March Straw Poll Results

I managed to remove the stuffed votes (most were for Obama, but there were also some for other candidates), and produce results for the MyDD March Straw Poll (allocated results = "other" and "unsure" removed):

MyDD March Reader Straw Poll
Candidate 1st Choice February 2nd Choice 1st + 2nd Choices Last Choice Allocated Results
Obama 36.1 34.0 29.0 65.1 2.7 40.3
Edwards 33.1 28.6 31.0 64.1 1.7 37.9
Richardson 9.7 5.9 18.3 28.0 0.9 11.9
Clinton 4.7 4.1 6.5 11.2 14.1 5.3
Kucinich 2.0 2.7 1.7 3.7 31.8 2.3
Dodd 1.1 0.7 2.5 3.6 1.5 1.3
Biden 0.5 0.1 1.7 2.2 25.2 0.5
Gravel 0.3 0.9 1.5 1.8 22.2 0.4
Other 10.6 10.0 4.9 15.5 -- --
Unsure 1.9 3.3 2.9 4.9 -- --

Obama maintains a narrow lead over Edwards. With Clark and Vilsack removed from the poll, the clear beneficiaries were the three top candidates: Obama, Edwards and Richardson. In terms of last place votes, Kucinich leaps ahead of both Biden and Gravel (a recent post by kos might have had something to so with that). In terms of overall negativity versus first and second place support, the MyDD community would clearly be quite happy if Biden, Gravel and Kucinich dropped out. Both Dodd and Clinton hover around the break even line.

Overall, not much movement. MyDD reader support seems to be solidifying somewhat, which is also demonstrated through the very low number of "unsure" votes. That is to be expected somewhat, since MyDD readers tend to be politically obsessed news junkies, and as such have probably taken long looks at multiple candidates at this point. Also, the goal for any campaign should not really be just to sway blog readers for your support in terms of votes, but to convince them to engage in activist endeavors on your behalf. Whichever campaign ultimately does the best job of agitating / inspiring its netroots supporters into action will be the most successful online.

Update: I should add that while Richardson is strong among second choice, Edwards is quite comfortably the clear second choice of Obama supporters, and Obama is quite clearly the second choice of Edwards supporters. Those two really dominate.

It is also interesting that Dodd is currently the only candidate who has neither a large number of supporters nor a large number of haters. that is kind of interesting.

Update 2: There were 1,295 votes in this poll. It was open from 2:15 pm eastern until 7:50 pm, eastern. For more information on how I identify stuffed results, click here. It is not purely scientific, but it is the best I can do. I really want to know the honest preferences of MyDD readers. People who think I would act otherwise just don't know me.



Display:


Re: March Straw Poll Results (3.00 / 1)

I think it's clear that online support is going to be split almost cleanly between Edwards and Obama.

The interesting dynamic to observe between the two would be the interaction between the campaigns and the netroots. Edwards' grassroots outreach appears to be largely organized in a top-down fashion. I think it wins a lot of fans in the netroots because it means the campaign is more actively engaging the base. Many (including some front-page posts here at MyDD) seem to be put off by the Obama's lack of active interaction within the netroots. Nevertheless, if one takes a look at Obama's website, it is a highly decentralized, bottom-up organization. As Chris noted in Breaking Blue, 500 volunteers are getting together in Oakland ahead of Obama's visit - without any guidance or direction from the campaign. Same thing happened with his earlier visits to GMU and Austin. Perhaps it is because some of his top online coordinators were from the Dean campaign, but I get the feeling that Obama's grassroots support is much more in the vein of what Dean was inspiring in 2003 - except on a much wider scale. I don't think it's necessary for Obama to 'pay homage', so to speak, to the grassroots community, whether it's on the Internet or off. There seem to be plenty of people reasonably inspired on their own to build his campaign infrastructure from the ground up.


by PsiFighter37 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 09:43:41 PM EST

I've been called by Obama's people already (3.00 / 1)

Don't know if they are calling all Iowa Democrats or if somehow they found out that I have volunteered in the past. I got invited to an organizational meeting for the Obama campaign in Des Moines. I told the organizer that I'm for Edwards--now it will be interesting to see how well they maintain their database. Last cycle I kept getting calls from Dean's people even after informing them several times that I was not for Dean.


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 09:50:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I've been called by Obama's people already (none / 0)

First rule of sales is to try back again later even if they aren't buying now.  My guess is you'll get called again.  

