A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore

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To maximize my coverage of the Chesapeake area primary, I decided to leave the Obama event early (after the roundtable, before the townhall) to try to see if I could catch the tail end of a Bill Clinton event at the Battle Grove Democratic Club in Baltimore. Unfortunately, I just missed the big dog, I arrived just as his motorcade was pulling away, but I stuck around to try to get a sense of what I'd missed.

The area surrounding the Dem club appeared to be a somewhat rundown working class suburb of Baltimore, not abandoned or anything but not thriving either; almost forgotten. The building was relatively small, low ceilings, weathered wooden floors, definitely lived in and probably not renovated in a while. Apparently the place lost power a couple times when Bill was speaking.  

Here's The Examiner's report of the event.

Clinton joined Maryland Gov. Martin O'Malley at the crowded Battle Grove Democratic Club in Dundalk, a Baltimore suburb, Sunday afternoon where the former president fought through a power failure that briefly cut out the lights and microphone.

Clinton said his wife would repair the nation's image abroad by embracing diplomacy instead of military force.

"From now on, we're going to have diplomacy with friend and foe alike whenever we can, and military force will be used only as an absolute last resort, not the other way around," he said.

I spoke to a couple of people outside the venue after it let out. Apparently the place was packed with 700 or so people, mostly white, many elderly folks, some families. I have to say, I was really quite struck with how homogeneous the crowd both leaving the venue and left still inside really was.

In addition to Governor O'Malley, Bill was joined by Sen. Barbara Mikulski and Kathleen Kennedy Townsend, which really impressed one woman I spoke to. "I got an e-mail that Bill would be here and I'd go anywhere to see him speak, but I had no idea the others would be there, it was quite a thrill." She continued, "This is just a small working class neighborhood. People have been hit by tough times, Hillary's message really hits home." She is a strong Hillary supporter. "It's her time," she said. "I love Obama, when he speaks, I tear up, he's very inspiring. But we need more than 'Wow' to clean up the mess that Bush left." She repeated that she really felt that Obama would have his chance, perhaps in 8 years after serving as VP, but this was Clintoin's shot and "she deserves it."



Display:


Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

"she deserves it."

Why?


by illlaw1 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:20:17 AM EST

because her last name is Clinton (2.00 / 1)


by highgrade on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:26:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: because her last name is Clinton (none / 0)

Now isn't that just the problem, named after Clinton, America's first Black president. So it is interesting that Bill Clinton's speaking venue was in the largely white Dundalk part of Baltimore.

Since Baltimore has a large Black population, Dundalk, a mainly white working class sector, was an interesting choice, again for America's former first Black president.

Don't believe it. Race is still an issue in this election, but has temporarily hid its ugly head. But one must ask here: is it the Hillary (and Bill) strategy to pander to all of those white Reagan Democrats still living in the shadows, who would not care to see a real Black president in office? Bill attracted those people when he announced during the 1992 campaign, that he would "change welfare as we know it." Anyone know the code-words, the associations that the term "welfare" elicited in that era and before. Remember Reagan's reference to cleaning up all of those welfare queens in Chicago, who drove around in Cadillacs? Those were not "white" welfare queens he was talking about.


Click on Peace, Propaganda, & The Promised Land and learn the truth about the I/P conflict.
by shergald on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:34:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 1)

I think she deserves it. She's worked hard for important causes like health care most of her life, she's done an effective job in the Senate, she's fought the glass ceiling, and while she has calculated and planned for a long time, I do believe it's ultimately always been because she believes in these causes, not because she craves power.

The question isn't does Hillary deserve the presidency, the question is does the presidency deserve Hillary? And that, I believe, is a very different thing indeed.


