MyDD :: GOP Fox News Debate Thread

GOP Fox News Debate Thread

by Todd Beeton, Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 08:00:50 PM EST

The debate out of Orlando, FL is live on Fox News or online HERE starting at 8pm ET.

Update [2007-10-21 22:31:23 by Todd Beeton]: I've got to give this one to Romney. He appeared presidential, didn't whine as much as he usually does, and even looked less airbrushed, ie more human, than usual. And he didn't run away from the healthcare plan he signed as governor of Massachusetts, he demanded credit for it. He's among the only ones up there to get the importance of domestic issues/policies to the voters. Giuliani running on war/9/11 can get him only so far. And Romney's the only one projecting a fairly broad, yet well-articulated message, as he put it on the post-show: "A message of changing Washington to bring strength to our economy, to our military and to our families." Thompson did better here than he did in his first debate appearance but was still stumbly and full of "umm"s and "uhh"s, McCain actually came off as really old and blah to me tonight, Huckabee didn't have enough air time to make much of an impression, and Giuliani did his usual schtick, which is more about applause lines than engaging in any substantive way. Romney seemed to be actually be engaging in a conversation.

Tags: 2008 presidential election, Republican primary, fox news debate (all tags)

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Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

what's up with the unkempt hair, mitt?

by Todd Beeton on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 08:04:14 PM EST

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Hillary thinks she can win 25% of the republican womens vote?.............fat chance...ha!!!!

by allmiview on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 11:11:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Why is it a fat chance? Clinton '42 won the votes of soccer/security moms in '96. As someone who grew up in a GOP household and was once a former Goldwater girl, Hillary can probably relate to the many Republicans particularly Eisenhower/Rockefeller Republicans who have become disenchanted with the party. I could see her say something to the effect in the general that she doesn't recognize the Republican party--the one with which she grew up--anymore. I think empathizing with disaffected GOP'ers in a conquer and divide strategy could win over a significant portion of GOP voters....

by ademption on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 11:30:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

FWIW, Just say Bill Clinton or Clinton at this point. It would NEVER be Clinton '42 as that designates a year... so you said Clinton 1942... IF Hillary wins then Clinton 42 would be the way to write it, although I'm sure it will go down as Bill and Hillary much as Bush 41 and 43 go down as Bush and W or Bush and Fucking Moron or Bush and Worst President Ever... You get the idea.

http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!

by yitbos96bb on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 01:03:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]

or Papa Doc and Baby Doc Bush (none / 0)

as I like to call them. "Worst President Ever" is another apt nickname for Dubya. It's a weird coincidence that he and his father are related to one of the previous contenders for worst ever (the hapless tragic alcoholic Frank Pierce).

by Zack from the SFV on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 01:32:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]

they went up against Mydd Blog Talk? (none / 0)

I'm surprised.

John McCain is a Bush ally on Social Security.

by John DE on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 08:07:39 PM EST

Is the R race so boring (none / 0)

that nobody's even bothering liveblogging?

by BingoL on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 08:46:26 PM EST

Re: Is the R race so boring (none / 0)

Well, there's livefacebooking. BTW, Rudy Giuliani just added you as a friend... Hilarious stuff. :)

For Student Power: http://forstudentpower.org/blog

by Liberaltarian on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 11:37:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (2.00 / 1)

chris wallace:

"you all seem to be planning to run against hillary clinton in the general election and at this point, all of you are losing to her in the polls."

fox news poll graphic: clinton 50, romney: 38

nice

by Todd Beeton on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 08:59:11 PM EST

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

That was a good one. They all attacked her from different angles. Giudy did the worst, because he made a joke about her being Pres. Huckabee is smoking crack if he thinks the military is going to be demoralized because there's girl as Pres. WTF has George Bush done to the military. Apparently the morale in the military is really high right now.

by Kingstongirl on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 09:04:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Did Huckabee really say that? (I was on the phone so I missed some of their answers)

It was funny seeing the crowd get so fired up about Hillary. We should disappoint them and nominate Mike Gravel.

by Namtrix on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 09:14:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

He obviously didn't say the girl as Pres part, but he did say the military would be demoralized in this serious times, when they need to be fighting islamo-facists.

by Kingstongirl on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 09:26:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Amazingly, that's -not- obvious. I almost even believed the 'girl' part.

by BingoL on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 09:53:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Yeah I heard that too , I was wondering ,
what the f**k did he mean by that ?