Hell, there could be a giant gaffe on Edwards or Obama's part that would cause ones side to shift significantly to the other.  I'm not expecting it, but for example, if the Iraq war becomes popular by a slight majority again like it was at the start and one of the two all of a sudden supports it (and in this scenario I am not talking about an attack by Iraq's government on American soil or anything of the like), I am sure they would lose a lot of their supporters in the primaries.  Or if one used a racial slur, an Ann Colter type sexual orientation slur or something else of the ilk, there supporters would leave them like mice leaving a ship.  So I would imagine in the unlikely event of that happening, you would get a call again.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:34:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

that is true (none / 0)

A lot can still happen in this campaign. Anyone can make a gaffe that is blown out of proportion by the media. I expect a media backlash against Obama later in the year. Depending on how he reacts, that could diminish his support or even strengthen him.

I know some very hard-core Edwards and Obama supporters here, but for the most part support for any candidate is soft now, and I know huge numbers of undecided people.


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:53:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: that is true (none / 0)

As much as I hate to say it, I am expecting the same thing with the backlash... led by Fox News.  I predict around July.  But I think Obama will handle it well.  


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:57:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

Psi... Here, you are hitting what is the crux of my dilemma.  When it comes to the candidate, I prefer Edwards over Obama for many reasons.  As an old Deaniac, I find Edwards' positions much closer to my own than I find Obama's.  Yet Obama's organizational structure appears to be much closer to my view of how campaigns should run in the twenty-first century and many of my friends are supporting Obama.


by aldon on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:08:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)


Yet Obama's organizational structure appears to be much closer to my view of how campaigns should run in the twenty-first century

I agree. However, I feel that the bottom-up directive works well mainly in the initial stages of boosting a campaign's base of supporters and volunteers. When it comes time to hit the streets and knock on doors, there definitely needs to be instructions from the top.


by PsiFighter37 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:15:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

No there doesn't. We can organize ourselves as we have been doing since before he announced. There are huge Barack Obama events that are taking place all over the nation (some are recorded) where Barack Obama had nothing at all to do with it. People are meeting, donating and sending it in to the campaign. He doesn't even have to be there. The staff don't have to be there either . When he said "This is Your Campaign" That's what he meant. We are doing this for us as well as him. We don't need him to post a little video to pacify us or get us all energized. We have plenty of video from every event he speaks at. While he's on the campaign trail doing the big stuff, we're doing our part on line and at meet ups. We don't have to be "instructed". The youth have been serving the Democratic Party for years taking orders. We know what it takes to knock on doors seeing that are the ones who do it. This time, we'll be in charge. That's the only difference. We want a president, not a Daddy. We can do this on our own.

See? http://www.barackobama.com/


by FreedomOFSpeechFromTheDNC on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:38:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

FOS - Obama has a lot of net support and (none / 0)

has some of the most experience on his staff it is a bit naive to think just because you don't see them in action, or get all the inner workings that they are not at play.

The people coming also because of the MSM push for the first African-American, what they are hoping for President, it takes all the real work out of their reporting, all they have to do is over and over and over again point out all the first, rather then digging into the real meat and potatoes of the issues.


Check out the New Progressive Blog EENRBLOG
by dk2 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:54:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

you are right and express my feelings.  I feel we don't need to have our hand held.  We have everything we need at the site and just like the draft movement, this is also ours.  
He allows this to be open to us and for us to feel like we are part of it.
that is how it's become a movement.
We donate and voluteer.  But, we feel we are driving this campaign as much as Obama.  The site is set up for us to be active and part of it.

by vwcat on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:54:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Edwards is set up that way also, (none / 0)

But the MSM is helping to drive Obama, noone can deny that Edwards is getting ignored and has been from the begining. ITs all about a Woman or an African American, IMO.


Check out the New Progressive Blog EENRBLOG
by dk2 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:21:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards is set up that way also, (none / 0)

I'm don't think Edwards is getting ignored, but you are right that he isn't getting nearly as much press as Obama and CLinton.  Race and Sex have some to do with it, but then the fact CLinton is a Clinton has as much to do about it as her gender... if she was any other female candidate, I doubt she would get the same coverage.  

Also remember, that nationally Clinton and Obama are leading the polling for Dems.  The media is going to focus on that as well.  If Edwards continues to poll Iowa as the leader, he will increase his coverage.

Personally, I think he made a mistake announcing when he did... The Ford thing was unlucky, but given much of the country is on vaction, with family or just not paying attention the last week of the year, it seems like a poor time to announce.  I think that is why he released his healthcare plan so early... to get some press coverage.  

Give Edwards time... as long as he does well in the Iowa polls and if he grows support in the national polls, the media will pay attention.  


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:46:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

The Clinton name may have a small % (none / 0)

But, even Geraldine Ferrero got plenty of Press, (more than she wanted I am sure)as V P in the 80's.

The Clinton name is giving her some pull.

As for the polls - Clinton and Obama leading - that is a direct correlation to the MSM and the push by them.

