Go Bloomberg, Go!

This week, I have twice blogged (see here and here) about my hope that Mitt Romney would win the Republican nomination, because I believe he would be relatively easier to defeat in the general election than either John McCain or, especially, Rudy Giuliani. Now, given new polling evidence from Rasmussen, let me also encourage current New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg to join into the race (4/2-4/3, 800 LVs):

Two-Way Races
Clinton: 47%
McCain: 46%

Giuliani: 48%
Clinton: 47%

Three-Way Races
Clinton: 46%
McCain: 37%
Bloomberg: 9%

Clinton: 46%
Giuliani: 37%
Bloomberg: 9%

Without question, a Bloomberg run would be a major blow to the Republican ticket. According to these polls, he draws roughly 90% of supporters from people would be be otherwise inclined to support Giuliani or McCain. I don't know exactly whose support he receives, but the most likely group are the wide swath of Republican-leaning independents who, until recently, actually self-identified as Republicans. It is in this way that a Bloomberg run could not only be useful in helping Democrats win forty states, but in further dislodging disaffected, former Republicans over the long-term.

Last year, Jonathan rightly excoriated Al From of the DLC for attended a dinner designed to explore a Bloomberg run for the Presidency in 2008. However, and I'm sure I am giving From way too much credit for even speculating about this, maybe he was just there as a form of subterfuge in order to convince Bloomberg to run, thus guaranteeing a Democratic victory in 2008. I'd be down with that. I mean, after looking at these numbers, I am personally inclined to say, "go for it Mike!" Hell, if Bloomberg ran, and Romney was the nominee, we could score over 500 electoral votes.



Display:


Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

While I have always thought a hardcore right wing candidate could siphon off enough votes for a Democratic victory I am surprised a moderate like Bloomberg is drawing such a high percentage this early on. If Rasmussen is correct that would bring about a Clinton electoral and popular vote landslide.


BlueSunbelt.Com Netroots for the Sunbelt states robwire.com My personal blog
by robliberal on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 12:59:37 PM EST

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (3.00 / 2)

Agree about a right wing candidate. I suspect the Bloomberg numbers would change and he'd end up pulling in more of the mushing middle indys, dems and republicans.

I figure he'd play it as the guy with ties to a party so not having any strings tied to him. He could play at being mr. pragmatic this-is-just-how-it-really-is-let-me-tel l-you-folks and get Perot like numbers but from the middle.


by Quinton on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:04:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Much better to run Roy Moore (none / 0)

He could easily poll well enough in the deep south that we could pick up Mississippi and South Carolina.


by andgarden on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:04:42 PM EST

Re: Much better to run Roy Moore (none / 0)

I've been hoping that Tancredo will run as third-party candidate.


by Quinton on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:06:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Much better to run Roy Moore (none / 0)

There is still the possibility that Michael Savage may run and that Judge Roy Moore of Alabama may run on the Constitution Party ticket. Those would pull votes in the Deep South as well and it could put Alabama, Mississippi, and some others into play. If we had a race with more than one credible third party candidate the GOP could be doomed.


BlueSunbelt.Com Netroots for the Sunbelt states robwire.com My personal blog
by robliberal on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 02:18:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Bob Barr (none / 0)

And remember, the Libertarians are likely to run their most credible candidate in years with former Rep. Bob Barr, a born-again libertarian.  That will suck away Republican votes too.  Imagine: a weak GOP candidate with three GOPers on minor-party ballot lines.  1936, anyone?


by lorax on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 02:23:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bob Barr (none / 0)

I forgot about Barr. He even sounds "progressive" on many issues nowadays and would draw some right and left votes in a lot of areas.


BlueSunbelt.Com Netroots for the Sunbelt states robwire.com My personal blog
by robliberal on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 03:34:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I am founding SJRWARDFV (3.00 / 1)

Short Jewish Republicans who are really Democrats for Victory.


by dataguy on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:09:27 PM EST

It already exists (none / 0)

It's called "Connecticut for Lieberman"


"You say the world has lost it's love I say embrace what it's made of" -Dar Williams
by Valatan on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 05:59:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

National Polls (none / 0)

The question, though, is what happens where. Would he get enough votes in NY from both sides to put it in play? Are there states where his message appeals more to likely Democratic voters? And if so, are those states more important that the ones where he appeals to the GOP voters.


by CT student on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:09:31 PM EST

Re: National Polls (none / 0)

New York doesn't matter if we win by 9%. And besides, since he is clearly taking 90% of his support from Republicans, it wouldn't be a worry anyway.
by Chris Bowers on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:15:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: National Polls (none / 0)

But where are the 90% and the 10%? I feel like the kind of Republican who's likely to vote Bloomberg lives in a blue state - I can see a lot of CT and MA R's voting Bloomberg over McCain or Giuliani. That doesn't do us any good

And what if the Democrats who vote Bloomberg are overwhelmingly in Boca Raton? Then we're in trouble.

