SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Thread

This coverage is sponsored by SEIU, the fastest-growing union in North America, with 1.8 million members in the United States, Canada, and Puerto Rico.

LAS VEGAS -- The SEIU/CAP presidential forum on healthcare at UNLV has begun. I'll be live-blogging in this thread and you will be able to watch a stream of the forum right here from Think Progress. The format of the forum is as such: Each candidate will speak for two to three minutes then take questions from moderator Karen Tumulty of Time magazine for 17 minutes. The order of candidates (which was determined by the order in which they accepted the invitation to the event) is Edwards, Richardson, Obama, Clinton, Dodd, Kucinich and Gravel.

Note: The extended write-up follows below the fold.

John Podesta of CAP and Andy Stern of SEIU take the stage to kick things off. Podesta notes the presence of of Rep. Shelley Berkeley and Elizabeth Edwards. Also notes that this is the first presidential debate to focus directly on healthcare and the first to take questions from the blogosphere. Stern recognizes the members and leadership of SEIU in attendence and speaks about the problems with America's healthcare system. Stern also underscores polling that clearly indicates that Americans do not want piecemeal reform but rather want to see a broad change, as a number of Governors and Senators understand. Tumulty takes the stage and notes finally that this forum is not about the latest YouTube video or the back and forth of the campaign but rather just about healthcare. What's more, she explains that all candidates of both parties were invited.

The first candidate of the morning is John Edwards, who begins by thanking the many people, including his fellow candidates, who extended their well wishes and prayers to his family. States that "we have a disfunctional healthcare system in America" and that there needs to be sweeping change. His plan would cover all Americans by requiring all employers to cover their employees or pay into a fund. In regions around the country, there would be pools of plans for Americans to choose, and Americans indeed would be able to choose their plan. The Edwards plan would also require preventative care and also provide subsidies for those earning below about $80,000 annually. The cost of the plan would be between $90 billion and $120 billion, which would be covered by rolling back tax cuts for the wealthy.

Tumulty's first question centers on whether Edwards is in the race to stay given his wife's health situation. Edwards states that he will, highlighting his family's -- and other families' -- ability to endure through healthcare crises in the past. Edwards also centers on the fact that other families have had to deal with this situation without healthcare coverage. The second question comes from an employer concerned with rising healthcare costs. Edwards states his concern that American businesses have a competitiveness deficit because of the higher healthcare costs for companies in our country, a problem that would be directly impacted for the positive by his plan. Question three from an emailer via Tumulty focuses on the pushback to efforts to reform healthcare in the past. Edwards notes that because his plan lowers the cost of healthcare for businesses through efficiencies like preventative care, etc., businesses will buy in. Tumulty's fourth question asks whether universal healthcare can be achieved without raising taxes. Edwards answer, in short, is "no", there needs to be "an additional source of revenue." Edwards also says that, particularly given what's happened in the last several years, it's important for the President to be honest -- and that begins with the campaign. The fifth question focuses on the dichotomy between single-payer and our current system, to which Edwards states that we need action now and his plan is achievable because it has choice. It could be that in some time the system will move towards single-payer, but for now change must be accomplished. The final question comes from an RN in the audience centering on nurse retention and safety. Edwards states that he believes universal healthcare can help towards this issue, also saying there needs to be new incentives, new subsidies, new scholarships to train new nurses.

Candidate number two for the morning is Bill Richardson (unsusually in a suit, not a blazer), who states that his first thoughts are about Elizabeth Edwards and, relatedly, that we should spend more on cancer research and stem cell research. Richardson says that he understands first hand as a governor the issues with healthcare. "All Americans and all businesses... should be able to buy the same coverage as Members of Congress and the President" and Medicare should be available for those at an even younger age (60, I believe he said, instead of 65). Veterans' healthcare should also be improved by giving them a card that would grant them access to any hospital. To deal with costs, Richardson says we should use tax credits to help those without healthcare get it, tamp down on credit card companies that have high rates on medical related debt, that there should be prevention (a la his ban on junk food in school and smoking around the state, and that there should be new efficiencies, including electronic medical records. To pay for these changes, Richardson calls on using the money now going to fund the Iraq War to pay for domestic priorities like healthcare. Richardson concludes that his plan would not add bureaucracy or raise taxes, and that if people like their current plans they will be able to keep it.

The first question from Tumulty asks how long it would take to achieve universal healthcare under his plan, to which Richardson replied that his plan could achieve it within a year. The second question centers on the Schwarzenegger healthcare plan, which covers illegal immigrants. Richardson says, "They're children... and we should cover children." He also says that we need to deal with immigration through securing the borders (not through the "stupid" wall) but also through legalization. The next question, from the audience, centers on the healthcare accessible to members of Congress and federal employees. Richardson says that this is the "cornerstone" of his plan, that these programs should be open to all Americans. The next question, via email, centers on how his experience as Governor of New Mexico prepares him to deal with the issue nationally. "What we need to do is what we do in the states," says Richardson, pointing to some of the things he's done in New Mexico which he mentioned in his opening statement. He also focuses directly on prevention, shifting from just treatment to prevention. The next question on mental health comes from a member in the audience. Richardson says that mental health has been long overlooked, but that there needs to be a focus on dealing with the issue, which faces one in five Americans. This also means dealing with treatment for substance abuse, including dealing with the growing meth problem, which particularly affects the West. The next question from Tumulty asks if there should be mental health parity; Richardson that his plan would cover mental health, but also notes that lowering the 31 percent in administrative costs would open up more money for direct care. The final question centers on the balance between costs and access. Richardson that it needs to be both, not just one or the other, also speaking to "taming the bureaucracy."

