Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC, Not Disrespect for Moderates

It looks like the Democratic Leadership Council is getting a bit huffy and puffy about the fact that the Democratic presidential candidates, a number of whom were at one time affiliated with the organization, have refused an invitation to speak at the annual DLC summer meeting this year. How huffy and puffy, you ask? So much so that they have turned to Ron Fournier, one time star of the miserable failure that was Hot Soup (it's no longer online, but it was to have been a social networking site run by a bunch of Beltway consultants -- I know, hard to imagine that it failed...), to whine publicly that the Democrats no longer care about moderate voters.

Bill Clinton will be there. So will 300 officeholders from more than 45 states. But one thing will be missing when Democrats gather in Tennessee this weekend to discuss how to appeal to moderate, independent-minded voters in 2008: the Democratic presidential field.

Not a single one of the eight presidential candidates plans to attend the Democratic Leadership Council's summer meeting, a snub that says less about the centrist DLC than it does about a nomination process that rewards candidates who pander to their parties' hardened cores while ignoring everybody else.

"They have tunnel vision," DLC founder Al From said of his fellow Democrats.

Al From has the best interests of the Democratic Party in mind... right. Perhaps that's why he decided long ago -- before any of the current Democratic candidates for the presidency formally formed their campaigns, before even the 2006 midterm elections -- to advise a then-Republican politician on how to mount a centrist presidential campaign. Perhaps you might note that polling indicates that a Bloomberg candidacy would do more to help than hurt the Democratic nominee. That does not take away from the fact that From has, however unofficially, however fleetingly, advised a non-Democratic Party candidate on how to defeat a Democratic presidential candidate indicates to me, at the least, that he does not have the best interests of the Democratic Party in mind.

But getting to the larger implication of the piece -- that the Democratic presidential candidates don't care about moderate voters, or as Fournier puts it, that the candidates' decision not to attend the DLC event "says less about the centrist DLC than it does about a nomination process that rewards candidates who pander to their parties' hardened cores while ignoring everybody else" -- rubbish, I say.

First of all, there is no way that the Democrats don't care about moderate voters or that moderate voters don't like the message being put out by the Democratic Party. No one would argue that moderates are not an important part of the Democratic coalition. In 2004, even as John Kerry lost to George W. Bush nationally, he carried the vote of moderates by a 54 percent to 45 percent margin. In 2006, the Democrats secured even stronger support from moderate voters (60 percent to 38 percent) in their successful midterm election victory.

And not only are moderate voters important to the Democratic Party's general election success, they are also important to the success of candidates seeking the Democratic Party's presidential nomination. Take Iowa, for example. In 2004, exit polling showed that 37 percent of Iowa Democratic caucus-goers self-identified as moderate (with another 6 percent self-identifying as conservative). Or take New Hampshire. Exit polling from the 2000 New Hampshire Democratic presidential primary showed that 38 percent of those who voted self-identified as moderate (plus 8 percent self-identifying as conservative). In 2004, exit polling pegged that number to be even higher (45 percent, with 10 percent either identifying as very or somewhat conservative). With upwards of two thirds of New Hampshire independents projected to vote in the Democratic primary this year, it's fairly safe to say that there are going to be a lot of moderate voters helping decide who the next Democratic nominee is. So clearly, moderate voters are important to the Democratic Party and to candidates for the Democratic Party's presidential nomination.

This brings me back to my first point, and to the broader point of this post. The Democratic candidates' decision to snub the DLC is not about snubbing moderate voters, despite what Ron Fournier or Al From or anyone else says. Rather, it's about snubbing the DLC, an organization whose founder is at the least flirting with the possibility of supporting a presidential candidacy that would oppose the Democratic Party; an organization that has had some questionable policy recommendations for the Democratic Party in recent years; an organization that may or may not actually have the best intentions of the Democratic Party in its mind and an organization that, despite its protestations, should not necessarily be viewed as the voice of all moderate voters, or even the moderate voters within the Democratic Party.