With a guy like Bloomberg who is so northeastern, the national poll is sort of meaningless.


by CT student on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 03:01:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: National Polls (none / 0)

New York doesn't matter if we win by 9%. And besides, since he is clearly taking 90% of his support from Republicans, it wouldn't be a worry anyway.

Yeah, or maybe not.  Maybe he's taking 20% from Giuliani/McCain in the south and 10% from Hillary in the north, which would radically change the state-by-state calculus.  Who knows?  National polls of hypothetical three-ways are just as useless as national polls of two-ways or the primary.


by aaronetc on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 03:15:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

HaHaHa, good one, Chris! (3.00 / 1)

Al From looking out for the interests of Democrats!  ROFL


Rudy Giuliani hates firefighters. And puppies.
by Fran for Dean on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:10:22 PM EST

Unity 08 (none / 0)

I have always thought that Unity 08 could become the new Republican party. I would not be surprised to see a complete implosion of the Republican party in 2008 and the Unity rise from its ashes. I would not be surprised if the 2016 presidential election shaped up between the Democratic President and the Unity nominee.


by Alice Marshall on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:20:15 PM EST

Re: Unity 08 (none / 0)

If we had a Democratic landslide in 2008 and 8 years of a Clinton, Obama, or Edwards administration the GOP would lose a lot of their base. Unity could emerage, a theocratic far right wing party could emerge, lots of things could be possible.


BlueSunbelt.Com Netroots for the Sunbelt states robwire.com My personal blog
by robliberal on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 02:20:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Unity 08 (none / 0)

I think we need a credible party to the left of the Democrats in order to ensure an enduring Democratic majority.  That way, with no change in platform, the Democrats could look like the centrist party while the Republicans are hopelessly marginalized.  This setup has kept the Liberals in charge in Canada for most of the last century (until a corruption scandal brought them down last year).  So I don't think it's as bad of an idea as many here do to see the Greens rise to a level of competitiveness in our safest districts.  That way, when Democrats like former Rep. Dan Rostenkowski are ousted in a corruption scandal, the voters aren't forced to pick a Republican.


by lorax on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 02:26:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (3.00 / 1)

People look at the last two elections and look at this as 1) stable and 2)normal.  Well, historically a long term close split for election after election with few or no states switching just doesn't happen.  The two times when it happened for two elections in a row were 1796/1800 and 2000/2004.  The last time before this, in fact, the only time before this, when a loser got 250 or more electoral votes before Gore (and then Kerry) was Charles Evans Hughes in 1916.

The 1796/1800 gridlock was followed by a very strong Democratic period and the actual demise of the Federalist Party.  There is certainly a good chance here that one side will get a Clinton like win with 370 or more electoral votes.  Right now the polls are showing that if anybody does that, it would be the Democrats.

The fundy/money establishment group running the Republican Party has not had even a temporary period of being completely out of power since 1993-95.  They really have not been out of it since pre-Reagan.  These guys just have no idea.  Only six GOP House members pre-date Reagan.  It is certainly my sincerest wish that they copy the Federalists and vanish from the political scene to be replaced twenty years later by a more moderate opposition party.  


by David Kowalski on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:22:06 PM EST

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

The situation between 1876 and 1892 shows a long-standing close split.  Once the southern states were "redeemed" and blacks disenfranchised, you had a situation where, more or less, the south was overwhelmingly Democratic, while the north showed a distinct, but smaller Republican advantage.  Only a few states were in play - primarily New York, Indiana, and Connecticut (Cleveland managed to win some other midwestern states  in 1892, in addition).  In these years, the Democrats generally had a slight overall edge in the popular vote (an unfair one, since it relied on the disenfranchisement of blacks), but because their support was concentrated in the south, they tended to have difficulty winning elections.  (The only race in these years in which the GOP won the popular vote was in 1880, which was probably the closest election in terms of the popular vote prior to 2000.) This only ended in 1896, when the Democrats embraced populism, which gained them competitiveness in the west, but lost them the northeast and insured large Republican electoral college until the GOP split over Progressivism in 1912 (and really, more broadly, until FDR was able to forge a majority Democratic coalition in 1932 - 1912 was a fluke, and the Democrats won in 1916 (as you point out, a very close election) largely thanks to the advantage of incumbency.

It's worth noting, though, that the long-standing even divide of 1876-1896 was largely due to the fact that the two parties were broad coalitions for identity politics, and that neither had any clear ideology.

