Reject. The. Premise.

Back when Republicans were putting forward a fraudulent piece of legislation in the name of Rep. Jack Murtha, I advised that Democrats shouldn't even dignify it with a vote. Just flat out refuse to vote on it, en masse. Show the Republican leadership that they wouldn't cow to such bullying tactics. Instead, a majority of Democrats voted against it. I guess that was the next best thing, but it didn't accomplish anything. Had the Democrats refused to vote, steadfastly rejecting the premise the Republicans had put forward, they would have turned the tables on them and turned the story from one about lack of a unified Democratic position on Iraq into one of Republican abuse of Congressional power. Alas, the wisdom of Scott Shields didn't effectively permeate into the House Democratic caucus.

And once again, I find myself shaking my head as to why Democrats find themselves incapable of rejecting a Republican premise. Case in point, ethics reform in the Senate. Writing at Talking Points Memo, Paul Kiel documents the problem.

Today, the Senate Rules Committee voted on two different reform proposals. One was the Democrats' Honest Leadership and Open Government Act; the other was an earmark and lobbying reform bill by Sen. Lott (R-MS). The Democrats' bill went down on party lines, 10-8. Lott's bill passed unanimously. In other words, in one short committee meeting, the Republicans completely co-opted the issue.

Let's think about your job for a moment. You pitch an idea and a colleague pitches an idea. Both are put to debate and vote. Your colleague calls you an idiot and votes against your idea. Do you then respond by throwing your weight behind his idea? Probably not. Sure, his idea may not have been completely terrible, but yours was better. So why, then, would you sell yourself out like that? More than likely, you would simply reject the premise that his idea was the superior one by voting it down. Is this really too much to ask of the Democratic members of Congress?

I honestly believe the problem here is that, God bless 'em, the Democrats just want to do what's right. So if some Republican comes up with a piece of legislation that brings them 60% of the way to good policy, they'll support it because they seem to think that 60% good is better than 0% good. And while that may be an admirable goal and a somewhat logical conclusion, at the end of the day, it's bad public policy. There's a lot of corruption Republicans can figure out how to shoehorn into that remaining 40%. And it's also bad politics. There can be no cooperation with Republicans on ethics. It's like cooperating with a pack of wolves on a plan to protect the sheep.

So here I am, once again, begging and pleading with the Democrats. Stop accepting every premise the Republicans put forward. Hardly anyone agrees with them. In fact, most people want to see them voted out of office. With the exception of the old handwringers in the Beltway Punditocracy who will yelp loudly at your lack of bipartisanship, no one will mind one bit if you simply say no to the Republicans. By November, they're going to accuse you of being obstructionists, anyway. You might as well actually try obstructing something in a meaningful way and show the country, when it comes to good government and ethics reform, compromising your principles is not an option.



Display:


They are just bad, really bad (none / 0)

The Democrats in the House are even less organized and less effective than their colleagues in the Senate.  They either cannot or will not play national politics.  They must be so submerged in the world of Beltway consultants and other DC people that they have no clue what people who are not in politics think or hope for.  They are just bad, really bad.


by James Earl on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 12:48:01 AM EST

I have a better strategy..... (1.00 / 1)

True, you could be obstructionist, and try to win political battles and lose the political war, as you've done for several years now, or.....

You could work with Republicans to eliminate the top priorities in Americans minds, that tend to favor Republicans - naitonal security, taxes, abortion, etc., then things like health care, poverty, education, would rise to the top of the list, and Democrats would be elected.

It's so simple, only over thinkers like John Kerry and Al Gore could miss it.


by truthiness on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 01:10:44 AM EST

Re: I have a better strategy..... (3.00 / 1)

What a great strategy! We go along with whatever the GOP claims is their national security policy this week, institute a flat tax, and make forced pregnancy the law of the land, and then the GOP will let us do whatever we want to get rid of poverty. Holy cow, what have I been thinking this whole time? This is totally brilliant!


by Scott Shields on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 01:56:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Truthy isn't a serious person (none / 0)

The first time I saw him, I thought he might be a brilliant satirist. But no, he is just a wingnut repeating the moronic talking point of the day.  


"Once in a while you get shown the light In the strangest of places if you look at it right"
by molly bloom on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 08:50:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I have a better strategy..... (3.00 / 1)

So we should just let republican'ts continue doing their worst, fuck things all up, and then Democrats can come behind once more to clean up the usual mess that republican'ts leave behind.  Such brilliant plan could only have come from the mind of someone that uses Thruthiness as their username -- oh the irony.  I wonder if Colbert knows that some the targets of the Thruthiness joke don't get that they are being made fun of... but I guess that the point.


