Obama & Hillary -

Nothing is going to change unless we put an end to this damn war...

During the Iowa democratic presidential debate last Thursday; Hillary Clinton once again claimed to have the "experience" to lead, and lead on day one.

Well, we all know after you have won anything, you don't lead on day one. I don't know about you, but my experience tells me that on day one, we party, we're generous on day one. Some people call their long gone friends, ex girl friends just to say hello. When you move to an apartment, we settle on day one,we don't lead.

And unfortunately for Hillary, she will not lead on day 1, 2, 2, 4,......999999999999...99

Based on result, her leadership and experience aren't for squad! She is the author of this biggest foreign policy disaster in our generation, she failed back then to demonstrate the quality of judgment required to be president. Some would say that she was fooled by George Bush. Perhaps, but if George Bush can fool her that easily, is there more to expect from her when she meets with smart war leaders?

But George Bush was not the only person who fooled her. Bill Clinton fooled her many times, and the last I can remember was with Monica Lewinsky, the famous Whitehouse intern.

But Monica Lewinsky was not the only person. There is a new story about Bill Clinton fooling around with a Canadian politician /billionnaire Belinda Stronach. Most of this story was written during the time she [Belinda Stronach] was running for the leadership of Canada's Conservative Party.

After she lost the leadership race, she was elected an MP and became a member of the opposition cabinet. She basically did next to nothing there, and then jumped ship to the Liberals just in time to prevent the most corrupts government from falling. They made her a government Minister (just by coincidence, really) at the same time. Again she did nothing there and in a few months they fell anyway and she was expected to run for the Liberal leadership, but showed her first sign of intelligence by keeping out of it.

Now that brings me the life and times of Norman Hsu, the Hong-Kong native, now fugitive who fooled Hillary Clinton -
Matthew Mosk writes in the Washingtonpost.com, (http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-trail /2007/09/21/hsu_still_a_hillraiser_at_le as.html),that when it was first suggested, at the end of August, the Hsu had bundled checks from an odd collection of donors, Hillary Clinton campaign stood loyally behind the top donor. [Poor judgment]

The following day, when it became clear Hsu had spent 15 years fleeing a criminal past; the campaign distanced itself from Hsu, announcing it would give his direct donations to charity. And when Hsu's business ventures began to fall under suspicion, the campaign dumped Hsu and the $850,000 he bundled for them, telling news outlets they had been duped, just as had scores of other politicians.  

Now the Post reported that the Justice department has unsealed a criminal complaint against Hsu, detailing alleged campaign finance abuses and what they alleged to be a $60 million Ponzi scheme.

But one step the campaign has not taken is to remove Hsu from its official list of Hillraisers. As of this morning, his name still appeared there.

Before casting your vote, you should be asking yourself where her leadership is and judgment in all this is "saletés".

In contrast Obama has approached his campaign as an opportunity to build a movement -- a movement based in communities around issues that matter.

Obama is straightforward, and is clearly about a lot more than his own ego. Unlike John Edwards, Obama hasn't had to "move to the left" or discover that he was wrong about Iraq. Obama didn't discover unions and the rift between rich and poor after losing an election in 2004.

Unlike Hillary Clinton, Obama has been consistently solid on the key issues --by the way, do we really need a second Clinton presidency, framed by lots of hype, which delivers so little in the way of progressive legislation, and so much to Wall St?

Unlike Hillary, Obama speaks about his candidacy, and even his possible election as president, as part of the launching of a new movement to change America.

Ladies and Gentlemen, there are two ways that we can look at next year's election.

(1)We can look at it as an opportunity to stop the endless mudslide of domestic and foreign disasters that have darkened our horizons during the Bush years.

(2)We can look to elect a president who not only looks different, but who thinks and acts differently, a progressive champion who boldly reasserts government's role as protector and up-lifter of the people at home, and who can reinvent American foreign policy as a force for peace, not coercive power, across the globe.

We need a candidate, and a president, who understands that, cannot succeed unless the people are standing alongside him -- ahead of the powerbrokers and money guys -- ready to help enforce their collective will.

At some point, a true leader is a person who builds consensus.

* A real leader should say, "Hey, let's come together and have a plan around a common purpose.

  • A real leader gets surrounded by smart and intelligent people, including his wife, that want him to succeed.
  • A real leader carves out his position where everybody has some sense of belonging, acceptance and a sense of contribution, a sense of value. They do not have a sense of being demine.

