Don't even try and credit me for a damn thing



First Netroots activism arrives gets the play of the week on CNN for the role it played with Hackett's near-win, so Jesse Lee at the DCCC posts a 4:57 pm friday attack that he later has to apologize for: Bob Brigham's Crusade. Then Clift gives Markos credit (he'd be the first to admit he didn't do squat) for leading the charge for Hackett, so does kos too get a whipping from the Dtrippers?

The credit goes to Hackett, the boots on the ground in Ohio, and the 10K plus people that made contributions.



Display:


They don't understand the big picture (none / 0)

How can they possibly understand the details?  They know one or two names, and repeat them.

But, hey, this might be ok, running under the radar often has real advantages, and we who read here daily (and give money ;-)) know.

by lindiana0 on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 03:59:40 PM EST

I gave but (none / 0)

I gave $100 after reading about
Hackett HERE, but when I went
to Act Blue there was no way to
credit MyDD.

dailyKos urges its supporters to
add a penny -- like $XX.01 -- to
each contribution so the recipient
will know the source.

by Woody on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:04:42 PM EST

Re: I gave but (none / 0)

It'd be nice for ActBlue to add a message and/or source field.  That way each donor could note where they came from and/or what motivated them to give, should they choose.
by teknofyl on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 06:44:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Late arrival (none / 0)

I've stated this before, but I think the frustration with the DCCC comes from their targeting of certain races that seem "winnable" or "safe." Not supporting Hackett early was frustrating in a race that proved so close, and emphasized that no race is beyond winnable, only more difficult and challenging.

The DCCC is seen as an "official" arm of the party. Hence when they target a race, it is essentially a tacit endorsement of that candidate by the national party. This opens doors to fundraising sources.

But more damaging, is when they target certain races, they label those not targeted as "unwinnable" or as without party support indirectly and very publicly. While this may not be true and only due to their organizations limited resources, it is devastating to candidates. It places a stigma of futility on their campaigns. It closes doors to fundraising sources. It places doubt about a campaign in the media, the state party, and traditional sources of endorsements.

If they were a private organization, such targeting of races would be understandable and more acceptable. But they are not. The DCCC is an arm of the national party, and as such has a duty to support candidates no matter how difficult their race or district. The question then becomes, how to do this in a way that works with their organizational abilities.

One suggestion I will make is this: the DCCC should highlight publicly races and candidates in ALL districts, and take the focus off their support of certain races and districts. I am not suggesting this be an equal division of resources. It could come in the form of highlighting candidates on their blogs or creating a list of "underdog candidates in need" that is put out by the organization formally and maintained on their website. This should be done early and as often as possible.

Another suggestion would be to look at how they do target the races they do. Jean Schmidt was a terrible candidate. Even though her district was one of the reddest their is, her complete lack of prowess as a candidate and ties to various scandals should have been weighted heavily when the decision was made not to support Hackett early on. A strategic loss here highlights many negatives for the Republican party in an area that needs to we softened up for Democratic party advances.

Witty comment goes here...
by michael in chicago on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:04:59 PM EST

no doubt late (none / 0)

I agree every Democratic nominee
running for Congress should get
a minimum contribution and public
DCCC support.

yet I can understand DCCC's
reluctance to spread limited funds
too thin in a general election when
hundreds of seats are at stake.

but with only one or two special
elections in any year, hey, go for it!
put a hundred grand behind
the campaign of the Democratic
nominee in every special election.

the publicity that comes to the only
election taking place in the country
guarantees good value for the money.

by Woody on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 05:04:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Late arrival (none / 0)

  I have to agree.  The US political party system is the most decentralized in the world.  Try explaining to someone raised in a different system the idea behind a primary (you mean ANYONE can run to represent YOUR party???).  Nor would they understand the concept of someone running for the national legislature (Congress) without the formal and monetary backing of the national party.  I mean we're not talking about county dog catcher here, we're talking about Congress.  I think the party needs to take FULL responsability for candidates that are the Democratic nominees to such high offices.  (as long as they don't start demanding that everyone becomes carbon copies of national leadership).
Next Generation Democrats
by Pitin on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 05:17:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Decentralized and Closed (none / 0)

There are features of American democracy that are open and features that are closed. The two party system is currently a detriment to political participation. Our reactionary Supreme Court has taken the lead in keeping the system closed to third parties. Both parties have cooperated to keep the system closed and lock out third party threats to their political duopoly.