All this being said, I'll just say that all these predictions of the death of the GOP are just as ridiculous as the belief Republicans were expressing a few years ago that they were going to have a permanent majority.  The Republicans may not be looking good now, but they'll be back.  They came back from coming in a distant third in 1912.  It's hard to see Mike Bloomberg succeeding where Teddy Roosevelt failed.  The Federalists were destroyed because they were seen as traitors  during the War of 1812, and because Madison and  Monroe co-opted all  their policies.  The Whigs were destroyed because of the slavery issue, a continuing cancer on American politics before the Civil War, which made a party which was essentially a coalition between northern anti-slavery protestants and southern plantation owners impossible to maintain.  (That the most important national Whig leader of the early 1850s (Seward) became the first Republican secretary of state to a man (Lincoln) whose first political idol was  Henry Clay,  suggests, in any event, that the demise of whiggery was greatly exaggerated - by the end of the 1870s or so, it's hard to see the GOP as anything but the old northern Whig party under a new name.

The Republicans may lose an election or two, but they'll be back.  And that's ultimately a good thing - one party rule is eventually corrosive, as the current Republican troubles suggest.


by jlk7e on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 03:04:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Yes. (none / 0)

Halfway through the Clinton administration, I realized that we were living through a second Gilded age.


"You say the world has lost it's love I say embrace what it's made of" -Dar Williams
by Valatan on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 06:06:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

1876 through 1896 produced mostly close popular votes but not so close electoral college votes.  Cleveland was elected twice following an extremely conservative hard currency policy.  In some ways, the similarity can be made re: triangulation )I'm not buying it.

Electoral college:

1876 185 R 184 D *stolen by Congressional recounts)

1880 214 R 155 D (not an electoral vote aqueaker)

1884 182 R 219 D (yes, barely)

1888 233 R 168 D (not an electoral squeaker even though Cleveland won the popular vote)

1892 145 R 277 D 22 other (populist)

1896 271 R 176 D

One can make a lot of comparisons to Adams + Jefferson and GW Bush/Rove.  Adams has historically (and at the time) been connected with limiting the rights of immigrants politically (the Alien Act required seven years of US residence for citizenship) for political gain and attacking civil liberties (the Sedition Act). In that case, Jefferson was the political mastermind, organizing the first political party and winning the 1800 election by flipping NY through putting NY City "semi sorta boss" Aaron Burr as VP (dangerous move).  Jefferson and his successors had a concrete political philosophy and did a better job of governing than Adams.

To get that long term majority, the Democrats not only have to govern well but have to mesh that with a popular political philosophy that bebefits a clear majority of Americans.


by David Kowalski on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 07:43:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

     The secret is giving weak Republican identifiers a half-way house for 2008. You don't go from a Bears fan to a Packers fan in one day. Give them a way out of the Republican Party in 2008, and many of them will eventually drift into the Democratic fold in the 2010s.
     Beyond that, we should do everything possible to cut down on the advantages Republicans receive from being one of the two major parties. Institute instant-runoff elections or blanket primaries, where the two top vote-getters, regardless of party, advance to the runoff. De-institutionalize the power of the criminal conspiracy which operates under the name of "the Republican Party."
by Ron Thompson on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:25:20 PM EST

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

and support the growth of alternative parties, like the Greens and the the Libertarians, depending on the district.  By regionalizing other parties and leaving the Democrats as the only true national party, our majority is secured.

Imagine this: a country in which the two competitive parties in the Northeast are the Democrats and Working Families; in the South and Midwest, the Democrats and Republicans; in the Mountain states, the Democrats and Libertarians; and on the West Coast, the Democrats and the Greens.  Keep the Republicans in their regional Southern prison, as the Democrats were for so much of their history, and they won't have a serious chance at securing a majority.


by lorax on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 02:30:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

On a more serious note (none / 0)

I wouldn't be so sure about Bloomberg being a guaranteed boost to Democrats / syphon of Republican votes.  Right now, anyone who knows who Michael Bloomberg is knows he's a Republican.  However, if he were to enter the race, he would be running as a Unity 08 candidate, and would supposedly have a Democratic running mate.  If that's the case, I can see Unity 08 taking just as many votes from the Liebercrat crowd as the "moderate/independent" Republican crowd.


Rudy Giuliani hates firefighters. And puppies.
by Fran for Dean on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:28:12 PM EST

On the other hand... (none / 0)

on the other hand, I bet it would depend entirely on who each party nominates.  If we nominate Barack Obama, I can't imagine we'd lose too many voters to Unity 08, and likewise if Republicans nominate Giuliani or to a lesser extent, McCain, I doubt they'd lose too many, either (since they're already seen as "moderates," though again McCain is losing that image quickly).  If we were to nominate Hillary, and they were to nominate a Tancredo, or Gingrich or someone like that, Unity 08 could definitely pull a lot more from both sides, as the D and R nominees would be seen as more "partisan", and the mushy middle could be attracted to a "moderate" or "bipartisan" ticket.


