Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or a Shade of Nuance?

Following up on my liveblog of today's MySpace/MTV candidate dialogue with John Edwards from the University of New Hampshire I just wanted to add a couple of thoughts on one of Edwards' answers, specifically on the issue of healthcare.

On this question, Edwards tried to draw distinctions with the other leading candidates, noting for instance that, at least in his opinion, the healthcare plan being put forward by Barack Obama was not fully universal. But more to the point of this particular post Edwards also attempted to show a difference with Hillary Clinton, whose plan he contends is based on his. In short (and I'm going off of memory rather than a transcript), Edwards said that whereas Clinton would allow insurance companies to come to the table, he did not believe that this was a wise strategy.

This apparently is not the first time that Edwards has tried to draq such a contrast with Clinton. A couple of weeks ago Ben Smith picked up on a similar meme, which he compared with earlier language from Edwards used during an interview with this site from back in February that seemed to strike a different tone.

And it does seem that Edwards' confrontational words on healthcare policy, which come with an explicit criticism of Clinton, are also rather newfound, intensifying at least after her defense of lobbyists at the YearlyKos convention last month.

"We fundamentally diagree about this and voters will have a choice," Edwards said last week about his and Clintons' views of the role of compromise. "My view is that if working with, compromising, sitting at the table with ins companies, drug companies, and their lobbyists would be successful, we'd have universal health care today. We don't have it. And the reason we don't have it is, it doesn't work. You have to take these people on. You ahve to be willing to fight."

But in an interview back in February with Jonathan Singer from MyDD, Edwards sounded a totally different note, expressing the hope that his plan would pass because "it's politically achievable because it makes some sense. I don't think it will alienate a lot of moderate Republicans. And I think a lot of Republicans... I had a debate with Newt Gingrich in California a few months ago and he's for universal healthcare. Not done the same way I'd do it, but he's for universal healthcare."

The interview continues:

Singer: ...also bringing in both corporations and labor and healthcare groups and doctors. Not getting into the specifics at all, but how do you see bringing in everyone so it's not just an us versus them, because us versus them didn't work in the past?

Edwards: I think you try to bring everybody to the table. You want their participation, you want to make the system work for everybody. I think there's a difference between a healthcare plan that builds on the existing system but deals with some of its deficiencies and problems as opposed to a complete new way of doing healthcare in America. The latter will engender huge opposition. And it will engender a lot of just plain political opposition. If on the other hand you're taking the system that exists, dealing with the problems with it, making sure everybody gets covered, it's just much more likely to be achievable.

It would seem, at least from Smith's account and my impressions of Edwards' answer today at UNH, that the candidate is moving his rhetoric on the issue of healthcare, if not his position, too. The Edwards campaign cautions against such a reading, stating that this is not a shift but rather a natural continuation of the plan. To this end, they suggest that with the insurance industry's near unfettered ability to lobby Congress without sufficient transparency and its large resevoir of money to donate to campaigns and run advertisements it would be difficult if not impossible to pass legislation mandating universal healthcare, that as a result there needs to be more openness (perhaps a mandate that members of Congress disclose all meetings with lobbyists on the day of the meetings), but that at the same time the insurance industry has the right to come to the table to make its case.

I still see a bit of a difference from February to now, but I'll leave it up to you to make your own judgement. Regardless, I think it is a wise strategic move for Edwards to distinguish how his plan or approach to healthcare are different from those of Clinton, whether they are rhetorical or substantive.

Note: My coverage of the MySpace/MTV presidential dialogue with John Edwards from the University of New Hampshire has been sponsored by MySpace.com.



Display:


Hillary can change her position too (none / 0)

she changed it on Torture
and it didn't seem to bother anyone
McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 05:16:42 PM EST

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

I think this issue is 100% rhetoric.  Of course no one is going to attempt a fundamental reform of the health care system without taking into account some sort of input from the business community, from the insurance industry.  It's all just signaling as far as how much importance you'd give to their views relative to what the other candidates would do, but it doesn't actually MEAN anything.


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 05:21:41 PM EST

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

Hillary said it best.  She is going to leave the details to Congress and will have meetings with Big Business, Unions, Healthcare Professionals, Hospital Administrators, Insurance Companies and Pharmaceutical Companies.  I would rather see a single payer bill, however it would be impossible to leave Insurance Companies out of the mix at this juncture.  Perhaps they won't hate her healthcare plan so much when the realize they can draw from a pool of 47 million more Americans.  


by changehorses08 on Fri Sep 28, 2007 at 12:22:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Old Edwards was right (2.00 / 1)

The old Edwards circa a couple months ago was right on the merits, the new Edwards is just posturing.


by Korha on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 05:30:38 PM EST

edwards (1.00 / 2)

This is just another episode of the strong of his latest flip flop.