Display:


We got it (none / 0)

I don't think one sentence from Al From is really worth a front page rant about the DLC. You don't like them. We got that a long time ago.


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 01:59:14 PM EST

Re: We got it (3.00 / 2)

Why are you upset about his bashing of the DLC?  They deserve all the scorn they get.


John McCain: Bush right to veto kids health insurance expansion
by Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:00:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

AMEN TO THAT ONE... (3.00 / 1)

and SHOCKED, SHOCKED, HRC not there, SHOCKED...


"I want my voice to be read"
by icebergslim on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:01:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We got it (none / 0)

Its not about the DLC. I'm just tired of people repeating the same thing over and over again on subjects that are tangentially related at best.

I think the important part of the diary is the discussion about coalitions being important within the party. However I gurantee you that 90% if the comments on this diary will just be "yeah fuck the DLC". Yeah that's productive.


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:06:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We got it (none / 0)

Yeah, I agree with you, but I'm sure we're in the minority here.

I don't agree with the DLC on a lot of issues--Free Trade for one--but I don't think they should get the Fox News treatment.


by Bush Bites on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 09:35:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We got it (none / 0)

Ha! Just read your other comments.

Guess I am alone. Oh well.....


by Bush Bites on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 09:37:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We got it (none / 0)

Well, this is the first time I have heard that the entire Democratic field had snubbed the DLC-- and a snub is what it is.

I actually think that's pretty big news. Has there been a post about this already? If so, I missed it, and I check here more days than I don't.

Regardless of what you might think of the DLC, the fact that its influence has fallen this far, when only a few years ago its members and their paradigms called most of the shots among Democrats, is a true watershed.

Hard to argue that's not worthy of comment.


by alteran on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 11:30:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: We got it (none / 0)

Actually, in 2003 the whole Democratic field declined to attend the DLC summer conference as well.

I would say the mass avoidance is to be expected, and the AP article's assessment is accurate.  The important thing right now is to play to the base.  We'll still need the middle to win, especially in those red and purple states.

And I would love to attend the conference (I'm in Nashville where it's being held) to see if the campaigns have significant surrogates attending in place of the candidate.


by gas28man on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 01:53:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC .. (none / 0)

As the saying goes .... F--k the DLC!!!   They were responsible for the Democratic party being in the wilderness for much of the 90's .. they don't and never will get it ... they were trying to sell out the Democrats ... Al From can go support Bloomberg ... or Rudy .. we don't need him


John McCain: Bush right to veto kids health insurance expansion
by Calvin Jones and the 13th Apostle on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 01:59:21 PM EST

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC .. (none / 0)

I wouldn't get too excited. Hillary remains DLC to the bone; she just skips their events too fool the left. Her campaign platform is drawn directly from the DLC planbook. Her description of herself as a "modern progressive"? Classic Will Marshall. If things keep going the way they are, the DLC will be back in the White House before too long. And progressives will be on the outs once Hillary wraps up the primaries. Do you really think she will be running to defend Daily Kos on Fox News this time next year?


by alexmhogan on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 08:58:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

more clinton triangulating (3.00 / 1)

bill goes/ hillary doesn't


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:00:40 PM EST

Re: more clinton triangulating (3.00 / 1)

I know, it is laughable, really it is...


"I want my voice to be read"
by icebergslim on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:04:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Moderates (none / 0)

No one would argue that moderates are not an important part of the Democratic coalition.

A lot of people on mydd and Dkos do. And I'm refering to moderate bashing NOT DLC bashing.


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:02:55 PM EST

Re: Moderates (3.00 / 1)

No one is bashing a moderate here. You seem to create controversy out of nothing. All i see is well deserved DLC bashing. Al From is not in a position to whine considering the DLC guys have made it their business to bash other DEmocrats over the years.


by Pravin on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:11:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moderates (none / 0)

I'm not refering to this thread. I'm refering to the community. The first part talks about the DLC sucking. The second part talks about moderates and coalitions being important. I'm refering to the second part of the diary and saying I don't think this is as universally believed around here as Jerome thinks.


