Obama blows into MySpace

This seems like it was bound to happen with Obama's top-down campaign structure as it grows by leaps and bounds. With much of that energy coming from a bottom up movement that's responsible for that growth, the campaign moves in to take control of the decentralized action.

The case in point is the myspace/barackobama homepage. The Battle to Control Obama's Myspace has been unfolding behind the scenes, and it reads like it ended pretty ugly. Write's Sifry:

How all this happened is a complicated tale that is still unfolding, and none of the parties involved--Anthony, the Obama online team, and the MySpace political operation--emerge from this story unscathed. Speaking on background, Obama campaign staffers are spreading word that Anthony just wanted a "big payday." Anthony in turn has posted a missive on his blog (that was originally sent to me as an email) accusing the Obama team of "bullying...[and] rotten and dishonest" behavior. However one parses those accusations (more below), the Obama campaign's reputation as the most net-savvy of 2008 has taken a big hit.

I can totally understand that the campaign would want to take control of the domain. The easiest solution would have been to hire Joe Anthony, a paralegal living in Los Angeles, to move to the campaign HQ's and start working on it there. The second easiest solution would have been to buy it from the volunteer. When that got onto the table, says Anthony:
I considered the time I had put into it from January 1st of this year, not counting the previous two years. It was about $39,000. Plus I asked that if any fees were to be paid to MySpace by the campaign up to that point in time, those should be shared with me, up to $10,000. There was no counter-offer. They said they didn't have any money.
The Obama campaign should have faxed him the contract immediately. Instead, write's Sifry:
t appears the Obama internet team was shocked by the size of Anthony's proposal and argued to themselves that it was proof that he was just in it for the money, even though campaigns like theirs regularly give tens of thousands of dollars to highpriced media consultants who would give their eye-teeth to deliver 160,000 rabid activists to a campaign. Instead to them, Anthony's bid was all the more reason to get control of the site. Obama's staffers are now spreading the word that Anthony wanted a big payday, including a huge percentage of any ad buys on MySpace. I have a copy of Anthony's email proposal, however, and it contradicts that claim.
Yea, $49K to deliver 160,000 supporters; that's .32 cents each for opted in and engaged activsts. A bargain. [The amount was actually up to $44K] $50,000 is what it takes to advertise on the Liberal Ad Network for two weeks. It's a minor expenditure in the grand scheme of things. But instead:
Whatever the case, at this point it appears the Obama people simply decided that they would get control of the myspace.com/barackobama url by going around Anthony and getting MySpace to lock down his access to it. In their view, Anthony was violating MySpace's terms of service by falsely representing himself as Obama, and thus they didn't have to pay him anything. The worst that would happen, they reasoned, is that they would have to rebuild the candidate's network of friends.
So Obama starts over. The company representative Jeff Berman said that MySpace is going to promising to restore Anthony's network of 160,000 friends as soon as he picks a new url for whatever unofficial Obama fan page he may care to create, which is interesting. Micah raises some great questions that are raised from the incident:
But this latest episode in the evolving interaction between voter-generated media and campaign-controlled content raises several unsettled issues:

*If it weren't for the hundreds of hours put into sites like MySpace by passionate volunteers like Joe Anthony, would the folks at MySpace even have anything like an Impact Channel? The only reason campaigns and advertisers are taking sites like MySpace seriously is because they have millions of users; shouldn't the volunteers who help draw the crowds to these new online town halls get some kind of compensation beyond a little modest recognition from political professionals now and then?

*Is it true that once a voter-generated site gets major traction, the campaign affected has to control it? Can a front-running presidential campaign--even one as devoted to empowering supporters to take their own initiatives and connect to each other through social network tools as the Obama campaign--afford a major site run by a campaign volunteer outside their control? Is such control even possible?

*Why couldn't the Obama people find the money to work out an amicable arrangement with Anthony? What are they spending the $26 million they raised last quarter on?

The most intriguing thing about this whole mess is this is the first time I can think of where the grass-roots activist at the bottom of the pile has a megaphone as big as the folks who tried to boss him around. Right now Joe Anthony is lying on his sofa, trying to gather his thoughts as he wonders what happens to all the sweat and passion he put into the last two and a half years for Barack Obama. As best as I can tell, he really doesn't know what he should do, because he's never been in these shoes, and he's as bewildered as anyone could be about how it all came crashing to the ground. But unlike every activist who's ever been crushed by events beyond his control, he can do something that just might give him a clue as to what comes next. He can ask his 160,000 friends for help.


Update [2007-5-2 10:4:35 by Jerome Armstrong]:Nothing on BarackObama's blog about this yet. I'm sure the campaign would rather it went away, but this sort of thing is pretty much unprecedented, though not unexpected, so we are going to see a lot of debate over the issue and it's ramifications.