According to politico:


Edwards to take matching funds for primary

CNN has the scoop, with a video interview.

Edwards is portraying it as a principled decision, denying it has anything to do with slow fundraising, and calling on his rivals to join him. And this can be a powerful part of his case about not being in the pocket of political donors.

But as with many of his stances: Will voters believe it's a matter of principle when it's adopted midway through an election campaign, and when convenience and principle seem to line up so neatly?

Edwards has taken a lot of criticism in the press today on a similar theme for drawing a sharp distinction between himself and Hillary on combat missions in Iraq, when he seemed to back combat missions in Iraq a couple of weeks ago. The press is likely, I'd guess, to harp on the fact that so many of his sharply-defined, and defining, positions, from support for universal health-care to opposition to the war, are new, adopted during the off-season or during the campaign.

And Edwards will have go find a way around the media filter for a message that voters will like.

This guy and his wife have ZERO principal and credibility.


Hillary: We will finally have a president who doesn't mind pulling over and asking for directions. Am I right, ladies?
by areyouready on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 05:52:10 PM EST

you are piece of work (none / 0)

the only one with no credibility is you.  If Edwards saved a puppy from being hit by a car, you'd complin he didn't have it spayed.


by DrFrankLives on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 06:51:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: (none / 0)

You are nit-picking. What he said last night he has said a hundred times.


by mrobinsong on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 07:15:12 PM EST

There Are Differences...Do the Voters Know? (none / 0)

Jonathan, your diary starts off with what I think is a correct observation: namely, John Edwards is trying to get the MSM to cover the differences between himself and the other candidates on universal health care. In general, Edwards has stepped up his efforts to get the MSM to cover the DIFFERENCES between the candidates on all the issues.

For what it is worth, the voters SHOULD be apprised of these differences before they vote. I would hope we can agree that the MSM has done an abysmal job of reporting the policy differences between the candidates. For example, over the last seven months, what percentage of the electorate do you suppose heard from the MSM that Edwards had a universal health care plan on the table, but Clinton did not? I am guessing that this fact was reported in less than 1% of the MSM stories over the last seven months.  

As I said in an earlier thread...now that all three candidates have proposed universal health care plans, the terms of the health care debate will necessarily shift to:

a) Whose plan is the best?  
b) Which of the three candidates has the best approach to ensuring that universal health care will actually be passed in 2009?  
c) Which of the three candidates is the least likely to compromise with their veto power and bully pulpit, such that the universal health care legislation that finally passes is what the people and principle demand, rather than what lobbyists and wiggle room allow?

The debate on the first question has yet to really be joined. But on the second and third question...

History will show that Edwards was the first top tier candidate for President of the United States to throw down the gauntlet, to really address, to tackle head on, questions "b" and "c."  

In a speech given on September 17, 2007, before the Laborers Leadership Convention in Chicago, Edwards explained to the nation his proposal for ensuring that universal health care will be passed in 2009:

on the first day of my administration, I will submit legislation that ends health care coverage for the president, all members of Congress, and all senior political appointees in both branches of government on July 20th, 2009 - unless we have passed universal health care reform.

I have noticed that partisans from other campaigns have criticized Edwards for being so bold as to offer an actual approach to ensuring passage in 2009. But the irony is that this single Edwards proposal is perhaps the greatest game changer in the whole universal health care debate.  

Yes, Congress would have to pass such legislation, and Edwards would then sign it, but think about Edwards' approach here. If Edwards becomes the nominee, it is virtually assured that every Democrat running for Congress will adopt Edwards' position.  Universal health care passage by July of 2009 would become the de facto position of the Democratic Party.

Still a naysayer?  For you naysayers...even if you assume that a handful of Democrats running for Congress would be shy about explicitly promising this when they run in 2008, if Edwards explicitly and repeatedly tells the voters that this is what he, and the country will do if he is elected, and he wins the election of 2008, it is highly unlikely that Congress will be able to resist his explicit mandate. If the American people want universal health care in 2009, they will get it.