Barack Obama is the third candidate of the morning, and he begins by thanking the hosts, focusing on SEIU, which he has had a close relationship with. Obama speaks to the fact that many of the benefits of the growth in the economy have just gone to those on the top, not to the workers, stating that instead both "the burden and the benefits of the new economy" should go to everone. This issue plays directly into the healthcare debate. Obama states that he will be laying out his program in the next few months, that broadly it should be fully implemented by the end of the next president's first term -- "my first term".

Tumulty's first question focuses on the lack of details in Obama's plan, with an SEIU member in the audience directly asking the question. Obama explains that his campaign is just eight weeks old, but that there will be a plan in the coming months. The basic principles of his plan are that "everyone's in"; that there needs to be new efficiencies (from prevention, dealing with chronic treatment more intelligently, new medical technology, decreasing administrative costs, etc.) that can be put towards covering those now without coverage; creating a new pool for coverage, perhaps like the one in which Senators are enrolled; and finding lower costs, such as through the use of generic drugs, not only name brand ones. Following up, Tumulty asks whether where funding should come from, what type of mandates there should be, whether we should continue basically with this system or to come up with a new system, etc. Obama again notes that he is developing his plan, but that he also wants input from Americans through roundtable discussions around the country. That said, Obama favors pooling to increase access but that it will take some time to transition away from the employer-based system but that, for now, employers will either need to pay or play (give their employees healthcare or pay into a system). The next question from the audience centers on differences in coverage for minorities. Obama says that much of this issue will be alleviated by moving towards universal healthcare but also notes that the vast majority of those without coverage are in fact working. Targeted programs dealing with issues like obesity, nutrition ("not just Popeye's"), led paint, and HIV/AIDS will make an enormous difference. The next question, which comes from email, focuses on the issues facing working, single mothers. "We're going to need to provide them a subside so that they can have access to healthcare. It's that straight forward," replied Obama. Pooling will address this issue, because many small employers cover so few people that they can't get the necessary savings now. On a side note, Obama says that we don't only need a plan but a political consensus. To this, he says he is more optimistic because employers are now participating in the debate. The final question from Tumulty is whether taxes must be raised. Obama says that money must be put in on the front end to make these changes but that by making the system more efficient more money will be available for coverage. Nonetheless, he's not at the point at which he's come to a conclusion that there needs to be additional revenue, but he's open to it. He also does not want healthcare providers (doctors, nurses, etc.) to be squeezed by these changes.

The fourth candidate of the morning is Hillary Clinton (who speaks with slightly more of a Southern accent than she usually does), who first sends her thoughts and prayers to John and Elizabeth Edwards. Clinton also thanks the hosts of the event for directly taking on the issue of healthcare, which she notes she worked on a decade ago. "I'm proud we tried," said Clinton, and that even though "we didn't succeed" at least a groundwork was set. Clinton also says that she is proud that all Democrats running are committed to universal coverage, saying that she, in particular, is committed to covering the millions without healthcare but also ensuring coverage for all Americans -- even those who already have it. Among other things, Clinton says that it is time to end insurance discrimination and that she will soon introduce legislation to achive this. Clinton also focuses on efficiencies and improving quality of care. To conclude, Clinton states that her battle scars only make her even more determined and that she is talking about healthcare at every chance she can get so that there is a movement built around reforming healthcare.

Tumulty's first question focuses on Clinton's statement that money will need to be taken away from those who are making out well in the current system. Clinton responds that insurance companies employ a lot of people trying to block coverage to some of those who they insure and that this will need to change. She uses a couple of stories to underscore this issue, saying that people should not need to call their Congressman or Senator to get their insurer to pay for a medical issue they need dealt with. Clinton also says that there needs to be incentives for preventative care, not just treatment after the fact. Tumulty's second question centers on whether the Clinton plan with mirror the previous Clinton plan, which at the time was controversial in part because of the employer mandate. Clinton says that if we are going to keep the employer-based system, every employer will either need to offer coverage or pay into a pool. She also says that individuals need to be responsible, including young people who believe they don't need coverage. On a separate issue, Clinton notes that we already have some good programs like Medicare and the federal employees benefit program that have significatly lower administrative costs than the current private system -- but that people will be able to keep their plans if they want (they will not be forced into a government program). Relatedly, she says that she will sell her plan better than she did the last time, which people were concerned that they would be forced into a plan with less choice. The next question comes from the audience and it centers on reining in healthcare costs. Clinton says that she wants to end insurance discrimination and that legislation needs to be enacted to implement electronic records (noting that she passed the bill through the Senate but that it got bottled up in the Republican House previously). Tumulty follows up asking where the funding for up front costs would come from, if there needs to be new taxes. Clinton says that we are already spending enough money in the system -- more per capita than anywhere else in the world -- but that up front costs for things like electronic records would not in fact cost so much, perhaps $200 million. Additionally, Clinton says that Americans, herself included, need to take better care of themselves. The final question centers on the timing of her plan (she says two terms, others say one), to which Clinton responds that it will take time to implement. Yet Clinton also underscores the importance of creating a groundswell among Americans so that some Republicans join the effort, because 60 votes are needed in the Senate (noting that Republicans filibustered in 1994).

