Clinton's plan

Clinton will be dead and gone before Social Security needs to be changed, but he's decided that he's had enough of seeing Bush get his ass kicked by Democrats over the issue of Social Security. Did the Republicans come up with a plan when the Clintons tried to reform Healthcare?  No, and that's why Bill Clinton got the Democratic Congressional leadership's head handed to him after the '94 midterm election. Now though, Clinton is supplying Republican talking points:

Former President Bill Clinton: "[I] Think [Democrats] Need To Come Up With A Plan Of Their Own." (ABC's "Saturday Good Morning America," 5/7/05, Via ABC News' "The Note," 5/5/05)

President Clinton: "I Think The Democrats Should Say What They Are For On Social Security In The Next Couple Weeks ... The Democrats Should Have A Plan And They Should Talk To The President And The Congressional Republicans About It." (ABC's "Saturday Good Morning America," 5/7/05, Via ABC News' "The Note," 5/5/05)

Let me guess, Hillary has a plan; let me guess, it raises taxes; let me guess, the Clinton's are going to find a way for themselves to shine while the Democratic Party gets beat again.

The Democratic Plan is already in action-- it's called Social Security.



Display:


Arrrrgggggh (none / 0)

Is this all we have?

The Clinton's bailing out Bush and now Kerry is saying that Massachusetts was wrong regarding civil unions...

What the fuck is wrong with this picture?

Besides telling us how to live, think, marry, pray, vote, invest, educate our children and, die, the GOP has done a fine job of getting gov't out of our lives.
by Parker on Fri May 06, 2005 at 12:50:58 PM EST

The Clintons (3.00 / 2)

This does not surprise me in any way.  The Clintons are for 1 thing- the Clintons.  Bill has stayed with Hillary because staying with Hillary has advanced his huge ego and greed; the same is for why Hillary stayed with Bill.  The two are social vultures and the Democrats would be smart to tell them to get lost-they had their time in the sun-to the detriment of the Democratic Party which has now lost both houses of Congress and the presidency.  (Even though the presidency was stolen, but I agree we need to help Democrats win by such a large margin that not even paperless touch-tone computer voting machines can steal away from them.)

Democrats are winning the debate on Social Security.  They need to point out what they have been pointing out-that Social Security is not in crisis, that private accounts will not only bankrupt the system but involve huge benefit cuts to almost every American, and that any problem in the future can be solved by rather harmless solutions such as raising the cap on the wealthy for SS taxes.

As I have stated in the past, I have had enough of Bill Clinton's kissing the butt of the Bush family.  This is all a strategy to position Hillary in the middle.  She will sell out her base once she takes office.  The base should call a spade a spade and tell her and her disloyal, adulterous, lecherous husband to take a hike.

Democrats can do better.  We have done better, we are the party of Franklin Roosevelt, Harry Truman, John Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson and the Great Society, the moral clarity and compassion of Jimmy Carter, the toughness of John Kerry, the compassion of John Edwards-we can do and have always done much better than this pathetic, self-serving, greedy and immoral pair of opportunists, Bill and Hillary Clinton.

by MichiganDemocrat on Fri May 06, 2005 at 12:55:14 PM EST

Re: The Clintons (3.00 / 1)

I agree with everything except the kerry line.  If Kerry was tough in the past he sure didn't show it in the campaign.  He let the swifties stomp on him and said almost nothing.
by Delver Rootnose on Fri May 06, 2005 at 02:15:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Clintons [OT] (none / 0)

Nice Nick.  I wonder how many people know where that comes from, Citizen Floyt?
by paperwight on Mon May 09, 2005 at 10:30:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The Clintons (none / 0)

Here's a discussion yesterday over at dkos. If Hillary has a plan, it better be a beaut. If Hillary doesn't have a plan, she better divorce Bill if she intends to run for office again.
by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 04:11:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Liking Clinton Less and Less (none / 0)

I think he's been hanging around Dole too much or something.  Maybe it's that President's Club thing.  Maybe he just can't live with out the spot light cast on him from time to time - no matter what he has to say to get it.  Maybe he really believes it or maybe he's worried about his "legacy " again.  Who knows?  But sometimes he just doesn't seem to be on our side.
by David in Burbank on Fri May 06, 2005 at 12:55:29 PM EST

FUCK CLINTON!!!!!! (3.00 / 2)

Reason #8,658 why Bill Clinton should not be lionized by the Left the way he has been of late just because George W. Bush is the Worst President this Country Has Ever Had.

