed and hissed at by Obama supporters.  Your take, in contrast, is very well thought out, intellectual, and not emotional. I love that you have respect for both camps.  You are able to disagree without being disagreeable!!

The problem I have with your Obama argument is - is he really "new" or just naive?  I believe Hillary when she goes on about the 'vast right wing conspiracy.'  Is it really the case that those within the far right - those who conspire - will really put down their swords and play nice with Obama?  How do we know he won't get trapped the way Jimmy Carter was?  

For the good of the country, if Obama becomes President than I hope everything he achieves comes true because it would be nice if the divisiveness would stop.  But in my heart of hearts I feel that that is a dream.


by findthesource on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 04:59:10 PM EST

I nteresting (none / 0)

Interesting. Not one mention of what Obama might actually DO as President. Nothing about health care, education, the economy, rolling back the Empire, restoring civil liberties, etc., etc.

Basically, you're voting for Obama because you think there is a chance that he will have a big, positive effect downticket and that he is more likely to win a big percantage of the vote. As to the first contention, there is simply no evidence for it, as Obama has never run outside of his own State in a general election. In fact, he has only run once in a general election even at the State level, and that was against token opposition. What reason is there to believe that his name at the top of the ticket would help the Party more than Clinton's? As to him winning big, most of the polls I've seen show him and Hillary running about the same against McCain. I wonder where you think he would run better than her? Which States would he carry that she wouldn't?

And, in general, it seems to me that it is the Clintons, not Obama, who have a proven history of success in general elections against the Republicans. Frankly, I think the Republicans will eat Obama alive. He can talk all he wants to about Hope and Inspiration and Unity, but the GOP, and its surrogates and fellow-travellers, will be talking about Obama's relative lack of general experience, his utter lack of foreign policy experience, his admitted drug use, the fact that an indicted slumlord helped buy his house, and the fact that he belongs to what is arguably a Black-Suprematist church. Despite the claims that the Clintons have played "dirty," the real story is that they, and the press, have treated Obama with kidd gloves.

Take the Rezko/house thing as one example, I have seen Obama supporters on this site and elsewhere say that the issue is over and done with because Obama "admitted he made a mistake." They may be good enough to get Chris Matthews to stop talking about it now, and it may be good enough for the Clintons to leave it alone, but there's no way in hell that it will slow down, never mind stop, the GOP from playing it for all its worth.

The rest of your reasons for supporting Obama seem even less substantial. I find the whole "generations" thing to be vague to the point of meaninglessness. You say that Hillary is a baby boomer, yet, according to some accounts, Obama is a baby boomer too. In any event, I don't think that people really can be judged according to which "generation" they supposedly belong to. The labels, cut-off dates, and alleged attributes for these "generations" strikes me as arbitrary and artificial. Hillary is less than 14 years older than Obama, I don't see how this really makes such a big difference. Also, I don't see any evidence that Hillary is committed to reliving the old battles of the Sixties, nor do I see her obsessing about the Vietnam War.


by freemansfarm on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:12:42 PM EST

Re: I nteresting (none / 0)

Thank you.  Once Republican talk radio gets a hold of the Rezko thing, all bets are off!  The talk radio audience is the biggest political audience out there--more potent than the blogosphere.  The Dems political ambitions will be torn to shreds if Obama gets the nomination.  We can basically write off the South and Ohio.  And the Presidency.  The Republicans will be content to win with another bare majority or plurality.


by Zeitgeist9000 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:25:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I agree completely.  Except for the part about being able to wholeheartedly support Clinton.  I will support Clinton, if it comes to it.  But it will be half-heartedly.  And even Jim Dobson might vote for McCain, if the alternative is Hillary.  I agree that Obama has greater upside potential.  And for those who think McCain could beat him, think of them in a debate.  It would be Bill Clinton vs. Dole all over again.


by aravir on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:20:23 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

"My first word of exit poll results says that the first two waves of results in Massachusetts show a "dead heat" between Hillary and Obama, and a 20-point margin for Romney among Republicans."

From Jim Geraghty at NRO.

With early exits coming in, could we get a dedicated discussion thread?  Thanks!


by FuzzyDunlop2 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:22:18 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

On risk . . . and JFK was a nearly insurmountable risk, too?


by tomthroop on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:25:48 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I have to congratulate you and Todd on your even-handed diaries, I thought Todd would go for Obama and you were going to back Clinton!  So there to anyone complaining for the past six months about bias.


by Shaun Appleby on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:35:21 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I'd like to see how you come up with a big electoral college win without Florida, where Obama finished fourth last week behind Clinton, McCain, and Romney.


by hwc on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:38:37 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

Where's the beef? Grow up. your living in fantasyland. You can't wIn on just a pretty fantasy. The republicans will beat Obama like a junkyard dog . You have to have substance to beat the republicans. fantasy. city is insufficient to beat the republicans.
by vediamo on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:43:45 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

I also have the feeling that some Democrats might see Obama as a lightweight against McCain and they would vote for him.  I think Clinton could hold those folks.


by wasabi on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 05:46:40 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

Jonathan,
Thank you for giving me a reason to keep reading this blog. The shilling for Clinton was really getting out of hand.
by keatsheart on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 06:12:39 PM EST

Re: I Voted for Barack Obama Today (none / 0)

Pegged you for a Clinton voter. I stand corrected.


by wolff109 on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 06:23:26 PM EST

So did I (none / 0)

The power of the president is the power to persuade; so said Richard Neustadt, who knew a thing or two about the presidency.  The president is not a monolith, the president does not single-handedly control the economy, and the president does not have the Constitutional authority to enact statutes.  The president persuades: the public, Congress, and the world.  It's that simple; who would do a better job of setting a national agenda?  I challenge those who would say Hillary to compare their speeches.  Is it shallow to reduce a vote to so simple a proposition?  Perhaps, but another "inexperienced" junior senator from Illinois used this power to reshape our nation.  How many of us can quote the Gettysburg Address even today?

One final thought: between his years in the Senate and the IL legislature, the inexperienced junior senator from Illinois has more years of elected service than does the tried and proven junior senator from New York.  Day One, huh???


by carloseljefe on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 09:35:35 PM EST


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