Nazi Comparisons Are an OUTRAGE . . . sometimes

From the diaries, lightly edited--Chris

I got this idea somewhere on a blog last night, but haven't been able to find it.  The idea is to look at those who were most exercised about the fake controversy over the MoveOn Nazi ads to see how quickly they take Santorum to the woodshed over his Hitler-in-Paris meltdown yesterday.

Let me say at the outset that I for one despise Nazi comparisons.  I am not amused when Janine Garafalo mentions the 43rd Reich, I cringe when I see Nazi spew in the comments here, I say "Ecch" to all of it.  Such comparisons are the stuff of college dorm door decoration, not reasoned debate.  

Anyway.

I googled "MoveOn Nazi" and picked the top three reliably conservative publications that showed up in the search results.  Then I looked at the current pages of those publications to see their takes on the Santorum statement.  The results after the break.

First up, Tammy Bruce, FrontPage Magazine.  She beautifully breaks down the fundamental problem with comparing Hitler to modern-day American pols:

Upon seeing the ad, one has to ask, do they really believe this garbage? Are they so ill that they really think this, or are they so ill that they don't believe it but are willing to subject this nation to the accusation? Either way you look at it, it is beyond the pale, to say nothing of obscenely absurd.

Hitler's Third Reich was a nation that invaded nations to enslave them and murdered tens millions of people worldwide. 12 million people died in the Nazi death camps. Ultimately, 61 million lives were lost because of Adolf Hitler's Jew-hatred and desire for world conquest.

No, she did not acknowledge that MoveOn had disavowed the ads, but is that really important?  What is important is the core principle that there is nothing worse in political discourse than comparing your opponent to Nazi's.

TODAY:  Tammy Bruce hasn't placed anything in FrontPage in a while.  FrontPage's, well, front page says nothing about Santorum.

Ms. Bruce's own website  doesn't have much in the way of news generally.  It does have - I am not making this up - a still from Mars Attacks of a Martian firing a ray gun with the caption "This is why we need the Minutemen" and a link.

So the final score from the FrontPage/Tammy Bruce survey:

Comparing Bush to Hitler:  BAD

Comparing poor Mexicans illegally crossing for jobs to evil Martians killing people:  GOOD

Comparing Democrats to Nazis:  Not worth mentioning.

Next up, Byron York, NRO.  He at least acknowleged that MoveOn tried to distance itself from the ads, but he wasn't having it.  He instead cited Nazi comparisons from a number of non-MoveOn leftists, then argued:

In light of those examples, it seems reasonable to argue that the themes explored in the two Bush-is-a-Nazi ads submitted to the MoveOn contest are a fair representation of the MoveOn view of George W. Bush.

Bryon's current take on Santorum:  crickets  NRO's coverage, to coin a phrase, ditto.

Next hit, Drudge Report.  Now we're really getting somewhere.  The first two are columnists who might take a few hours to really get after Santorum.  Maybe they just haven't posted yet.  But of course Drudge is always about the BREAKING NEWS, so surely he will cover it.

Drudge's original report quoted Jack Rosen of the  American Jewish Congress at length:

Comparing the commander-in-chief of a democratic nation to the murderous tyrant Hitler is not only historically specious, it is morally outrageous. Comparing an American president, any American president, to Hitler is an outrage.

Powerful stuff.

New Drudge says . . . nada.  But for useful comparison, they do feature at unflattering headline about of a new MoveOn ad that shows Bill Frist blowing up the capital.  A cynic might think that Drudge is more offended by the existence of MoveOn than by anything they actually say.

Perhaps someone, somewhere on the Right will acknowledge the inconsistency and take Santorum to task.  I had hopes for Andrew Sullivan, but nothing so far.  But we can pretty much count on those who showed the most outrage over l'affaire MoveOn to remain silent.


Display:


Prescott Bush, the President's grandfather (none / 0)

Was a financier of the Nazis.. and he also helped launder nazi money after the war.. Until 1951..

Do a search on his name..

Also, the US government has supported many Nazi-like fascist regimes around the world - Fascism is actually the most common form of government.. rule by the strong, worship of power, contempt for the poor and weak..

We don't want to face this reality, because its a highly disturbing one.. but there is a lot of fascism here.. and its getting worse, quickly..

by ultraworld on Fri May 20, 2005 at 12:56:18 PM EST

URLs (none / 0)

http://www.guardian.co.uk/usa/story/0,12271,1312540,00.html

http://www.btinternet.com/~nlpwessex/Documents/bushhitlerprojecthtm.htm

by ultraworld on Fri May 20, 2005 at 01:00:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: URLs (none / 0)

also:

http://www.john-loftus.com/bush_nazi_scandal.asp

http://www.tarpley.net/bush2.htm (and the rest of the book on GWBs father there)

http://www.nhgazette.com/cgi-bin/NHGstore.cgi?user_action=detail&catalogno=NN_Bush_Nazi_2

by ultraworld on Fri May 20, 2005 at 01:05:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: URLs (none / 0)

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/printFriendly/0,,1-3-1109528,00.html

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/1018-01.htm

Please read up a bit about fascism and you'll see, its not dead, its very much alive..