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:15:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Moderates (none / 0)

Jonathan


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:16:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

the problem... (3.00 / 3)

isn't with moderates per se, it's with the dlc's approach.  they still think that we're running against nixon.

the dlc approach (run from or to the middle) presupposes that moderates prefer accomodation, that they have no strong principles, and that they refuse to abandon their "middle" position.  republicans have successfully pursued a strategy that rejects all three.  there is no reason why progressives/liberals/whatever can't take on the republican's "move the middle" approach (unless you believe there is a center-right electorate).

* moderate voters can be appealed to with principled positions that are tightly framed (eg, "i support universal health care because it will make american companies, especially manufacturers more competitive in a global marketplace").

* moderate voters can be swayed to a side with science, logic and strong messaging (eg, the evolution debate in kansas).

* moderates are more likely to turn out to vote if they are given visceral reasons for doing so.

the dlc has missed all of these and took the wrong lessons from mcgovern's defeat.  while the dlc was advocating that democrats abandon their base and their principles, republicans took control of government and the terms of political debate in this country.  they've done very little to get it back...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:46:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: the problem... (none / 0)

Good post Bored Now

The only problem I have is this

moderate voters can be appealed to with principled positions that are tightly framed (eg, "i support universal health care because it will make american companies, especially manufacturers more competitive in a global marketplace").

* moderate voters can be swayed to a side with science, logic and strong messaging (eg, the evolution debate in kansas).

* moderates are more likely to turn out to vote if they are given visceral reasons for doing so.

A moderate does not mean that you're in the middle on an issue. Theres PLENTY of moderates who are for Universal Health Care for the same reason the most far left liberal is. I mean we can all agree Bill Clinton is no liberal but he started talking about universal health care LONG BEFORE most Americans did. In fact he ran on it in the 92 election. A moderate is someone who rejects the grouping of ideas along political party. (I know to some extent everyone does this but moderates tend to do it more and on "bigger issues")

For example a moderate democrat might support universal health care and a progressive tax system but also be pro gun and pro life.

Or more generally speaking a moderate democrat could be a social conservative but also an economic populist. A fiscal conservative who is pro business but also very socially liberal.

We reject the package deal of politics. What the hell does me being pro gay marriage have to do with my stance on trade? If I'm a democrat against free trade why should I have to be against gun control? Zuh?

And THAT is the problem with running to the middle. You're right that moderates, or the average American as being a moderate, don't want someone who is wishy washy. We want to be able to pick and choose the issues we like from either party and we want people that fight like HELL for the issues we believe in.

Let's continue this discussion


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 04:56:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

i agree... (3.00 / 1)

that being "moderate does not mean that you're in the middle on an issue."  in fact you make some very important points.  let me add one: there is no defined or agreed upon position for moderates.

one reason i've found that most voters self-identify themselves as moderates because (as you suggest) they are ala carte voters.

i find this point very interesting:

A moderate is someone who rejects the grouping of ideas along political party.

if only because i've never thought about this in this context.  this aspect, though, is very familiar:

We reject the package deal of politics. What the hell does me being pro gay marriage have to do with my stance on trade? If I'm a democrat against free trade why should I have to be against gun control?

obviously, the old fdr coalition is built upon the premise of different issue/interest groups coalescing around the democratic standard.  clearly, that coalition has frayed.  one of the elements of democratic politics that frustrates me the most is a general resistance at the national level of either rebuilding the democratic coalition or ditching the thing altogether.  candidates down ballot (especially senate and congressional candidates) are often crucified for aspects of this coalition that no longer exist (save in the conservative mind).  this is one thing i agree with al from about: democrats need to be rebranded.  i just don't like his ideas about its rebranding.

all of what you've said here conforms to what i find in direct contact with voters, either in the formal context (research) or informal one (field)...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 05:20:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: i agree... (none / 0)

Exactly

Look I get pissed at liberals on this site a lot. But I always stress coalitions. Americans are very diverse people and the democratic party as the party of the people needs to be a very diverse nation.