Vox Mia -- Adding My Voice to the Chorus
by bedobe on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 02:13:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I have a better strategy..... (3.00 / 1)

Do you work for the Republican party?   This is nuts.


by oakland on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 06:41:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I have a better strategy..... (none / 0)

Yes, he does work for the Republican Party.


by Baltimore on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 08:52:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I have a better strategy..... (none / 0)

No, I am a Republican, but I happily do this at no charge, trying to return America to a vibrant 2 party system, not the horrendously lopsided David and Goliath situation we have now....


by truthiness on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 03:11:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

In this case, it's nowhere close to 60% of the way to good policy. Maybe 20% or 10%. This appears to be a lot better than many pieces of legislation (which lots of Dems voted for) for which the best part was the name. But remember that many of these bills (No Child Left Behind springs to mind) were much better when they were first voted on than the version which went into law. And even if this bill ends up instituting a cosmetic tidbit of reform, it sounds oh so much better for them to say "We responded to the problem."

On the Dems' side, I don't think it's so much wanting to do right. I doubt many of them are still under the illusion that the Republicans could do anything in the public interest. Rather it is probably that they are afraid of it being said that they voted against reform. Still, refusing to dignify it with a vote seems like a good strategy.


by Hong Kong Chevy on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 01:26:37 AM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

"I honestly believe the problem here is that, God bless 'em, the Democrats just want to do what's right."

Yes. The Democrats in the congressional delegation remember the times of Dem power. To those of us under 25 DEMOCRATS HAVE BEEN LOSING SINCE WE WERE OLD ENOUGH TO KNOW ABOUT THESE THINGS. We see this whole thing as a struggle for the republic and they just don't. It's why they will always keep the powder dry on the fillibuster, it's why they can't ever comprehend that the best way to improve the country is to get Speaker Palosi and Leader Reid.


by MNPundit on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 03:55:13 AM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

THIS is really sad.  The RIGHT thing to do is to stand up and fight for what you believe in.  This group of Dems has been so isolated in the beltway with high paid consultants who don't give a shit who wins or losers that they have no idea of reality.  Pea brains and granite heads.


by oakland on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 06:43:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

I think it would be great if you could have posted the  link to some kind of draft of the Democrat legislation, instead of only posting the one to the GOP version.

Does anyone have that link? This is important legislation to be sure - and one in which, clearly, 60% of the problem solved, is not enough.

For this is reform of lobbyist activity - and this is, a CANCER.

To remove 60% of a cancer is to leave 40% to metastatize throughout, one must remove 100% of a cancer or face remission. The consequence of this bill, more so than any other - to be incomplete - is especially dire in that lobbyists always use loopholes - and this bill, if you are correct, has loopholes big enough to drive a truck through.


by turnerbroadcasting on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 06:43:47 AM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

Good call.

http://www.dccc.org/fights/honesty_princ iples/


by Scott Shields on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 12:07:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

This stuff is pretty hot. I like this element of the  package:

The Scully & Tauzin Reform: Disclosure of Outside Job Negotiations. Requires lawmakers to disclose when they are negotiating private sector jobs, and requires Executive Branch officials who are negotiating private sector jobs to receive approval from the independent Office of Government Ethics.

This one gets close to what I want to see:

Require that all conference committee meetings be open to the public and that members of the conference committee have a public opportunity to vote on all amendments. Make copies of conference reports available to Members, and post them publicly on the Internet, 24 hours before consideration (unless waived by a supermajority vote).

The only thing I would do , to change that is to incorporate that all members of congress who propose riders and amendments have to defend them on the floor.

I have spent a little time reflecting upon
what the package really means, ie. the one that passed the house.

As best as I can tell, when you are looking at this one line item, which to me, is the most important one - it makes the problem +worse+.

Heres why. The new legislation requires that members of congress explain "why their rider would help with the business of government."  

If this means that the bill amendements and riders are still anonymous, then the author of the amendment just hires a kid out of UGA or Harvard or some place like that, and presto - more language for the bill.

But the problem is, there are regularly, 10,000 page bills heading to the floor. Simply because the authors are still anonymous and the riders are
not defended or open to scrutiny by their colleagues.

People most negatively react to a government they feel they can't comprehend, or control with their vote. And right now, public sentiment is at an all time low.

What we need, is an organic solution that says, stand up for yourself - if you want to get something from the government, by gosh - defend it on the floor.

If we add this to the Dems package,  then we're good to go imho


by turnerbroadcasting on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 01:03:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

When they get back from the Summer Break, the Democrats should obstruct everything.  Long debates, millions of amendments.  Anything that can be done to STOP THE GOVERNMENT.  The premise being that polls show the American Public want the Republicans to STOP so we ought wait till after the election to DO anything.  Between now and then--just quietly slowing things down and getting the Republicans to Vote NO on reform before the voted YES on their own lame version can't hurt.


by David in Burbank on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 09:55:09 AM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

True DAT.  Put the brakes on until the new crop comes in in January.  Then spend the first year undoing as much of the really horrible stuff that BushCo has been up to as we can.