Lastly, on the issue of compromising, and settling for "a watered-down, sausage universal health care", Edwards has again laid down the gauntlet in that same speech:

I will not compromise on universal health care - not on coverage, not on quality, not on cost. I'll fight for it with everything I've got.  ... There are four principles that have to be met: it must be truly universal. Anyone who has health care must be able to keep it, but they should pay less for it. Anyone who doesn't have health care must get it, with help if they can't afford it. Doctors and patients, not insurance companies and HMOs, must have control of health care decisions.

It's going to take some time, and probably some expensive polling by Clinton and Obama to fish out the voters, (to determine if the MSM has reached them about Edwards' positions), but I predict that both Obama and Clinton will again follow Edwards' lead, and substantially adopt John Edwards' positions on questions "b" and "c."

As for the notion that Edwards has changed his opinion regarding the grip that the insurance industry and the drug companies have over our elected officials, I do not see that at all. (Of course, when he was in the Senate, Edwards saw that death grip when he and Ted Kennedy sought to pass the Patients Bill of Rights. And the netroots certainly witnessed the drug companies essentially writing the new Medicare drug benefit, and Congress dutifully passing it.)

Your diary comes very close to confusing readers when it mixes up the players involved, mentions different sounding notes, then sub rosa, hints at a substantive change in Edwards' position. Look, passage of universal health care will involve at least the following players: the electorate, Democrats, Republicans, House, Senate, President, big business, small business, labor, patients, doctors, nurses, lawyers, researchers, hospitals, AND drum roll please...insurance companies and drug companies.

One can say that we need to work very closely with the first 15 players...to them, you can say "we need to bring everyone to the table." This is what I believe Edwards was saying in his colloquial response to your question in February which casually mentioned "both (sic) corporations and labor and healthcare groups and doctors."

But, had you asked Edwards in February specifically about insurance companies and drug companies, he would undoubtedly (and logically) have indicated that they would fight his universal health care plan with all the power they wield. In fact, conventional wisdom would suggest that these last two players stand a pretty good chance of killing universal health care in 2009...just as they did in 1992.

To better understand this, look into the details of the Edwards, Clinton and Obama plans. Notice those unprecedented restrictions on insurance companies? How are they going to pass all those restrictions on insurance companies?! How? How?! Good luck!

I am sure that Clinton and Obama do not want to talk about this.  Heck, I'll bet the MSM doesn't want to talk about the "how." But, the only way I can see passing all those restrictions on insurance companies is (hopefully) getting an explicit mandate from the electorate to make it happen.  You must ask for, and receive, a mandate from the electorate to explicitly take on the insurance and drug companies...otherwise...you will lose.

Once again, you have to credit Edwards with leading on this particular issue.  


by Demo37 on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 09:37:48 PM EST

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

It's like Biden said last night, Hillary Clinton's plan will face enormous opposition in the Congress mainly because she is the one proposing it. That makes her proposal a non-starter to begin with.


by Freaky Thirsty on Thu Sep 27, 2007 at 10:37:08 PM EST

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

Freaky -- so you think Republicans will go along with any healthcare plan no matter who its being presented by.  You are watching too much Fox noise.  The fact is that every Republican candidate has come out in favor of privatizing all healthcare.  300 Million Americans would have to find their own healthcare.  There would be no employer based healthcare -- currently 150 million Americans get their healthcare from work. This would be history.

The Republican party does not believe in anything that helps the middle class or the poor. Next time you want to attack Hillary for her plan ask yourself where is the soul of the Republican Party and why do they hate the average American?


by changehorses08 on Fri Sep 28, 2007 at 12:05:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

I don't need to ask myself anything about the Republican party. I know quite well that they are heartless selfish bastards. I have no love for them. Not even just a little. My "attack" on Hillary Clinton is stating the frickin obvious. And I only quoted what Biden said. I realize it is a truth Hillary Clinton supporters don't want to acknowledge but it is a truth nonetheless. I don't frickin watch Fox either, cept for the Simpsons and the like.


by Freaky Thirsty on Fri Sep 28, 2007 at 09:36:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

Sorry if I thought you were a Pub its just that we get some freepers in here.  I support Hillary because I want the Clinton years back.  I look around at my new development and all I see are for sale signs and foreclosures.  We are stuck in 2 endless wars--the Iraq war is costing 1 Billion a week.  How can we get healthcare or anything else when we are invisible to this President?  The Clinton years meant jobs and a balanced budget with Social Security secure until 2055.

You think people wouldn't vote for Hillary.  I don't think thats true.  In 1932 people were hurting as bad as they are now and they voted for a man in a wheelchair despite an all Republican Press.  He and the Democrats won in a landslide capturing Congress and the Presidency.  

