Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire

The new Concord Monitor/Research 2000 poll out of New Hampshire (400 LVs, 12/10-12, MOE +/- 5%) confirms what we've seen in recent New Hampshire polls, that Barack Obama has pulled even with Hillary Clinton and even may have a slight statistically insignificant lead.

Dec.JulyRCP 5-poll Ave.
Obama322529.2
Clinton313330.6
Edwards181515.2
Richardson877.0
Biden223.0

So much for that firewall.

This new two-way race between Clinton and Obama in New Hampshire does seem to be the result of an Oprah bump, as all the polls showing the two tied have been in the field during or since last weekend's Oprah-palooza. Obama wanted Oprah to help him with women and she seems to be doing just that as he now leads Clinton 34% to 32%. But the real story appears to be Democrats vs. undeclared independent voters, a key voting bloc in New Hampshire.

Of the likely Democratic primary voters surveyed for the Monitor poll, 37 percent aren't registered with a political party. When it came to those undeclared voters, Obama trounced his opponents: 40 percent of undeclared voters likely to vote in the Democratic primary backed Obama, compared with 23 percent for Clinton and 13 percent for former North Carolina senator John Edwards.

Clinton, in contrast, won the support of more registered Democrats: 36 percent said they'd vote for Clinton, compared with 27 percent for Obama and 21 percent for Edwards.

It was always expected that independents would break for Obama whose above the partisan fray message was presumed to appeal to them. That finally appears to be happening. Interestingly, this is very bad news for McCain as independent voters can vote in either primary in New Hampshire (he is currently tied with Giuliani for 2nd place.) In 2000, independents voted overwhelmingly in the Republican primary sending John McCain to victory. Conventional wisdom was that if Obama was perceived not to be viable in New Hampshire come primary day that those voters would once again vote Republican, possibly sending McCain a much needed boost. Doesn't look like that's going to happen.

It should also be noted that Obama's rise looks to be coming almost entirely at Clinton's expense, as Edwards is on an upward track as well (18% is almost 3% above his recent average.) We always knew Edwards had the ability to close late in the race, we may be seeing the beginnings of that here.



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Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

It seems both Obama's and Edward's strategies are working, and this race is going to be close. I am happy to see Edwards in the upper teens. If he makes it to 20 given the bounce he has a shot at NH too.


by bruh21 on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 11:30:24 AM EST

I agree (none / 0)

I think if he is within 10 points of the leader in New Hampshire (whether that's Clinton or Obama), and he wins Iowa, it's enough to give him a shot in New Hampshire.


A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy. - Teddy Roosevelt
by minvis on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 11:44:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I agree (none / 0)

I think that the average bounce that someone has worked out- (maybe Bowers or Fla Dem) is somewhere 12 to 20 pt bounce


by bruh21 on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:08:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

it's 14 points. (none / 0)


by rapcetera on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 05:42:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (2.00 / 1)

I will start off by saying that an Obama supporter much wiser than myself has advised us to handle ourselves with class--and not to gloat or taunt. I appreciate the reminder and hitherto I shall try.  

Nevertheless, it is a tremendous feeling to see Obama get out of the low 20s in multiple polls, in multiple states.  We know he has this solid core support of 20-22 percent; but finally, finally we are starting to see movement into the low 30s.

Woot!

http://dpw.mydd.com/comments/2007/12/13/ 201224/32/7#7


by aiko on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 11:30:46 AM EST

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

When is the next poll?  It will be interesting to see what the fallout will be, if any, from the Shaheen disaster and whether that breaks in Obama or Edwards favor.


by Piuma on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 11:44:04 AM EST

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

Women are the voters more likely to be turned off to negative campaigning.  And they hate even more a woman who appears, well, to be a b*tch.  Clinton does not do nasty well.  It reinforces the narrative built up over a decade.  Also, the idea that she did not know about the smear smacks of falsehood.  And that too is a narrative of her, that she can't be trusted.


by Javier Doval on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 11:46:20 AM EST

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

It's sad, because she really didn't need to go nasty. Their reaction to the Philly debate was much worse than the debate performance itself.

And then all these un-forced errors.

Really, I don't get it.  


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 11:50:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

political instincts (none / 0)

We are seeing that Hillary just does not have good political instincts. She mostly rode Bill's coattails into the Senate but now her lack of natural talent is showing.

It's not surprising. It's kind of like when Micheal Jordan tried baseball. If it was really his sport he would have been playing it all along.  


by JoeCoaster on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 11:59:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

good not great (none / 0)

I should have said that while Hillary is good she is not great (talent wise) and she is up against a tough field this year. Bad luck for her.


by JoeCoaster on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:04:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: good not great (none / 0)

Except...she can still win.