Display:


I understand not wanting (3.00 / 3)

a free lancer to have so much control.

but the guy built the site for the last 2 years and was asking for 39K for past work... plus SHARING any fees to myspace  (which by the way is owned by Rupert Murdoch's company).

anyhow seems like their excuse that 39K was a "big" payment is a joke.

didn't Obama just raise 26 million?


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:41:11 AM EST

Obama should have paid (3.00 / 2)

the $39-49k and sent Anthony on a trip to Disneyland.


by ROGNM on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:45:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama should have paid (none / 0)

It appears that the site had around 30,000 friends when the Obama campaign began directing traffic from MySpace's presidential election channel to it.  And the number of friends grew very quickly after that.  So I'm sure in the mind of the campaign most of the friends were gained as a result of Obama's momentum rather than the work of the site owner.

The campaign also did offer to pay a consulting fee, but at $49K for 4 months of part-time work (he said he's not asking money for the 2 years of work before), the guy is asking to be paid like a top political consultant.  I think at that point the campaign must have decided that he is just out to score some cash and decided not to give it to him.  That may turn out to be a bad decision for the campaign, but the site owner does come across as a bit too greedy.


by Peripatetic on Wed May 02, 2007 at 01:29:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama should have paid (none / 0)

I agree, here.  I think the two factions, if they sit down, can come to a medium here.

This is happening everywhere, where ppl are making my space, facebooks of their favorite candidate.  We are in "new territory" here, and will definately be something that will be looked at down the road.


"I want my voice to be read"
by icebergslim on Wed May 02, 2007 at 02:52:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama should have paid (none / 0)

The campaign also did offer to pay a consulting fee, but at $49K for 4 months of part-time work (he said he's not asking money for the 2 years of work before), the guy is asking to be paid like a top political consultant.  

Did the guy achieve results like a top political consultant or not? Who cares if he was a "professional," he achieve results and put them in place before anyone else in the race. He gave the Obama campaign an edge by having the infrastructure in place before the other campaigns and a huge seed base of "friends" to grow from. He performed like a top political consultant. Pay him comensurate with his results.


Witty comment goes here...
by michael in chicago on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:20:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

$40K for three months part-time? (3.00 / 2)

pretty good deal.  I guess I should start making fake celebrity myspace pages too.


John McCain is a Bush ally on Social Security.
by John DE on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:21:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: $40K for three months part-time? (3.00 / 1)

It is a free country.  If YOU see a potential future superstar in somebody, what would stop you from setting up a website with their name or a myspace site?  


by georgep on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:50:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: $40K for three months part-time? (none / 0)

That is another issue, good point.

The "NAME".  This is a new territory here, wonder how it will be taken care of.  I think the owner of the myspace page will get compensated, one way or another.  And for future candidates, ppl will have to create these accounts in "compliance" with the campaign, for control issues.  That is what I see happening.


"I want my voice to be read"
by icebergslim on Wed May 02, 2007 at 02:54:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: $40K for three months part-time? (none / 0)

hopefully one thing that might stop you is the law.


by DonBinTN on Wed May 02, 2007 at 07:35:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: $40K for three months part-time? (none / 0)

if you can collect 160,000 names in three months, you should totally go for it.


by corn dog on Wed May 02, 2007 at 02:05:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

the bottom line (none / 0)

all the guy has to do is change to

"welovevarackobama"

or

"obamaniacs"

or

anything else.

His friends and site are his, he just needs to change the name.  Nothing was taken from him that was his.


John McCain is a Bush ally on Social Security.
by John DE on Wed May 02, 2007 at 04:23:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I didn't donate to soothe a MySpace squatter (3.00 / 3)

As somebody who donated to the Obama campaign I don't think the Obama campaign should be spending money to make a volunteer go away so Markos, Jerome, and techPresident don't say bad things about Barack Obama. MySpace contacts aren't some kind of magical currency - I'd be shocked if as many as 10% were active MySpace accounts.

Joe Anthony wants more money for creating a MySpace page as a volunteer than Tim Tagaris was paid as staff for Sherrod Brown and Ned Lamont combined, more than Matt Stoller was paid to work for Jon Corzine. It's borderline extortion. Anthony himself said he only wanted to be paid for work since January 1, 2007. Is it even in the realm of the possible that maintaing a MySpace page is worth that amount?

