MyDD :: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers

Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.

Did you see the ad ?

maybe you should watch it.

The 527 is probably to help her out , moneywise . not negative stuff.

She is being incredibly outspent almost 4 -1 .

by lori on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 01:58:01 PM EST
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by DPW on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:04:19 PM EST
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The ads are reportedly going to be pretty negative, basically portraying Obama as all talk, no action.

Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.

Well , you are better off seeing it first.

I don't take stock in news media accounts of things regarding the clinton campaign too much.

The ad already has a reference to Obama in there that was too subtle to be noticed by the lay man.

If thats the road they are taking i won't call that negative , brutal etc , whatever choice words there is.

by lori on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:10:51 PM EST
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by DPW on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:15:31 PM EST
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Okay, I just watched it, and it's certainly not very negative. In fact, I'm not the least bit offended by it.

I was just going off of what I'd read at First Read. Also, after the Buffenberger rant last night, I was expecting the worst.

Re: The first video is (none / 0)

Swiftboating with a rubber knife.

My intuition? She is almost totally out of money and this is a work around to avoid going dark on TV. An abuse of the 527 system, but the video I saw won't cost Obama votes or win Clinton voters, either.

No vetting is complete until we've seen the tax returns.

by Bill White on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:53:14 PM EST
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Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.

Obama hit Clinton really hard on Nafta in Wisconsin with mailers , i didn't see any reactions.

He is the same in Ohio and his allies in labor are helping out.

How come we never hear about how Obama is going negative.

by lori on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:14:10 PM EST
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http://blogs.usatoday.com/oped/2008/02/o pposing-view-3.html

Obama accepting public financing?

Hillary/Obama08

by annefrank on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:16:07 PM EST
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"Dogwhistle" McCain-Feingold (none / 0)

Public financing with conditions.

Obama needs to negotiate and negotiate and negotiate but never seem to reach agreement on those conditions.

The freepers HATE McCain-Feingold and the more eager McCain is to negotiate (desperate for cash) the weaker he will appear. And the more freaked out Michelle Malkin and Hugh Hewitt will become.

Now suppose McCain AGREES to co-sponsor a tough new expansion of McCain-Feingold in the Senate (cracking down on 527s for example) and promises to sign it if elected maybe Obama should agree to consider public financing.

But then again, teasing McCain but never reaching agreement would be so much more fun.

No vetting is complete until we've seen the tax returns.

by Bill White on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:39:08 PM EST
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by DPW on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:18:15 PM EST
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I wasn't calling foul necessarily, I was just passing along what I had heard in the press.

But, since you ask, I don't particularly like negative campaigning, although some contrast has to be drawn. On trade, I suspect that Obama and Clinton are pretty close to agreement, so those mailers were probably a little less than fair. Clinton's TV ads, likewise, unfairly portrayed Obama's social security position. Both sides have been unfair, and I'm happy to admit that.

Re: Running 527s (2.00 / 2)

If she wants to include the 90s and her time as co-Pres with Bill amongst her "35 years" -- then she has to answer for NAFTA.

It's that simple.

Bill Clinton pushed NAFTA through congress. It's one of the fundamental reasons unions aren't backing her.

My dad is in NO WAY a political activist, but he traveled from our home (near South Bend) to Indianapolis for a big rally against NAFTA with his union (plumbers and pipefitters 172 -- not even a union hard hit by NAFTA, by the wway).

Against union and democratic opposition, Bill rammed NAFTA through congress with help from the GOP.

HIllary Clinton needs to answer for that.

She can't have it both ways.

Either she gets credit for Bill's reign in the 90s -- or she doesn't get blame for the bad of the 90s.

It's not that complicated.

by zonk on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:19:03 PM EST
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illegal? (none / 0)

Isn't that illegal? Or is it 'OK If Your Hillary'?

by JoeCoaster on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:15:22 PM EST
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by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:22:08 PM EST
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So what? She shouldn't be entitled to being bailed out by super-rich supporters when she runs out of campaign cash.

Obama has out-raised her massively. That's not some advantage that he has, that she deserves to have a special group to counter it. It's a failure on her part to motivate people to give money.

Tony Romo for Secretary of Awesome

527s aren't all bad. And it is not a dirty word. Just because the swift boat was a 527 does not mean that all 527s are swift boats.

If someone wants to run adds on her behalf they have the right to.

by kasjogren on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:56:02 PM EST
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by zonk on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 05:53:06 PM EST
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Sure.

But let's have no illusions about why we're seeing this 527... because a lot a of fat cat, maxed out Clinton donors can no longer donate directly to her campaign.

That One is the Right One for 2008.

It's illegal to use a 527 as an end-run around campaign financing laws. Donors contribute well in excess of the $2300 limit, sometimes in the hundreds of thousands of dollars.

527's are legal when used to advocate an issue, not a candidate.

by GFORD on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 06:37:46 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

she has until March 4th .

If she doesn't win Ohio and Texas , its light off.

I am getting to my last nerve on this primary season.

Now the general is a different ball game entirely .

Mccain is going to be a formidable opponent and contrary to what the polls show now , in terms of Obama , it would probably be different come November.

