Obama Showing Movement on Residual Troops

Although I'm an Obama supporter, I'm sympathetic to the point Chris Bowers and Matt Stoller are making about residual troops.  However I think they might have missed some interesting movement from Obama on this issue.

In fact, what I think is interesting is that we're starting to see Obama hedge qualify his previous support of residual troops significantly. A new consensus among the Democratic front-runners is emerging on this issue.  Obama was clearly exasperated during the Petraeus hearing, and we're starting to hear that.

Here is Obama during his speech in Clinton, Iowa:
We will need to retain some forces in Iraq and the region. We'll continue to strike at al Qaeda in Iraq. We'll protect our forces as they leave, and we will continue to protect U.S. diplomats and facilities. If - but only if - Iraq makes political progress and their security forces are not sectarian, we should continue to train and equip those forces.

In other words, Obama would support further training Iraqi troops, if and only if it was proven that the government reached political accommodations and security forces we're training cease to serve merely sectarian ends.  To my knowledge, Obama never added this precondition before.

But wait, there's more.

And then here's Obama this afternoon in an interview with NPR's Michelle Norris on All Things Considered.  He goes even farther:
Norris: So I want to make sure I understand something.  Are you advocating a total disengagement from Iraq?  Would a President Obama basically take every last American out of Iraq?


Obama:  Of course not.  We can't totally disengage from Iraq any more than we can disengage with any other part of the world.  And we've got both strategic interests and humanitarian interests in the region, but what my plan calls for would continue to involve US troops protecting a US embassy and US personnel there, and US troops who are able to strike at terrorist targets inside Iraq, although the troops themselves and the strike forces might not have to be deployed inside Iraq.


If the Iraqi government comes to a political accommodation, and you've got forces that are non-sectarian and are functioning, then you can continue to serve in a training capacity.


But all this is predicated on triggering the kind of political negotiations and compromise that so far have not been forthcoming from the Iraqi leadership.


So Obama reiterated that training government troops would only take place if it was proven that these troops would not be infiltrated and used to further the civil war --- a political accommodation that Obama himself expresses pessimism about in his last sentence. Second, his position is that troops striking at al Qaeda in Iraq would not need to actually be stationed in Iraq but in neighboring countries.

To be clear, I don't think this is enough to answer the concerns that Chris and Matt are raising, but there is more movement here than you're giving Obama credit for.  Obama is frustrated with the progress, frustrated with Petraeus' testimony, and his plans are changing.


NPR Audio available here. Cross-posted at Open Left.



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Re: Obama Showing Movement on Residual Troops (none / 0)

You know the only movement I see is his explicit call for the beginning of an immediate withdrawal of troops . Other than that I don't see any difference in what He has been saying all along.

Nonetheless I find myself not agreeing with his position and even Hillary Clinton's for that matter on iraq.Which is quite shocking to say the least.


this country it belongs to folks like me and you ,so let the voice of freedom sing out through this land this is our country
by lori on Wed Sep 12, 2007 at 10:30:05 PM EST

Obama is being ambiguous (none / 0)

His distinction of "combat troops" is murky at best. What about non-combat troops? How many would he leave and for how long?

According to his own website, Senator Obama is planning to leave residual troops.

The plan allows for a limited number of U.S. troops to remain in Iraq as basic force protection, to engage in counter-terrorism and to continue the training of Iraqi security forces.

So, Senator Obama, will you please answer Governor Bill Richardson's question?


by Ken Camp on Wed Sep 12, 2007 at 10:33:18 PM EST

Re: Obama is being ambiguous (none / 0)

You're referring to his website, which is explicitly describing his January 2007 proposal on Iraq.  I'm talking about comments he made today that hedge on residual forces (aka the non-combat troops you're talking about.)  My whole point is that his position is changing:

Previously, Obama has argued (like Clinton) that troops would be needed to (1) continue to train Iraqi troops; (2) protect the embassy and US personnel in Iraq; (3) continue to launch raids against terrorist camps ---- only today he is adding a series of preconditions and is backing away from these roles.