The fifth candidate, sans tie and in a blazer, is Chris Dodd, who thanks the hosts and also notes that his thoughts are with the Edwards family. Dodd notes his strong ties to labor and that he wants to stand with organized labor, including SEIU. Dodd says that although he is in some ways preaching to the choir here, we need to make changes (noting statistics showing that we aren't doing enough). Dodd states that things like income equality greatly affect healthcare in America, and that more must be done on that front. Dodd's principles for healthcare include universality, prevention, extending on the successes of Medicare and Medicaid, and investing in and better utilizing new technologies. To conclude, he highlights his achievements in healthcare, including his leadership on family medical leave legislation and that he founded the children's caucus in the Senate, and we can't just achieve this in a 51-49 situation but that a consensus must be achieved. Dodd also states his support for Americans getting at least as good as coverage as Senators.

Tumulty's first question (aside from noting that Dodd is the candidate who can most properly pronounce "Nevada") focuses on the fact that the Clinton healthcare plan, which Dodd co-sponsored, never got a vote. Dodd responds that the problem is significantly greater today because the costs are so much higher and, as a result, employers and others who previously were opposed to reform can now be brought on board. He also talks about bringing people from both sides of the aisle aboard, including some Republican Senators he's worked with for decades. The next question, from the audience, centers on expanding healthcare to children. Dodd moves in a related direction noting that he will be introducing legislation that will overturn the decision by the national labor relations board that blocked many nurses from organizing. Dodd also highlights his work on children's issues and family medical leave, noting additionally that Head Start needs to be expanded, autism must be dealth with, more in-school centers, etc., among other things. The next question, via email, asks what the largest issue dealing with healthcare is, to which Dodd responds dealing with costs, that unless this is dealt with, through incentives and otherwise, we might be back in four or eight years dealing with the exactly same issue. (Unfortunately, I missed the end of the questioning due to a personal situation caused by an excess of coffee this morning.)

The next candidate is Dennis Kucinich, who says that it is time for a sweeping change that truly deals with private insurance companies. Kucinich says that there should be Medicare for all -- a single-payer, not-for-profit system -- hearkening back to Lincoln and emancipation, suffragettes and women's suffrage, King and civil rights, Cesar Chavez and organizing, etc.

Tumulty's question notes that Kucinich is the only candidate on the stage so far advocating for single-payer but that the last time it was on the ballot, in Oregon, it was voted down overwhelmingly. Kucinich says there needs to be more leadership to overcome the millions of dollars from the insurance industry, which were spent in Oregon and which would be spent around the country. Kucinich says that this is not American Idol -- we're electing a President. The next question comes via email and it centers on the rising costs, to which Tumulty adds the question over how rising costs might affect a single-payer system. Kucinich responds that although the insurance companies warn about rationing, the current system has worse than rationing -- 50 million without healthcare and another 50 million underinsured -- as a result of the major costs going to administrative costs and corporate profits. The next question, from the audience, focuses on rural issues. Kucinich notes that his plan would cover everyone -- urban, suburban and rural -- but that his proposed investment in infrastructure would positively impact rural communities. Another question from the audience focuses on how healthcare costs impact employers, to which Kucinich responds that many comanies are indeed negatively impacted by the high costs but that his program, by limiting administrative costs, would alleviate a number of these problems. Tumulty asks about Kucinich's opinion about Edwards' plan, which includes the option of single-payer but does not mandate it. Kucinich says that such competition would lead to the government only getting the most expensive healthcare consumers, which could bring down the system, and that government should not be subsidizing private insurers. Kucinich also scoffs at the notion that the other candidates actually support universal coverage.

The last candidate on stage is Mike Gravel, who offers his condolences for Rebels fans (UNLV's basketball team lost last night) and who thanks the organizers for including him in the forum (where others are not). Gravel says that we need to get rid of the employer-bases system, which was a relic of a bygone era. As such, Gravel says that he supports a universal, single-payer, voucher-based healthcare system in which everyone gets the same product, which people could add to by buying coverage on top of it. Gravel also notes that he was bankrupted by healthcare costs in his past. (Gravel runs noticeably over his 3-minute time limit for his opening.)

Tumulty asks how he would pass his plan, to which Gravel moves to his bread and butter issue: a nationwide initiative process, which he explains in some depth. The next question, over email and from the audience, centers on the hybrid nature of Gravel's plan, being both single-payer and voucher-based, but also on the role prevention plays in his plan. Gravel says that there needs to be leadership from the President on healthcare issues, speaking about how obesity can at least in some way be abated by using the bully pulpit to cajole Americans into making good choices about their nutrition and exercise. The next question also comes from the audience and it also focuses on prevention, particularly for seniors but also for all Americans. Gravel says that he wants to phase out Medicare and Medicaid over time through the implementation of his voucher plan. Responding to Tumulty's follow up, Gravel lashes out at trial lawyers and medical malpractice liability costs. The final question from Tumulty is where does Gravel go from here. Gravel admits that "lighting would have to strike" for him to win, but that lightning has struck in the past and that he only needs a modicum of funding to get his message out.

That wraps up the candidate portion of this forum, but John Podesta and Anna Berger will be talking with the press in a few minutes, and I'll be blogging that as well. Any particular questions for them?

Berger notes that this event was successful because it brought more focus to the debate over healthcaere and because it underscored the determination to provide coverage to all Americans, and Podesta concurs. On the question of where things move forward given that no Republican candidates showed up, Berger states that SEIU is still going to try to work with Republican candidates to join in the debate. Another questioner asks the level of specificity SEIU is looking forward for, to which Berger responded that she was happy with the participation of so many candidates. Someone also asked about SEIU's endorsement process, to which Berger answered that they are still working on it. Another question on response to what was heard, Podesta highlights that Clinton threw out some new ideas, that Edwards had an opportunity to speak about his new plan, that Obama is still working on his plan but was able to speak about his general ideas and that Richardson was able to talk about prevention and the work he has done in New Mexico (and apologizes for the fact he didn't cover the other candidates). One other questioner asked if Berger and Podesta were unhappy with the fact that none of the candidates, other than Edwards, seemed to speak to how they will pay for their plans, Berger notes that other candidates actually did speak to some if this question. On the question of healthcare for illegal immigrants, Berger noted that the position of SEIU was that people should come out of the shadows and that all Americans -- all Americans -- need to be covered.



