MyDD :: Michelle Obama's misogynist remarks

Michelle Obama's misogynist remarks

by MollieBradford, Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:53:38 PM EST

I have no use for sexist men and even less for sexist women. Today on GMA Mrs. Obama said she would have to think about supporting Senator Clinton should she win the nomination. Nice!

So when I went to look at that video I found this one. On this she blames Clinton for her husband's cheating and says she gives a bad family role model and is unqualified to be president. Imagine any woman saying another shouldn't be president or get any job for that matter because her husband cheated on her.

Hey Michelle, I hear it's happened to you and I hope that's just gossip because if it isn't you are dooming all of us to another republican presidency. Cross the fold to see the video.

Tags: Election 2008, Michelle Obama, Hillary Clinton (all tags)

Permalink :: 139 Comments :: Post a Comment

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

OMFG!

by rossinatl on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:54:55 PM EST

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 3)

I have to admit that those are rather stupid comments.

by Drummond on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:57:00 PM EST

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 3)

thanks Drummond.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:57:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

The most important part of your piece is that Michelle wouldn't say she would support Sen. Clinton. That's appalling behavior.

OMG -- if Bill Clinton said that, the media would talk non-stop about it for DAYS!

What have you heard about Obama wandering?

by susanhu on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:13:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

She seems to be a straightforward (none / 0)

person who's also very emotional. Given the horrible tactics she has seen played by the Clinton campaign, she can't be blamed for how she feels.

"Bill Clinton said that, the media would talk non-stop about it for DAYS!"

Bill Clinton is still considered by many to be a leader of the party. His obligations to the party that elevated him to power and stuck by and supported him through impeachment (which came to exist because of Clinton's reckless self-indulgence with Monica, knowing fully well that the rightwing was looking under every stone to bury him, his wife, his VP and the party) are far greater.

Obama's Pop. Vote LEAD = 600K | Clinton & McCain = WAR Authorizers

by NeuvoLiberal on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:25:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: She seems to be a straightforward (none / 0)

That video was done months ago - before anything that the Obama campaign can complain about the Clintons ever took place.

by Shazone on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:41:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: She seems to be a straightforward (none / 0)

Even if true, which it isn't, two wrongs don't make a right.

by Mike Pridmore on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 10:38:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Bill Clinton used and threw Monico under the bus (none / 0)

by dissing her as "that woman" while lying to the public (that's when and why Monica pulled out here blue dress).

The Clinton machine was out demonizing Monica by trying to paint Monica as a "stalker". That's how much the Clintons care about women. For the Clinton's, everything and everyone comes only after their political ambitions.

Obama's Pop. Vote LEAD = 600K | Clinton & McCain = WAR Authorizers

by NeuvoLiberal on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:50:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bill Clinton used (2.00 / 1)

Dumbass, read what he wrote. You are talking about another aspect of the story. He is talking about something else.

by Pravin on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:49:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bill Clinton used (none / 0)

Whether it was Tripp or Monica who trottted out the blue dresss is irrelevant to the main point in his comment. You are focussing on a triviality. The main point was the Clinton machine tried to smear Monica. I understand why he would lie about it. Hell, I don't really care about Clinton having an affair with a woman who seduced him. But to call the other guy a dumbass over who trotted out the blue dress is stupid.

by Pravin on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 10:02:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Response diary posted: (1.00 / 0)

Watch Bill Clinton throw Monica Lewinsky under the bus

Obama's Pop. Vote LEAD = 600K | Clinton & McCain = WAR Authorizers

by NeuvoLiberal on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:01:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

WOW...! (2.00 / 4)

I didn't know she said that. That's so below the belt. And no media has covered this. It's not on any TV. How double standard is this.

by JoeySky18 on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:57:17 PM EST

Bingo (2.00 / 4)

I've said it since last spring ... double standard bigtime. People can rag on Clintons all they want but Barry Obama is off limits.

by dpANDREWS on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:58:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: WOW...! (2.00 / 1)

As I just mentioned above, if BILL CLINTON had said that on GMA, that's ALL that the media would be talking about.

by susanhu on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:16:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Go ahead (2.00 / 2)

try and tell me this is not what she meant.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:57:18 PM EST

Re: Go ahead (2.00 / 1)

"Hey Michelle, I hear it's happened to you .."