As for the 160,000 "committed activists" who are friends on MySpace that's a giant joke. It takes far more time to register for a Daily Kos account to post and only about 1 in 10 of the User IDs are in active use if I recall an old post studying the number of active users. That's on a highly political, highly engaged website. MySpace is much more passive. So it's more like 16,000 active profiles at best and they are not all 'committed activists' - many are people who took 10 seconds to adds Obama as friend and never looked at the page again. I appreciate Joe Anthony's enthusiasm but let's not make this guy out to be a martyr. He spend a few hours a week on a civic project and wants $39,000 for his volunteer efforts. As an Obama contributer I'd rather weather the storm from this riduculous story then payoff a diva MySpace website operator who thinks he's worth more per hour than the best professional internet staffers in the business.

You can't simultaneously say $39,000 isn't a lot of money and then preach small-donor activism. Small donors and all donors should have an expectation that campaigns spend funds frugally. Giving $39,000 to purchase your own name from a MySpace webpage operator is hardly being frugal.

$39,000 is one paid staffer a few months early in a Feb. 5 primary state. That's what wins elections, not capitulating to an unofficial fan club president who has a list of 15 year-old would be supporters.


"Nothing seems to embarrass the political class today." - Bill Moyers
by joejoejoe on Wed May 02, 2007 at 12:48:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I understand not wanting (none / 0)

The $26 million dollars is sexy for context but it has little to do with the value of Joe Anthony's work creating a MySpace page. Anthony was asking for 9% of Gov. Mike Huckabee's TOTAL fundraising for creating a single MySpace page. How's that for context?


"Nothing seems to embarrass the political class today." - Bill Moyers
by joejoejoe on Wed May 02, 2007 at 02:24:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (2.71 / 7)

Jerome, this is a bit dishonest:


Yea, $49K to deliver 160,000 supporters; that's .32 cents each for opted in and engaged activsts.

Having a friend on MySpace is not the same thing by having 'opted-in and engaged activists'. Same goes with the 300,000+ Obama group on Facebook.

I do think Obama screwed this up a little bit, but honestly - $39,000 retroactively is a bit ridiculous, IMO.


by PsiFighter37 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:41:29 AM EST

really (3.00 / 4)

if  you had a hobby that you worked on for 2 years and built up  would 19,500 per year seem like a lot?

I'd imagine some consultants on the campaign make that each week.

the money doesn't make any sense - it's nothing.


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:44:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: really (none / 0)

I have been on his page before all this... Having worked and been a hiring manager in the IT industry, he did not do $40K worth of Web Administration..  The situation was handled poorly, and they should have negotiated, but Anthony is greatly overestimating the value of his work.  I would say the PR fuckup though is much costlier than losing the friends network who are most likely signed up on either Obama's site or Facebook or other engagements.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:01:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I'd agree it's a PR (3.00 / 1)

thing...

probably could have been handled better whether or not the value was there, the PR could have been more friendly


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:03:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: really (3.00 / 1)

This is about $40k worth of web administration?  No, that's not what this is about at all.  Not in the least.  In fact, the idea is ridiculous on its face.

Clearly, this is much more than just web administration.


by pseudo999 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 11:18:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: really (none / 0)

Let me put it this way:

Suppose you're a web administrator, and you happened to create... Facebook.  The parallel isn't quite right, but just work with me here.

Do you get paid only for web administration services?


by pseudo999 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 11:20:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: really (none / 0)

The big increase in his workload (which caused him to ask for payment) was just web administration. And this increase in workload was due to the popularity of the candidate, not to any genius on Joe Anthony's part concerning site design or content.  He started it on a volunteer basis, and had he not, the campaign would have done it this year, and would have had 160,000 friends all on its own now, rather than having to start from scratch.


by CeeCee34 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 03:00:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: really (3.00 / 1)

The big increase in his workload (which caused him to ask for payment) was just web administration. And this increase in workload was due to the popularity of the candidate, not to any genius on Joe Anthony's part concerning site design or content.

He asked for payment because they wanted to take it over and push him aside -- not merely because his workload increased.  And his workload increase  is also a testament to the quality of the work he was doing.  Anthony's site isn't the only Obama dedicated site on the web.  Yet it had 160,000+ "friends".  But I'm sure that had nothing to do with the guy who has been generating content on the site for 3 years now, riiight.  

The guy started this as a labor of love, and was quite responsive and worked with the campaign for free.  He did the tough part for them.  Establishing the site and growing and maintaining, and they couldn't even be bothered to compensate him when they wanted to take it over.  Pretty pathetic on Obama's part.

Furthermore, taking into account the value of the site along with the work put in for the year is quite valid.  It' silly to ignore the value of the site as it is now.   The value of the site as well as the cost of the labor to maintain it should both be in play.

He started it on a volunteer basis, and had he not, the campaign would have done it this year, and would have had 160,000 friends all on its own now, rather than having to start from scratch.