There is no question that Barack Obama is such a candidate and such a leader.



Display:


Re: Obama & Hillary - (2.00 / 2)

Listen, I like Obama, if you want to help him write something of merit, don't spread rumours about Bill Clinton's alleged affairs.


by ArkansasLib on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 12:46:01 PM EST

"alleged ?" (none / 0)

I don't know whether the particular Canadian woman mentioned is one of his many affairs, but face the facts--the man is a serial philanderer. I personally don't care, especially because Hillary doesn't seem to either, but I also don't want to spend the next four years hearing about Bill's latest conquest every night on the news.


by Mystylplx on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 04:41:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (2.00 / 2)

There is a new story about Bill Clinton fooling around with a Canadian politician /billionnaire Belinda Stronach. Most of this story was written during the time she [Belinda Stronach] was running for the leadership of Canada's Conservative Party.

- You contradict yourself in the same sentence , you say its a new story and then you say most of this story was written when she was running .. Which one is it ?

You are not fooling anyone , it is not a new story  , unless you call 2005 new , but at least you make Tarheel look more appealing , he goes back 2 weeks to write his own crappy diaries , you go back to 2005 to peddle your own crap. If you knew that much about the woman and Canadaian politics you should know better that it was a taboloid rumor that was promoted by right wingers .
 This was the story you were talking about , you can read it and realize your own deception , although I know you already know it but in your quest to write a distasteful diary you probably ignored it .

http://telepixtvcgi.warnerbros.com/v2/ne ws/0405/21/3/text.html

Let me save you some time and give you the relevant bits :

So who is the mystery woman? And what's she really doing with the former president? Only "Extra" has the answers.

New York Daily News columnist Ben Widdicombe told us the woman, Belinda Stronach, is a billionaire member of Canada's Conservative Party, and she's very possibly a future candidate for prime minister of Canada.

Anytime Bill Clinton is seen with a beautiful blonde, there's going to be rumors," Widdicombe insisted. "But in this case, they really are just friends."

And there's more good news for Bill watchers too: his good behavior is carrying over to his diet. While Jack, Jerry and the rest of the party dined on steak at BLT Wednesday night, Bill feasted on a healthier meal of swordfish and white asparagus.

You would have a better diary and people would be more receptive to what you are saying , if you don't peddle these tabloid rumors like right wingers do . It is just a smear and responsible people don't do that.

 


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:04:36 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

"- You contradict yourself in the same sentence , you say its a new story and then you say most of this story was written when she was running .. Which one is it ?"

Actually it doesn't have to contradict itself.  I'll give you an example.  

I just found out something horrendous.  Lets say... Sensenbreanur (Spelling is off, but the Old Republican Congressman from Wisconsin) is involved in a sex scandal.  I get a lot of information on it, I write the story up, and I wait.  I wait for 2008 to come.  Bam.  Story hits the news in September 2008, when I wrote it in September 2007.  That is how it would be a new story written beforehand.  

Larry Flynt has about 30 congresspersons he is targetting.  That is the exact same thing.  They have the stories, they just haven't released them yet.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:12:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

It is a contradiction because the diariest says its a new story and in the same sentence says it was written when she was running for a certain positions in ( 2005).

- The diariest is either putting out misleading information intentionally or is not aware of the facts of what he/she is writing about .

This is not a new story , it was a tabloid rumor being spread around in 05 and the writer I suspect knows that , that is the reason for the contradiction because he/she has clearly read a lot about the story and the woman to know it is not a new story , hence the pivot from it is a new story to it was written when she was running ... ( in 05 ).

If you want to raise the tone of discussion on this site , it is not proper to justify this type of tabloid rumor being spread around like it has some validity to it . Its just like me saying I read one of our candidates say Obama had a rendevous with some other woman because they were seen having dinner in Kenya and I read it in a gossip magazine , hence it must be true.

Just type in the 2 names and see the tabloid crap you are going to get all in 05 , the discussion on this site will be better served not going down that path.


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:39:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

I quoted you, and responded to that quote, saying that you can have a new peice written beforehand.  Apparently it doesn't apply to this diary, but it applies to your statement that wasn't worded to make a tight fit on this diary.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:53:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Hum!

Is that the only thing you guys have retained from this diary?
I guess you are just like the person who wrote this diary.

why everytime someone comes here and pander a little truth about the Clintons, who guys jump on him/her like angry snake?