So that's the Clinton's closing strategy? The lowest form of smear mongering? Kind of tells us all we need to know about them (and you).

People can sense Hillary's smallness...that's why she is losing ground fast.

by JoeCoaster on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:27:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go ahead (2.00 / 1)

I'm sorry, I agree with the person who originally posted this diary. Michelle Obamas tactics are disgraceful and downright low class. And it is true that of Bill Clinton said this, CNN would be all over it.....

In this campaign I feel sorry for the Clintons.

by findthesource on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:48:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go ahead (none / 0)

Closing strategy? LOL. Character assassination was the opening strategy and main theme of the HillBillies's campaign all along. That and race baiting. Are you surprised?

Guess what else we got today? More crocodile tears. LOL. I expect to hear Bill Clinton in California telling Mexican immigrants that Obama hates them because he's black any minute now.

NJ Hussein Independent

by NJIndependent on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:56:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go ahead (none / 0)

NO! Obama's campaign began playing the Race Card - by allowing Oprah to tell blacks to vote for THE ONE - the BLACK one.

Then ObamaBots hyped Hillary's historical statement about LBJ and MLK, Jr.

Oh- and Jesse Jackson did win primaries - but not the nomination. But according to ObamaBots - that statement was "proof" the Clintons are racists!

Obama's racial slur toward Edwards during the SC debate intended to send the message that Edwards was irrelevant.

Obama is a race-baiter - big time!

Hillary/Obama08

by annefrank on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:51:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (1.00 / 1)

At least Bill cheated with a FEMALE Michelle.

by dpANDREWS on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:57:40 PM EST

Now that's in very poor taste. (none / 0)

Ick. Stick to the issues. Who the fuck is she to say what and what isn't a good family or a good house.

It's an election, not an auction.

by cosbo on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:59:01 PM EST

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

OK... this is getting ridiculous.

1) those remarks are old and have been around for a while

2) those Obama charges are patently false

3) I am sorry to tell you, but Clinton's BJ cost Gore the election.

Would you hire George W Bush to be YOUR latex salesman?

by jgkojak on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 01:59:41 PM EST

huh? (2.00 / 3)

so the remarks don't matter because they are a few months old? And what charges re you talking about?
Did she or did she not say that Clinton can't be president because she can't run her own house?

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:01:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: huh? (none / 0)

The diary says it was today. Yes, it's relevant if it's a few months old, but much less so.

by Drummond on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:26:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: huh? (none / 0)

no the diary does not say it was today.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 11:27:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: huh? (none / 0)

It doesn't say it wasn't.

by Drummond on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 12:45:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

asdf (1.00 / 0)

"I am sorry to tell you, but Clinton's BJ cost Gore the election."

Agreed: 2000 Election Synopsis

Obama's Pop. Vote LEAD = 600K | Clinton & McCain = WAR Authorizers

by NeuvoLiberal on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:29:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: asdf (none / 0)

2 things lost Gore the election - Nader syphoning votes in NH and FL, and not counting the votes in Florida. Just because the votes weren't counted, doesn't mean they don't count.

by AnnC on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:14:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: asdf (none / 0)

And he actually won the popular vote by half a million.

by Mike Pridmore on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 10:46:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

A fabrication. Presidents who have 67% approval ratings do not cost their VP the successive election. The media mistreated Gore the same way it is mistreating Hillary now and he didn't know how to fight back. And besides that, he actually won the election by half a million votes. And he won FL but the US Supreme Court stole it from him.

by Mike Pridmore on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 10:44:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

by Mike Pridmore on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 10:44:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

1) Had Gore not felt the need to rationalize opposition to Clinton's "moral" issues, he would not have been forced to pick Lieberman.