Display:


Past Experience? (3.00 / 1)

I'd really be interested in knowing if Hillary mentions, at all, the Clinton administrations' failed attempt at health care reform in 1993 & 94.


by howardpark on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 12:56:16 PM EST

Edwards (3.00 / 3)

Is it just me....or was Edwards truly exciting when he was speaking about the issue? I loved the fact that he brought up the idea that he needs to be upfront about the taxes it will take-especially since its a reality-that way no one can try and bite him in the A** later with it.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:08:49 PM EST

no one else is (3.00 / 1)

going to say how they'd pay for it...


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:16:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: no one else is (none / 0)

Obama has said he will roll back bush tax cuts juts like edwards.

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20070222/NEWS09/7022 20396/1001/NEWS

I wish he said this at the forum. I think he wants to roll back the cuts to fund numerous programs not just health care and wants to determine how much his plan will cost before he answers where the funding will come from.


by dpg220 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:48:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: no one else is (none / 0)

Obama took the right approach... he said he is open to raising taxes if the need arises, but until he has finalized his plan and also see what people want, then he won't say it HAS to be done because there is a chance it might not.  As a small business owner, I like the pooling ideas.

I respect Edwards saying he will raise taxes as being honest... Hopefully, it won't be necessary.  I would like to know specifically what he is talking about raising.. just repealing Bush's cuts for the rich or new taxes?


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:48:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: no one else is (none / 0)

I think the Bush Tax Cut rollbacks will pay for most of it. However, new revenue will ahve to come in to continually supply the system and to keep it fro running at deficits. So what I grasped from that is nex taxes will have to come on top of the tax rollbacks; however, the level of tax raises would also be significantly less than with a single payer system.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:52:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: no one else is (none / 0)

I wonder if we spent money better in government and didn't waste it on all the fucking earmarks and outspending the world in defense, if we couldn't avoid tax increases (outside the rollback)


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:55:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: no one else is (none / 0)

Eh.........perhaps. but one must also realize that a lot of the spending now on defense is deficit spending. So we're not really  fully spending american money, we're spending loans. Edwsrds' plan also assumes that we are cutting the deficit at the same time.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:13:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: no one else is (none / 0)

Even with a balanced budget we still spent more on Defense than EVERY OTHER COUNTRY in the world COMBINED!  This was during the balanced budget of the Clinton years mind you... so that doesn't take in account W's handout to Halliburton.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 05:59:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I do not like Obama's force feeding of generic's (none / 0)

You should be able to chose and not have them just look at stuffing Generics in the drug program down everyones throat.

IF they can negotiate the price of Generics they can also do it for Brand.

Obama's plan made me think of a take it or leave it, no choice kind of plan.

We have had enough of the no choice route!

I do not like Obama's plan.
Kucinich's either.


Check out the New Progressive Blog EENRBLOG
by dk2 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:25:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I do not like Obama's force (none / 0)

Big surprise there.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 05:59:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I do not like Obama's force (none / 0)

I don't think you're really helping Obama being negative on here...


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 06:23:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

just rollling back bush tax cuts (3.00 / 1)

however, he's noted (but not party of any plan)  that brokerage houses currently do not even report capital gains to the IRS.

as part of the taxing wealth like you tax work, Edwards would like to see capital gains reported to the IRS to increase revenue


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:30:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: no one else is (none / 0)

There are lots of reasons though to roll back Bush's tax cuts on the rich - health care is just one of them. I know its politically risky, but its about more economic parity and a rejection of trickle down economics.

Obama needs to be clearer I think on what his priorities are.


by okamichan13 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 05:25:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

To be fair, until he had decided on his .. (none / 0)

.. plan, John Edwards did not say where the money was coming from. For example, in the Gnomedex Q&A 1 (YouTube), John Edwards talks (at the end) about just the basic goal of universal health care, as opposed to all the weasel words that are used to sound good on health care without really taking a stand for Universal health care.

When he worked out his plan and knew that it needed what it does to reach Universal Health Care, then he could say how the plan can be funded.

Now, there are some pressing challenges to America's position in the world - the catastrophic Iraq invasion and occupation, the runaway current accounts deficit, the deepening dependence on imported energy - that every Senator should have a position on, and ought to be able to give his or her stand on the second that he or she puts up his or her hand to run for President.

However, for a large range of domestic issues that, under the committee system, it is normal for Senators to specialize in a particular area. So, as critical as this issue is, and as important it is that we hold Senator Obama's feet to the fire in terms of the credibility and ambition of his plan, it is only reasonable to allow him three to six months to hammer out his plan.


*John Edwards* ... and the JE08 Supporters Blog
by BruceMcF on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 04:18:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

are you at the event Johnathan, or just watching on webcast?


by eteraz on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:13:30 PM EST

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

Yes, I'm here in the press galley (but not in the hall). It's a little quieter in here and thus easier to live blog.


Blogging here @ MyDD.com. Twittering @jonathanhsinger.
by Jonathan Singer on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:17:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

is that behind the cameras? that's where i am. front row behind cameras.


by eteraz on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:21:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

sorry to any richardson but he's so full of it.

he's blaming the private insurance "beauracracy" but isn't going to create any government plan..

are people really that dumb to think this is a plan?

empty platitudes


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:17:42 PM EST

Re: Richardson is full of it (3.00 / 1)

Exactly....the crowd was less than enthused with him too.