There are many explanations for low voter turnout in America. The two party system is one of them.

by Gary Boatwright on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 10:15:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Late arrival (none / 0)

What if some looney candidate decides to run as a democrat, say in blood red Utah on a platform of polygamy? Should the DCCC support him because his local netroots does?

I don't see the concern here. The netroots is gaining in significance and influence. I say let the autonomous organizations sort themselves out and concentrate on what they each do best.

How about the netroots consolidating and establishing a formal nationwide organization?

http://operationyellowelephant.blogspot.com/
by Vote Hillary 2008 on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 10:19:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

My Point (none / 0)

is this.  I'm not sure primaries are the best way to select Party candidates (feel free to flog away).  The system will not change anytime now.  But assuming that an Uber-conservative in Utah was in a Democratic primary, danm near everysingle Democrat in the country would chip in to defeat him/her.  Perhaps even an official disaproval from Dean or Reid.  If this individual was succesfull in hijacking the primary, then YES, we should support the candidate.  That is what political parties are for.  Now no one ever wants to see this scenario pan out.
To answer your question for substantially.  Yes, the DCCC and DSCC should support anyone who runs with the Democratic banner.  If we in the party don't like said candidate, that should be taken care of in the primary.  But whoever wins the primary is the Official candidate and should count on full support from the Party.  (not neccesarily the netroots though)
Next Generation Democrats
by Pitin on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 11:33:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: My Point (none / 0)

Some crappy candidates make it through primaries. Look at Katherine Harris for the republicans.
http://operationyellowelephant.blogspot.com/
by Vote Hillary 2008 on Sun Aug 07, 2005 at 03:19:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Crappy nominees (none / 0)

  If someone wins a primary, that is because they won a plurality of the vote in the primaries.  I am not naive enough to believe that means that they are supported by the plurality of the party.  Therefore, the blame lies on the party and it's voting members for not mobalizing to support a stronger candidate.  But I will tell you that Washington does not always know who the strongest candidate is for CD's or other localized elections.  So, whomever wins the primary is the selection of the local party (voters if not leaders) and thus should be supported by the national party.  The Alabama Democratic Party is officialy anti-choice (someone PLEASE correct me if I'm naming the wrong state), and while that might not be what we want here in Washington, it is apperantly what they want down in Alabama.
  My point is this, no one wants Washington handpicking the candidates, so we HAVE to trust the primary system, and support whomever comes out of it fully.
Next Generation Democrats
by Pitin on Sun Aug 07, 2005 at 05:14:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

asdf (none / 0)

Bob stepped over the line.

Bob believes in challenging the parties institutions  to perform better, and that's good. But as Jesse's post makes clear, Bob has pretty much been willfully misrepresenting the DCCC's actual contribution to OH-02.

I think Jesse was right to publicly challenge Bob, especially since Bob has had no problem railing inaccurately against the DCCC to every major media outlet that he could find.

by blueflorida on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:33:06 PM EST

Opinion, not fact (none / 0)

I've been following the discussion and it is not black and white where the "blame" lies. Jesselee has been "misrepresenting" or spinning details every bit as much as Bob has. One man's opinion is another man's "misrepresentation."

Bob has just as much right to publicly challenge the DCCC and Jesselee as Jesselee has to respond. What I may have missed is where Bob made it personal by using Jesselee's name. What I haved seen from Bob have been generic complaints about the DCCC. I have not seen any personal attack that Bob made against Jesselee or any other individual.