McCain sucks!
by teknofyl on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 10:13:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

have to say, in some sense I disagree. this is one of those strategy points that does make you think - ie. would it be better to stop the enron crowd here and now, or let them operate but clip their wings?

I think moderately bad government is not worse than no government at all. I am not inclined to give my represenatatives paid vacation.


by turnerbroadcasting on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 01:31:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Shows that 2006=1994 analogy... (none / 0)

...is a pile of crap.

Can you imagine Gingrich doing such a thing in Feb 1994?


by skeptic06 on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 10:30:32 AM EST

Two Words (none / 0)

Nancy Pelosi.


by Paul Goodman on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 10:48:26 AM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (3.00 / 1)

WHY DEMOCRATS DON'T (AND CAN'T) WIN ELECTIONS

Why does the Democratic Party keep losing elections when they are on them right side of every issue that the public identifies with in the endless polls taken?

They have become, for the most part, craven cowards seemingly without the courage or principles or the conviction to fight for what is right. The minute Harry Reid invoked the rule to bring the Seenot to a screeching halt until we got answers on the intelligence about Iraq, and then caved utterly and broke his promise, the image of gutless, unprincipled Democrats was again reaffirmed and reinforced the belief that we are bumbling cowards, with no more integrity than Republicans. And if we are viewed to be the same as the sycophantic, morally corrupt, and morally bankrupt Republicans, take a wild guess which party is going to get its ass kicked again in 2006 and 2008.

This is, I know, a sweeping, generalized, and very harsh judgment, but it is deserved. Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Hillary, Rahm, and others who want to be "nice" and go along to get along should look up the word nice. According to the Oxford English Dictionary (the definitive dictionary of the English language), the original meaning of the word "nice" was "idiot", a perfect definition for a party that has lost the will, knowledge, courage, and conviction that makes people vote for a Democrat; they no longer know how to win elections.

We ARE on the right side of every issue, but we appear to be just "Republican Lite" because we don't fight tooth and nail, no-holds-barred, Texas-style, fight to the finish with a nine month time limit to the 2006 elections.

Given the nature of the House of Unrepentant, its rules, and the fact that Democrats have been so beaten down and demoralized that they are just Hastert's bitch, there is no hope of accomplishing anything there. We look like idiots when we hold solitary hearings in a just-like-your-high school-cafeteria setting. People see it as the genuine sign of weakness it is and they are not going to vote for weak, impotent idiots.

The Seenot is a different matter altogether, but there is one glaring weakness on the part of Democrats, and it's called "Unanimous Consent", which allows for the smooth operation of the Seenot and fosters amity.

Amity will not win elections. Until the public sees the Democratic Party fighting vigorously and effectively against the most pernicious agenda of the most pernicious political party in American History we will continue to lose. Lose badly and repeatedly.

Harry should have kept his promise; we should refuse unanimous consent for anything, even what time a committee might meet, and especially when they are trying to push through their ruinous causes. Every time there is a party-line vote on a controversial issue, every democrat should change their vote to "abstain", so it is crystal clear which party is passing bad stuff. Until we return to our Democratic roots of being the champions and defenders of the people of this country we are doomed to be further relegated into obscurity.

If this current Democratic Party had been the same in the 30's, no New Deal, work projects, Social Security; in the 40's, the loss of W.W.II; the 50's, loss of the Korean War, continuing McCarthyism, and communists being hunted endlessly; the 60's, the civil rights movement crushed, equal rights for all denied, and segregation the norm; in the 90's, no balanced budgets, no surpluses, no 22-million jobs created, and no 187% rise in the stock market.

Quick! Name three great things the Republicans have done that benefited the ordinary citizen during the 70's & 80's, and the end of the Cold War doesn't count. Reagan simply outspent the Russians and drove them into bankruptcy trying to keep up. Any teenager with a limitless credit card backed by the treasury could have done that.