Obama is falling flat too....he is just pushing out tired platitudes.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:24:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

question from the audience (3.00 / 1)

member to Obama..

she went to Obama's website but couldn't find anything on healthcare....

ouch...


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:27:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Obama promises (3.00 / 1)

in a couple months to have something on his website.

questioner asking the follow up. if Obama can share his thoughts on what possibilities "intrigue" him...

Obama will set up round table discussions with experts over the next couple of months to figure it out..


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:31:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama promises (none / 0)

Roundtable discussions: washington for ain't nothing going to happen.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:35:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama promises (none / 0)

That's if it's happening once elected. It's okay to have roundtables now.  Anyone else remember Clinton's 1992 economic roundtables before the inauguration?

Candidates can't roll out every since plan this early; they'd have nothing left to make headlines for months.


by Adam B on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:59:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

or have to defend it (none / 0)

for many months


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:10:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: or have to defend it (none / 0)

Granted.  But until then, people are free to attack the absence of detail as well.


by Adam B on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:12:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama promises (none / 0)

True..the Clinton Roundtables were awesome. I think though that a presidential forum like his really isn't going to be reaching the vast majority of Americans. This is a fairly specialized forum, so any plan the candidate offers they will have multiple opportunities to make rounds with it in the press in the coming months.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:22:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama promises (none / 0)

Its march... one paces themselves in a long cycle... his plan...good or bad.. when it comes out will make headlines giving him some  additional press.  Strategically its a good decision as long as he stays close in polls.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:51:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama promises (none / 0)

Ah there's the cynical attitude that gets things done.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:49:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama promises (none / 0)

Actually, I could say the same thing about your above comment on it being a good strategy for Obama to purposefully not present a health care plan while at the same time asking people to support him based on broad generalities.


by adamterando on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 09:31:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Obama promises (none / 0)

Is that that same as 'focus group it'


by del on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:30:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (3.00 / 1)

Ha ha....yeah, that was a genius question by her. I laughed so hard. I must admit that Obama handled it fairly well though.

Obama: I HOPE we can set up a federal system......?

You HOPE? Isn't this your time to say what you KNOW you can do or at least are damn sure what you can do?

This is kind of brutal to watch
 


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:32:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (3.00 / 0)

He HOPES because Congress has to make the bill. He has to sign it. So, he HOPES they implement the plan he proposes.

;p


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:40:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

Eh...it sounded to me more like he was unsure that a plan could be created that used the federal system. But that could have been my ears.

He sounded genuine, way more than richardson.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:12:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I know there's (none / 0)

some richardson fans, but that was the most I've heard him talk and he was full of hot air.


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:15:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I know there's (none / 0)

I hate to do this because I feel sorry for him and I like him, but you are right. I confess. I was sitting up here laughing when he was talking. How many times did he use the word "governor" ? I'd say 100 at the least.


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:20:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I know there's (none / 0)

I like Richardson too and was excited for him to speak. Too bad he didn't make more of an impression.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:23:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I know there's (none / 0)

Yeah. I was laughing because I felt embarrassed for him.


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:28:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I know there's (3.00 / 0)

He has that effect on people ...

Seriously, that's why I started having doubts about him. Once you get him talking for more than a couple of minutes on any domestic issue outside of energy, he really starts to sound like he's just vamping, only from a 1998 playbook. I'm starting to think all those folks who have him pegged for SecState or VP at best are right.

I still kinda like the guy just because he's got the best peace vision around, and his energy work has been great. But ... that just isn't enough.


by BriVT on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:41:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

What plan?  More vagueness and "hope" again.

I would have thought he would be prepared for this forum.

Obama is a decent guy and his heart seems to be good, but he needs some specifics.

I thought it was a flat performance.  He does better with big crowds and broad, vague statements.  The debates will be interesting.  


by littafi on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:02:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

He said he'd role his plan out in the next few months... strategically it is smart as it creates headlines when they are needed.  


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:59:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (3.00 / 1)

So are the proposed roundtable discussions a strategic move for headlines or are those part of the new kind of politics?

I'm just really getting impatient here. I understand the strategy. But it smacks of calculation and manipulation.

Yes, his campaign is only 8 weeks old, but who said that only presidential candidates can come up with a UHC plan? Wyden has one and he sure ain't running. Obama's been in the senate for over 2 years now. Hasn't he had time to think of something?


by adamterando on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 09:36:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

Yes, that was sharp , but he did say that he is in the process of transporting information from his SENATE website to his Campaign website.

Ew, Hillary is up next.


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:43:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (3.00 / 1)

Yes he did. But there really isn't ANYTHING more on his senate website

http://obama.senate.gov/issues/health_ca re/index.html

then there is on his campaign website

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/health care/


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:15:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

"Patience , Daniel Son"

;p


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:23:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (3.00 / 1)

Ha ha. I realize I like alot from my candidates. I was replying to the statement you made which implied that Obama had more on his Senate page that he was transferring over to his campaign page.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:28:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

Well, there's a little more on there but I know what you mean. You want a complete detailed list. I confess. I do too. I'm gonna wait for it though because I know Obama doesnt just do things without thinking them through.

BTW....

What the HELL is Kucinich talking about?


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:32:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

Kucinich really isn't going to win points with this plan. I understand he wants to create systems close to those in Europe...however, that's not going to fly here.

And besides....judging Kucinich's track record back in Cleveland, I don't really trust him on economic issues.