But he did, and they wanted it.  What does it matter what might have happened if Obama would have done XYZ.  

If it's so simple to do what Anthony did, go ahead and start a page for a candidate that you support, grow the community to that size and then give it away.  Let's see how successful you will be.  It should be cake right?  Since the only thing that matters is the popularity of the candidate??


by avagias on Wed May 02, 2007 at 04:56:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: really (none / 0)

He didn't create Facebook... that like comparing a BB Gun to a Bazooka.  He had a myspace page.  People search myspace for Barack Obama and become his friend.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 03:23:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

They are not supporters that are engaged enough to have opted in? That's a ridiculous claim.


by Jerome Armstrong on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:45:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 2)

No, it's not. Being a friend on MySpace and being in a group on Facebook is merely an expression of interest for most people. It does not mean they are engaged in activism at all. Yes, some of them may have opted in to the campaign, but it's highly unlikely.


by PsiFighter37 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:49:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I don't know myspace all that well, but i know if you have a friend, you can contact them, right?


by Jerome Armstrong on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:06:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

That is different from being an engaged person.

And the only way MySpace could be an effective contact tool is if you can send a message to every single one of your friends, which is a feature I do not believe the website has.


by PsiFighter37 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:11:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Bulletin boards.

Tim


by Tim Tagaris on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:15:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Not a feature MySpace has...yet.  But I bet you that MySpace would be willing to allow the campaigns to have the feature if they pay for it...It can't be that hard to modify their code to do it.

They created the Impact Channel, which means they smell money here.  It doesn't take much to guess they'll add the feature later on.


by Conquest on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:15:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Yes, it is a feature ... bulletin boards.


by Tim Tagaris on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:27:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I thought you could, I'll check on it. I know that MySpace had in the works, last fall, the ability to text message all your friends from a phone. That's what I was thinking about, as far as the value.


by Jerome Armstrong on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:15:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

MySpace is predominantly a teenage site.  It has open borders which kids seem to shy away from when they get to high school and beyond. Users like the limits and control provided by the groups that Facebook offers.

As an example, after the murders at VA Tech, students used facebook to network not myspace. I suspect that whole lot of those 160,000 are under 18.


by aiko on Wed May 02, 2007 at 01:35:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

There are thousands of people trolling for friends on myspace. It doesn't translate into support perse. So your doom and gloom and hand wringing about how callous Obama is to poor little Joe misses a fundamental point.

To add insult to injury, you claim to have very little knowledge of how myspace works. Isn't that where you should have started Jerome?


by kekuta on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:18:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

Look I think Jerome's post goes a bit far in over estimating the power and impact of this group... but the Obama campaign did screw this up and should have negotiated and not kept rescheduling calls (provided Anthony is telling the truth)... that is unprofessional and those staffers should be dismissed immediately.  Above all though, there is no need to insult Jerome.  


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:21:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (2.33 / 3)

Ah, don't worry about it, these are Obama supporters, and it's typical to lash out at the messenger, no biggie.


by Jerome Armstrong on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:23:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 4)

And thank you forinsulting someone who stuck up for you.  I appreciate that Jerome.  I'm an Obama supporter too... There are irrational idiots supporting all 3 candidates here, not just Obama.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:27:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

lol, i'll stop why i'm ahead.


by Jerome Armstrong on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:30:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

ALl I am saying is its not cool to lump everyone together in a broad insulting generalization... what if I said, All Left Wing Bloggers are wackjobs with no sense of reality or All political consultants are really just whores, selling themselves to the highest bidder?  Pretty insulting statements... true of a few maybe, but definately not all...  See my point?


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:36:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I take umbrage at your accussation that I am insulting Jerome. That to put it nicely is untrue. I am just putting my point across and if you are that sensitive to criticism logged at Jerome...tough luck


by kekuta on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:24:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I saw your first couple of lines as insulting... If that wasn't your intent then my apologies...


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:28:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I have no reason to insult Jerome. If I come across as such...my apologies MR. ARMSTRONG


by kekuta on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:33:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

I didn't take it as an insult.


by Jerome Armstrong on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:37:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

What's the fundamental point?  I think having those friends of 160,000 is worth paying for, especially in comparison to having this story out there.


by Jerome Armstrong on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:22:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

The fundamental point is: you are building up a storm over a simple matter. If Joe was right, why would myspace take his domain from him. He was domain squatting and wanted to make a shit load of money out of it. That is unfair as well.


by kekuta on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:27:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

The above comment hit the nail on the head.  Why are you trying to fan the flames on this non-issue?  Anthony is guilty of domain-squatting and extortion.    The threat of bad PR only has teeth if sites (like this) portray Anthony's complaints as legitimate -- which, legally and ethically, they are not.


by grimm on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:51:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 2)

Cybersquatter?  The guy was working hand-in-hand with the Obama campaign for literally months.  The campaign implicitly endorsed his cybersquatting.  At the least, there's an estoppel case there.  On top of which, he had prominent disclaimers that he was not the actual person.  Obama's campaign could easily have created a new, official profile, w/ an '08 tag after his name.


by pseudo999 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 11:13:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

Domain squatting?