2) That 10,000 or so people in FL probably voted differently due to Clinton's mess?

Would you hire George W Bush to be YOUR latex salesman?

by jgkojak on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 12:58:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I hate to tell you but not everything is about the Clintons.

by Piuma on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:03:56 PM EST

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

Do you SERIOUSLY believe she is not talking about the Clintons in this video?

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:06:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

maybe Obama doesn't (2.00 / 1)

want single moms voting for him or something....

yes Obama got a pass on this very nasty comment.

I also think M. O. was a bit meaner than she needed to be at the UCLA event

McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions

by TarHeel on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:48:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

you are right (2.00 / 1)

but this remark clearly is.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:12:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

The line that "if you can't run your own house, you can't run the White House" has been a staple of MO's speeches for a long time.

She used to say it in the context of a cute anecdote about their kids, and Obama supporters used to vehemently deny that it was any sort of veiled shot at the Clintons. Heck, at first I gave her the benefit of the doubt myself.

I hope all those knee-jerk defenders feel stupid now. Lord knows I do.

She is literally arguing that if you can't keep your husband from cheating, you're not qualified to be President. Imagine if this statement got one-tenth the scrutiny as whatever comes out of Bill Clinton's mouth. Amazing.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:05:12 PM EST

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

No. She's arguing that if you stick with a husband who repeatedly cheats on you then you aren't qualified to be President.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:07:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

Wow!

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:08:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I personally don't agree with her, necessarily, but I know a lot of women who feel exactly that way.

It would be the same if the genders were reversed, only more so. A male politician whose wife was constantly cheating on him, and everyone knew it, but who stuck with her anyway, would never get elected as dog-catcher.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:10:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

Can you give me an example of a male politician whose electoral fortunes went by the wayside because his wife cheated?

Since there are tons more male politicians than female, I'm sure you can think of plenty of examples of this argument being used against males.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:20:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Can you give me an example of a male politician whose wife was cheating on him repeatedly, and everyone knew it, whose electoral fortunes didn't go by the wayside?

I can't think of any examples of this aqrgument being used against males because it wouldn't ever even get that far. A male politician in such a situation would be more likely to either--

1.Drop out of the race. Or,
2. Divorce his wife and try to continue.

The truth is I can only think of one example where a politician ran for office while still married to a well-known philandering spouse, and that one example is Hillary Clinton.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:26:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

So either

1) every male politician in Washington has a wife that never strays; or

2) people just don't really care very much about whether or not their wives are straying.

I know which I would choose. It's amazing how the lack of any supporting examples whatsoever doesn't dissuade you in the slightest.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:32:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I get your point #1, but your missing the key part, "and everyone knows about it.

Your point #2 is backwards. If anything there's a greater stigma attached to a man who is 'cuckolded' than to a woman whose spouse cheats. Don't ask me whay that is.

Look, all you have to do is imagine (honestly) a male politician whose wife was known to have cheated on him repeatedly, and quite publically, but was still married to her. Now try to imagine him running for President.

NOW imagine someone saying something like what Michelle Obama said--would that be 'sexist' to say something like that in such a situation?

Of course it wouldn't.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:40:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

If people actually cared about this sort of thing, you bet your bottom dollar the opposing candidate would be making sure "everyone knew."

I consider your thought experiment to be quite silly. The fact that you can't cite to even one example from the real world says it all.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:45:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

You can't cite a single example either, where a man whose wife was known to be cheating on him ever won an election to anything. The reason there are no examples is because none exist. The reason none exist is because if it were a man it would never even have gotten to the point of a Presidential race. Like I said, he couldn't even win dog-catcher.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:48:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I hope all those knee-jerk defenders feel stupid now. Lord knows I do.

This is an old line and an old video. She no longer talks about this and hasn't for months. Her speeches since Iowa concentrate on her life, Barack's life, and the difficulty of attaining what used to be the American dream. She steadfastly stays away from anything which can even remotely be misconstrued. Look at her speech yesterday.

by Piuma on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:52:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

So you think the video in this diary was "misconstrued" as being about the Clintons? You honestly think that?