And does anyone else think he might need a different haircut?


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:39:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

ROFLMAO

So that's the reason I start craving Keebler snacks whenever I see him

;p


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:42:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

Actually, a Medicare-for-all plan (like what Kucinich is proposing) doesn't really resemble most European health care plans.


Join us at Show Me Progress!
by clarkent on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:21:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

I did a little more research on this and you're right. What I was thinking was that Kucnich's plan is a universal single payer system which would require the tax structure of Canada and those of European nations. Medicare so far funds a select group, opening that up to all would require a much higher tax rate. I am not opposed to that idea, as I'd rather pay taxes and have my basic needs fully covered, but I don't think its going to win him many points in the electorate.

I apologize for my mistake ;)


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:49:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

What I meant was that the Canadian health care system is different than most European countries'. Kucinich's plan is much closer to the Canadian model than the British, French, or German.


Join us at Show Me Progress!
by clarkent on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 07:42:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: question from the audience (none / 0)

That's a misleading question...


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:55:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (3.00 / 0)

do the union members realize the 31% beauracracy fees richardson is decrying are the same private insurers that he will keep around without any new competition such as health markets?


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:29:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (3.00 / 1)

Yes...judging the fairly flat response he got...I think they do.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:33:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (3.00 / 0)

Obama doesn't want to make promises that he can't keep like the others. He's not going to say what people want to hear when they want to hear it to please them. He has to be honest. Know that when the plan comes out, it will be real and not something he pops off to in an effort to shut up his critics.


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:39:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

one would think though that if you are going to a HEALTHCARE forum you would have more concrete ideas.

Why do you assume that those who are proposing details can't keep them?


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:10:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

Elect them and you will be pissed. Watch. promises , promises , and not a one to keep. Look at the promises on the campaign trails when they ran for other offices. Who has actually tried to implement what they promised irregardless of whether or not they have "enough" votes. Where is the effort that they at least tried?

Hmmm?

Promises, promises and not a one to keep.

;p

Why is Dodd doing stand up?


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:14:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

Eh....but you know...isn't that what the blogosphere is for?

I'd rather have someone with a detailed plan and someone who has worked extensively on an issue, then someone who can give generalities (which you can't really hold a candidate to).

that way, someone who offers SPECIFICS can be held accountable.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:19:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

This early in a campaign though its unfair to say that all Obama ever will speak of is in generalities on health care.  Yes, he currently hasn't publically released a plan, but one will be forthcoming in which case then there will be specifics... He hasn't been running for 4 years like Edwards has after all.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:10:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

No one said that Obama would do that for four years. You're implying that. What the discussion was, was on the merits of electing someone who does speak in generalities. Perhaps he will be general on the healthcare issue (how many other candidates have been in the past few election cycles....think about that). Then again, he might not be.

But we werent predicting he would be so continously.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:16:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

What are you talking about, you completely misunderstood what I wrote... I said Obama hasn't been compaigning for 4 years liek Edwards has so he is still fleshing out some of his plans.  Until they are completed and have been with released, ANY CANDIDATE would have to speak in generalities.   Edwards has had more time to formulate and perfect what he feels will be a good plan because he has been campaigning for 4 years.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 06:04:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

"that way, someone who offers SPECIFICS can be held accountable"

I like that, I want specifics whoever it is so we can know what we are supporting and also put their feet to the fire later on if need be.


by okamichan13 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:37:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

I want specifics too... this early in, I'm not worried about them... but if we don't see something by September (and even then some things need to be held back for the General Election) then I would be more worried.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 06:05:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

One must wonder why you are so defensive over Obama


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 06:26:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

in 4 years - he just doesn't have any specifics yet.


by PhillyGuy on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:10:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

Yes. It can be done. 8 weeks in. Wait for it. He can't give it to us premature like others do. When he takes a position and announces a plan,he knows he can't change it the next week like Hillary does. He has to campaign on it the whole season. It has to be right the first time. It has to be perfect. He has to be real.


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:18:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (3.00 / 1)

8 weeks in....but that's since the semi-'official' announcement. We all know he, like many of these candidates, has been working on their campaigns WAY before the announcement.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:20:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

Nope. Not so. He is the only candidate "FORCED" to do this by extensive and aggressive Draft Movements. He wasn't thinking about it or working towards it. If he were, pffft. Hands down. He would be far more better than the others.


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:26:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (3.00 / 1)

ha ha ha ha. a candidate FORCED into running for the presidency. ha ha ha ha.

on a side note: I like Obama, he's charming as hell and he's won me over a little bit since he took a stronger stance on Iraq and froze out Fox News. So don't think I'm being anti-obama.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:31:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

I know. You're cool. Are you watching Kucinich though? WTF?

I took a test to see who I was compatible with and I got Obama 100% and Kucinich second. I'm not understanding why.

lol


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:35:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

Yes I am...where is this test?


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:42:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

Yes I am...where is this test?


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:42:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

Here. It has all candidates on it from both sides.

It's fun.

http://www.selectsmart.com/plus/select.p hp?url=08frontrunners


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:46:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

I got:

100%) 1: Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D)
  (97%) 2: Ex-Sen. John Edwards (D)  
  (95%) 3: Ex-VP Al Gore (D)  
  (93%) 4: Gov. Bill Richardson (D)  
  (90%) 5: Sen. Barack Obama (D)

Which, except for the kucinich thing (a mystery to me) is pretty spot on.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:53:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

Interesting. Looks like when you factor in who you feel is most electable , you will choose an Edwards/Obama ticket.

;p


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:59:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

As for now...I'm hoping they combine forces.