If I want I can (assuming it were available) buy the domain for Halliburton.com. IF Halliburton wants that site, they have to pay me for the rights, regardless of whether they had the name first. This is similar to "Doing Business As" situations. A man I once knew bought the rights to an insurance company's name/trademark in my state. Now, this company was located in a neighboring state but was expected to expand. When they DID expand, they had to buy rights to their own name from the guy who bought the rights.

So, basically, this is a "first come, first serve" sort of deal. As with patents, if you get to the patent office and obtain the rights to something FIRST, then you get the benefit of it if those rights suddenly become desirable for someone else.  If Obama doesn't think the site is worth $39,000, he could have counteroffered with what he thought it WAS worth. Otherwise, the site should have been Anthony's. IANAL, but I would say that he might very well have some legal claim against Myspace for doing Obama's bidding and taking away his page. Certainly an option he should look into.


by AmericanJedi on Wed May 02, 2007 at 11:26:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

Actually You are wrong about that... Its not the same as a DBA... to compare it to such shows you don't know what you are talking about.  A DBA is set up for a corportation or entity to operate under a different name, but that name is linked back to the original

Comparing it to a business however is not even an apples to apples comparison.  Its a cybersquatting case; there is no FIRST COME FIRST SERVE when it involves a famous persons name, since the value of the site is derived from the name.  THe precident on this is crystal clear.  In fact, now a days, the reason many people still buy up names is so that they can try and talk the person into letting them run the site or paying them, etc.  They still have to give up the site for little to no compensation.  

Whether Obama could legally sue for control is questionable, since it belongs to MySpace... but MySpace has every right to take away the name if they see fit.  


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 03:31:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Cybersquatting by definition pertains to domain names. A domain name is registered through a registrar that has the authority from ICANN to register domain names. An example of domain name is: BarackObama.com (which Mr. Obama's campaign owns). MySpace.com is also a domain name. ICANN (Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers) controls all domain names. They do not however control MySpace.com user names. I don't believe there is any law relating to which user names may be assigned to a particular user on a private website. Also, for it to be considered Cybersquatting, there must be evidence, not just speculation, that the domain name was acquired in bad faith to extort money from a trademark owner. This would be pretty difficult because Mr. Anderson was running a site promoting and benefiting Mr. Obama. And further, cybersquatting applies to trademarked names. Is Mr. Obama's name trademarked? By the legal definition, there is no cybersquatting case. The law applies to domain names, not user names.


by CerebralHorticulture on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:02:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

But are the 160K unique?  THAT'S the big issue here.  


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:29:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

If every single one of the 160k users were not unique, and each had two or three accounts, everyone one of them, that'd still be 50k users and it'd still be worth it.  That's highly unlikely.


by pseudo999 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 11:15:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I doubt there were 50K unique addresses that the Obama campaign didn't have.  I'd put money on it... the value was in setting up his name on MySpace, not in the friends list.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 03:32:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 2)

160,000 names from an opted-in list of POTENTIAL donors/volunteers, with an already built-in communications system that costs nothing else to use beyond a one-time fee, and the ability for those numbers to grow and extend out virally...

$39,000 is hardly an overpayment.  It's not a matter of what the kid who built this did - if that were the case, every campaign should give money to Al Gore for creating the internet (I kid), the people who started YouTube, the people at Google, the people who created MySpace and Facebook, and probably all of the 'net access companies.  This is a matter of the value of what the kid was sitting on.  It was worth $50,000 to get for sure - especially with a campaign that's at $26M after Q1.


Help build a stronger and more progressive Democratic Party from the grassroots on up
by Peter from WI on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:33:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I doubt it had a $50K value... But we won't know unless we find out the number of unique users between the Myspace group and other Obama controlled sites such as his website.  Any of those friends that are signed up on Obama's site already have no value to the campaign.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 03:34:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

people who spend so much time on the net always over-estimate it's value to those who do not.  my own opinion is that both sides were wrong.  joe probably overvalued his time (or worth) for creating a fansite.  the campaign should have responded to his offer with a request for an accounting of the requested payment.  nobody gets $40k without a breakdown of what it was for...


"Anyone who voted for me or caucused for me has so much more in common with Senator Obama than Senator McCain." -- Hillary Clinton
by bored now on Thu May 03, 2007 at 07:50:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 2)

And there is no chance that those people are already on his website?  