I still have not forgiven Bill Clinton over signing Welfare Repeal -- nor will I ever.   He is breathtakingly cynical, and has proven time and time again that he will sell out the Democratic Party for his own personal political gain.

Democrats, get out of your startruck gaze at Bill Clinton and develop a backbone.  

I never quite understood the fascination that black people have with Bill Clinton.  I remember how Toni Morrison named him the "first black President" -- my gut feeling at the time was, "I doubt Lani Guinier would feel that way"

by Paul Hogarth on Fri May 06, 2005 at 01:11:01 PM EST

Re: FUCK CLINTON!!!!!! (none / 0)

With all due respect, when African-Americans see someone who they can relate to and vice-versa, whom they have dealt with on a very regular basis (as was the case in Arkansas), an inevitable bond forms.

More than any other communtiy, the African-American community was outraged by the persecution and harassment leveled at Clinton by Kenneth Starr and his Republican cronies.  They could relate to being targeted.

Clinton has had black friends dating back to childhood.  He is naturally comfortable in the African-American community.  He isn't afraid to tell them how he feels, as in the case of Sister Souljah.  Some blacks were upset, but it solidified his respect in the community.  He didn't pander.

African-Americans form the most loyal group within the Democratic Party.  Yet too often, the respect has not been sufficiently returned.  Rather, they are viewed as just another special interest group.  A lot of latte liberals, who may not even know any black people, think that they can "relate" to them.  Yet they don't even know them.  And they make no effort to learn.

But Clinton doesn't fall into this group.  It is a sincere relationship that he has with the African-American community.  And you can't put a price on that

Does this answer your question?

by v2aggie2 on Fri May 06, 2005 at 10:42:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: FUCK CLINTON!!!!!! (none / 0)

I am a white guy so I am hardly an expert on Clinonton's relations with blacks.  But, in my midnd, Clinton is the epitamy of how Democrats take blacks for granted.  Yes, he had "feel good" tours in his second term about a "national dialogue on rac."  But what did Clinton actually do for African Americans.  

I do know he ended the welfare entitlement so poor people (of any color) can commence starvation after 5 years on welfare.  I know that he did not propose one program of substance to deal with poverty.

To give credit where credit is due, he did raise the earned income tax credit, which assisted the working poor.  But as far as taking a position on most economic matters that would have made a real difference in the life of poor and middle class people of any color, Clinton wasnt particularly there.

I understand that your post dealt with race and mine dealt with class and poverty and of course I recognize that blacks compose every class and income level.  Still, I think blacks are way over represented in the ranks of the poverty stricken and the working poor and Clinton (and most
democrats) do nothing about this.

Andy Katz
by Andy Katz on Sat May 07, 2005 at 02:27:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: FUCK CLINTON!!!!!! (none / 0)

Remember, he was working with a Republican congress.  It is hard to get everything that you want.

And as for welfare reform, well, you can argue with the merits of the actual bill passed, and this is valid (I won't comment here.).  But there is no doubt that there was widespread support for some sort of welfare reform on both sides of the aisle.  Welfare in many cases can be a perpetuator of a worse life.  Helping and rewarding people with a path towards self-sufficiency is never a bad thing.  Welfare in many ways provided a convenient excuse for some Democrats to act like they were doing something about poverty, when in fact, they weren't.