And you call this democracy?


by Lori Washington on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:12:27 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

why everytime someone comes here and pander a little truth about the Clintons .

- Where is the truth in the tabloid rumor ?

If he had avoided that sort of information in his diary , it would have been a perfectly legitimate diary , but you can't go around spreading these type of rumors you got from tabloids and right wing smear merchants , it doesn't help your case and totally undermines your diary .  


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:42:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (2.00 / 1)

Put aside the content of this stupid hit piece, Obama has no prayer in general election.

Poll after poll have indicated he's behind major GOP contenders in swing states such as OH and FL by doubt digit while both Clinton and Edwards are competitive.

To nominate this guy is just a kiss of death to the democratic party's chance.

Obama Is Unelectable.


Hillary: We will finally have a president who doesn't mind pulling over and asking for directions. Am I right, ladies?
by areyouready on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:26:12 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (2.00 / 1)

....no. Obama is electable. You are untruthful and you "polls" are getting old.


"I don't oppose all wars...what I do oppose, is a dumb war" ~ Barack Obama
by BlueDiamond on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:28:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

http://www.mydd.com/story/2007/9/21/1348 13/072

Read! This is not the first one, and certainly won't be the last poll showing Obama losing to top GOP contenders in OH by DOUBLE DIGIT.

I'm perplexed by all the 'map change' talk of Obama and his supporters. He is unelectable. To nominate this guy is for democrats to kiss the goodbye to the white house, period.


Hillary: We will finally have a president who doesn't mind pulling over and asking for directions. Am I right, ladies?
by areyouready on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:57:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (2.00 / 1)

Al Gore won some early polls too.  Look at the 8 years we've had as him president.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:19:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary (none / 0)

"Obama Is Unelectable."

The polls that say he has the best favorable/unfavorable ratios might have some disagreements with that.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:39:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary (none / 0)

This has got to be a joke, right?   Democrats and Democratic-leaning Independents typically give Clinton 80% + favorables and mid-teens unfavorables whereas Obama gets favorables in the mid-60s and unfavorables in the twenties, sometimes even low 30s.  You can't get elected to the nomination for your party with favorables/unfavorables that look like Obama's.  It is essentially impossible, especially since the frontrunner has a 20%+ NET advantage on him and there is another candidate running who also shows better favorables/unfavorables than Obama does at this point.


by georgep on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:06:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary (2.00 / 1)

I'm talking the whole enchilada.  You know, since winning the nomination isn't the only part of getting to the white house.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:20:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Oh???

Me thinks the next 6 months will show a big change in the polls. I do think that Hillary could be a good president, but not note worthy -- she would be a sheep in bush clothes.

Barack on the other hand is completely tuned into the need for change and how to do it. Something none of the other hopefuls have a clue about, at least not the way Barack is looking at it.

Polls this far out have never been a good indicator of the final out come.  Obama is developing a strong following.  Barack has common "horsesense" which will be  a winning asset next year.

Iran is also going to have an impact on the 2008 elections.  Three wars at the same time will kill any Republican hopes.  If Obama votes against a war with Iran and Hillary votes for it, she is toast.  I am trusting Obama to vote no -- we'll just have to sit back and see -- again!


by Rocky37 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 03:48:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

your polls


"I don't oppose all wars...what I do oppose, is a dumb war" ~ Barack Obama
by BlueDiamond on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:28:30 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (2.00 / 1)


Obama voted against the war!

Oh wait, he didn't. He opposed it as State Senator.

Most people actually thinks that he voted against it.


by dailyroad on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:38:59 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Obama is going to WIN this thing.

PAY-TO-PLAY politicians i.e. Hillary will do everything to stop Obama. The pundits, the media (lobbyists secret weapon) are helping Hillary a lot. That doesn't work.
People just don't want her as President.


by win on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:41:08 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

This is the type of diary that brings discourse on this blog down.

The diarist comes here once a month and leaves a hit-piece filled with contradictions and errors.  The problem is that the diarist NEVER sticks around to discuss her/his diaries.   I have yet to see a SINGLE comment from this diarist in one of his/her hit-piece diaries.   That is bad form.   We'll see if THIS time it is different and this diaries addresses the many mistakes that were made in this diary (and corrects or defends,) but don't your breath, people.   It is bad enough that we have hit-diarists of our own, we don't need drive-byers writing weak hit-diaries on top of that.


by georgep on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:46:54 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

STOP WHINING !