Mccain would be incredibly appealing to a lot of democrats .

Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.

by lori on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 01:53:58 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Why?

by telephasic on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:16:08 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

What Democrat in their right mind wants McCain at the helm to continue the GWB agenda, appoint new cronies to the SCOTUS and leave us in Iraq for another century?

by PD1769 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:38:02 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (2.00 / 1)

the power to "force" their members to vote a certain way, no. and they shouldn't have that power.

the power to assist in the ground game that Obama has already demonstrated he's got a good mastery of? or the power to increase fundraising, phonebanking, and other campaign efforts? hells yes they do.

there is also the effect of eliminating the image that Clinton was the sole recipient of blue collar, working class support. it's incredibly clear from the Potomac Primaries and Wisconsin that that's simply not the case.

by fightinfilipino on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:04:17 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (1.00 / 1)

Yeah. In fact, if it weren't for the dues coming out of people's checks, they wouldn't know they were in a union.

by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:04:36 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (2.00 / 1)

I hope that's meant sardonically. My father was arrested fighting for unions in the late 40s, after he came home from serving 3-1/2 years in the military throughout Europe and Africa. I hope, as a Democrat and a working class American, that you really are not that dismissive of them.

by mady on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:10:03 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (2.00 / 1)

They would probably realize they WEREN'T in one pretty quickly if their unions disbanded and their health insurance, pension, higher wages, job security and safe working environments disappeared. There are a lot of things people take for granted that are a direct result of unionization.

John McCain, like George Bush, doesn't care about sick children

by Ms Bluezone on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:16:10 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (2.00 / 2)

That's a fairly despicable GOP talking point.

As the son of a union teacher and union pipefitter - who was able to go to college because his union parents made 30% more in salary than their non-union counterparts, whose family had healthcare ONLY because of union bargaining...

I say screw you.

by zonk on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:22:03 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Screw me? Dinner first.

by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:27:41 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Whatever.

I am a supervisor that works for the federal gov't. I STILL allow my union dues to come out of my check, even though I can't be a member anymore.
I used to be a high school teacher, and was a member of the local union there as well. My fathers first pay raise from .35 cents a hour to a dollar was through a union.
Don't you DARE dismiss who Unions are and what they do.
You don't like Obama, fine. You don't like that the unions endorsed him, hey, that's ok as well.
You want to trash a core constituency of the Democratic party, then we have a problem.

Fake democrat!

by xodus1914 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:14:07 PM EST
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Ridiculous (2.00 / 2)

C'mon. When I was in the Sheet metal 109 in Houston, my union not only paid for some training (got me a 5.00 an hour raise, big money when you are a college kid) they went to bat for me when I got an injured toe on the jobsite.

Still time to get on the bus.

by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:23:37 PM EST
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by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:27:25 PM EST
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Um, no.

Re: Ridiculous (2.00 / 1)

You'll come around. Once the angst has worn off.

In the meantime, quit it with spouting off about shit you obviously know nothing about.

by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:29:26 PM EST
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by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:32:51 PM EST
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That's the second time you've used that kind of impolite language with me.

Keep it up, and I may have to send a bar of soap to your dorm room.

by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:35:40 PM EST
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'bout twenty years to old to receive that, but thanks for thinking of me!

Your entire persona here is impolite. You just use different words. You managed to insult a huge part of the Democratic base, with absolutely nothing to back it up; that's polite, to you?

by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:40:41 PM EST
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The only one I've offended is you.

If you're such a huge part of the Democratic base, how big are you?

by Cycloptichorn on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:43:16 PM EST
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Seems that I'm not the only person here who responded to your comment. Might want to take another look.

Really, though, I'm not looking to trade barbs today. I'll be here when you come around, with a hand outstretched, to get you on board.

by EMTP democrat on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:01:43 PM EST
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I would have left this alone, but no, he's not alone.

I'm a paramedic for a union shop and proud to be a Teamster.

There's lots of things we can and should explain to each other as democrats, but unions and what they have done for the working class in this county is not one of them.

First it was blacks, then caucus-goers, then liberals, then small states, then red states, then independant voters. Now, for fuck's sake, you're dissing the labor movement. The labor movement. Pull up! Pull up!

Hear , Hear!
I am getting sick and tired of that small minority of Hillary supporters that want to lay waste to the Democratic party if Hill doesn't win.

The Unions are one of the original and most solid sources of support of the Democratic Party!

by xodus1914 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:17:41 PM EST
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by bluedavid on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 04:58:56 PM EST
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i'm a freelance musician in new york and wish to god that my main gig was union. unfortunatley, i know that if we try and unionize they will fire all of us. they've already done it with the waitstaff.

i can't wait for democrats to get in power so that we don't have to be afraid at our job anymore.

by bluedavid on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 05:00:28 PM EST
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oh and SHUT THE FUCK UP with your union-bashing. you have no morals and would stick up for the KKK if they endorsed hillary.

I'm tired of your bullshit. don't you get dizzy from all your spinning??