- My antennas went up because I think he said that in terms of her being a woman , but it could also be because its a Clinton , I live among veterans and I can tell you they voted for Clinton but for some reason they don't like him very much .(they say he shrunk the size of the military ,cut funds etc and all that crap which i personally think is some right wing bull crap I haven't looked into the issue to see if there is any validity to that claim and if anyone can verify it or disprove it then it'll be appreciated ) .

But I sure felt it was the woman thing or maybe I am just too sensitive to such things , but that was a bizarre comment.

Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.

by lori on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 10:02:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Maybe I'm repeating right-wing crap, but I think it -is- true that Clinton shrunk the military. At least a little. Remember the 'peace dividend'?

Sounds silly, now, but at the time, if memory serves, we kinda thought that, having won the Cold War, maybe we wouldn't need such a large military, and could spend the money in other ways.

Silly us!

by BingoL on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 10:10:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

No if their is some factual basis of the claim I can take it because i know people who make that claim and they are not necessarily right wingers . I just never checked the validity of it , thats all.

Those right wingers fabricate a lot of stories but once in a while they do say somethings that are based in facts . As much as I try to dismiss everything they say as not based on facts , once in a while they say a few things that are factual.

For example when they say Hillary Clinton is a liberal ( although they are saying it to spite her ) , it is true. She has the most liberal/progressive record of anyone running. But somehow some people on the blogs would say she is righty , some would even say she is a republican.

Educated in a small town Taught to fear Jesus in a small town Used to daydream in that small town Another born romantic that's me.

by lori on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 10:19:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Clinton seems to me as very close (in more ways than one) to the archetypal liberal of the 90s.

by BingoL on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 10:31:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Hey, one Blog Bircher over at DU thought she was going to promote Facism.

by spirowasright on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 10:57:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

She may have the most liberal/progressive record (though I would be surprised if she could go toe to toe with Kucinich on anything with real bite rather than the raw statistics) but that just goes to show how little power the progressive movement has since we can't get a real progressive within sniffing distance of the nomination!

by Rickyspub on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 01:28:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (2.00 / 1)

Military spending started to decrease significantly during Bush I (under sec def Dick Cheney), and continued to decrease until the end of the Clinton administration when with the huge surpluses it began to modestly increase.

Go back to Hussein Texas

by gobacktotexas on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 10:56:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (2.00 / 1)

If I remember The West Wing correctly, CJ Cregg gave an excellent explanation as to the reduction of the military in the 1990's when she came face to face with a conservative warmongering General in the Second Season;

"I think that's about the cold war ending ten years ago and America not needing to spend
quite so much money defending itself against a country that can't bake bread."

It aired in 2000 and back then it made sense. No one was prepared for what Bush would eventually do to the military, no one.

They can blame Clinton to reducing the size of the military in the time of peace, when it seemed like the logical thing to do. Why has it taken us so long after 9/11 to increase it?

The American people; they were for the war before they were against it.

by nrafter530 on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 11:42:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (2.00 / 1)

Why would a terrorist threat require the increase of the military? That's the whole point of asymmetrical threats. Do you propose defeating al-Qaeda with counter-insurgency operations? It is their fondest dream to sucker us that way and so far we have obliged them. We have to completely change our thinking, get smart and hit them where they are weakest not create another generation of discontented young Muslim refugees with nothing left to lose.