I think that's the issue here... you don't know MySpace well and seem to have the notion that MySpace is more than it is in the advocacy realm...  It builds exposure, sure, but not necessarily a donor list... there might be some on there not signed up to his site or other sites liek Facebook, but I would bet the vast majority are on his site as well as myspace.  So the question becomes how many of the friends are truly unique and how many have several memberships to various social networking sites including Obama's own social networking site?  

My sister and a good friend were members of that group... plus have a profile on BarackObama.com;  but they are in no way politically active, except voting.  So a good part of your friends on MySpace will be these people... enthusiastic supporters, but not going door to door for you.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:19:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

I'd guess that while there is obviously some overlap between his myspace friends and obama's site, there's probably a lot of them who aren't.  my question is, doesn't everyone really lose if Obama's campaign doesn't have access to those 160,000 from this resolution?


www.adamconner7.com
by Adam Conner on Wed May 02, 2007 at 11:13:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I don't know about Myspace, but on Facebook, you can set up to send out "notes" to your friends, so that they'll be notified on their facebook page.  So basically you have an electronic contact channel here that has no communication cost.

If you send out 1 mass mailer, that's going to cost at least 15-20 cents per contact for postage alone. So just in terms of postage costs alone, this list of 160,000 is worth at least what this guy is asking for.

This is a group of people that are going to be ok with weekly messages, and if you have a good voter contact crew, this will save you sending costly snail mail to this group.


by ManfromMiddletown on Wed May 02, 2007 at 04:00:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

There are two aspects to this.  

"committed supporters"? by being Myspace friends?

That's a definite "no".  You are wrong there.

And yet - this guy did good work for them.  They pay huge sums of money to consultants, and expect that this guy gets...nothing?  

I don't know if 50K is too much.   But again, give the guy a job, right?  Use people's energy and talents to your advantage.

We are assuming of course, that this guys is telling the truth.  


by jc on Wed May 02, 2007 at 12:58:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)


by liaozhi123 on Tue Oct 16, 2007 at 02:51:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I agree with the comment upthread (3.00 / 1)

should have given the guy a 39K check and thanked him for building up the site.

look at this comment on Joe's blog

This is such a negative impact on Baracks campaign and I'm very up set with his people!! This is my message to them!!!! "What you are doing to Joe is really screwed up!! Barack is a community ORGANIZER not a community DESTROYER!!! This is going to impact his campaign very negatively. We are a very strong community and have been for a long time and for you to take that away is down right unjust and a disgrace to Barack and all he stands for!! All Joe was doing was promoting this campaign and this is how you reward him!! I hope you reconsider your actions and let us have a unofficial fan site for Barack...Joe never ever pretended to be Barack. He has been very honest!! When I first found the site he told me exactly who he was..Infact his site is how I learned to donate to Barack's Campaign and start a profile on www.barackobama.com. Joes site is very valuable and should be rewarded not destroyed!!! Please let us keep our community...and please apologize to Joe for your mistake!!! "..:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office " /><o:p></o:p>

Posted by Kat on Tuesday, May 01, 2007 at 4:29 PM


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:48:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree with the comment upthread (3.00 / 1)

I agree.  I just used the "contact" form on the Obama website urging them to come up wiht a reasonable accomodation with Joe Anthony.  (And mentioned that I was a donor to the campaign while I was at it.)


Get a Vegetarian Starter Kit and a Dem. Party Mastercard
by Go Vegetarian on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:29:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree with the comment upthread (none / 0)

Are you a donor to his campaign?


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:32:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree with the comment upthread (none / 0)

Yeah.  $2300 a couple of months ago.


Get a Vegetarian Starter Kit and a Dem. Party Mastercard
by Go Vegetarian on Wed May 02, 2007 at 01:13:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree with the comment upthread (none / 0)

Just wanted to make sure.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 03:36:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree with the comment upthread (none / 0)

Ditto here.  I wrote my fundraising contacts for that campaign and made my opinion clear with my pocketbook.  They forwarded my email to the campaign manager.

I'm waiting to hear a response.


by jamiek on Wed May 02, 2007 at 01:21:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

Sure, being a friend on MySpace doesn't mean you're dedicated, but that's 160,000 contacts that they can reach out to.  That's 160,000 people that they can contact without too much effort.  How much would it cost them to get 160,000 contacts to willingly sign up with the campaign?  How many of those 160,000 contacts will be turned off by their moves here once this breaks in larger media?  Won't they feel used by Obama because he basically doesn't see their weak support as important?