Are you watching gravel? I'm not sure railing against the military-industrial complex in NEVADA is going to win him points.  


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:03:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

He's not making any sense to me. He seems angry and negative about everything.


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:05:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

I like that he went in depth...although the negativity thing really is going to drive people off. He seems REALLY bitter.

Also, when he asks if you agree with him... he says it in a way that frightens people into saying yes. ha ha.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:10:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

I know. He scares me. The only message I got from him was:

"Grrrrrrr! Gimmie 10 Million Grrrr!"

Okay. It's over and it was a blast chatting with you but I have to get going. Have a great day.

:)


"I don't believe in this can't do, won't do, won't even try style of politics. Yes We Can!" ~ Barack Obama
by ObamaEdwards2008 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:13:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

You too....I am officially the most boring person I know. 3 hours of a presidential forum and I'm glued to my seat the whole time ha ha.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:15:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (3.00 / 1)

Edwards froze out Fox, Obama was considering it but I never heard that he did say no to them.


by del on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:18:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (3.00 / 1)

Ummmmmm.....Edwards froze out Fox for the Nevada Debate...but Obama got a lot of press [even on here] about freezing out Fox for their false coverage on the Madrassah non-incident.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:53:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

I don't agree with that either and I love the guy... he wasn't forced... but he has only been considering probably since July at the earliest to October... and it does take time to build infrastructure.  Plus, it is stupid to release specific plans early unless one has too... EDWARDS had too...  he needed the press.  By waiting he maximizes the press bump he gets when releaseing the plan.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:16:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He has made a promise to provide UHC (none / 0)

I'm not so sure if he had to. I think he wanted to for sure and I think its part of his strategy of pushing issues like his energy and global warming plan.

He's going to keep doing this until January for sure and putting pressure on other candidates. I'm not sure if it will work, but I think thats part of his strategy.


by okamichan13 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 07:17:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I think proposing (none / 0)

100 billion dollars in tax cut rollbacks ala Edwards is the most honest answer I've heard.


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:12:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think proposing (none / 0)

Obama has said he will roll back bush tax cuts juts like edwards.

http://www.desmoinesregister.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20070222/NEWS09/7022 20396/1001/NEWS

I wish he said this at the forum.

I think he wants to roll back the tax cuts to fund numerous programs not just health care and wants to determine how much his plan will cost before he answers where the funding will come from.


by dpg220 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:51:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I think proposing (3.00 / 1)

He's also been vague about it (like today) as well. I'm not sure if he's made up his mind yet.


by okamichan13 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:44:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Richardson is full of it (none / 0)

Disgree... He didn't seem flat at all.  Edwards though did get the best response... The response to Obama seemed much better to me than to HRC or Richardson or Dodd or the others.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:53:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (3.00 / 1)

im an americanmuslim and i am liveblogging the event as well (but not in this detail). hopefully this motivates more people in my community to vote democrat.

keep up the good work. ill link over

http://eteraz.org/story/2007/3/24/10815/ 8892


by eteraz on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 01:19:11 PM EST

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

Thanks for the blog. I have the exact sentiment as you do about Hillary.


by PhillyGuy on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:16:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

kucinich (none / 0)

Did Kucinich just try and pander to the hispanic crowd?

Si Se Puede?


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:33:39 PM EST

Kucinich is right! (none / 0)

Kucinich has hit the nail on the head! The problem is with the power and the death grip that insurance companies have on our system. A Medicare for all approach is what we need. If people want cadillac coverage beyond that, they can pay for it individually. I wish that one of the top tier folks were advancing it.


by cmpnwtr on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:36:15 PM EST

Dodd! (none / 0)

Dodd continues to impress me.  He has the experience of a politician and the personality of a friend.  I especially liked how he spoke about how healthcare interacts with other problems (income inequality, energy, etc).  He doesn't have to prove that he will fight for universal healthcare; his record has done that.  He showed how a comprehensive policy is the way to get it done.  I really hope he sticks around in this race.


by TulaneDem on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 02:44:13 PM EST

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

The big three and Richardson are really disappointing me here.


Me | My Work | Future Majority
by Josh Koenig on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:01:31 PM EST

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

Can you elaborate?


Join us at Show Me Progress!
by clarkent on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:18:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

Two things:

Only "fringe" candidates are calling for single-payer. This is the "right" solution IMHO (technically and morally) and it's frustrating.

When it comes to actually making progress in any way, it's important to keep things simple, direct, and high-contrast in the message department. A candidate who's message is a technocratic explanation of a complex solution seems unlikely to be one who will actually, you know, get shit done in office.

Americans like Big Ideas. I would really like to see this issue handled like that, and with more passion. The People do actually want this, and the fact that so many sort of dance around it so as not to to appear like they're unfriendly to the insurance industry (which is a massive reverse wealth-redistribution scam when it comes down to it) is fucking annoying.


Me | My Work | Future Majority
by Josh Koenig on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 03:54:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Edwards plan allows for single payer (none / 0)

to win over if Americans choose it.

the political and cost realities are that going immediate single payer is not politically feasible


McCain - a serial Opportunist, from marriage to policy positions
by TarHeel on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 08:35:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

(Unfortunately, I missed the end of the questioning due to a personal situation caused by an excess of coffee this morning.)

Did you deal with this better then the Pretzelnit when he had a similiar issue at the UN?


by 2liberal on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:04:32 PM EST

Presidential Healthcare Forum (3.00 / 1)

Cross post from think progress, the forum.