What you call "railing" I call constructive criticism.

by Gary Boatwright on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 10:20:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Opinion, not fact (3.00 / 0)

Like I said, it's terrific that Bob's challenging the establishment and its assumptions. Calling the DCCC "irrelevant" and cursing at the DCCC Exec. Dir. is a little more than 'constructive criticism.'
by blueflorida on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 11:29:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Opinion, not fact (none / 0)

Cursing! Well that would certainly be rude. Who is the DCCC Exec. Director?

I'm not sure why a little blue language has any substantive effect on the discussion at hand. Is the DCCC Exec. Dir. an overly sensitive type or perhaps have a touch of blue blood in them?

by Gary Boatwright on Mon Aug 08, 2005 at 03:16:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

He apologized (none / 0)

for calling him a liar, not for saying what he did. You're as bad as they are.
by asf6 on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:38:25 PM EST

Re: He apologized (none / 0)

He apologized for the personal attack, which is what I pointed toward. About the larger debate,

I didn't bother getting into it with this post, but I don't think that the DCCC, having obviously been overspent by volunteer forces, has much of a leg to stand on in their defense, when we wound up losing by just 3 percent. But I do think they are smart enough to avoid making that mistake again.

by Jerome Armstrong on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:50:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

We'll see what happens in CA-48 (none / 0)

I tend to think that the marshalling of funds/resources is not necessarily a bad idea, but they need a minimum.

Once the Dem Primary is over, the Dem nominee should get some damn seed money!  We're not talking about a ton of change her, by DNC/DCCC standards.  We're talking about enough to get a legitimate campaign going, and enough to make citing DCCC/DNC backing more than a technicality.

I'm no expert, but I don't think that the DCCC has the 'metrics' to accurately pick a winner from a field of losers.

Statistics are great... I'm a firm believer in the analysis, and strategically placing your resources, etc.  But the fact is... that there are things peculiar to each election that make it different, which is why none of knows what will happen before a given race.

You gotta put some of your portfolio in blue chips, some in bonds, and some in lottery tickets!
The Hackett race was WINNABLE.  There were 500 more potential Hackett voters in that district, and we failed to reach them.  Not the DCCC, but the Hackett campaign.  But earlier DCCC support would have been nice.

BTW, I don;t buy that bit about the DCCC staying out of it to keep the RNCC from getting involved.  BS!  They wrote it off.  Then changed their minds.  It was a TURD of strategy, not a jewel like they want to presnt it!  This isn't friggin' Rocky III where you let the opponent wear himself out on your face.  We're not Homer Simpson here!

That being said, I'm glad the DCCC kicked in at the end and helped out for the cause.  Props for reversing the write-off, if not for frankness about the logic.

I want to see CA-48 seriously targetted by all progressive and Democratic organizations.  We need the special elections to futhere 'work the cut' that we started in OH-02.  Anyone who watched Ultimate Fighting knows how that works.  We'd be fools not to seek any way possible to embarass and weaken the GOP, to send shivers down their spine and make them all second guess siding blindly w/ GW.

Let's all tell Dean to get silly, too.  I'm waiting to hear him dig the GOP out for running a wrinkly old puss like Schmidt.

And we need a candidate in CA-48.  One that rocks.  One that's tuned into that disctrict.  Maybe that's where the blogosphere can help, in identifying the winner for CA-48 and putting that halo around them.

by teknofyl on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 06:58:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: He apologized (none / 0)

Well I watched on cable news as Hackett's team said they had more than enough money by the end of the campaign and that more grassroots/turnout efforts would have been needed to close the gap for a win. So that final 3% wouldn't have been solved by throwing more dollars at it.
http://operationyellowelephant.blogspot.com/
by Vote Hillary 2008 on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 10:21:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Just be honest (none / 0)

This quote was the most honest assessment of the situation:

DCCC Executive Director John Lapp issued a statement defending the committee. Saying the DCCC would like to fund every House race, he said: "Resources are not infinite. That is why MyDD, the Daily Kos, and the larger blogosphere are so important. You are critical in the effort to expand the playing field well above and beyond the 30 or 40 districts typically in play."