Do you honestly think there is a Democrat that they won't try to destroy?  They labeled Max Cleland a coward and likened him to Sadam Hussein and this was a man who left 3 limbs in Nam.

The Republicans are going to put up Newt Gingrich now.  He is a good talker but if he becomes president what we are living through now will be the good old days.  I will continue to support Hillary because I believe that she cares about us and will do everything she can to change this country back to one which works for its people.


by changehorses08 on Fri Sep 28, 2007 at 12:02:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

I do not support Hillary Clinton because she voted for the Lieberman resolution. Period. It demonstrated to me where her real loyalties lie. And then she turned around and stated that she wouldn't have all of our troops out of Iraq by 2013. To me that isn't ending the war it is perpetuating it. And I will not support a Democrat that will not end this war.

You are free to vote for or support which ever candidate you choose. I can respect that. And you didn't attack me so I respect that as well. I remember the Clinton years fondly. Our country was prosperous and we weren't involved in a perpetual war. I can't say that I think electing Hillary Clinton will return things to the good old days. She has already stated that she will continue Bush's war and that she favors a military confrontation with Iran. Yes, I know she didn't come right out and say that but a YEA vote for the Lieberman resolution means exactly that. And her health care plan does absolutely nothing to help the people that cannot afford health care already. Nothing. Tax breaks a year out on imaginary income doesn't pay for health care. Her plan sounds good but it comes up short. And if in her opinion that is what it takes to pass her so-called universal health care plan then ta hell with it.

I know how bad the Republicans are. I know several. I can't stand them. But if there is anything I hate worse than a Republican it is a Democrat that doesn't do justice to the Democratic party. We are not a party of war. At least not  when we haven't been attacked. And Iraq did not attack us and Iran hasn't attacked us.

The thing that bothers me is that some of the folks here seem to think that it isn't democratic to criticize some candidate that we honestly think will be bad for our party. To me that is being a Democrat. One that actually has a spine.


by Freaky Thirsty on Fri Sep 28, 2007 at 08:46:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

I understand how you feel.  The Democrats took over Congress to end the war in Iraq and now the 3 top candidates talk about keeping our troops in Iraq for the next 5 years.  Its frustrating for me too.  What bothers me more is that Bush said last week he wants all the candidates both Democratic and Republican to be on the same page with him on Iraq--now why would he say that unless he is warning them if they talk about ending the war in Iraq he will declare Martial Law and not allow an election.  Obermann played their comments at the debate.  Edwards, Obama and Clinton all basically said the same thing about keeping the troops in Iraq.  As an about face it was too abrupt to be real.  

My friend we are condemned to live in interesting times.  We can only vote Democratic and hope for the best.  


by changehorses08 on Sat Sep 29, 2007 at 03:40:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

Thank you for the substantive reply. I don't think Bush would have the ability to declare marshal law but I do believe that something is fishy with the top three agreeing with Bush. It makes me very concerned for our democracy.


by Freaky Thirsty on Sat Sep 29, 2007 at 10:44:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards on Healthcare: A Shift in Strategy or (none / 0)

Freaky -- I too am concerned about our Democracy but I am hoping for the best.  God bless


by changehorses08 on Sat Sep 29, 2007 at 12:28:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Tailoring his message to the audience on health (none / 0)

care is the one constant in Edwards approach to health care.

I attended the California Democratic Convention, as a Richardson supporter.  On April 29, 2007, Edwards spoke of how his health care plan was likely to evolve into a single payer solution.  Another commentator wrote:

While Clinton and Obama both called for universal health care, said Edwards, "it's not enough to say you'll do it without creating a specific plan." He suggested requiring every employer to provide health care or else create a fund - and give Americans free choices on what health care system to get. "And [this may very well] end up being single-payer," he said. Edwards said his plan will cost $90-120 billion a year, "and I can pay for it by getting rid of George Bush's tax cut."

A Rolling Stone profile on Edwards in August contains:

Edwards is also careful to temper his progressivism with more centrist positions. Speaking to Rolling Stone, Edwards refused to rule out recommitting U.S. forces to Iraq to halt a genocide, and he even demonized single-payer health care: "Do you think the American people want the same people who responded to Hurricane Katrina to run their health-care system?" On The Tonight Show, Edwards also played it down the center, soft-pedaling global warming and trumpeting his anti-poverty credentials.


Bill Richardson: "Get out now. Get all our troops out now. It is the only right and responsible choice."
by Stephen Cassidy on Fri Sep 28, 2007 at 01:20:54 AM EST


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