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:01:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Whatever it was, it was dropped a long time ago.

by Piuma on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:04:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I am trying to determine whether you are able to own up to what's right in front of your face. So far, you can't.

It's remarkably dishonest behavior to jump into a thread making comments like "not everything is about the Clintons" and then, when called on it, hide behind dodges like "gee, it was a long time ago."

There are so few Obama supporters I have any respect left for at this point. Way too much dishonest and dissembling. You've provided another perfect example here.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:07:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You are the one dissembling. (none / 0)

Of course that comment was about the Clinton's. Duh. And there was nothing in the least sexist about it. If anything it was a very mild criticism compared to what it might have been.

The same criticism applied to a male politician in the same circumstances would not be considered 'sexist.' The dishonesty here is that some people see sexism where none exists.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:17:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You are the one dissembling. (none / 0)

You should take it up with the person I was responding to, who keeps maintaining that he has no idea whether it was about the Clintons. Talk about blatant dishonesty.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:38:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

None of us know whether it was directed at Clinton or Giuliani or politicians in general so don't talk to me about honesty or fairness. My opinion is it was probably meant as a gentle dig which came out sharper than intended so she dropped it. But that is my opinion only. I have a lot of respect for Michelle from listening to her speak a number of times but I also know, as she mentions often, she's from Chicago politics. She is no saint. But she is a good and decent person.

by Piuma on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:25:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

"Maybe it was about Giuliani." Come on, you're making a joke of yourself at this point.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:39:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Andrew Jackson's wife was acussed of bigamy. Something about marrying AJ before she was divorced. He was elected twice, and is one of the founders of the Democratic Party. Grover Cleveland acknowleged an illegitmate child in the campaign of 1888. He served two terms.

by DaleA on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:17:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

of course the same would not be said of a man. Men don't get blamed for their wives cheating.
You are truly clueless about sexism and how it works in this world. What a classic example of the ugly backlash against equal rights you are.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:04:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Women don't get blamed for their husbands cheating--they get blamed for putting up with it, same as men.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:29:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

And it would most definitely get said, in such a situation. A man running for President with a wife who is a well-known serial philanderer would be challenged on that fact over and over. You know it, I know it, anyone who's being honest knows it.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:45:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Give me one example of where it has ever happened. Any male politician, at any level, losing because his wife cheated. Just one example.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:48:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I already told you, repeatedly, that I can't. I told you why. You are starting to sound like a broken record. Why not debate this honestly instead of parroting the "one example" mantra?

Or why don't you give me one example, just one example, of a man whose wife was publically cheating on him who ever got elected to anything? Ever?

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:51:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Let me put this even more clearly... (none / 0)

I can think of two examples of a politician of either gender getting elected to anything at all in spite of a spouse that everyone knows is a serial philanderer.

1. Hillary Clinton 2000 Senate race.
2. Hillary Clinton 2004 Senate race.

Can you think of any more examples?

Anyone? Anyone?

Pretty well illustrates my point, doesn't it?

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:03:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

So what is your point? (none / 0)

Cuckolds have no right to public office? I really don't care whether you can or cannot think of a male candidate who was elected after a cheating wife became public knowledge (By the way, I can think of one - Trudeau in Canada), I'm not going to condone the attitude expressed by Michelle Obama regardless of the sex of the offender or victim. If we can elect cheaters, we can elect the cheated.

by lombard on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:56:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So what is your point? (none / 0)

I agree with you about the fact that it shouldn't matter. My problem with this diary is calling Michelle Obama a sexist and a mysogynist.

Talk about nasty? Mollie could write the book.

Oh, and examples would have to come from the U.S., other countries aren't so silly about these things as we are.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:01:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

boo hoo (none / 0)

she is a sexist.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:06:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Then I repeat... (none / 0)

...where's the double standard? How is she holding Hillary Clinton up to a tougher standard on this compared to what a male candidate would face?