Most Americans go for name recognition and if they see a name plastered everyday for awhile that is human nature to pick a name they are familiar with. That is one of the top reasons millions are spent on the adds, name recognition and then informational smear 2nd.

I do think Edwards is ignored, CNN for one has a reporters already with Clinton and Obama, do they have one with Edwards, (if they do, they aren't giving that reporter any airtime).


Check out the New Progressive Blog EENRBLOG
by dk2 on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 04:45:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Edwards is set up that way also, (none / 0)

Well, their running for president is a new story.  Edwards is a repeat player.  Of course the new folks are going to get more attention.


by Adam B on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:12:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

And there may be at that time.  Obama seems to be trying to build himself a little "army" for lack of a better word, in all 50 states.  Once he gathers these people, it wouldn't surprise me to see them contact the most popular

It seems to me like he is running two different campaign... one a bottom up approach, the other a top-down approach.  If it is successful, then this could be a winning blueprint for future progressive candidates at all levels.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:39:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

Case in point...

http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/h ac/


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:26:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Edwards has been doing the same with OneCorp (none / 0)

http://blog.johnedwards.com/onecorps

Obama has lead on any of the net stuff, if anything I see Edwards doing something and Obama do the same as a copy, IMO.


Check out the New Progressive Blog EENRBLOG
by dk2 on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 09:32:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Balancing Bottom-Up and Top-Down (none / 0)

I think there is a constant, and constantly shifting, struggle between the top-down and the bottom-up in any campaign.  I think Trippi captured the dynamic pretty well in his post, back in May 2003, The Perfect Storm.


The other thing that is needed -- is a campaign organization that gets it -- or at least tries to get it. One of the other reasons I think this has not happened before is that every political campaign I have ever been in is built on a top-down military structure -- there is a general at the top of the campaign -- and all orders flow down -- with almost no interaction. This is a disaster. This kind of structure will suffocate the storm not fuel it. Campaigns abhor chaos -- and to most campaigns built on the old top-down model -- that is what the net represents -- chaos.

I should note that this is about campaign structure, and not the technology tools a campaign has available.  It is about how people in the campaign communicate with one another and with supporters.  Having the best tools doesn't necessarily mean using them most effectively.

But to get back to the 'constantly changing' aspect, I believe that the nature of the interaction between supporters and campaign staff needs to evolve over time as the campaign progresses.  I do think that both the Dean campaign and the Lamont campaign didn't handle this evolution as well as they needed to.  I wrote a little bit about this in Managing Transitions on my blog.

I am a big fan of emerging self organizations, but I wonder how far that can go.  Does Dunbar's Number limit how far self organization can go?  My gut feeling is that it does.

So, how will all of these things play out in the race between Obama and Edwards?  It is hard to say.  As I've noted, I find myself closer to Edwards positions, which I think is a very important base.  I wish Edwards organization was more bottom up.  Yet the lack of a good bottom up structure might help in transitions later on.

Anyway you look at things, it will be an interesting campaign season.


by aldon on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:03:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Balancing Bottom-Up and Top-Down (none / 0)

P.S.  I've pulled together a bunch of thoughts about this into a longer post at Orient Lodge


by aldon on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:32:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (3.00 / 2)

Have you looked much at Edwards' website? its pretty bottom up, I would say in some ways much more advanced than Obama's website. Its a full on blog with an open posting system for diaries, quick posts, news etc. The interaction you see with the netroots here and at other sites is partly from the campaign but mostly from supporters who don't specifically represent the campaign.


by okamichan13 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:54:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

I'm not sure if you have actually fully delved into Obama's site... the site is basically Myspace for Obama Supporters.  On the site, every supporter has their own blog.  Every supporter can create groups and join groups of other supporters with similiar interests... Locations, students, LGBT, Christians, Aetheists, etc.  From those groups, you can send emails to the entire group for rapid response, communicating etc. in a mass email.  There is also a messaging client that you can use to send in system messages to your friends list... similiar to an Private message on a forum board.  There is a section for supporters to create events, such as meetups, rallys etc and to RSVP to events which then creates a list that you can then change your mind, add additional attendees, etc... similiar to a calendar system.  Then there is the fundraising component to let you create your own fundraising campaign for Obama..similiar to the way ACT Blue works.  You can even create a profile about yourself.  
Overall, while currently the campaign doesn't interact with the page that much, there really isn't a need.  It is truly bottom up... people write their own blogs (instead of just Diaries), people plan their own events, people create their own fundraising drives, people organize into their own groups of supporters with common interests or locations, and people network with other individuals and have their own friends list.  That is just the supporters site.  The main site has a blog monitored and posted by the campaign's new media team.  This allows comments as well.... the diaries are obviously not needed as that ability is covered in the individual blogs.  This blog gives campaign news, tells of events, encourages others to get involved, behind the scenes and ont he road stories, etc.  