The DCCC admits this is their strategy.  Now they have to ask if this is the correct one.  They should not be going around implying they purposefully waited until the last moment because that was their strategy, that they did not want to nationalize the race.

And I agree, the DCCC should spread the money and resources around a little better.  They have to stop with the winnable/unwinnable notion that comes out of their endorsements.  It's the same thing as the 17/18 state strategy that Washington DC is employing.

by exLogCabin on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:39:43 PM EST

Re: Just be honest (none / 0)

It is the same " 17/18 state strategy that Washington DC is employing", on the House CD level instead of the state level, good point.
by Jerome Armstrong on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:53:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Reality check (none / 0)

About 96% of incumbents get re-elected. Republicans generally raise about twice as much money as Dems.

So, given the limited resources, and the small chance of winning, would one of you sceptics please offer a viable strategy?

Thanks, I await (as I'm sure the does the DCCC) your suggestions.

---Policies not Politics
Daily Quiet Image
by rdf on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 04:42:30 PM EST

Re: Reality check (none / 0)

I would have argued with some others that the DCCC should have invested $1M in the race a week out. That would have done a number of things.

First, it would have doubled the volunteer effort, thus signaling that the DCCC understood what was happening, and was taking an aggresive position in the effort. This would have signaled leadership to the netroots, and they would have been getting credit for the race, even if we'd lost by the same amount, instead of scorn. It also would have paid off, because they'd be getting more contributions for appreciation, rather than unsubscribes.

Second, it would have effectively locked the NRCC out. The NRCC came in first, and bought up the best hours, and effectively left the DCCC with only an option of being in the market at half the exposure of the NRCC. The DCCC knew it was close, but thought the NRCC was asleep, and wouldn't spend a dime in the race, so they waited. You never underestimate your enemy like that, when winning is your focus. Instead, money was the focus of the DCCC, conserving resources. They sat back and watched, instead of taking the initiative.

It's easy to do hindsight calculations in how Hackett could have won. It's much more difficult to act as an institution with limited resources to win, instead of having those limited resources be an obstacle to doing what it takes to win... as the gurus say, thinking and acting abundant is the key to making it happen.

The DCCC probably got the worst of all the worlds in how it played out. They did go in with resources, probably making it closer than it would have been had they sat out, then they got the brunt of the blow for the effort just missing. I know these guys that work in the DCCC work hard, and I'm sure that Rahm realizes that this was one that could have been won with a bit different strategy, so we'll see what happens next.

by Jerome Armstrong on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 05:11:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Reality check (none / 0)

This wasn't an incumbent, but an open seat.
by Jerome Armstrong on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 05:11:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Realistic starting point (none / 0)

1) As above, an early contribution
to the nominee in EVERY special
election. Do that routinely.

2) Make a useful contribution, of say,
$10,000, to every nominee, EARLY,
a week or so after the primary.  We know,
early money is like yeast. And if the early
money comes from the national Dems
it can help to stimulate local donors,
just as it absence, as noted above,
can demoralize them.

3) Make the contribution in a way
that gets press, e.g. Pelosi or another
name Dem ( obviously, one chosen
as suitable for the district, sometimes
a ranking official from a neighboring
state would be best ) flies in for
a fund-raiser and rally, photo op
presentation of check measuring
8 feet by 3 feet, amount exceeded
by that raised at the local event.

4 ) If there is not enough money
in the pot to give every candidate
a $10,000 dowry EARLY, then
set a transparent, reasonable
but attainablestandard for this
and the future year's contributions.

Such as, to every campaign in a
district where the Dem Presidential
ticket got over 45% of the vote,
OR
where the Dem share of the vote
for Congress has increased
by more than 5 percentage points
over the previous cycles.

( The second criteria because,
for example, without it next year's
candidate in Ohio-2 would not qualify,
due to the Bush share in '04. )

It would help for candidates and
grassroots Democrats to know
that a good campaign effort will be
rewarded by the national Dems
the next time around even if the
effort does not win the seat this time. )

5) In every state with three or more
Congressional districts, EARLY
funds to the district with the highest
Dem share of the vote in the previous
election. ( So not all districts in all
Southern and Border states
will be written off always. )

Well, it's a start.

by Woody on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 05:50:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Why accept the 96%? (none / 0)

Of course it's 96% or whatever when you don't contest so many!