The Wayward Episcopalian
by Transplanted Texan on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:27:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 0)

I also feel very strongly that she deserves it. She has worked hard quietly, without fanfare, mostly in the shadows of others, mastering the issues facing this country, observing years when mistakes were made, seeing how they could be corrected, and developing a pragmatic vision of how very much this country can be improved. There is almost no one who has had the experience of serving at the top both in the White House and in Congress and brings to the job the perseverance and in depth knowledge she does. She has weathered countless political storms and can function at her best through them all. Running for political office is a sacrifice for most of the people who choose to put themselves through it, there is great risk and many hurts and betrayals involved, and it requires a characterological equanimity and poise to survive it. Constant baseless accusations and demeaning attacks and outright lies are a great burden to bear for the chance to do public service. We cannot attract good people who are willing to go through all this crap, getting Swiftboated and held under minute scrutiny every moment, with pundits ready to tear you to pieces at the slightest  misstatement. When good people still want to show up for the job, we shouldn't waste them. I will feel it is a terrible waste for us to miss giving Hillary Clinton a chance to serve as President, if we pass her up in favor of someone who is a fine orator but has so little experience. She is so much better than her husband, frankly.


by 07rescue on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:00:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

Without fanfare?  Please....  Even if a Clinton didn't want the attention, they always are going to get it... They are always big news.


by lordmikethegreat on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:18:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

There are no turns. Many people have worked harder on important issues. By that measure they deserve it more.


by illlaw1 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 10:02:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

Deserves it for the corporate run medical care system she is proposing.

Does anyone know if she is receiving any campaign contributions from medical insurers, hospital corporations, the pharm industry, or even the AMA. Only in America: medicine is a business, and that means corporate run medical care, and that means Hillary, the candidate who criticizes Obama for proposing a single payer medical system.

God forbid. It's a Democrat idea.


Click on Peace, Propaganda, & The Promised Land and learn the truth about the I/P conflict.
by shergald on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:27:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

Lot's of other people have done hard or harder work for important causes. Do they deserve it as well?


by illlaw1 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 09:59:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

Yup. Like I say, the real question is, who does the presidency deserve, and who do we deserve? It's about the country, not the individual.

Apologies for the lagtime in responding.


The Wayward Episcopalian
by Transplanted Texan on Wed Feb 20, 2008 at 03:24:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 3)

To quote the great Toby Ziegler on getting your party's presidential nomination: There are no turns.


by Cobalt on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:40:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

She Deserves It (2.00 / 1)

I don't find "she deserves it" persuasive, but that particular voter did, and perhaps others do.

I guess I'd make a lousy royalist. I think candidates should earn the presidency. I don't award any bonus points for family connections or time waiting in the political queue. That's how you get nominees like Bob Dole, to pick a classic example.

I'm glad the Democratic Party has a deep and rich talent bench, and I'm glad it seems to be open to new people. Those are signs of a healthy, dynamic party. Whichever candidate wins, he or she will be stronger for it. If Clinton has to come up with a better reason for people to vote for her than "it's my time," that's terrific. If Obama has to do better to convince people he has specific goals and can accomplish them, that's good, too.


by BBCWatcher on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:12:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: She Deserves It (none / 0)

I find it persuasive, considering what as a woman she has put up with for so long.

Perhaps mostly women her age and older will understand what that means, since they know how hard she had to fight to be able to so many things that were closed to women in the beginning.


by splashy on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:42:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (2.00 / 1)

Turn it around "why does Obama deserve it?"


by rossinatl on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:40:02 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse (2.00 / 0)

Because he will usher in a new era of togetherness and unity. He will be the new Dalai Lama that will make love and peace prosper across the land. He will make meat eaters become vegans overnight, and he will cure cancer patients with the touch of his hand and sound of his soothing voice. That's why He deserves it.

ahem.


by need some wood on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:43:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (2.00 / 1)

Ha Ha.
As an Obama supporter, I feel this way: NOBODY DESERVES IT. YOU MUST EARN IT!
The brutal, simple fact of the matter is that for all of Hillary's vaunted 'experience', Bill's presence and   Obama's fault's, Hillary Clinton is in the fight of her life for the presidency against someone who has two years experience in the U.S. Senate.
Is it her weakness? Is it his message? The answer is a little of both.
Whoever the people vote for, whoever wins...
THAT'S WHO DESERVES IT!