Now, Edwards has a good site, but I am not sure how it is more advanced than Obama's in the bottom-down organizing.  I don't see really any of the things that Obama has there... they do of course have some links to some third party sites, but nothing really fully integrated.  Obama's has one stop shopping, so to speak.

Please if I am mistaken direct me to it... I have been all over Edwards site and just aren't seeing these features that are much advanced over Obama's site.  

BTW, Obama is having a huge community kickoff on March 31.  This will be a bunch of house parties... they are encouraging all supporters to either attend or host a house party... Obama will be speaking from an Iowa family's home, where he will be having a discussion with the group.  They are encouraging the supporters to mobilize.. both on their own and for campaign events like this one.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:26:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Ballot Stuffing (none / 0)

Just wondering -- did it seem to be directed by the campaign itself, or through enthusiastic supporters, or would you rather not say?


by Adam B on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 09:45:24 PM EST

Re: Ballot Stuffing (3.00 / 1)

And a related question: how can you tell which votes were stuffed and which just happened to be cast for Obama or whomever around the same time other people were stuffing?


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 09:48:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ballot Stuffing (none / 0)

Probably by ip? Just a guess.


by okamichan13 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:55:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ballot Stuffing (3.00 / 3)

It is quite simple, really. There are ten options in this poll, and you are asked to rank them. Further, I can see the order of votes that come in. This means first that constant repetition of the same ten digit sequences are easy to spot. Further, whenever anyone only ranks one vote, and it happens in long stretches, those are clearly stuffed votes. Yet further, any long stretches for a single candidate are suspicious.

If someone receives 90% of the vote over a 200 vote span, that is clearly stuffing. If someone receives a long string of votes where suddenly no one is ranking the candidates anymore, that is clearly spam. If the same combination of rankings come in over any stretch at time, that is clearly stuffing.

In this case, I deleted all votes that had fewer than three people ranked. It was more than a little suspicious when Obama suddenly was receiving 85-90% of the vote, after recieving about 35% during the first 600 votes. It was suspicious when all of his supporters were suddenly not ranking the other candidates, even though his first 200 supporters had done just that. It was extra suspicious that, during this same stretch, they all ranked exactly two candidates (Obama and "other"), in exactly the same order. It was clearly vote stuffing, and I removed the offending votes.

Basically, there is no way to sutff these polls, given the amount of data I can look at.
by Chris Bowers on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:08:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ballot Stuffing (none / 0)

Yeah that sounds like stuffing.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:30:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

If you just vote for ONE (none / 0)

....your vote counts for that candidate or not at all? THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT I WANT.

Nothing quite as infuriating as "your Clark vote counted for Obama!"

This whole experience has soured me on IRV actually.


by MNPundit on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:33:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If you just vote for ONE (none / 0)

Like I said, I did the best I could. I don't doubt that I wiped away some legit votes. However, if you are not ranking all the candidates, you are not participating in the overall spirit of the poll. This isn't a contest where you vote strategically to try and help your candidate. This is an educational effort where you are honest about your feelings on all of the candidates.
by Chris Bowers on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:43:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Let me clarify (none / 0)

Thanks for your response. It so happens I usually rank about 8 candidates so I don't think you've thrown my votes out. Your criteria for throwing stuff out is certainly imperfect but I can't really think of a better way to get around ballot stuffing and you're being open and upfront about it so I don't intend to criticize that.

It's the entire process of the polls here that annoy me. I've read through the explanation of how it works several times and I just don't like it. That's only increased over time.


by MNPundit on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 06:07:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

How can I change your mind? (none / 0)

In a real election, if you don't happen to get your favorite, would you rather have your second choice or have your faction's votes split and have the opposition wind up winning?

In a purely data gathering poll such as this, we want to affect the primary process which is long and involves lots of public opinion and slow attrition of candidates dropping out. Right now my favorites are 1. Kucinich, 2. Richardson, 3. Obama. 4. Edwards. I'm going to keep listing my long-shot ideologically aligned favorites first as long as they're in the race. Right now the IRV doesn't matter (and I wish the MyDD poll wasn't on demochoice so it wasn't such a big deal) it's just about the data. I want my data to count for the way I really feel about these things.


Start Running Better Polls
by bolson on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 03:27:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You probably eliminated my legit vote (none / 0)

You probably eliminated my legit vote.  I voted Obama for #1 and Edwards for #2.  I didn't want to vote for any other candidates so I left the rest blank.


Sean Robertson
by Sean Robertson on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 11:18:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You probably eliminated my legit vote (none / 0)

You should have known that those two candidates would finish 1st and 2nd. There was no way your vote would ever count for anyone else.
by Chris Bowers on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:44:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ballot Stuffing (none / 0)

No. I can assure you it was just one silly kid who had a lot of free time , playing around. In any event, it doesn't matter , because they are able to erase those stuffed ones anyway. Looks like whoever did it, wasted time, as he still won.