The whole raison d'etre of the fundamentalist Islamic movement is to preserve a doomed, Medieval social structure. Time was on our side, it still is, but our weapons are prosperity and modernity, not cluster bombs and curfews. Not to mention first class counter-intelligence against the terrorists themselves.

by Shaun Appleby on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 02:27:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Good point.

I guess we've all been brainwashed into this belief that our military can solve every problem.

The American people; they were for the war before they were against it.

by nrafter530 on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 10:19:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

The funny thing is our military infrastructure, especially the Air Force, is in woeful need of replacement. The average age of US combat aircraft is 20+ years, transports even worse. We just need to keep everything in balance, I guess. We have drifted a long way from sane policies. Remember the Powell Doctrine? It went something like this:

The questions posed by the Powell Doctrine, which should be answered affirmatively before military action, are:

1. Is a vital national security interest threatened?
2. Do we have a clear attainable objective?
3. Have the risks and costs been fully and frankly analyzed?
4. Have all other non-violent policy means been fully exhausted?
5. Is there a plausible exit strategy to avoid endless entanglement?
6. Have the consequences of our action been fully considered?
7. Is the action supported by the American people?
8. Do we have genuine broad international support?

Wikipedia - Powell Doctrine

What a sensible idea that was.

by Shaun Appleby on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 05:24:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Would the military get demoralized? No, of course that's idiotic... But could THEY SELL THAT? Hell Yes they can... Remember the Swifties is something our party needs to say for the next century as not responding to these attacks quickly will sink our candidate. John Kerry's lack of a response probably cost him the election... I wouldn't laugh off that attack, if Hillary is the nom then you will see it repeated ad nauseam. Her response will dictate its effectiveness

http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!

by yitbos96bb on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 01:07:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Hannity apPAULed (2.00 / 1)

Hee hee! Ron Paul leads the FOX texting poll yet again, with 38%. Sean Hannity's head explodes.

-- TP

by Rethymniotis on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 10:05:40 PM EST

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Did Romney just pretty much fess up to lying in tonight's debate?

Go back to Hussein Texas

by gobacktotexas on Sun Oct 21, 2007 at 11:27:13 PM EST

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Romney's appearance was a bit off, but I agree his message was sound from an overall electorate perspective. His problem was the sound attacks on his record from the others though. Huckabee might really be able to stand out on this, in that he has always stood by what he believes. McCain also challenged Romney on this, so in the end I'm not sure that Romney did so well. Really this debate was about candidates throwing attacks at each other. The only candidate who wasn't attacked was Huckabee, so I'm going to say he won. His only problem was that he wasn't given any time, so he could have only won in the sense of people who already know all the candidates or in the sense that maybe people will show less enthusiastic support for their original candidates.

by Progressive America on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 12:10:27 AM EST

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

I think we need to go on the offensive with Huckabee and frankly all the top guys... Google bomb to some unflattering stories would go a long way... much like the McCain bomb Bower did earlier.

http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!

by yitbos96bb on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 01:09:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Did anyone else catch McCain's reference to Czechoslovakia? ;-)

by frankies on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 07:26:02 AM EST

Re: GOP Fox News Debate Thread (none / 0)

Looks like Romney's image consultants told him to look less "airbrushed" -- his hair was "accidentally" out of place, his tie wasn't perfect, and he is starting to let some gray hair show. (Focus groups probably told them he looked too young with it died completely black.)

Romney did better in this debate, only because he didn't make any campaign-threatening gaffes, as he did last time by saying he would check with his attorneys before (A) saving the country (if you're a neocon) or (B) violating the Constitution (if you're a libertarian.)

Meanwhile, Ron Paul got back at Fox for stacking the audience against him, first with a smack-down of the entire GOP in his closing statement, and then with a few subtle digs at Hannity in the spin room afterward -- asking him why he doesn't like his own poll, and highlighting the fact that his ticket count was restricted, when he could have put 2,000 people in the room.

by Lex on Mon Oct 22, 2007 at 12:26:24 PM EST

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