The war against poverty is bigger than Bill Clinton.  It should have begun before his administration, and continued after.  Neither has happened.  I'm not saying that Clinton could not have done better.  But how much help was he getting from other Democrats. ABSOLUTELY NONE!  
He carried the Democratic Party throughout the 1990's

It is easy to forget that when Clinton took office, he faced the hard task of rebuilding an economy for the long term.  In 7 years, he balanced the budget, despite significant fighting with Republicans to get what he wanted.  Did issues with poverty suffer?  Probably.  But Clinton faced the long-term first.  It is difficult to fight poverty in a first-rate manner when you have to face the devastating effects of large budget deficits.  By 1999, I think we were ready to start a true war on poverty.  Unfortunately, Gore lost in 2000.  Bush became president.  We have record deficits.  And poverty?  Clinton made an effort.  Bush never will.

The problem with fighting poverty in the past is that the Democratic Party has dealt with certain symptoms of poverty, but not the disease as a whole.  If you do that, the disease goes merrily on.  Clinton started the process of doing this.  But it was never going to end with him if it was to be successful.  This fight is not easy.  It is hard work.

Finally, I will say this.  I am 33 years old and Indian-American.  I have been a Democrat my whole life.  However, prior to 1992, I viewed the opportunities for minorities such as myself to be non.  It was still largely a white man's party from the leadership standpoint.

Clinton's election in 1992 changed that for me and others like me.  He brought in more minorities and women BY FAR than any other President, before and since.  Now, I felt that I could make a difference in my Party.  I am a Precinct Chair in Northeast Texas now.  I don't believe that it would have possible without Bill Clinton.  He gave me the inspiration.

So, when you call his "national dialogue on race" a "feel good measure", well, with all due respect, it means a lot to me.  Race IS an issue in country, and Clinton had the guts to take the issue on head-first.  When I saw him talk about race, I knew right away:  HE GETS IT!  A lot of Democrats still don't, though they would like to believe that they do.

by v2aggie2 on Sat May 07, 2005 at 05:46:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Let me guess (none / 0)

Is it OK to hate Hillary now? I've been suspicious of her silence on key issues for several weeks. This confirms my suspicion. Hillary has no loyalty to Social Security or the Democratic party. Dick Morris has been right about her all along.

Query 1: Is Hillary DLC?

Query 2: Who the hell cares?

Query 3: Are Al From and the DLC going to back Clinton's play?

Query 4: Has this been their plan all along? Is this the reason the Democratic party has not officially adopted the them There is no crisis?

I don't know exactly how you target the turncoats, but they have to be made to pay a price. Lieberman is step one. Biden, Feinstein or Hillary will be step two. We have to have a Political Human Sacrifice organized by the netroots. It's not going to come from any other source.

The goal is to send the message to politicians in Washington. If you betray working class Americans, you lose your job.

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 01:17:11 PM EST

Re: Let me guess (none / 0)

Is Dick Morris your guide?

Sorry to hear that...a disloyal, smarmy lowlife such as Morris is worthy of no respect.  Whatever he says, it is a safe bet to believe the opposite, and see what his vindictive motives really are.  He doesn't like Clinton, even though Clinton basically gave the worthless son of a bitch whatever "fame" he has.  This is the jackass who is publically supporting the counter-Clinton library in Little Rock.

Want to control air pollution?  Tell Dick Morris to shut up!

by v2aggie2 on Fri May 06, 2005 at 10:50:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I've got a better idea (1.00 / 1)

Tell Bill Clinton to shut up
by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 10:58:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I've got a better idea (none / 0)

Thanks for the advice, Dick.
Hope the Fox news gig keeps paying dividends
by v2aggie2 on Fri May 06, 2005 at 11:01:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I've got a better idea (none / 0)

See you at my new diary asswipe. Wishing you lots of luck extracting your head from Bush's asshole.
by Gary Boatwright on Sat May 07, 2005 at 12:03:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I've got a better idea (none / 0)

Boy, what a comeback!
I'm so impressed.
Please keep posting...your rants are always good for a nice laugh.
by v2aggie2 on Sat May 07, 2005 at 02:01:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Bill Clinton is Heliotropic (none / 0)

Just like plants, Bill Clinton is always turning towards the Sun. More precisely, the spotlight of public attention.