;p


by FreedomOFSpeechFromTheDNC on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:40:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ballot Stuffing (3.00 / 1)

It wasn't the campaign. If it was, it would have been a lot bigger than this. this only affected about 400 votes or so.
by Chris Bowers on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:52:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ballot Stuffing (none / 0)

Why would any campaign even care?  These polls are unscientific and it doesn't do anything for them to win the Kos poll or win the MyDD poll.  Its more just fun for us.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:31:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Ballot Stuffing (none / 0)

If you're Chris Dodd, and you've done outreach to sites like BooTrib, you'd like to demonstrate that it led to some results.


by Adam B on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:14:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Clinton (none / 0)

How can it be that she is so low in this (and other blogo) polls, yet retains such a high percent in MSM polls? All on name ID? Or does it all come from Democrats who are not politically active (or online)?


by Benstrader on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 09:59:04 PM EST

Re: Clinton (none / 0)

I think that it's the high name ID among Democrats who aren't as engaged in the political process.


by PsiFighter37 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:07:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton (none / 0)

This poll also isn't very different than recent polls on DKos, which show her around 4-5%.  She just doesn't have much support in the hard core politico junkies.


by rashomon on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:17:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton (none / 0)

But what does this mean? That anyone that knows anything more than her name is "Clinton" doesn't support her? While I support Barack, I think Dems have a great field, and think Edwards and Clinton (and Gore and Clark) would be great presidents. What I fear is that Clinton will get the nomination with millions in the bank yet no one in the grass/netroots to do the ground work necessary to win the general.


by Benstrader on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:25:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton (none / 0)

If she gets the nod , we lose anyway so it won't matter. I don't know why people keep pretending they don't get this, or maybe they are making themselves forget, but if Hillary is in, Ralph Nader has vowed to destroy her. There will be many new Youth voters who don't understand what he did last time and they will be so blinded by anger and hatred for Hillary, that Nader will be successful once again.

There will be no President Hillary.


by FreedomOFSpeechFromTheDNC on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:29:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton (3.00 / 2)

Ralph Nader will destroy Hillary Clinton!?  People, for the most part, learned their lesson from 2000 - Nader dropped from nearly 3% of the vote (2000) to less than .5% in 2004.  Ralph Nader isn't destroying anyone.

I'm not nearly as pessimistic as you are - in fact, I think any of the Democrats in the field could potentially win (of course I think some have a better chance than others).


Netroots for Gore
by NYPopulist on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:52:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton (3.00 / 3)

agree! ralph nader couldnt destroy the cockroaches at my neighbor's apartment at this point

give me a break

its funny how people seriously try to argue that hillary can't win but obama or edwards can..

either any can win or none can win...thats the way i see it... they all got issues..lets face it... they ain't no giulianis or mcains..much as i prefer them..


by serge in dc on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:58:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton (none / 0)

Both of the above.  Her name ID is higher than that of other candidates, but more importantly, MyDD readers != Dem primary universe != All Dems


Nerding out on politics since 2002
by meelar on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:35:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

interesting..in spite of the many pro-edwards and a few anti-obama posts on mydd obama still leads mydd..

do we have over eager mydd pro-edwards posters who are maybe posting a bit much??? ie., every time a new poll comes out and they write "edwards leads in new poll" when in reality edwards is down by 10 points to hillary?

perhaps..


by serge in dc on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:39:42 PM EST

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

How can someone "post a bit too much"?

This "poll" is a snapshot of who was around today.  That's all.  It shows a rough split among Edwards and Obama, notwithstanding some  Obama supporters who tried to cheat.  

As Chris said, creating activists from the netroots seems to be what matters, and Edwards certainly has that -- they may "post a bit too much."  That's good.


by littafi on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:21:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

right..next time i see a poll that says obama is trailing by 12 i will post "obama leading new poll"

you make my point for me.. i really think the edwards supporters strategy is to flood mydd with diaries about how great edwards is doing..as if thats what actually going on or something!

"edwards leading" (oh wait he's trailing by 11 to hillary)

"edwards picking up suppot in media for being liberal" (oh wait the quotes are by his campaign manager bonior)

"in the general more people would support edwards than hillary or obama...TRUST ME!" (this one was really nuts)

but perhaps all this wishful and misleading posting will work and the diaries will lead to an edwards avalanche as he rides the netroots to the primary win...

oh wait.. obama won the mydd poll..oops


by serge in dc on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:31:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (3.00 / 1)

You just seem very silly and full of some anti-Edwards animus.