I think this is going to be a large problem for the Obama campaign.


by Conquest on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:57:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 3)

They should have offered 15k and a personal meeting with Obama, and be done with this.  If this guy decides to sue this will get a lot more expensive to the Obama campaign in legal fees, even if the guy has no case.   Not to speak of the bad publicity this would create.


by georgep on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:47:30 AM EST

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 4)

I don't think he'd be stupid enough to sue... precident is pretty clear on this sort of thing...  But I agree with the rest of the sentiment... the campaign workers fucked up and should have negotiated.  Whoever declined to negotiate should eb terminated... immediately


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:03:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

What's the precedent?


Help build a stronger and more progressive Democratic Party from the grassroots on up
by Peter from WI on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:34:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Every Cybersquatting case out there is legal precedent.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 03:37:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

This, in my opinion, would not be protected by the Anti-Cybersquatting Consumer Protection Act. See my explanation here:

http://www.mydd.com/comments/2007/5/2/93 621/10103/174#174


by CerebralHorticulture on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:07:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I think they missed an opportunity as well. This guy Joe was obviously devoted to Obama and obviously helped bring at least some people (and money) to the campaign.

And dissing him, regardless of the pay issue, really sends the wrong message to the thousands and thousands of grassroots supporters that sent in $20 checks.

Its a campaign mistake that will hopefully be remedied.


by okamichan13 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 01:54:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

No chance he'll sue. One personal phone call from Obama, with the charm and the apology and an offer to make things right--and this is over. This guy invested hours and hours and hours into Obama's campaign; on some level, I bet he's still deeply committed.


by BingoL on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:05:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

True, but it's amazing how getting f'ed over will change a person's mind.


Help build a stronger and more progressive Democratic Party from the grassroots on up
by Peter from WI on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:34:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

That nails it - negotiate it, unless the guy really is an utter tool, simply out for the cash.  Which seems doubtful, given the time he put into it.


by jc on Wed May 02, 2007 at 01:02:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Wow. (3.00 / 1)

Tens of thousands of people's goodwill - if not more - swept away.

This is going to cost them more than $50K.


by MasonMcD on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:54:33 AM EST

Re: Wow. (none / 0)

Maybe... I was on that page and while I think its a big gaffe, it hasn't swept mine away. Plus he already had my info from his website... It will cost him some but saying it costs all the people is a bit much.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:04:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

heads should roll on Obama's team for this (none / 0)

I'm sure Obama was not directly involved in the dealings with this guy, but whoever was responsible for handling the situation should be fired ASAP. They were stupid to start driving people to the site if they were uncomfortable having a volunteer in control.

I have no idea what Joe Anthony's time and effort over more than two years is worth in dollars. Maybe his effort "only" built the community up to $30,000 people (before Obama's campaign started directing people to the site).

To me $50,000 doesn't sound like a lot of money to pay him. He helped build a thriving community.

And obviously, this bad publicity is going to be much more costly for Obama. He's not going to lose the yitbos96bbs of the world, but he will probably lose quite a few soft supporters in the netroots.

Fortunately for him, this is the kind of inside baseball story that is unlikely ever to gain wide currency among caucus-goers or primary voters in the early states.


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Wed May 02, 2007 at 02:59:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

This is what worries me about Obama (none / 0)

I think he lacks a feel for politics.  When it comes to elections politics is important.


by dpANDREWS on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:06:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Sure, the Obama campaign obviously blew this one--but give 'em a day or two, and they'll fix matters. Offer him the money, blame the staff, arrange a photo-op.

This is roughly analogous to the Edwards campaign's failure to do due dilligence regarding the hired bloggers. A mis-step, but not a particularly meaningful one.

My bet: within eight hours, this'll be resolved and Anthony will issue an extremely pleasant press release.


by BingoL on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:56:24 AM EST

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

This is roughly analogous to the Edwards campaign's failure to do due dilligence regarding the hired bloggers. A mis-step, but not a particularly meaningful one.

Ehh. In Edward's case, he pissed off Bill Donohue, and got some bad press in conservative circles.

Obama's pissing off his own people.


by MasonMcD on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:04:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

What's (roughly) analagous is lower-level staffers making potentially-damaging decisions, for lack of due dilligence.

I'll bet you ten virtual bucks that Obama's own people won't stay pissed through tomorrow.


by BingoL on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:08:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

You win. I don't a rats hoot.

;p


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:41:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I don't "GIVE"...a rat's hoot.

;p


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:41:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Is he though... There are some negative messages... but not even 1000 people's worth of them.  I don't think most supporters would care.  We'll see if the MSM picks this up... if not, then this dies fast... Techpresident is cool, but not exactly the New York Times or Chicago Tribune.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:09:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

The comments on Techpresident were not very friendly to Anthony...