Since the current debate is about Social Security, Clinton cannot resist the urge to draw attention to himself -- and he can't do that, unless he trumps GWB.

While he was president, I often said Bill Clinton's great failure was that he is a trimmer, following the latest polls.

A true statesman, like FDR, is always guided by the pole stars of conviction. Polls are useful for calibrating the message -- but if you have no principles, in the end you will only empower the Bush-Gingrich-DeLay Barbarians.

by ck on Fri May 06, 2005 at 01:47:15 PM EST

If the Plan calls for creating Universal Health (none / 0)

care as a part of Social Security, like Medicare for all, etc. then maybe I could see it as something I could get behind. Sure it's a frog without legs, but as a good offense to get us off defense, I could like it.
Jeff Wegerson - PrairieStateBlue
by wegerje on Fri May 06, 2005 at 02:10:24 PM EST

Clinton's Plan (3.00 / 1)

I disagree with Clinton on this.

However, I see no reason why we should pounce on him and attack him as though he were a Republican. This is ridiculous. Can't Democrats tolerate Democrats who disagree with them? How on earth can Democrats make a comeback if we fight among ourselves?

Reserve your ire for Republicans and how they are trashing our country. Then discuss ways of improving our society.

by PaulSiegel on Fri May 06, 2005 at 02:10:39 PM EST

Re: Clinton's Plan (3.00 / 1)

I'm pouncing on him for giving bad advice.
by Jerome Armstrong on Fri May 06, 2005 at 02:37:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton's Plan (3.00 / 1)

No Democrat is more important than Social Security. Have you been to the GOP site that Jerome linked to?

Democrats are on the verge of grasping defeat from the jaws of victory. Clinton deserves to be slammed. Why should BillandHillary be treated any differently than Lieberman or any Republican that threatens Social Security?

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 03:41:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton's Plan (none / 0)

Agreed!

Excellent post.

by v2aggie2 on Fri May 06, 2005 at 10:52:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I didn't find anything at the Note (none / 0)

Does The Note have another page somewhere? I couldn't find the story. I'm taking another look, but the only thing I found about Bill was about some global initiative:

The Clintons of Chappaqua:
Deb Orin of the New York Post chatted with the former president in Baltimore earlier this week and provides a months-early curtain raiser on the "Clinton Global Initiative" gathering he is organizing in New York this September. Orin has an early peek at some of the folks invited and expected to attend. LINK

The Wall Street Journal's Alan Murray interviews Bill Clinton about his Global Initiative:

"The Global Initiative will be funded by charging the companies that participate. Any funds left over after covering costs will go to the William J. Clinton Foundation, a nonprofit that pursues various global health, economic, political and social initiatives."

There was also nothing under the Social Security heading.

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 02:11:00 PM EST

Re: I didn't find anything at the Note (none / 0)

Are you accusing the RNC of lying, ha, I took the bait... from what it says though, it's a transcript of TV.
by Jerome Armstrong on Fri May 06, 2005 at 02:37:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I didn't find anything at the Note (none / 0)

I went to the source precisely because I don't trust the Republicans on anything. The GOP site says May 5th Note, but I was checking the May 6th Note.

Mystery solved.

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 03:31:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Clinton and Soc Sec Reform (3.00 / 1)

Agree with wegerje and PaulSiegel, above. After reading My Life, I am convinced that Clinton is, first and foremost, a pragmatic politician. I hardly agreed with everything he did during his administration and he may have taken one step backward on progressive issues but, on the balance, he took two forward in a politically hostile environment.  I think he deserves credit for that.  The Clintons are no more or less narcissistically changed then many others inside the Beltway, enven if they live in Chappaqua now . . And, after reading the American Prospect article on Bill Thomas, Rethuglican chair of the House Ways and Means Committee,the Dems better have some response to his avowed plan to ram Soc Sec reform through the committee and onto the House floor for a vote.    
by MD in MA on Fri May 06, 2005 at 02:38:19 PM EST

Re: Clinton and Soc Sec Reform (none / 0)

Clinton's skills as a political strategist have always been overrated.  He was (is) an extraordinary politician, but not a especially strong strategist or tactician. Afterall, he thought Dick Morris was a political genius.