Watergate? Domestic spying? Enemies Lists? Iran-Contra? The largest expansion of government ever? The biggest deficits in history? And that doesn't even cover what Bush has done to America in the first six years of the new century, which includes failing to protect us from 9/11; failing to catch Osama and diverting resources to Iraq; the Iraq attack that is the biggest strategic mistake ever made by America; the proliferation of nuclear weapons on their watch; the creation of thousands of new terrorists; the destruction of America's reputation; treaties broken and ignored; enemy combatants held forever without charges, trials, attorneys; torture, secret prisons, kidnapping; tax cuts for the uber rich, no body armor or armored vehicles for the troops; poverty rampant, no health insurance for millions; food programs, education funding, child care funds, after school programs, child support enforcement programs all slashed; a doubling of the trade deficit, exploding budget deficits, more money spent in five years than in the preceding two hundred years; the collapse of diplomacy in favor of raw force; the breaking of our military from over extension and multiple tours of duty in a war zone; new domestic spying, the labeling of dissenters as traitors; a president that has assumed imperial powers, a "unitary executive" with plenary power that holds himself above the law; my god, the list is endless, it is vile, it is corrupt, it is amoral, and it has so distorted the world's view of America that we may never again be respected or trusted.

And this is the party that wins election after election while our Democratic leaders give "unanimous consent" and foster amity in the Seenot instead of fighting with every fiber of their being, every ounce of willpower, and the vigor necessary to stop them in their tracks.

That, in a nutshell, is why I say that the Democratic Party has degenerated into a pack of craven cowards.

Voters respect those willing to fight for their beliefs. They will ignore labels like "partisan" and "obstructionist" as long as they believe Democrats are fighting for them and their rights and the issues they care about.

After all, is amity worth the destruction of the American way of life? So grow a pair and a spine, spit right into the eye of the Republicans, and find the heart and courage to fight the good fight, AND WIN.


by Bill Arnett on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 01:30:48 PM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

the image of a growing pair of testicles, and a backbone with the nerves all dripping out is really pretty disgusting...

tell you what. since democracy is the gift of women anyway (try having a democracy in a room full of warrior soldiers..) ... how about we say ...

just throw everything you've got into a pair of boltcutters for that leash around Dean's neck?


by turnerbroadcasting on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 01:33:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

I generally agree with your point here.  I'd just like to point out as an additional consideration that this is the Senate so Dems have more opportunities than they do on the House side to push their agenda and this has an effect on strategy.  I'm not claiming to be in their heads or anything but I read this situation a little differently.

Dems have a full package that will be their proposal.  This was one piece of what will be brought to the floor.  Rather than voting for their proposal and against the Republican one in Committee, I think the Dems opted to vote "for reform" under any circumstance so that they would be somewhat innoculated against charges of being excessively partisan or only wanting in their way.  When the bill comes to the floor they can get full Senate votes on the Dem package or even each component of the package individually.  The thinking being that this is the real story anyway so why give them any votes to bash us with in the Committee process.  

Just my guess.


by micarrdc on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 02:39:48 PM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

The fundamental problem seems to be that not all (or even most?) Dems aren't convinced that they deserve the majority.  It's a bigger problem than is seen here directly, as it's also acted out in the gradual move to the right.  But they don't have faith that standing on Democratic principles is virtuous in a population that may actually want the Repub version of things.  Of course it would be nice to see them snap out of it, but it hasn't happened yet.


by Lucas O'Connor on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 02:50:49 PM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

We really ought to print stuff like this out, sign itat the bottom and send it in to the democratic senators.  You have to wonder what are they doing to make themselves get heard.  After a while youd think the democrats would be "You know what, we arent gonna do squat until i get satisfaction, so just sit down and listen to my filibuster until then fella".

Its so GD frustrating day after day to see this go on and on and on.


by roycommi on Wed Mar 01, 2006 at 03:34:38 PM EST

Re: Reject. The. Premise. (none / 0)

Why does the Democratic Party keep losing elections when they are on them right side of every issue that the public identifies with in the endless polls taken?

They have become, for the most part, craven cowards seemingly without the courage or principles or the conviction to fight for what is right. The minute Harry Reid invoked the rule to bring the Seenot to a screeching halt until we got answers on the intelligence about Iraq, and then caved utterly and broke his promise, the image of gutless, unprincipled Democrats was again reaffirmed and reinforced the belief that we are bumbling cowards, with no more integrity than Republicans. And if we are viewed to be the same as the sycophantic, morally corrupt, and morally bankrupt Republicans, take a wild guess which party is going to get its ass kicked again in 2006 and 2008.

This is, I know, a sweeping, generalized, and very harsh judgment, but it is deserved. Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Hillary, Rahm, and others who want to be "nice" and go along to get along should look up the word nice. According to the Oxford English Dictionary (the definitive dictionary of the English language), the original meaning of the word "nice" was "idiot", a perfect definition for a party that has lost the will, knowledge, courage, and conviction that makes people vote for a Democrat; they no longer know how to win elections.

We ARE on the right side of every issue, but we appear to be just "Republican Lite" because we don't fight tooth and nail, no-holds-barred, Texas-style, fight to the finish with a nine month time limit to the 2006 elections.

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by kimi98 on Mon Mar 20, 2006 at 04:42:45 AM EST


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