If you want to play games, I can tell you that Edwards won the Daily Kos poll last month that involved 20 times or more the sample size of this poll.  Hmmm.

Grow up.


by littafi on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:00:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

Serge,

Robliberal posted that poll on Michigan and he is NOT a hardcore Edwards supporter.  He has said he has given to all of the Big 3... he doesn't have anyone he supports 100% over the others.  So while the headline was unintentionally misleading, that was really all it was.  No harm, no foul.  


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:37:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

Yeah I agree... there are definately a handful of Edwards supporters who post A LOT, but there is nothing wrong with that.  That is the point.  The Edwards supporters on MyDD very strongly support Edwards... and thats good overall.  Passion is a good thing... especially if we direct that passion to beating the GOP.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:35:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Raw Data (none / 0)

Is it possible to release the raw data (with or without manual anti-stuffing) for us to run our own analysis on?


Start Running Better Polls
by bolson on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:47:01 PM EST

Re: Raw Data (3.00 / 1)

Unfortunately, no. I lost the password, and can only access it myself right now because it is saved in my browser.

I will make sure not to make that mistake next time.
by Chris Bowers on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:11:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Raw Data (none / 0)

Does it automatically log you in? If it brings you to a form with asterisks for the password, you should check out freeware like this that does password reveals.


by PsiFighter37 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:21:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (3.00 / 1)

I feel that in the blogging community the support lays pretty much between Obama and Edwards.  A few here and there but the bulk in most of the community at large is about a split between the two - give or take.
i don't feel that it's good to try to push or persuade someone to my candidate if someone likes someone else.  the point now, I think is to respect each others candidate and their choice and have discussions.
I am so tired of the hatchet someone because they don't like them.  What does it gain the person.  You are not going to change anyone's mind and only piss off people.
by vwcat on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:49:21 PM EST

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

amen brother! i just hope the edwards people on this blog read your post..

man they've been hardcore the past few days..feels like an orchestrated campaign at times..

chill out people...its only march!


by serge in dc on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:52:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (3.00 / 2)

Coming from you this is quite a statement.


by adamterando on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:20:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

you're joking right? what diaries have i started?

i'm reacting .. i 'm not leading anything

actually you'll be glad to know that on wed i leave for a two week mission to cape verde so i will not be posting as i got beaches to check out, music to listen to and some local drink called grogue to down.... you guys can go back to running the edwards show around here!..


by serge in dc on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:37:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Can't wait for the debates. Things will start (3.00 / 1)

to really shake then.


Check out the New Progressive Blog EENRBLOG
by dk2 on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 10:56:51 PM EST

Re: Can't wait for the debates. Things will start (none / 0)

Debates will be good.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:40:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

If MYDD is going to continue with these straw polls, and then go on and try to make analyses from them, there needs to be some disclosure on the poll.  I don't think its responsible to make comments on how the online community is supporting or not supporting a candidate based on a poll where 20 people could have voted.

I mean come on, I'd expect this on Fox News! We can do better.


by wanderingpolitico on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:32:56 PM EST

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

agree.. more importantly stuffing should not be an issue...there must be a way to control this... i would hope.... if we all have to register to vote so be it..


by serge in dc on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:35:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

What, you think it is easy to build a poll tool that only allows registered people to vote? It isn't. That would be quite expensive, and difficult, for not much.
by Chris Bowers on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:09:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

Such a tool doesn't already exist?  That really surprises me.


by greebsnarf on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 07:39:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

I didn't get a chance to cast a vote in this straw poll but would have cast it Obama, Richardson, Edwards, Clinton, with either Biden or Kucinich last - I don't want either of those two blowhards on the stage wasting our time and sucking up oxygen from the room.

Obama is going to win Iowa with over 40% of the vote and roll from there.


by j flynn on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:43:30 PM EST

it could happen (none / 0)

Obama could win Iowa, but right now it's Edwards' to lose. In my mind the main question is how close will Obama come in second place.

Clinton has no chance to win Iowa, and I can't imagine her coming in second unless there is a dramatic implosion of either Edwards or Obama (unlikely).


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:59:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: it could happen (none / 0)

Edwards gets 33%, Obama gets 28%, HRC gets 20%, Richardson 10%  and the rest split the remaining.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:51:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: it could happen (none / 0)

Iowa is very close to Chicago, a city that has plenty of highly skilled and under-utilized political pros (some with relatives in Iowa) with nothing better to do than help him there - some might be paid, lot's of others will do it for free.


by j flynn on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 08:44:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (3.00 / 1)

Can someone explain Richardson to me?  He's got a wealth of experience in government, but I see nothing about him that aligns ideologically or philosophically (politics + political mechanisms) with anyone I know within the netroots.  