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:12:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

Not analgous.

Edwards stands up for two campaign bloggers who piss off Bill Donohue.

Obama fails to grasp what this 'new' politics he keeps talking about really looks like.


Help build a stronger and more progressive Democratic Party from the grassroots on up
by Peter from WI on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:36:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 2)

Analagous:

Edwards staffers idiotically hire bloggers with easily exploited archives. When the problem blows up, the campaign does the right thing.

Obama staffers idiotically refuse to pay myspace guy. When the problem blows us, the campaign ...

Wait for it.

This is flash in the pan. It's a very interesting flash in the pan, because it highlights a new dynamic that campaigns face, but it illustrates a new truth about campaigns, not about Obama.

I'm a pretty strong Edwards leaner at the moment, but I try to call bullshit if it's focused on Edwards or Obama.

Of course, in both cases (the link is to my problem with Matt's tying O'Hanlon so closely to Edwards), I think there's more going on that meets the eye initially. It's in the interest of those of us to the left of the major candidates to try to draw them leftward. So we want to ping Edwards for a right-wing foreign policy, just to shove that window over, and we want to ping Obama for being unresponse to net-supporters, just to change the focus of his campaign.

Sometimes I suspect that I'm being presented with strategic information, and am responding with complaints about typos. But I do try to see the big picture, every now and again.


by BingoL on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:45:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Yes.

The feeling that you're being presented with strategic information or analysis for unseen reasons is a very annoying one.  Partly because the case for this behavior being sometimes necessary is a pretty good one.  And yet of course it still sucks.

It's just the insider/outsider dynamic creating itself all over again, inevitably.


by texas dem on Wed May 02, 2007 at 12:58:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 3)

There's stupid, and then there's epic stupid.

Guess which one this is?

What's the cost, monetized, to Obama's brand now as a roots empowering new age pol?


by Pachacutec on Wed May 02, 2007 at 09:59:10 AM EST

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (3.00 / 1)

Just regular stupid, because this is to easily reparable. Now, if it's not fixed by Friday morning, we're in epic territory ...


by BingoL on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:02:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

If I were Anthony, (assuming I don't have any anti-Catholic rants in my background), I'd solicit the Edwards campaign for a position and take my 160,000 "friends" with me.


by randron on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:01:53 AM EST

I was thinking how amusing it would (none / 0)

be if his redirected "friends" that myspace will provide him became a pro-edwards or pro-hillary site..


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:04:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

But the friends aren't anthony... I know some of the people on the list... some have Edwards as their #2 and some don't like him at all... That's the big mistake here... to think he controls 160K people.... he doesn't.  I would bet many of the people were already signed up on his regular website anyway.  Anthony might be able to convince a small group, but the bulk... not a chance.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:06:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

I think $50K was an absurd request.  I'd pay him half that at most.

I think the mistake the campaign made was not responding with a counteroffer quickly.  They could have easily said, "Here is what we normally pay for a list of soft supporters (that's all MySpace friends are - check how many are friends of multiple campaigns), that's what we'll give you."


Sean Robertson
by Sean Robertson on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:09:16 AM EST

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

Where does it say he asked for $50,000?


"And so in the place of the palace of privilege, we seek to build a temple out of faith and hope and charity."-FDR
by jallen on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:11:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

It says $39,000 and then split fees up to $10,000.  People are confusing the numbers.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:13:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

That's what I thought.  Oh well, this should be an interesting discussion to listen to for a few minutes, until something more important comes along.


"And so in the place of the palace of privilege, we seek to build a temple out of faith and hope and charity."-FDR
by jallen on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:14:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama blows into MySpace (none / 0)

People combine the $39K for the site and members he "nurtured," and up to $10K for any ad revenue!

I say, let the MySpace/Murdoch-owned company pay Mr. Anthony. They have profited from the publicity as well as the Obama campaign.


by Books Alive on Wed May 02, 2007 at 10:15:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

How much would Bob Schrum get? (none / 0)

The only reason it's an "absurd" request is that he is not an established campaign person.

But what do you expect from a campaign that hires (and pays FAR more to) people like Robert Gibbs: http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/2 /22/134458/142

There is a huge difference between a campaign that actually values its grassroots supporters and empowers them (e.g, the Dean campaign) and one that just wants to use them for its own purposes, like Obama's. In case anyone was in doubt on this point, the hiring of Gibbs was an unmistakable F.U. to Dean's supporters -- and Obama is far to savvy not to know this.


"We are building a political movement - not one that wields the power of lobbyists and corporate interests, but the power of millions... who seek change." -Dean
by Jim in Chicago on Wed May 02, 2007 at 11:19:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]