Oh. I forgot, that's not your definition of 'sexism.' She won't be voting for Hillary Clinton, so in your mind I guess that does make her sexist.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:23:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Last point before I leave for the day-- (none / 0)

You challenge me to come up with an example of a male politician who lost elected office because his spouse cheats, yet it was you who were saying that Michelle Obama is sexist due to her challenging Hillary on this. That means the burden is rightfully on you to show that male politicians get away with having cheating spouses, but that female politicians are held to a higher standard.

So show me an example of a male politician who ever succeeded at getting elected to anything with a spouse who repeatedly publicly cheats on him. Just one example.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:13:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Last point before I leave for the day-- (none / 0)

You challenge me to come up with an example of a male politician who lost elected office because his spouse cheats, yet it was you who were saying that Michelle Obama is sexist due to her challenging Hillary on this.

I said Michelle Obama is sexist? Where did I say that?

One of the most idiotic things about arguing on the Internet is the "no, the burden of proof is on YOU" debate, and I am not tempted to play that game even a little bit.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:41:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Last point before I leave for the day-- (none / 0)

You've already played that game. You say upthread, "the fact that you can't cite to even one example from the real world says it all." By considering this commenter's failure to produce an example as a presumption that one doesn't exist, you are indeed playing the burden-of-proof game.

But, I'm just a dishonest, dissembling Obama supporter, so feel free to ignore me.

by DPW on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:49:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Last point before I leave for the day-- (none / 0)

DPW is right. YOU started the "burden of proof" game.

But I admit that you didn't say Michelle Obama is sexist. It was Mollie who did that, and you certainly did seem to be agreeing with her...

In fact you really very much seemed to be agreeing with her...

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:07:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (none / 0)

then what's your beef?

(Get ready for a no-response or more dissembling, everyone.)

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:11:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (none / 0)

My beef is that you lied about what I said.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:19:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (none / 0)

My beef is that you won't engage in honest debate. You know you were agreeing with Mollie--talk about dishonest dissembling!--and now you can't answer a simple question--

If you don't think what Michelle Obama said was 'mysogynistic' or 'sexist' then what's your beef with what she said?

Funny how you criticize Piuma for denying the obvious fact that her statements were about the Clintons, then you make an even more absurd denial.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:27:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (none / 0)

I'm upset with what she said because it's slimy to imply that if you can't keep your husband from cheating, you're not qualified to be President. It's a revolting personal attack. That's my beef.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:31:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (none / 0)

Well then we interpreted what she said differently. I don't think she was blaming Hillary for not being able to controll Bill's behavior, but rather for her own acceptance of that behavior.

But then the comment was vague enough it could be interpreted in various ways.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:40:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (none / 0)

Besides, if you can forgive Bill Clinton for his racist comment RE Jesse Jackson then surely you can forgive Michelle for this much milder and less offensive comment which was made months ago and not repeated?

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:45:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (none / 0)

"racist comment"? Holy fuck, why did I ever waste my time with you.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 05:07:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So if you weren't saying MO is sexist, (1.00 / 0)

Are you suggesting it wasn't racist? Then why did I ever waste my time on you?

After Obama wins a landslide victory in SC Bill Clinton excuses it away by saying that Jesse Jackson won it twice and you don't get that as racist, but you are all offended by Michelle Obama's relativly innocuous comments about Hillary's 'stand by your man' acceptance of Bill's rampant cheating?

Talk about your irrational double standards.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 06:14:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It was NOT racist (none / 0)

There are lots of 'true' comments he could have made. He could, for example, have pointed out that he, Bill Clinton, won it twice with massive AA support.

Jesse might choose to give him a pass, but that doesn't mean I have to. He was clearly implying that the only reason Obama won was because he is black. He was dismissing Obama's victory as a racial thing. It was a racist statement.

by Mystylplx on Thu Feb 07, 2008 at 03:50:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

and that is
1. None of your business

2. Sexist

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:13:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Politicians marriages have always been fair game. Why should Hillary's get a pass when Prince Rudy's divorces be an issue but Bill Clinton's philandering not be?