Troops can continue to launch raids, but they can do so from outside Iraq.  Troops might continue to train government forces but only if the government can ensure that these forces wouldn't be used for sectarian ends --- a development that Obama is pessimistic about.  

I think Edwards and Obama are moving in the direction of only maintaining troops in the country to protect embassy staff.


One Million Strong --- Join up
by psericks on Wed Sep 12, 2007 at 10:49:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama is being ambiguous (none / 0)

I think Edwards and Obama are moving in the direction of only maintaining troops in the country to protect embassy staff.

It's about time, but Bill Richardson was first.


by Ken Camp on Thu Sep 13, 2007 at 12:28:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

sigh (none / 0)

If Obama can't stand the pressure from an obscure blog 'openleft', how can we expect him to be commander in chief?

Such a sad ending for all the candidates who are artificially pumped up by blogsphere...


Hillary: We will finally have a president who doesn't mind pulling over and asking for directions. Am I right, ladies?
by areyouready on Wed Sep 12, 2007 at 10:35:03 PM EST

Re: sigh (none / 0)

You missed my point.  These are things Obama said today before Chris posted.


One Million Strong --- Join up
by psericks on Wed Sep 12, 2007 at 10:44:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: sigh (1.00 / 2)

I'm not sure his constant pandering to an obsure blog will do him any favor...

These egomaniac Chris & Matt can not and will not move a single actual vote despite their constant barking...


Hillary: We will finally have a president who doesn't mind pulling over and asking for directions. Am I right, ladies?
by areyouready on Wed Sep 12, 2007 at 10:57:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: sigh (none / 0)

don't bother addressing him.  and we all know that chris and matt posted before the whole speech.  did not hear all the speech.  and forget areyouready, no use in arguing with someone who has nothing to bring to the table but constant flux.


by iamready on Wed Sep 12, 2007 at 11:23:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Showing Movement on Residual Troops (none / 0)

Interesting post, but why do you keep describing Obama as "hedging"? I don't see it as hedging at all; he has updated his proposal and changed his plan to reflect what he sees going on in Iraq. I've long thought the antiwar Democrats were wrong to leave so many missions open for residual troops: as long as we're there, I believe we foment violence and make any government complicit in an occupation, depriving Iraqis the opportunity to develop a government worthy of their respect or allegiance. I am very pleased to see that Obama's plan now subtracts training from the stated mission, making it contingent on political developments there. And that antiterrorist forces might be stationed only outside the country. That seems to me to greatly reduce the likely number of residual forces and their negative impact.
   The explicit denunciation of moves toward war with Iran and the call for a new constitutional convention are two other very positive and significant elements of Obama's speech.
   
by skeptica on Thu Sep 13, 2007 at 01:51:39 AM EST

Re: Obama Showing Movement on Residual Troops (none / 0)

I agree about the term "hedging." I don't think psericks is using it in the conventional sense (i.e., equivocation). Indeed, the diarist appears to mean the opposite (clear, direct). Clarification would help.


by DPW on Thu Sep 13, 2007 at 04:07:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama Showing Movement on Residual Troops (none / 0)

That's a good point, it's the wrong word.  My point was merely that he's starting to restrict his statement and add lots of qualifiers.  And that these qualifiers are going to open up a path for mainstream Democratic candidates to dramatically scale back the numbers of residual troops that have been talked about previously.

I guess I was also trying to fend off a couple of the polemics yesterday directed at Obama by some of the folks at Open Left by... trying to meet them halfway, I guess.

I've actually never really thought about the word "hedge" before.  What I was getting at was the sense of newly restricting a statement in such a way as to allow for a different outcome --- such as 'to hedge your bets.'  I didn't really mean the intention to confuse or mislead part that you're right about.


One Million Strong --- Join up
by psericks on Thu Sep 13, 2007 at 11:50:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]


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