He's, at best, a Clinton Democrat.  He embraces the same anti-liberal straw-man-ism rhetoric that drives middling ineffective policy and a total inability to impact politics beyond his own immediate actions and consequences (i.e. non-transformational).  

Did anyone else see him at the Drake U. College Dems thing on CSPAN?  It was a dreadful performance for an effing state senate candidate, much less a presidential candidate and his policy positions made me cringe as a Democrat and one looking to help build a movement.


Help build a stronger and more progressive Democratic Party from the grassroots on up
by Peter from WI on Mon Mar 12, 2007 at 11:58:51 PM EST

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

Good points on Richardson, I guess the reason I have him #2 is because that's what I think he'd be good at - Vice President.  He's got foriegn relations experience and he's a hispanic governor of a western state - I'd like to win Arizona, NM, Colorado and Nevada in 2008.


by j flynn on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:10:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

How do you know which votes were stuffed and which were legit?  Unique Ip Address?  Overall though this is just what I am sure most of us expected... Obama and Edwards neck and neck and clearly one another the second choice for each other for the most part.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:26:37 AM EST

this is why I think Clinton will lose (none / 0)

I know so many Iowans who are undecided between Edwards and Obama, and so many people who favor one but say the other is their second choice.

I just don't hear people say they are undecided between Clinton and someone else, and I don't hear people say Clinton is their second choice.

Late in the game the undecideds will start making up their minds, and this is when Clinton, stuck around 15-20 percent, will fall far behind Edwards and Obama (in some order).


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:57:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: this is why I think Clinton will lose (none / 0)

I'll have to take your word for it... I tried re-reading your article on how the Iowa caucuses work and I went cross eyed.  Wow thats complicated.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:52:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Des Moines Register Endorsement Also Important (none / 0)

Don't forget...if the race is close between Edwards and Obama leading up to the caucus in Iowa, the Des Moines Register endorsement (which none of us will know until about ten days before the caucus) could tip the race. It helped Edwards surge back in 2004.  Bottom line:  both campaigns need to do right by the Register!

And there is another factor to consider as well:  which candidate is likely to be the second choice candidate for Richardson, Kucinich, Dodd, Biden and even Clinton supporters?  Whenever a candidate fails to get 15% (if I recall correctly) of the vote at a caucus site in the first round, that candidate's supporters are then free to give their vote to one of the other candidates who did get over 15%.  

You can expect that at many caucus sites, Richardson, Kucinich, Dodd, Biden, and maybe even Clinton, will not get the 15%.  Will they naturally go to Edwards or Obama?  Tough call at this point.


by Demo37 on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 02:25:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Des Moines Register Endorsement Also Important (none / 0)

I'd think Richardson and Biden would got to HRC.  Kucinich would go to Obama or Edwards.  No idea Dodd.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 03:14:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Mike Gravel (none / 0)

To bad Mike isn't higher in ranking. His wikipedia profile looks good to me.  I'm not too enthusiastic about Richardson since he joined Kissinger McLarty Associates and he's a favorite of the Cato institute.


by medleysoul on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:55:04 AM EST

please, no national ballot initiatives (none / 0)

I don't want more policies decided by the public in referenda. That system has been a disaster for California.


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 12:57:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I hear people say that (none / 0)

What has been the problem? If we had that federally, we'd probably be able to end the war. If we require public disclosure of whether signature gatherers are paid by corporations, it would be alot harder for them to collect signatures. After all, isn't the name of this site Direct Democracy?


by medleysoul on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:21:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hear people say that (none / 0)

We'd also would probably have a flat tax.


by adamterando on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 09:18:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I hear people say that (none / 0)

If you've read about the fair tax, you know it's actually a very reasonable idea.

We could do a lot worse. Oh wait, we already have worse.

I'll give Gravel props for his guts to stand up and say, "This is worth a shot."  It's far too easy to be a target for potshots by people who hear "flat tax" and conclude it's a dumb idea without reading the details. I, for one, would be very happy with eliminating income tax. YMMV, of course.


Karl in Drexel Hill, PA
by KB on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 09:39:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

Not only did Markos trash Kucinich pretty comprehensively, but did you see his comments about the now-cancelled Fox News debate?

"If you want to be the President of the United States, you can't be afraid to deal with people with whom you disagree politically," Kucinich said. "No one is further removed from Fox's political philosophy than I am, but fear should not dictate decisions that affect hundreds of millions of Americans and billions of others around the world who are starving for real leadership."

Kucinich said "the public deserves honest, open, and fair public debate, and the media have a responsibility to demand that candidates come forward now, before the next war vote in Congress, to explain themselves."

"I'm prepared to discuss the war, health care, trade, or any other issue anytime, anywhere, with any audience, answering any question from any media. And any candidate who won't shouldn't be President of the United States."