And I know you think everything that doesn't heap praises on Hillary Clinton is "sexist," but if anything it's the opposite. I said above that if the genders were reversed it would be a MUCH bigger issue. A man running for office with a wife who repeatedly cheats on him would have a much more difficult time of it. Much more difficult.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:19:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Wow - that's a very Repug family value point of view!

Personally, if either my husband or me cheated, I would hope it would not be an automatic dump - but rather a time to look into our marriage and try to work it out.

IMHO!

by Shazone on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:46:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Mysogyny and sexism have been at play throughout the entire campaign -- both by Obama and the media.

When the media is blind and biased it's a very dangerous condition. The disease spreads like wildfire.

by seattlegonz on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:06:24 PM EST

It's not because her husband cheated on her... (1.00 / 1)

...it's because she played the role of the poor little wifey and "stood by her man" as he cheated on her and continued to cheat on her again and again. Most women I know are stronger than that. Most women wouldn't stand for it.

by Mystylplx on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:06:31 PM EST

Re: It's not because her husband cheated on her... (none / 0)

So now she is weak!? You were not in her situation, you were not in her shoes, you do not know what happened behind closed doors, you do not know how she came to the decision to stay with Bill. And to assume that she is weak for working out her marriage is ridiculous.
I thought the women's movement was so women could have a CHOICE. and she chose to stay with Bill, and that choice should be respected. Attacking a woman for leaving her man as they may have done in the past is as bad as attacking one for standing by her man!

by musicpvm on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:10:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It's not because her husband cheated on her... (none / 0)

How do you know so much about Clintons' marriage problems? Who told you these stories? Did Hillary call you to tell you her problem with Bill's continuous cheating??

I rememer that these stories were told by ROVIANS for God's sake! Dems fought so hard against Rovian smear attacks and now we are witnessing Obamacans are quoting Rove in every single chance. Very sickening.

by praxis1 on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:11:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It's not because her husband cheated on her... (none / 0)

My mom said to me that sometimes self-sacrifice is need to keep the family together, and that I can't use my judgement on her decision, I don't have a place in their bedroom.

by JoeySky18 on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:34:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It's not because her husband cheated on her... (none / 0)

Dumb! It takes real strength to live through what she did in the public eye and still end up with her marriage.

I think she did GREAT!

by Shazone on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:48:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: It's not because her husband cheated on her... (none / 0)

there is nothing weak about keeping your marriage together.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:08:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Why did the MSM pretty much ignore this? Instead they concentrated on Bill's supposed "racism" for a month. No coverage on the crap coming out of Michelle's mouth.
The disrespect the Obamas have shown the Clintons sickens me.

by musicpvm on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:07:55 PM EST

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

it was covered, but died out fast. michelle put out a statement saying she was only referring to herself, not hillary.

if you believe that you'll believe robert johnson when he says he was talking about obama's community service work ;-)

by campskunk on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:13:19 PM EST

Really stupid commentary... (none / 0)

by Mrs. Obama--and divisive...no wonder Barack's had her gagged for most of his campaign.

Clintonism is the kind of Government I could get used to...

by Mariel on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:15:18 PM EST

Double Standard (2.00 / 1)

Bill is fair game, but Michelle says something sexist like this, and gets off???!! Outrage just isn't strong enough of a word to describe the rape of the Clintons by the MSM.

by izarradar on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:19:10 PM EST

rape? (none / 0)

cmparing the relatively soft treatment of the clintons by the media with forcible sexual assault? talk about idiotic.

by highgrade on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:30:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: rape? (none / 0)

Offend the Media - Vote for Hillary!