Rudy Giuliani hates firefighters. And puppies.
by Fran for Dean on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 01:35:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: On the other hand... (none / 0)

Which is, of course, absolutely insane, as Obama is more partisan than Clinton.  

But whatever.  Insane, but true.


"You say the world has lost it's love I say embrace what it's made of" -Dar Williams
by Valatan on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 06:12:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: On the other hand... (none / 0)

Obama is seen as bipartisan, and to an extent it is true.  He HAS found ways to work with Republicans on issues where they have common ground.  Of course, Obama is certainly more liberal/progressive/whatever than Hillary, but Hillary has spent years being villified by the right as being a crazy liberal.


Rudy Giuliani hates firefighters. And puppies.
by Fran for Dean on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 08:59:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Bloomberg's Expert at Drawing Lib/Dem Support (none / 0)

Imagine $500 million being thrown at Democratic and independent voters touting Bloomberg's health, environmental, and security record in New York. He doesn't have huge name recognition now, but if he runs and puts his money behind his bid, he will and he'll do so by touting his largely liberal record in NYC. That was the secret to his overwhelming 2005 mayoral win; he did it with loads of Democratic support, and it's a sure thing he'd pick up more once more Dems (even liberal Dems) hear about his NYC record.


- Glenn Hurowitz
by Democratic Courage on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 02:21:28 PM EST

Re: Bloomberg's Expert at Drawing Lib/Dem Support (none / 0)

Bloomberg is a good day to day manager of NYC and has for the most part governed slightly left of center.  I have never voted for him but I am not displeased with his performance.  However, he has weak political skills and an incredible tin ear.  He is still defending Con Ed on their handling of the disastrous blackout last year in Western Queens that lasted 8 days.  

He has been blessed in Mayoral runs with 2 incredibly weak and flawed candidates in Mark Green and Freddy Ferrer which speaks to the weakness of the NYC Dem party on the municipal level.  I have no doubt that candidates like Clinton, Obama or Edwards would not just crush him in NYC but nationally.  This guy is not a serious Presidential candidate.


by John Mills on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 03:34:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bloomberg's Expert at Drawing Lib/Dem Support (3.00 / 1)

With $500 million any candidate could get at least a few points in a national election no matter how bad they might be.


BlueSunbelt.Com Netroots for the Sunbelt states robwire.com My personal blog
by robliberal on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 08:47:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bloomberg's Expert at Drawing Lib/Dem Support (none / 0)

Agreed but if he approaches Ross Perot's numbers in either race I'd be surprised.  I just don't see him as a serious candidate.  He only takes off if people are unhappy with the party nominees but Dems seem to be so pumped and energized I just don't see it happening.


by John Mills on Sat Apr 07, 2007 at 05:17:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

I also think that Nader will get in if Hillary is the candidate.

He would pull 5-6% because of the war and that would be the only reason. I suspect the war will still be goung on in 2008


by BDM on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 03:29:43 PM EST

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

Perhaps not if Edwards is.  With Edwards' platform, and IIRC Nader has endorsed him before, he'd probably stay out.


"And so in the place of the palace of privilege, we seek to build a temple out of faith and hope and charity."-FDR
by jallen on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 04:37:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

I think Nader said some weeks ago the only two acceptable Democrats are Dennis Kucinich and Mike Gravel. If they do not win Nader will once again be "forced" to run.


BlueSunbelt.Com Netroots for the Sunbelt states robwire.com My personal blog
by robliberal on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 08:46:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (3.00 / 1)

I think these numbers speak to the overall strength of the Dem field.  Most Dems seem to be pleased with their choices which is not something I can remember in my lifetime.

Unless, Bush changes course, something he is incapable of doing, I think the 2008 election is going to be a blowout for the Dems.  People across the country seem totally fed-up with the Repubs.  This is starting to remind me of 1980 in reverse.


by John Mills on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 03:41:01 PM EST

Re: Go Bloomberg, Go! (none / 0)

Romney is a wolf in sheep's clothing. You root for him at your own risk.

Check out Taylor Marsh. She knows:
http://www.taylormarsh.com/tag_results.p hp?displayTag=Mitt%20Romney

I think McCain is the one we should be rooting for. He is totally discredited, and is a 70 year old coot. Remember Bob Dole? McCain is only going to get worse as the year wears on.


by lectric lady on Fri Apr 06, 2007 at 11:14:57 PM EST


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