Talk about being desperate for attention.  Sometimes I think Kucinich supporters are the lowest-information voters of all.

Link


"Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
by Steve M on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:29:35 AM EST

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

what will interest me is that if national polls are 35-35-15 do some Edwards supporters in Iowa
go to Obama to stop Hillary, I too think Hillary is a disaster for Dems on so many levels if she is to be the nominee, the question is stopping Hillary enough to move voters (netroots) types to the Hillary alternative while it's early enough to matter.
Obama! because 51% isn't enough!
by nevadadem on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 01:31:53 AM EST

Iowans went for the 'safe choices' in 2004. (none / 0)

Iowans showed in 2004 that they aren't driven by national polls. Iowa caucus-goers made a very late move to the candidates they viewed as 'safe' for the general election -- Kerry and Edwards (I think they got it wrong on Kerry and right on Edwards).

In 2008, I'll be surprised if Iowans will view Obama (or Hillary) as the safest option for the general election.


John Edwards 2008
by MeanBoneII on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 03:31:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

The key for the John Edwards campaign is not to burnout and maintain a lead in Iowa throughout the rest of the year.

I believe his healthcare plan dvd that he sent to over 70,000 likely Iowa-cacus goers was a brilliant move in the right dirction.

As of right now, he is the only candidate with substantive solutions rather than flowerly rhetoric to the problems facing this country.

I believe the celing in Iowa for % of total degleates Edwards can obtain is about 40%.


by Djneedle83 on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 06:02:38 AM EST

no, his ceiling is higher (none / 0)

He got 32 percent of the delegates last time despite quite a poor showing in many of the eastern counties. If he gets a third or half of former Kerry supporters (such as myself), he could easily get more than 40 percent of the delegates.


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:20:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

yitbos96bb writes: "How is Obama Lieberman's acolyte?  He was assigned Lieberman as his mentor.  Obama's beliefs and stances are not even close to Liebermans."

Please, please explain to me Obama's behavior in the Connecticut primary.

David Sirota - "In a CBS News story about a spat between Al Sharpton and Barack Obama, Sharpton fires off a very, very important question:

   "Why shouldn't the black community ask questions? Are we now being told, `You all just shut up?'" Sharpton said Monday. "Senator Obama and I agree that the war is wrong, but then I want to know why he went to Connecticut and helped [Sen. Joseph] Lieberman, the biggest supporter of the war." (emphasis added)

Obama came up to campaign for Lieberman before the primary, very carefully timing his appearance at the Connecticut Democratic Party to try to kill Ned Lamont's antiwar primary challenge before it got off the ground. Then in the general election, he refused to lift a finger for Lamont. For a guy like Obama who runs around bragging about his antiwar credentials, yet who then spent most of his first year in Congress absolutely silent on the war - his behavior in the Connecticut Senate race says a lot about him as the supposed post-partisan conviction candidate."

From David Sirota


"Man will never be free until the last king is strangled with the entrails of the last priest." -- Denis Diderot
by Stoic on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 07:22:48 AM EST

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

I wonder how many of you obama supporters know that he campained for joe lierman.Ive been trying to choose between richardson and obama.nobody has come up with a good reason not to support richardson.


by idahojim on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 07:34:48 AM EST

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)


nobody has come up with a good reason not to support richardson.

I found this comment over at DailyKos.  It was the beginning of the end of my support for Richardson.

I also don't find him particularly inspiring in his speeches.


by maddogg on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:10:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

when you look at the kinds of things joe lierman has done,they are far more serious than what was listed for richardson.lierman has backed everything bush has done.everything.and he has used republican spin and lies to attac democrats.I was in obamas camp until he supported lierman.I like edwards but he has a quick trigger finger and he voted for the iraq war.hes a nice guy ,gives great speeches but fails to make right choices in tuff times.another thing about obama,he was calling bush a good man right up until he anounced.then silence.Iam still not 100% in richardsons camp.


by idahojim on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 10:10:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

well... good luck!
I'd say you sound like you're in the same spot I am.  Nobody's perfect.  All the candidates have their flaws.  You know them.  You just have to prioritize which flaws are deal breakers.
by maddogg on Tue Mar 13, 2007 at 11:25:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: March Straw Poll Results (none / 0)

when you look at the kinds of things joe lierman has done,they are far more serious than what was listed for richardson.lierman has backed everything bush has done.everything.and he has used republican spin and lies to attac democrats.I was in obamas camp until he supported lierman.I like edwards but he has a quick trigger finger and he voted for the iraq war.hes a nice guy ,gives great speeches but fails to make right choices in tuff times.another thing about obama,he was calling bush a good man right up until he anounced.then silence.Iam still not 100% in richardsons camp.

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