From what I've seen in my experiences with unaffiliated voters, and even some republicans, is that they reject the democratic party because they have this image of our party as very narrow and far to the left. I know plenty of people who believe in the heart of democratic beliefs, equality, social justice, promotion of education, and pragmatism over dogma, and yet they shy away from our party because they don't feel welcome.

The fact is that our big tent has become a very small tent and we've lost elections because of that.


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 07:14:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I think one candidate (3.00 / 2)

is repesented by her husband, Bill Clinton.

Just as she criticizes O'Relly and defends Daily Kos, while taking a $2300 contribution from his paymaster, Rupert Murdoch, in June 2007 for her presidential run, Senator Clinton tries to have it both ways.  

The DLC has been wrong, wrong, wrong, for years.    


by TomP on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:23:26 PM EST

Re: I think one candidate (none / 0)

Was it wrong for the Clinton Global Warming Intiative to take $500,000 from Murdoch?


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 04:58:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

nope... (none / 0)

and murdoch should be hit up for more.  how about $500M?  there are much better uses of his money than faux news or buying the wsj...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 05:23:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: nope... (none / 0)

then why can't Clinton take her money for her campaign?


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 05:24:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

does she want his endorsement? (none / 0)

because that's how it would look.

i didn't know murdoch was actually a us citizen, and thus eligible to legally contribute to clinton.  but there is a difference between contributing to a charity and contributing to a campaign.  people look at it as not only the contributor endorsing the candidate (which is absurd, since many high end contributors contribute to both sides) but also as the candidate endorsing the contributor (equally absurd).  perceptions are everything in politics...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 08:14:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: does she want his endorsement? (none / 0)

Who says theres a difference between contributing to a candidate and charity? "Dirty" money is "dirty" money. The only difference might be trying to buy influence with someone but I doubt Murdoch is trying to influence Clinton with 2300.

Bitching about Clinton getting 2300 from Murdoch but not saying a word about the Clinton Global Warming Intiative get $500,000 is selective reasoning AT BEST.


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 10:45:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

you won't see me... (none / 0)

accusing anyone of accepting "dirty" money.  money to campaigns is what pays my bills.  personally, i believe in the divestment plan -- got a right-winger who has a load of cash?  divest him of it...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 07:10:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

The DLC is Not Moderate (3.00 / 1)

Right now: Moderates want US troops out of Iraq. Moderates want single-payer universal healthcare. Moderates want reductions in CO2. Moderates want more efficiency, more renewable energy, and less fossil fuels. But does the DLC?


John McCain wants to make abortion illegal
by RandomNonviolence on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:48:07 PM EST

Re: The DLC is Not Moderate (none / 0)

Moderates want a single payer system?


by Bush Bites on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 09:41:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The DLC is Not Moderate (3.00 / 1)

Yes. Here is David Sirota writing about this last year in a post called "News Flash - America Wants a Single-Payer Health Care System":

As an ABC News/Washington Post poll showed in 2003, the majority of Americans support a single-payer, government-sponsored health care system, even when they hear the right-wing's alarmist arguments... - Question 49 shows 62% say they support a universal health care system "run by the government and financed by taxpayers" over the current system.  

When 62% of Americans want something, then most moderates must want it.


John McCain wants to make abortion illegal
by RandomNonviolence on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 10:17:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The DLC is Not Moderate (none / 0)

Single Payer system is  misnomer. Single Payer isn't a proper noun, IE there are many different types of single payer health care systems.


by world dictator on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 10:49:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

FOX and DLC... (none / 0)

...have one thing in common. They are both being snubbed by the Democratic presidential candidates. Does anyone think we are in this for the long run? Is there anyone else out there we can piss off before the week is over?
by joliepoint on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:52:57 PM EST

Re: FOX and DLC... (none / 0)

Well, Fox's mission is the destruction of the Democratic Party, so I see no problem with telling Fox to screw off.