by Seymour Glass on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:41:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I found these remarks by Michelle Obama very offensive when she made them - it kind of reminded me of Barbara Bush's "it rhymes with witch" comment - totally rude and inappropriate for a possible future first lady. Why are women their (our) own worst enemy? Call Hillary on the issues, or her votes, whatever, but some things are out of bounds.
The funny part is - if Obama does win the election (and I don't believe he could win the general against McCain), all the Hillary haters from 1992-3 will quickly become Michelle haters. I don't think the Obama's would hold up as well against the republican smear machine as the Clinton's did. Just my opinion.

by AnnC on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:23:42 PM EST

Today? (none / 0)

I'm seeing posts which indicate it's months old. Please confirm or correct the diary.

by Drummond on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:28:16 PM EST

Re: Today? (none / 0)

Whether you are right or not, I see nothing in this diary that needs to be corrected.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:33:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Today? (none / 0)

See my comment below concerning the diarists' characterization of Michelles appearance on GMA. I think it is misleading.

by DPW on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:39:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Today? (none / 0)

It can be clarified. I came away with the impression in my first read. Yes, it can be read both ways. In the interest of clarity, the diarist should ensure that it's only read one way.

by Drummond on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:55:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Today? (none / 0)

The "today" reference seems to be related to Michelle Obama saying this morning that she's not willing to say she would support Clinton if Clinton wins the nomination.

Then the diarist went looking for the video and found this one. I don't know if she felt this was from today, but I didn't read it that way.

by Shazone on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:51:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Today? (none / 0)

thank you and no, I knew this comment was not from today. I think that was clear in the diary.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:13:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Today? (none / 0)

No, it really isn't.

by Drummond on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 12:43:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Today? (none / 0)

Please reread, I said she said today that she is not sure she would support Hillary and that while I was looking for that video I found this other video too.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:12:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Today? (none / 0)

It would be much clearer if you indicated the time of the second video.

by Drummond on Tue Feb 05, 2008 at 12:44:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Reality check (2.00 / 1)

since when it's the wife's fault when husband cheated.

by JoeySky18 on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:35:18 PM EST

Re: Reality check (2.00 / 1)

Since it happened to Hillary Clinton.

by LakersFan on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:35:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reality check (none / 0)

that is classic sexism, it always has been the fault of the wife in more conservative families. Michelle is clearly not very liberal or liberated either.

ABO... Anybody but Obama. I LIKE the democratic party.

by MollieBradford on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:15:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I think you've misrepresented what Michelle said on GMA. Here's the video:

http://polijamblog.com/?p=262

The relevant portion begins around 3:10. Essentially, the question posed to Michelle asks whether she could see herself "working to support Hillary Clinton should she get the nomination?" The question quite obviously seems to be asking whether Michelle will actively campaign for Clinton--not, as your wording suggests, whether she will vote for Clinton. Michelle responds that she will have to think about it--that it will depend upon a number of variables--which seems like a decent enough response.

by DPW on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:37:52 PM EST

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 0)

That's not a decent response at all. I consider it positively sickening.

If you really want the entire machinery of the Democratic Party to mobilize for YOU if you get to be the nominee, then you don't get to play the game of "oh, gee, I don't know if I could be bothered to work for a different candidate."

It's one thing if you or I didn't feel like working for a particular nominee, but for a candidate or a candidate's spouse to take this position is unacceptable.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:47:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (1.00 / 0)

Sickening? Give me a break. I don't think there is any significant tradition of spouses of primary losers campaigning for the victor. Does anyone really expect Romney's wife to campaign for McCain? Would Theresa Heinz Kerry have campaigned for Dean or Edwards? Of course not. It's a silly expectation, and Michelle's reluctance to respond with an unequivocal "yes" is being oversold as some kind of betrayal.