I was particularly distressed by Clinton's apparent behind the scenes role in enabling the Iraq war.  This was more evident in the U.K. than in the US. It appeared that Bill Clinton may have played a critical role in enabling and bucking up Tony Blair to support Bush's war in Iraq in 2002 and 2003.

by Ben Brackley on Fri May 06, 2005 at 03:07:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton and Soc Sec Reform (none / 0)

"Clinton's skills as a political strategist have always been overrated."

I could not agree with this more.  If nothing else, Clinton will go down in history as the worst party leader since Herbert Hoover.  Thanks Bill.

Andy Katz
by Andy Katz on Sat May 07, 2005 at 02:29:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Clinton and Soc Sec Reform (none / 0)

the Dems better have some response to his avowed plan to ram Soc Sec reform through the committee and onto the House floor for a vote.

The Democratic plan is called Social Security. Their response to GOPers ramming something through the House is a filibuster in the Senate.

Clinton is throwing Bush and the Republicans a life preserver. They will be gloating about this until the cows come home drunk. I now despise BillandHillary more than Dick Morris does. Dick Morris has far too high an opinion of Hillary.

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 04:08:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Email Hillary! (none / 0)

Email Hillary. I think we should let her know how we feel.

I just sent the following email:

Dear Senator Clinton,

Is your husband out of his ever loving mind? What in the hell is this about:

http://www.gop.com/news/Read.aspx?ID=5430

DAY 7 AFTER PRESIDENT ANNOUNCES SOCIAL SECURITY
PROPOSAL; PRESIDENT CLINTON TO FELLOW
DEMOCRATS: GET A PLAN

"Bill Clinton's call to Democrats to stand up and address the issue of Social Security is a refreshing reminder that he and former Democrat Senators Moynihan, Kerrey and Breaux understood the importance of strengthening Social Security. The Pelosi-Reid Democrats of today should learn from their predecessors and set aside their agenda of obstruction. It's not only a losing political strategy, but Americans deserve leaders of both parties who lead with principle rather than partisan antics."

-Tracey Schmitt, RNC Press Secretary

If you would like to clarify whether or not you agree with the former Bonehead In Chief, you are not particularly popular at MyDD right now:

http://www.mydd.com/story/2005/5/6/123816/5795

Is Dick Morris right about your ambition? Are you planning on pulling a Lieberman and throwing Bush a life preserver?

I think an explanation is in order.

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 03:38:22 PM EST

NG (none / 0)

I live in an extremely conservative, Repub controlled area of PA (Lancaster County), and guess who was the head speaker this week at the annual Repub lovefest, otherwise called the annual Chamber of Commerce dinner?  Bill Clinton who was paid some astronomical sum to speak for a few hours.  

Why does Clinton do these things?  For money, or to convert conservatives to the side of the "force", or does he really want to be one of these guys?  Inquiring minds want to know?  When Clinton was in office and he paved the way for all these jobs to go elsewhere, did that indicate a workingman's Democratic leaning?  I think not.  In fact, it seems to me that a lot of Bush's outsourcing economic tendencies were put in place by big Bill.

Finally, I am going to hear Roy Neel speak tonight at a local Democratic gathering, which because of this hyperconservative location will be small.  Roy Neel use to be a Clinton Deputy Chief of Staff, and was Dean's campaign manager.  Is this guy a comitted progressive?  Is he like Clinton and the same question can be asked of Clinton?