A PROUD Hopium user!
by xodus1914 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:58:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (2.00 / 0)

By your calculation, George W. Bush thereby deserved the presidency, even earned by lies and machiavellian machinations. Whoever wins, eh?


by 07rescue on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:03:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (none / 0)

DOn't be a jerk. Bush stole both elections. It's an insult to Barack's campaign to make a comparison. He has played by the rules.


A PROUD Hopium user!
by xodus1914 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 10:23:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (2.00 / 1)

Obama would never say he deserves it.  And his supporters wouldn't say it as well.  We would say we deserve it, we deserve to take our Government back from the special interests, we deserve an open and transparent government, we deserve to know what earmarks our representatives are asking for, who they're carrying water for, and how they have amassed their fortunes.  


by Piuma on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:46:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (none / 0)

Excellent point. I have always felt that if Hillary was elected then we would see her administration populated by the diehard CLinton loyalists. Which is in itself, politics is usual and not necessarily evil.
However, you ever thought it would be nice if a guy got into office and the people selected seems like the best qualified and not buddies of the candidate?
Who would be Obama's VP? Secretary of Defense? etc?

A PROUD Hopium user!
by xodus1914 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:10:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

FDR (none / 0)

Did say WE have nothing to fear but fear itself.


by zonk on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 08:31:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (none / 0)

Oh boy.


by Mar154 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 09:57:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: how UnKennedyesque of him (none / 0)

How would MLK say "we" about his dream?


by illlaw1 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 10:01:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

He doesn't (none / 0)

He's EARNING it during this campaign.

That's the fundamental difference between the two campaigns.


by zonk on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 08:30:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse (none / 0)

No one deserves it. There are no kings or queens. There are no turns.


by illlaw1 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 10:00:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (1.00 / 3)

Wasn't Hillary ragging on Obama for saying he'd talk to our foes?

If you can't beat 'em, imitate 'em.

I bet she goes to her next campaign event in blackface.


by Cutwolf on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:45:27 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

It's the timing of the talk that's matter.  

Sen. Clinton said she won't talk to Iran until he stop barking like mad dog and agree with some concrete solution.  The position of US President holds a prestige value.  And she said "I don't think we should give them the honor to meet the president until there are some progresses in the negotiation team" (paraphrase).  This remark shows the depth of her foreign policy.   Of cause there will be a negotiation by the middle and top negotiation team.

This point again has been twisted in the media.  Obama said yes I'll talk with Iran.  Clinton said no I won't  (until they behave better.) - this last bit has been left out in MSM and people don't have a chance to consider the whole statement.   She has a good reason for it.  And It shows a stark different between Obama and Clinton sophisticated understanding in this area.  Foreign policy is not a yes/no issue.   That kind of mentality has got us into this mess.


by JoeySky18 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 08:10:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

The Experience Meme (none / 0)

With no modesty whatsoever, allow me to suggest a look at

http://www.bestoftheblogs.com/2008/02/11 the-experience-meme


by jlmccreery on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 01:51:58 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 1)

That hopemonger Obama, just goin' around giving touching speeches. He doesn't care about the working poor, or the elderly not like Hillary does.

Hillary's message hits home?  Which one would that be.  "I deserve to be elected president, because it's my personal life ambition"?  Hillary's message hasn't hit home with me, and I'm not going to vote for her out of pity either.  


by ikonoklast on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:08:37 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 1)

Y'all keep missing the point here - at some point or other one of the two of them will absorb enough of the other's message to matter.  Hillary will get more inspiring, or Obama will get more detailed and concrete.  And either way it happens will be the best thing for the country.

I'm a Hillary supporter mainly because I like watching real professionals work, and because of how hard-bitten she is.  Her team learns from its mistakes, although the lesson often comes too late to overcome some of their early decisions.  Waiting until this late in the game to hit up her base for money was one of those early decisions; not organizing well in the caucus states is another.