Listen, I don't like the "if you can't run you family" remark at all--especially in the context of the video featured in this diary. But, the response by Michelle about campaigning seems perfectly fine, considering the fact she will be fucking sick of campaigning and a bit spiritually damaged after a defeat. Moreover, Michelle isn't really an important component to the party machine. She's a candidate spouse, whose view is worth little in a campaign where her husband isn't the candidate.

by DPW on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:01:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (2.00 / 1)

It's a disgusting thing to SAY. She didn't say "gee, I have kids at home, I'm not sure how much time I'll have to campaign." She said she might not support Hillary because of the "tone" of her campaign. That sends exactly the wrong message to partisan Democrats whose attitude is "hey, I'll respect the outcome if the other guy wins, but I expect the same in return."

Why would she say "it depends on her policies, her approach, her tone," if what she meant was that "spouses of primary losers never campaign for the victor"? I don't enjoy playing this "What Obama Really Meant" game. Her words speak for themselves, and what they say is not "oh, primary spouses never campaign for the victor."

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:46:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Disgusting? Your choice of words is ridiculous.

Anyway, you ask:

Why would she say "it depends on her policies, her approach, her tone" . . .

Well, first of all, that should factor into anyone's decision to associate themselves closely with a campaign (as well as their decision to make personal sacrifices in supoort of the same). I don't particularly care about sending messages to partisan democrats, as you may have noticed by now. I like a little independent spirit, and I don't worry myself over little details like this. Furthermore, it's no secret that each campaign has expressed dissapointment over their opponent's tone, approach, and policies. You didn't seem to suffer from feelings of disgust when Bill compared Obama to a talk-show host on Charlie Rose, in addition to numerous other comments that questioned Obama's qualifications and readiness for the job; or, when Bill implied that Obama's support was limited to black voters; or the Clinton campaign's consistent efforts to paint Obama as a naive, irresponsible, coke-blowing, empty suit who gives great speeches. This is a campaign, and it would be foolish to expect one campaign to constantly speak favorably of its opponent. Some of it pisses me off, but I've yet to be "disgusted" or "sickened."

by DPW on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:21:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Um, no, I have no problem when the Clinton campaign questions Obama's experience. I would have a huge problem if they implied they weren't going to support him if he were the nominee, though.

"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman

by Steve M on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:28:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

Well, I don't think Michelle implied that she wouldn't support Hillary. Her remarks concerned actively campaigning, and even then she just demonstrated some uncertainty regarding her interest in playing an active role.

In contrast, it was your man Edwards who actually seemed reluctant in the past to say that he would support (if only verbally) Clinton should she be the eventual nominee.

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/ 11/12/a-not-so-perfect-picture-of-party- unity/

He eventually came around and said he would. And, to be clear, I'm not accusing you of having inconsistent reactions; I've no idea how you responded to Edwards' behavior back when this make news. However, I do want to highlight that competitors often withhold enthusiasm when asked about the prospect of defeat. Moreoever, Edwards' reluctance is far more significant than Michelle's because he is an actual democratic politician and candidate. As such, Edwards is a far more instrumental spokesperson than Michelle, whose role as a surrogate has been limited to Obama's personal characteristics and integrity. Michelle isn't considered a spokesperson for the party's policies, platform, or political philosophy.

by DPW on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 04:50:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

If Bill was asked that question and said "I'll have to think about it" there would be massive outrage from the media and Obama's supporters. But the Clintons would never say such a thing in the first place.

Let's not forget it was Barack who said "I am confident I will get her votes if I'm the nominee. It's not clear she would get the votes I got if she were the nominee."

by musicpvm on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:48:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

What would happen if Hillary said the same thing about Obama? What if she says "well, I will vote for him but I am not sure I will actively work for him." Would you be happy? Would you call it as a fair game? What about Bill? What if he says the same thing Michelle just said? Well. I can tell you that the MSM will be all over Clintons.

by praxis1 on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 02:49:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Michelle Obama's mysogyinst remarks (none / 0)

I really wouldn't care. Furthermore, Michelle is a completely different kind of figure than Hillary or Bill. Did you really expect Michelle to be a valuable surrogate in the event of a Clinton nomination? Of course not. She's a candidate's spouse and little more.

by DPW on Mon Feb 04, 2008 at 03:03:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: idiotic dismissal of Michelle Obama (