I lke Edwards, too, because he's a straight shooter, and talks in a transparent, clear, honest manner. I've read his book, Four Trials that gives a closer look at his character. So does Elizabeth's memoir, Saving Graces.

I want to hear him address our constitutional crisis (Bush administration says Congress has no role in oversight over the WH; Gonzales says the Constitution doesn't guarantee habeus corpus).

Gov. Richards not clear in explaining his plan. John Edwards very clear and sounds well-planned. Obama was shockingly ill-prepared. Here comes Clinton. I hope someone asks her what happened to the Clinton plan when there was a Dem majority and Dem in the WH, and lots of goodwill in the country. Why did it fail? Why not send it to the congress? Bill ran on it, but his plan wasn't completed and ready to go for the congress.

Clinton good job explaining the problem - but what about the solution? I think this campaign will come down to who is the one to get the job done. I think people are sick of the rhetoric, lies, or ineffective governing.

I want to hear Clinton say, this is what I would do, when, how and how to pay for it.

Hillary: We need a movement for health care in this country. Huh? Check out the front page here: 64% off us think the government should guarantee health insurance.

Dodd is so far the only one who has addressed the power dynamic - what's holding back the effort to get the job done, in the past, and what can be done in congress to move it forward.
I'd like to see a House and Senate Bill example posted on their website. Out of the closet! Put your plan on the line because we're tired of the rhetoric. Please stop saying, "I want to see...." (Dodd) No! Democrats want to see your plan!

I agree with Kucinich and like medicare care for all, but can't stand his self-righteous, sneering manner of saying it. 64% of us want it.

Edwards offers medicare for all to compete with madatory insurance and thinks that over time the government plan could win out because it is better. Also, he says how to pay for it. Change the taxes for the ultra rich who have had a free ride for 6 years.


by mrobinsong on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:19:35 PM EST

Re: Presidential Healthcare Forum (none / 0)

Ill prepared and not releasing details are vastly different.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:19:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Presidential Healthcare Forum (3.00 / 1)

I think the matter of Obama being ill prepared or not is left to the political grey area and really shouldnt be a topic of heated discussion.

Where I think a lot of people get this is that Obama didnt seem to be-compared to other candidates and his usual self-at the top of his game. Perhaps he knew more than he was letting on, but to many people he didn't seem as though he was fully present.

However, that's only a perception. Yours may be different and in politics, this is one of those scenarios where things can be that way.


by apolitik on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:24:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Presidential Healthcare Forum (none / 0)

I thought Edwards did the best, Followed by Obama, then Dodd, HRC, Gravel, Richardson and Kucinich who just seems like he want off the deep end.  I thought Obama's speech this morning was most excellent.


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 06:09:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Presidential Healthcare Forum (none / 0)

Saying he is flat I can accept as opinion... I disagree with it, but there you go... But him saying Ill prepared... well to steal a phrase, that dog don't hunt (although it could pee on the carpet.)


by yitbos96bb on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 06:10:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

For Podesta - In any restructuring of our current healthcare system there will be losers (insurance companies, Big PhRMA, for-profit hospitals, etc.).

We already spend 50% than the next highest country and get worse results. Adding more money is cowardly IMHO.

Why do most new plans suggest increasing funds when the US already spends more from less? Isn't the solution more to convince the American people that for-profit medicine is like a bad apendics - it's serves no purpose and it's killing us?


"Nothing seems to embarrass the political class today." - Bill Moyers
by joejoejoe on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 03:29:56 PM EST

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (3.00 / 1)

Hard to convince people of that when many if not most Americans have pretty good insurance through for-profit medicine.

That's why I think Edwards plan offers the best chance of political and real world success.


by okamichan13 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 04:47:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (3.00 / 1)

Actually, most people don't need to be convinced. They already want the system to be universal and revamped, and understand that corporate greed isn't the reason we have nice medicine.

What it takes is someone with the courage and leadership to call for a real solution. The facts are there, the public support is there, but only the fringe candidates talk single-payer. I don't know that "single-payer" as a message piece is the best, but the fact that none of the ostensible leaders seem to want to even go into that territory means it's defacto taboo.

Reminds me of when no-one with any institutional cred would point out that the Iraq war rationale was total BS. The facts where there, the public didn't really want to invade, but nobody would step up and lead. This is an ongoing policy thing, and not 100% analogous, but the situations seem very similar.


Me | My Work | Future Majority
by Josh Koenig on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 03:59:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Is This Forum Recorded? (none / 0)

was this recorded? I saw some of it, but not all. did seiu put it on the web?
thanks
art3 in tx
by art3 on Sat Mar 24, 2007 at 11:14:57 PM EST

Consensus (none / 0)

One or two of the candidates talked about "building a consensus" for medical reform or "building a movement" for healthcare reform.

They were not talking about the Democrats, who all want universal healthcare coverage.  They were talking about the Republicans -- about convincing the Republicans.  I don't know why this is so hard for some people to understand.
Medical reform cannot be enacted without those all important votes.  

All Presidential candidates were invited to participate in the Forum in Las Vegas yesterday, including each and every one of the Republican candidates.  ONLY the Democratic candidates accepted the invitation.

That is what Hillary and Obama meant when they said "we must build a concensus".


by marasaud on Sun Mar 25, 2007 at 09:44:44 AM EST

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

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by nekanelop on Mon Apr 23, 2007 at 04:35:01 AM EST

Re: SEIU/CAP/UNLV Presidential Healthcare Forum Th (none / 0)

So which one was elected?!
Cheers.
____
Winter is on my head, but eternal spring is in my heart.
[california drug northern rehab]

by bsdwork on Fri Oct 12, 2007 at 02:58:22 PM EST


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