I like Obama for the things he would like to do, but I'm not sure he hasn't bit off way more than he can chew here.  I trust him when he says he wants a post-partisan politics, but I don't think he's being realistic at all.  I've watched him during debates, and I've gotten the feeling that he has more than once tried to "wing it" on some very serious questions.  I could see he knew he was winging it, too, from the look on his face, and wondered if anyone else could see it too.

I'm not one of those who worries that the world will end if my candidate isn't chosen; we have really good candidates on both sides.  Either one would be a game-changer, and either one would cream McCain/Huckabee in the general election (if for no other reason than that "movement conservatism" has been exhausted for a decade or more as a governing philosophy and there's really nothing for Republicans to point to as a way forward except more of the same).


by beerwulf on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 08:41:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

Somebody give this guy a tip!
If more Hillary supporters was like this, I wouldn't be so worried about Barack's voters staying home if Hillary wins the nomination..

Well said.  


A PROUD Hopium user!
by xodus1914 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 10:38:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 0)

Great post. Thanks.

Hillary is the one who can address and redress our nations economic problems.

She's also a visionary. She was talking about the need to bring high speed internet into the poorest and most rural communities before anyone else. And, of course, she was 15 years ahead of the game when it comes to universal health care.

I love that when she couldn't get  universal health care done in 93, she turned around and went after care for children, FMLA, veterans health, first responders. She goes for the gold, and if denied, she doesn't quit...she just keeps working to help us all.


by seattlegonz on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:09:38 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 1)

Great point, it's her hard work that has earned the respect of so many, including the countless staunch Republicans in upstate NY who never voted for a Democrat before voting for her. She will never give up trying to help people.


by 07rescue on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:08:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

It's nice when people note that Democrats have an abundance of riches to choose from this primary season.


by rfahey22 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:14:30 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

I think the phrase is "an embarrassment of riches".


by jim in austin on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:38:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

Yes.  It's a bit late and my brain isn't firing on all cylinders.


by rfahey22 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:21:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

Battle Grove Democratic Club
Dundalk, MD, Baltimore "suburb."
mostly steelworker, union families, hard hit with loss of Bethlehem Steel plant, pensions slashed, but sturdy people.
by CLK on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 02:49:09 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 1)

No one "deserves" the presidency. You have to earn it.


by s5 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:07:47 AM EST

Exception That Proves the Rule (none / 0)

Al Gore because, after all, he won.


by BBCWatcher on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:13:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

I gotta say I cringe when I hear, "It's her turn"  Ugh!  It was Bob Dole's "turn", too in 1996 and look at how that turned out.  

If you let someone win the nomination out of entitlement, you will most surely lose the general.  

Ironically, while hillary supporters are always saying, "It's her turn,"  I've never heard an obama supporter say, "It's an african american's turn".

Unfortunately, especially the older clinton supporters really hold on to the entitlement mentality, with the excuse that Obama hasn't "earned" it... I try to remind them about JFK's "experience", but for most of my family, "not earning it" is code for, "I'd rather not vote for a black person if I can help it."  Some of the new deal generation still aren't very good at the great society.

Thanks,

Mike


by lordmikethegreat on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 03:16:26 AM EST

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 0)

I haven't heard anyone say "it's her turn", but how would that be different from the Obama theme "it's our time"?

My main issue with Obama is the same issue I had with Hillary 4 years ago when people were dropping her name for president - not enough years in the senate. Although you can't compare Hillary or Obama's national experience to Biden or Dodd's, we are left to decide between the 2 - and I choose the one with more national experience. She is the only full term Senator (post-Edwards), and as much as people might discount her experience as First Lady, I think it does give her a diplomatic edge.  And I'm not sure what you mean by JFK's experience - he spent many years in congress before becoming president - I think about 14 years.


by AnnC on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 07:54:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (none / 0)

It's different because it's HIM. Duh.


by Mar154 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 09:58:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: A Glimpse From The Ground In Baltimore (2.00 / 0)

Jesus. Not EVERYTHING is about race. I'm brown. I like Hillary.  It has NOTHING to do with race. Only Obama supporters and David Axelrod make it into a race issue that it never was.


by Mar154 on Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 09:59:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]


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