You accused the diarist? Just write one yourself and get over it.


by win on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:54:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

What the hell are you talking about?  The DIARIST NEVER comments in his own diary.  NEVER.  Look at his other diaries he has left here on his fly-over.   That is ALWAYS considered bad form on blogs.   If you write a diary, the least you do is stand by it, comment in it, respond to problems with it.   It is common sense and simple blogging etiquette.  


by georgep on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:08:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

I asked the question recently.  There isn't such a thing.  You can write diaries you know aren't true, and make up stories and nothing happens.  Blogging standards don't mean anything.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:21:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Blogging standard? what does that mean?
nonsense...

Do we now have a blogging standard?


by msnz911 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:43:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Basically the same as etiqitue.  Only difference is that standards could be enforced.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 08:06:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

:-)


by Rocky37 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 03:53:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Well, Georgep, you're wrong!

I am here and have I just don't have time to respond to all your comments.
I realised that all that counts for you are the information that you disagree with...

I love women and I respect President Clinton.
But lets face it. David Geffen was right, with Bill Clinton, nothing has changed.

As far as the canadian billionnaire story goes. Its the truth, you don't want to admit it.

Clinton will not kiss and tell my friends. But he will hit and run. Kiss and run I should say.

Next comment?


by msnz911 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:56:19 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

What does Bill Clinton have anything do with this election? What is he is still having an affair? He is not running for president. Hillary is. The fact that she is able to keep this marriage together despite all these rumors suggests strength.

You should be ashamed for making irrelevant personal attacks on her, but I guess that's just reflection of the desperation of her critics.


by PhillyGuy on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:02:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

If your partner is a "ho", what does that says about you your and your judgment?


by msnz911 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:14:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Enlighten me (none / 0)

What exactly does it say?


by PhillyGuy on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:49:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

"He is not running for president. Hillary is."

They do a good job of blurring that.  Bill Clinton does a significant number of fundraisiers.  Bill Clinton has been on the trail a number of times with Hillary.  Sure Bill isn't running for president, but I'm sure he could have some people fooled.  


by JeremiahTheMessiah on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:22:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

As far as the canadian billionnaire story goes. Its the truth, you don't want to admit it.

- what is the truth ?

Clinton will not kiss and tell my friends. But he will hit and run. Kiss and run I should say.

- This is just bizarre.


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:08:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

There has not been a diary in the past that you have responded to, ever.  There is always a first.  So, stick around and defend this diary, and have a conversation about it.  

For starters:

You claim that the "story" is new, when it indeed ancient, and without proof and merit.  So, why write "new" when it is anything but?  If you fib on simple things like that....


by georgep on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:11:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

You are right , he tries to pass off the tabloid rumor like its something new , when its some crap from 05 , if you try to write a hit diary , don't try to pass off old tabloid information as new and the truth.


Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.
by lori on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:20:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Well, Georgep, you're wrong!

I am here and have I just don't have time to respond to all your comments.

what do you want me to defend? the diary speaks of itself.


by msnz911 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:41:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh, please... (none / 0)

Obama is the one that is full of hype. He opposed the war when he was not in the Senate, then voted to fund the war at every opportunity he got. You call that clarity?

Remember, Obama also took a significant amount of contribution from Hsu. Does that mean he is easily fooled too? I guess you would have to cross him off as having poor judgment, huh?

What exactly is Obama's movement? He is certainly not moving in the polls. In fact, he is losing popularity as more people get to know him.


by PhillyGuy on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 01:57:49 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Obama does not need Bills affairs to beat Hillary. I consider such attacks below the belt anyways.

The way he beats Hillary is to overcome the feeling a lot of democratic voting women have about the idea of electing the first woman president.
Hes got to make those voters realize that ending the divisions in this country so we can achieve our common goals is more important that having a symbolic first woman president.
Easier said than done.


by joachim on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 02:14:01 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Obama's campaign is finished.  There is no way now he can win the nomination.  The remark about meeting dictators with no pre-conditions was the beginning of the end.  Many, including myself, thought it was a mistake for Hillary to call him naive and irresponsible for it- but that one comment derailed his campaign.  All it took was one puff from her and his whole house came down. He decided that was a great opportunity to hit back hard on her with the Bush/Cheney lite comment, which annoyed democrats, then he thought he didn't want to be seen as weak because of his no pre-condition comment so he starts talking about invading Pakistan, another huge miscalculation and it's been downhill ever since.  There is just no way now he can get the nomination and he needs to start thinking about his political life after this is over - he has really damaged himself in this campaign.


by reasonwarrior on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 03:52:25 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Where can I buy some of that stuff your smoking?