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:12:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: good not great (none / 0)

Of course. I'm just saying that without Obama the primary would have been a cake walk for her. Her weaknesses would not have been exposed (until the general that is).


by JoeCoaster on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:20:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

I think they have internals that showed them headed for defeat long before we saw them. They had to do something and they were already tied into several campaign narratives like experience, Clinton wonder years, inevitable, strength. Altho I think Dick Morris is slime he has a piece in the NYPost that says their choices boxed them in and that maybe they choose experience so that they could say that Obama was inexperienced. And then their experience narrative started to fall apart (do we really want to go back) and their inevitable started to fall apart (in the polls) and Bill stuck his foot in his mouth. Boxed in.

She decided to look strong instead of human. I think that is it in a nutshell.


by aiko on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:16:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

Dick Morris is a scumbag, but a perceptive one.  I agree that their internals must have shown her negatives going up and that is why they rolled out Chelsea and momma Clinton.  When you have to prove to voters you were not born of a jackyl you got a problem.


by Javier Doval on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:33:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

As an Obama supporter , i'm not getting giddy yet...Why? , because the past news-cycles have been very confusing to who will eventually benefit from the Shaheen fiasco.

No one really know how the shaheen drug drop narrative will play out in the polls as of yet.

The Clintons have been working hard to get it out into the news cycle and it's finally gotten some spins , and my hope is it will kill the Clintons and not hurt Obama.

Word out of Iowa from friends is , the Iowa TV coverage has not been good for Hillary and the narrative seemed to suggest the Clintons got an  sacrificial hinchman(Shaheen) to make sure Obama's past drug use gets some media spin.

Whether this hurt Obama is anyone guest , but as long as Clinton takes a bigger hit , Obama will be fine.

My friend also told me that Clinton is slowly being branded as the negatives candidate which could kill her among second choice.


by Prodigy on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:44:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

I was wondering if she is getting negative press in Iowa. There is no doubt the national press has turned on her over the past two+ weeks. she cannot catch a break....and the kindergarten thing is equal  to the 'haircut' --its referenced over and over again in every article.  The story will not die.


by aiko on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 01:00:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

Now we have a new front runner, MSNBC not withstanding, the nation will hopefully get to test his political instincts soon. This is a nation of empiricists, like children who just have to put their fingers in the path of a flame to understand fire, presidential candidates have to be tried and tested.   An Obama win in Iowa and New Hampshire will definitely concentrate everyone's minds on what the next chapter in this saga, and we will no doubt all be looking to Obama to fill in the pages with more than beautiful words.  Its going a long, long, journey. Hillary for the moment should sit back and relax.


by superetendar on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:39:45 PM EST

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

It wasn't just Matthews and MSNBC which lauded Obama's performance as Presidential, David Gergin, Joe Klein, and John King on CNN all said the same thing.  Obama's debate style has always fit better as the front runner than the come from behind aggressor.  His "testimony" on behalf of Joe Biden yesterday was the most Presidential moment in all the debates so far.  It showed him as a uniter not a divider, as someone who can bring about exactly what he is now ends his stump speeches with: A Nation healed, a World repaired, an America that believes again.


by Piuma on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 01:10:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

You're right. Absolutely, MSM et. al., will soon have to decide if they want to "go all the way baby" and take full responsibility for Barack just as they did with George. In shaping these campaign narratives (see Bob Stoller) the MSM are arguably, no, probably, the nation's kingmakers. They make it, they break it, they own it. They did flub the last choice though.


by superetendar on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 02:03:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clilnton and Obama Tied In New Hampshire (none / 0)

"Strength and Experience"  

The message has changed to "Strength and Experience are required to deliver change."

That tells you what the internals are showing.  


"Life can only be understood backwards, but it must be lived forward." - Soren Kierkegaard
by SixthElement on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 12:41:46 PM EST

What happened to your edge? (none / 0)

And where the hell is Georgep????


by rapcetera on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 05:47:23 PM EST

Dems v. Independents (none / 0)

One of the things I wonder is whether a Hucakbee win in Iowa will drive Independents, presumably more secular than other voters, to vote in the Republican primary. That could have a big effect on the Democratic primary since Obama does better with Independents and Clinton with Democrats.

Or have voters decided the Republican nomination is a joke and the Democratic primary is essentially choosing the next president?  Oh, if only that were true.


by BDB on Fri Dec 14, 2007 at 06:54:48 PM EST


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