Does anyone out there have any realistic opinions about Neel and/or questions you would suggest to be asked of him?

by NG on Fri May 06, 2005 at 03:51:14 PM EST

ugh I don't trust Hilary or Bill (none / 0)

... one bit.

We need W to twist in the wind for as long as possible -- we've waited too long for W's arrogance and stupid bullheadness to put him in a box...  what the hell is Bill doing, cutting him a door?

by sarany on Fri May 06, 2005 at 04:16:08 PM EST

Unmitigated Disaster (none / 0)

There is no other way to look at it:

(1.) Bill Clinton has just single handedly salvaged Bush's 60 day disaster campaigning to kill Social Security. Bush can get up in front of the whole nation and say "See? I was right. There is a Social Security crisis."

(2.) Republican accusations that Democrats are obstructionists have just been legitimized.

(3.) The slight chance that the Blair-Bush Iraq memo would make either the Sunday Funny Shows or the MSM is now dead. The only topic on the Sunday Funny Shows will be Bill Clinton agreeing with Bush that there is a crisis and we have to fix it this year.

(4.) Democrats are going to get their butts kicked on Social Security this weekend and from here on out. They were already doing bad enough as it is.

(5.) Is it too late to go back to the Senate and Impeach Bill Clinton?

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 04:36:01 PM EST

This comment... (none / 0)

"The Democratic Plan is already in action-- it's called Social Security."

... bears repeating.

The 10,000 Things
by Andrew C White on Fri May 06, 2005 at 05:01:46 PM EST

Nitpicky Correction (none / 0)

Clinton lost Congress in the 1994 midterm election, not 1992.  He won the presidency in 92.

Also, I've disagreed with Clinton on many issues, but I still feel he was a great president overall.  In my book he was too conservative, but I don't expect perfection or across the board agreement.

by Ryan on Fri May 06, 2005 at 05:03:31 PM EST

Re: Nitpicky Correction (none / 0)

Correction noted; yea, this has nothing to do with his presidency (but it probably does with hers).
by Jerome Armstrong on Fri May 06, 2005 at 06:35:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Clinton Lost Congress . . . (none / 0)

. . . in 1994 because of his absolute ineptitude on everything, during his first two years in office.

Starting with Gays in the Military, through multiple Nanny Gates, ending with Hillary Care, Bill Clinton screwed up everything. They would think out loud about policy, get battered from the left and right, and finally wimp out on the issue of the day. Week after week, Mark Shields would be aghast at their incompetence.

This horrible performance played right into the Limbaugh/Gingrich axis of right wing bullshit -- and the 1994 rebuke at the polls led Bill Clinton back to Dick Morris, and a repudiation of the Democratic Party. The Triangulation Strategy made Republicans and Democrats the scapegoats, and allowed Bill Clinton to dodge the consequences of his first two years.

by ck on Fri May 06, 2005 at 06:58:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Correction (none / 0)

Clinton and the Democratic Congress raised taxes without a single GOP vote -- that took real courage.

But it was also a major factor in the GOP takeover in 1994 -- Clinton's promise not to raise taxes while he was running for president helped set the stage for the demonization of the Democrats.

by ck on Fri May 06, 2005 at 07:04:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Correction (none / 0)

Clinton and the Democratic Congress raised taxes without a single GOP vote

Right, so let the Republicans raid Social Security without a single Democratic vote, know what I mean?  Does anyone believe that the GOP will be attacking the Democrats for not moving to privatize SS in '06 campaigns?

by Jerome Armstrong on Fri May 06, 2005 at 08:13:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You're right... (none / 0)

Constructive criticism will never get this party anywhere.  We should just continue with same routine that we've had since the mid-80's.  Having comprehensive, defensible positions on issues will never win elections.  That's why President Kerry was so eloquently murky in regards to the War in Iraq.  
by Fugee BoBfUn on Fri May 06, 2005 at 06:24:58 PM EST

Re: You're right... (none / 0)