The ball game hasn't even started yet -----


by Rocky37 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 04:01:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Well, I admit I could be wrong.  It is just how I see it- but if he is going to make a big comeback, he better start doing it now.  Even Obama admitted about a month ago that time was running out.


by reasonwarrior on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 06:35:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

I agree that Obama has not been showing good numbers -- and I am amazed that has played out that way.  America badly needs a new direction and I really see Obama filling that need --- I just don't see Hillary being as effective.  Barack is the "Pied Piper" for America.

Obama is pacing his movement--building as he goes.  You can see the effect he has on the crowd in front of him and he plays into that very effectively.  

Hillary is not that "user friendly".


by Rocky37 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 11:38:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Seconded, that is some good hash my friend.


by Korha on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 07:01:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

If his campaign is over why are people still giving him money.Why are huge crowds still showing up to see him.Whether you people like it or not,there are some folks out here that like him and support him.Sorry,everybody is just not on the hillary bandwagon,it's alot of people out here that are just not going to vote for her period.


by redtime12 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 04:25:50 PM EST

Same reason Dean looked viable (none / 0)

Obama does, like Dean, have a big, dedicated group of supporters.

But is is not big enough, and not made up of solid primary voters.


by dpANDREWS on Sun Sep 23, 2007 at 07:51:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Looks like a couple of Obama socketpupets are coming out of nowhere. LOL.


Hillary: We will finally have a president who doesn't mind pulling over and asking for directions. Am I right, ladies?
by areyouready on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 04:36:08 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

Hmmmm -- would you be pointing that finger at me maybe?  :-)


by Rocky37 on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 11:43:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

She is the author of this biggest foreign policy disaster in our generation

The above comment is a load of crap.  Are all Obama supporters this insane?

Hillary is on her way to becoming our next President.  Barack Obama has proven he is not up for the job.


by samueldem on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 05:30:01 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

In the end, OBAMA IS GOING TO PREVAIL !


by win on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 05:32:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

My demoxcratic friends in IA told me that at the HARKIN steak fry about half of the 12,000 people their were solid committements for their particular democratic candidate,Of that group Obama had 50% OR 3000 + people

These Democratic party officials were very surprised at his organizational strength and committement of these people for Obama. 15 buses from 10 different locations in IA.

Obama win's IA and the whole ball game changes.

Don't under-estimate Obama.

Also poll's change and I believe the support for Hillary is soft.

Rasmussen showed Hillary ahead by 22 pts over Obama a week or so ago.
This Friday the margin is 11 pts 36-25 Talk about volatility.


by BDM on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 08:46:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

True- and John Edwards is much more an author of it than Hillary- he co-sponsored the bill, for goodness sake.  His hand in it is much dirtier than hers.


by reasonwarrior on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 06:38:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

author, biggest foreign policy disaster (none / 0)

Edwards ahead of Hillary on that charge. She at least voted for an amendment to limit the authority to one year. He voted against that and every other alternative amendment. He had access to the complete intelligence as he sat on the Intelligence Committee. He co-sponsored the vile giveaway of war authority to Bush. If there was an author of  "this biggest foreign policy disaster in our generation" in the Senate, Edwards was it, among the candidates, not Hillary.

I'm not a Clinton supporter, but you should get your facts straight and apply accountability in a just manner.


by zac on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 06:55:05 PM EST

Re: Obama & Hillary - (none / 0)

I don't know why people bother with hit diaries anyway?  It's not like anyone is changing their minds over nasty allegations.  I would try positive diaries about your own candidates, you probably won't convince anyone to change their minds but you may ease their accepatance to the future nominee of the party.  

Why do people feel they need to go to freeperland to find shit about the Clintons?


by Justify My Vote on Sat Sep 22, 2007 at 07:17:15 PM EST

Obama is no longer even a realistic candidate (none / 0)

Debating the pros and cons of Clinton vs. Obama is fruitless.  You may as well argue case for Dodd vs. CLinton, or you vs. Clinton.

The only candidate with a chance to beat Clinton at this point is Edwards and it is a long slim chance.  

Obama's campaign as entered vanity campaign status.


by dpANDREWS on Sun Sep 23, 2007 at 07:48:50 AM EST


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