The DLC, on the other hand, wants to influence the Democratic Party. I don't agree with a lot of their positions and I don't particularly want the party to go their way, but I don't think they should get the Fox News treatment.

The Democrats have a great opportunity to cast a wide net. The Repubs have been throwing moderates out of their party at record rates and I don't think they even realize how much they're bleeding because of it.

I hope the Democrats don't blow it by making moderates feel that they don't have a home in the Democratic Party either.


by Bush Bites on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 09:51:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC (3.00 / 1)


The DLC lives in a time warp, in 1992 Forever.

Isn't it time for someone to do another one of those membership checks of the DLC just to see who they claim among public officials who is still anybody?  I remember a list published here or on dKos in 2005, I think, which showed what a basicly decrepit and obsolete bunch of folks their 'leaders' are.  Other than the Black Caucus, which needs every dime, and Hillary Clinton, who's in out of acknowledgment for all the work they did for Bill in 1990-92, iirc they have no one with a future in the Party.


by killjoy on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 02:59:59 PM EST

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC, Not Disres (none / 0)

I don't know, following Frum's orders has always led to disaster so perhaps he's using this is as a clever way to sink a Bloomberg candidacy.


by MNPundit on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 03:25:43 PM EST

What are Democratic moderates? (none / 0)

Not like the DLC, which is right-of-center on Iraq and economics and left-of-center on social issues.

I'd say that moderates that the Democratic Party should court, and which already make up a larger percentage of the party than DLC-types, are the opposite: opposed to the miserable war in Iraq and opposed to the failed economics and political theory of Goldwater and Reagan, yet not so liberal as the rest of the party on social issues.


Things You Don't Talk About in Polite Company: Religion, Politics, the Occasional Intersection of Both
by Anthony de Jesus on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 03:26:23 PM EST

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC (none / 0)

Hillary Clinton is the biggest freaking HACK out there.

She's one of the people in charge of the DLC and she's not attending?

I guess she thinks most people are 1) too stupid to know that she is DLC to the core, or 2) she thinks that most voters have some idea what the DLC is about.

She must think that the people who are actively involved (the netroots in particular) is too stupid to know that she is DLC?


by OE on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 05:28:33 PM EST

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC, (none / 0)

the Dlc is the conservative not moderate wing of the Democratic party


by orin76 on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 05:31:12 PM EST

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC, (none / 0)

OK, it's the conservative wing of the Democratic Party. So what?

They're not being asked to sign a pledge, just state their cases.

I really don't see the problem with them speaking to this group.


by Bush Bites on Wed Jul 25, 2007 at 09:45:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the (none / 0)

I just wanted to point out that the Dlc in no way holds the center ground in the Democratic party.


by orin76 on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 10:58:33 AM EST

Democrat Party? (none / 0)

Jonathan,

One nit to pick in the next-to-last paragraph-- what is this "Democrat Party" of which you speak?

The heinous subject matter appears to have made subtle and warped marks upon your psyche!   ;-)


by alteran on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 11:21:14 AM EST

Re: Democrat Party? (none / 0)

Thanks. One of those times where I decide to change what I've written from "Democrats" to "Democratic Party" but forgot to add the "ic". No worries -- I'm not trying to reinforce George W. Bush here.


My Direct Democracy
by Jonathan Singer on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 12:44:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dems' Snub of DLC is About the DLC, Not Disres (none / 0)

FYI, the candidates will all be off pandering to Millennials at the College Democrat National Convention.

Time much better spent, in my opinion.


Youth to Power
by Mike Connery on Thu Jul 26, 2007 at 01:08:41 PM EST


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