Do you think the Republican Party of the 00's represents the same GOP of the 80's?  If they've changed, so should we; in fact we must, but instead, we keep on getting these majority-minded 'leaders' that think they are in the position to affect policy.
by Jerome Armstrong on Fri May 06, 2005 at 06:35:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I was being sarcastic, by the way. (none / 0)

My point was that we've had about 20 years of losing elections because we've run out of ideas.  What's wrong with offering a superior plan to fix Social Security and then letting the GOP vote it down?  We have spent the last 20 years being the party of "no" without offering viable alternatives.  Do you think that the Republicans have slight majorities in Congress and a President who was twice elected by the slimmest of all possible EC majorities because the American people agree with them on most issues?  Or is it because they've successful framed themselves as the party of the future and taken up the reform mantra?  We can't continue to run with the slogan "We're not them" and expect to win.  That was the problem with the "Anybody but Bush" movement.  How are we supposed to attract anyone except Bush-haters if we care more about stopping the Republican agenda than we care about promoting our own?  We have 45 Senators and 203 Representatives in our caucus and they are obligated to do more than wait for a majority to fall into their hands.  
by Fugee BoBfUn on Fri May 06, 2005 at 06:47:57 PM EST

Re: I was being sarcastic, by the way. (none / 0)

What's wrong is that we are basically giving them an easy out. Do you think any of the Democratic plans don't involve raising taxes?
by Jerome Armstrong on Fri May 06, 2005 at 06:50:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Is that you Newt? (none / 0)

/ We have spent the last 20 years being the party of "no" without offering viable alternatives.

The party of No since 1985? Are you done being sarcastic yet or you just an idiot?

/What's wrong with offering a superior plan to fix Social Security and then letting the GOP vote it down?

Here a four things wrong with offering any plan at all:

(1.) Bill Clinton has just single handedly salvaged Bush's 60 day disaster campaigning to kill Social Security. Bush can get up in front of the whole nation and say "See? I was right. There is a Social Security crisis."

(2.) Republican accusations that Democrats are obstructionists have just been legitimized.

(3.) The slight chance that the Blair-Bush Iraq memo would make either the Sunday Funny Shows or the MSM is now dead. The only topic on the Sunday Funny Shows will be Bill Clinton agreeing with Bush that there is a crisis and we have to fix it this year.

(4.) Democrats are going to get their butts kicked on Social Security this weekend and from here on out. They were already doing bad enough as it is.

Instead of throwing Bush an anvil, Clinton just threw him a life preserver. Let me add reason number five:

(5.) No matter what plan Hillary or anybody else comes up with, it will give Bush and Bill Thomas momentum for their version of "saving" Social Security. Any plan conceeds the argument that something has to be done this year. Clinton has just provided bipartisan cover to any Republican that Bush can peel away from the Conscience Caucus.

How are we supposed to attract anyone except Bush-haters if we care more about stopping the Republican agenda than we care about promoting our own?  We have 45 Senators and 203 Representatives in our caucus and they are obligated to do more than wait for a majority to fall into their hands.

A positive agenda for 2006 does not require surrender on defense of Social Security. There are all kinds of agendas and plans and ideas that do not require a plan to "fix" Social Security.

Bill Clinton is as much of an idiot and Bush sock puppet as Joe Lieberman.

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 06, 2005 at 11:09:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I Hope Hillary Follows Bill's Advice (none / 0)

Since I think Hillaary's nomination would be as bad for the Party as Bill's presidency was, I hope Hillary follows Bill's advice on social security.  Since she is trying to "tack" to the middle, she will have to come out with some sort of benefit cuts, which will hurt her in '08.

I think she us too smart for that.  I dont think she will have any plan at all.  Which makes me wonder, "what the hell was he thinking??"

Andy Katz
by Andy Katz on Sat May 07, 2005 at 02:33:59 PM EST

Email Hillary (none / 0)

Yeah, good luck with that.
I find her responses to communications less than forthright.
Let us know what you get back (if anything).
by brhodes on Sat May 28, 2005 at 10:49:49 PM EST


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