It's seductive to a ruling elite who are worried about maintaining power, but it always leads to a horribly destructive situation.. It needs to move forward - to avoid collapsing under its own lies, and it does this by maintaining a state of terror...through murder..

This leads to the worst kinds of evil humanity has ever known...

by ultraworld on Fri May 20, 2005 at 01:10:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

MUST READ BOOK... (none / 0)

Read Hannah Arendt's 'The Origins of Totalitarianism' - it explains SO much about how totalitarian regimes work that it is a must read for all of us now.. to avoid making the same mistakes that were made in the past..

People are trying to spin this book as being only about the situation in the 50s, or only about anti-Semitism.. they are wrong.. or lying, its very relevant and very illuminating.. especially about how totalitarian movements gain power and control..

...there is nothing else out there like it....

by ultraworld on Fri May 20, 2005 at 01:14:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Nazism then and now (none / 0)

In the early 1930s, Jews living in Germany were mostly assimilated, just as Jews in the USA are today.  We think of ourselves as Americans, or maybe Jewish Americans or American Jews; they thought of themselves as Germans, or German Jews.

When Hitler came to power, things started happening.  Little by little, incrementally, rights were eroded.  With each step, people thought, Okay, this is bad, but how far could it go?  Never in a million years did they imagine how far it would go.

Today in the USA, as a Jew, and even more as a gay person, I think, this is bad.  And I'm truly afraid to imagine how far it will go.

The comparison of Bush to Hitler is not inappropriate.  It is very real.

by nocloset on Fri May 20, 2005 at 01:54:49 PM EST

Digby has a great analysis (none / 0)

Digby compares how Sen. Byrd used the reference to Hitler and how Santorum used the reference to Hitler, [Ricky in Paris:

Santorum, of course, is speaking out of his ass. Norm Ornstein has definitively written about this. The Republicans are breaking the rules.

To make this happen, the Senate will have to get around the clear rules and precedents, set and regularly reaffirmed over 200 years, that allow debate on questions of constitutional interpretation-debate which itself can be filibustered. It will have to do this in a peremptory fashion, ignoring or overruling the Parliamentarian. And it will establish, beyond question, a new precedent. Namely, that whatever the Senate rules say-regardless of the view held since the Senate's beginnings that it is a continuing body with continuing rules and precedents-they can be ignored or reversed at any given moment on the whim of the current majority.

Santorum is full of shit and everybody but the theocrats and the press knows it. Even Ricky. His analogy is wrong. The correct analogy to this situation would be if the French said to Hitler, "We have a treaty, you can't bomb our cities. You can't invade Paris!" Which they did. And he invaded anyway. I think you can figure out who represents the French and who represents Hitler in our little senate passion play.

And that brings us to Byrd:

But witness how men with motives and a majority can manipulate law to cruel and unjust ends. Historian Alan Bullock writes that Hitler's dictatorship rested on the constitutional foundation of a single law, the Enabling Law. Hitler needed a two-thirds vote to pass that law, and he cajoled his opposition in the Reichstag to support it. Bullock writes that "Hitler was prepared to promise anything to get his bill through, with the appearances of legality preserved intact." And he succeeded.

"Hitler's originality lay in his realization that effective revolutions, in modern conditions, are carried out with, and not against, the power of the State: the correct order of events was first to secure access to that power and then begin his revolution. Hitler never abandoned the cloak of legality; he recognized the enormous psychological value of having the law on his side. Instead, he turned the law inside out and made illegality legal."

And that is what the nuclear option seeks to do to Rule XXII of the Standing Rules of the Senate.

Digby's summary:

That is correct. Hitler didn't defy the rules or the law. That's one of the hallmarks of the totalitarian state. They always operate within the law. They just make sure the law confers upon them absolute power, that's all.

So, we have both Byrd and Santorum making references to Hitler as regards this rules change. One is barely comprehensible and posits an absurd analogy to Democrats being Hitler in Paris. The other quite astutely points out that these arbitrary rules changes to advance the power of one party are not without precedent. Indeed, Hitler was a master at it.

I suppose that Hitler references are always going to cause a stir. But, aside from the sheer glory of Byrd's rhetoric compared to Santorum's incomprehensible blubbering, there is a serious point to be made. When one party is acting in ways that seriously draw the comparison, maybe it's fair to look at the substance of the charge. The fact is that while this rule change may not be the end of the world, it is another in a long line of pure power plays on the part of the Republicans who show no signs of having any limits. I know it's not nice to bring up the H-word, but if the shoe fits...


by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 20, 2005 at 02:31:08 PM EST

Semi Busted Link (none / 0)


Ricky in Paris.

by Gary Boatwright on Fri May 20, 2005 at 02:32:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The Diarist needs to (none / 0)

reflect on what a fascist personality is, and then look at which party such personality types are supporting. It sure as hell ain't the democrats! I'll give you one more guess...
by Paul Goodman on Sat May 21, 2005 at 10:14:34 AM EST


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