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Well, let me put it this way--people only really think about their unions when it's time for a new bargaining agreement and when they look at their dues coming out.

by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:27:02 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

I've been in a union. I find that people are increasingly cynical about their union defending them personally in labor disputes, etc.

by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:30:39 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

They may be increasingly cynical but try working life today without a history of unions setting some standards for workplace compensation and health.

I can't even imagine the purpose of trashing unions, from a Democrat no less. Why do you need to do this? We are not having a conversation about there being room for improvement, we are talking about the existence of one of the few potent forces that support workers here.

by mady on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:38:17 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Most workers aren't even represented by unions, first.

Secondly, we are not talking about unions in the context of supporting workers; we are talking about unions in the context of supporting Obama.

And I objected to that argument!

by Zeitgeist9000 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:42:58 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

I did not say most workers were, just that without the existence of unions the bar would be set even lower than it currently is (and it is low) for workers' rights.

Arguing against whom a union should support should not entail arguing against the union, that was my point. It's an easy thing to fall into, not counting people and organizations who do not support a candidate you do, but that always ends up with a self-defeating stand.

I support Obama but will not go to Daily Kos for that reason; it's an all Obama universe and I can't deal with it. I like hearing both sides, keeps me grounded.

by mady on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:49:33 PM EST
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Step Aside Clinton (2.00 / 1)

Penn simply wants to slash and burn. He is trying to take Obama down because Obama's team schooled Penn and made him suffer the embarrassment of marshalling the worst run campaign ever.
After this, his career is over except for being the occasional Fox News contributor. He is interviewing for the job by trying to take Obama down with him

Progressives need to fight this. The progressive movement must unifiy and create an outcry for Clinton to step aside and let inevitability take its course to stop Penn from destroying our chances in 2008.

by gil on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:06:40 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Your right. All it does is gives you a few more yard signs and volunteers to make calls. I would be willing to bet that a sizable share of the Teamsters & Boilermakers will vote for McCain, since these unions are dominated by white men.

by Safe at Home on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:12:00 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Well, hell. Hilary and Barack should just drop out then. I mean, neither of the Dems are white men.....

by xodus1914 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:22:15 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

As someone from the movement, these aren't exactly the shining lights of the labor movement. The IBT is ponderous, decentralized, and corrupt in many places, and the Boilermakers are moribund and widely viewed as one of the more "mob tied" unions.

Now, if Obama won the UAW, or the Steelworkers, or CWA, that would be an excellent "get."

Still, it's a good story of the minute on the news cycle.

by telephasic on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:20:45 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Glad to see that Boilermaker endorsement. I'm sure thousands of Purdue alumni will vote for Obama in November.

Huh? Oh, THOSE Boilermakers...

by KTinOhio on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:24:57 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

That was the first laugh out loud comment I have seen on here in a while

Tony Romo for Secretary of Awesome

by kasjogren on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:01:02 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

527s, huh? That's where Clinton wants to go?

And just because this ad isn't bad, you don't think the rest of the $10 million is going to be nice.

See, to knock down an opponant, you have to go negative. But you also need to sell yourself positively. The 527, answerable to NO ONE, can be all kinds of nasty, and Hilly can take the "high road."

But as we saw in 04, nothing good comes from that.

So, "bring it on," as it were. This will only destroy the Clinton legacy more. And I LIKE the Clinton legacy. But there are lines that shouldn't be crossed. The Clinton's always liked hanging out in those lines, and usually it's a good thing to fight fire with fire.

But if Hillary can't get her argument out without off-the-books help, then forget her. She deserves political wilderness if she doesn't step in and say "we won't go there."

Fight the Smears!

by Lettuce on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:31:52 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (1.50 / 2)

Obama needs to show more respect to unions. Hillary is speaking to them all the time, and he has mostly IGNORED them. They are an important part of the liberal coalition and he doesn't understand that.

by oyo on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:35:55 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

This simply isn't true. At nearly every speech Obama has the local unions attend and personally thanks them for coming in his speech. The reason he doesn't have to go speak to the unions by themselves is because, unlike Hillary, Obama's message doesn't change depending on who he is talking to.

by matchles on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:42:40 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

That's why the 1.9 million strong SEIU came out for Obama. Because he ignored him. They like a candidate who plays hard to get.

by EMTP democrat on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:06:00 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

I have some lovely pictures from an SEIU event in Chicago back a year or more ago where the honored Obama for fighting for them and where he advocated for nurses who were getting the shaft. I know some union members who would disagree with you.

by illlaw1 on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:21:32 PM EST
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Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Can you get me a link to a quote from Hillary making this same point?

I'd be very grateful.

No vetting is complete until we've seen the tax returns.

by Bill White on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:40:32 PM EST

Re: Obama Endorsed by Teamsters, Boilermakers (none / 0)

Whoa. There is a boilermakers union? How freakin' old school sounding is that?

Tony Romo for Secretary of Awesome

by kasjogren on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 02:53:31 PM EST

How can this be? (none / 0)

Isn't Obama anti-union? I remember a bunch of Clinton backers telling me so in their diaries!

Stupid union execs!!!

by Bob Johnson on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:10:42 PM EST

Re: How can this be? (none / 0)

After looking at your name ...LOL!