Look... A LOT OF PEOPLE IN CONGRESS SUCK.  On both sides.  Find the ones that suck the worst, and make them pay for it.

this is why we need Dean's 50 state strategy.  We need someone in each district telling us what is going o there, how it's playing out.  GOPers from heavily red districts take their reelection for granted, and piss people off.  Some of them are ugly, or inarticulate, or just plain goofy.  Fuck, you can spot them on C-SPAN!

Have you seen The Waterboy?  You know when the kicker is looking for the onside kick, and spots the dork... and smiles and says "Yeah, you're my bitch..."?  That's what we have to do... see past the numbers and realize that some of these losers just don't belong in the U.S. Congress.  House and Senate.

Hindsight is 20/20, but you're just a dumbass if you can't learn from experience.  We've seen what hoarding the resources and running only in swing states/districts got us.  A kick to the nuts, and the worst fucking president in the history of presidents, with a double majority in Congress and the chance to nominate at least 1, maybe up to 3 or 4 SCOTUS justices.  WTF?

We've been getting our asses kicked by a bunch of clowns who are destroying our country.  Hackett was balls-on when he said that the greates threat to the US was GW.  We have to win NOW, because it's gonna take much longer to clean up the mess than it took them 9and us) to make it!

The plan?  Be agressive, be optomistic, go for the jugular early and count on victory to bring in more resources.  Simple... you put everything into a blow to the face... if it lands, you'll have PLENTY of time to place the next blow.  If not, the guy is on the defensive.  Hopefully.  You still need faith, and no guarantees... but you never win the fight standing there covering your head and nuts hoping the other guys runs away from your weak-ass defense.

by teknofyl on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 07:11:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Why accept the 96%? (none / 0)

You're going to need a consolidated netroots organization nationwide to really bring that effort to bear. The GOP has had a powerful grassroots network such as that in place for decades and you saw the result of it in 2004.
http://operationyellowelephant.blogspot.com/
by Vote Hillary 2008 on Sat Aug 06, 2005 at 10:24:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Jerome, you can help solve this (none / 0)

Jerome's got more credibility than anyone. If you really think the DCCC is what Brigham says, then say so -- and let us know we shouldn't donate money to it, should unsub from their list and should generally consider it "irrelevant."

IF Brigham is acting out of line, which is how it appears to a lot of people who have no particular "old guard" stake to defend, then maybe you could ask him to calm the waters a bit.

The stakes are far too high for this sort of pettiness and self-sabotage. Democrats can't afford to do this now, when we're still on the brink of becoming a permanent minority party.

by desmoulins on Sun Aug 07, 2005 at 12:21:51 AM EST

Re: Jerome, you can help solve this (none / 0)

I've not criticized Bob, he's ignited the discussion and if that helps to get the DCCC and the netroots on the same page going forward it's good.
by Jerome Armstrong on Sun Aug 07, 2005 at 12:53:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Jerome, you can help solve this (none / 0)

I never donate to organizations, only directly to candidate campaigns. It's the only way I trust my dollars not being used for some hotel suite upgrade or funneled to some 3rd party.
http://operationyellowelephant.blogspot.com/
by Vote Hillary 2008 on Sun Aug 07, 2005 at 03:25:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

One step further (none / 0)

I hand deliver my donations directly to the Candidate. This way, after they're (re)elected, they remember the face when I want to talk policy.


Democratic Candidate, US Senate, Wisconsin 2012
by benmasel on Mon Aug 08, 2005 at 09:47:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Credit? (none / 0)

I don't give a rat's ass about credit I care about getting stuff done!

Stop patting eachother on the back and march dammit.

DAGGER
by goplies on Sun Aug 07, 2005 at 12:42:11 AM EST


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