I'm tired of electable candidates.  I want a reform candidate.

Peace

Maybe I'll change my mind in three years, but for now I'd say Clinton is a really really bad choice.  It thumbs its nose at the energy of the new reformers in the party from left and center and it sweeps aside the old perception of the party as being a coalition of liberal groups with a grass roots process for coming up with a candidate.  Trickle down politics is what we want to get rid of, don't we?

The poll comes from Fox which would love to alienate Dems from their party because they get the feeling that the DNC/DLC are going to lay a candidate on them.

She is too polarizing to win in 2008.  See my replies on the ringmaster's diary.

I will not campaign for HRC if she gets the nomination.

I'm not so sure how the public would view Bill back at the White House with time on his hands, but Hillary could lose big if it looks like another 4 year soap opera is in the making.

Hillary is very smart and articulate. However, she is not the best candidate -- too much baggage to drag along. She is not the charmer that Bill is and will not be able to magically just make that baggage invisible.

The DNC should be looking for a Governor with a good record on economic issues. In 2008 the economy is likely to be the big issue. Get him/her a running mate with a strong foreign policy and military record. And don't hide the running mate in the closet like Kerry did with Edwards.

Finally, don't discount Howard Dean or John Edwards. Both may come back to surprise. There base is larger than most suspect.

I would vote for her before i would Lieberman,etc. but would find it hard to vote for her if she was running against McCain.

Oh and McCain or Giulani will never get the nomination.

I'm holding out for Dean, Gore, or Feingold in '08.

Her political recovery has taken place in the dusty halls of the establishment.  Unless she shows real courage and independence (and I won't hold my breath), I think her candidacy could split the party.  A break might be a good thing but it would take years to recover from, don't you think?

As an educated, assertive, (and occasionally tactless) woman from NYC, Hillary would energize the Republican base. As the epitome of a DLC Democrat, she would do little for the Democratic base. The GOP would have a field day with her. Remember, that the right-wing attack machine was able to defeat a popular universal health care plan by calling it "Hillarycare" and using other ad hominem and ad feminam attacks against Hillary Clinton while refusing to debate the merits of the plan.

Getting "tough on immigration" may get us a few votes in the South (but not enough for Hillary to overcome her image), but it will cost us in the long run.  Bush is taking heat from his conservative base for his guest-worker program, but he knows where the future electoral votes are.  They're in the Southwest and Florida.  Bush is making sure to appoint Latinos to office and to work on the Republican image with Latinos.  And it's working.  Hillary is playing into his hands.

I never really cared much for Hillary (I'd support her against a rank and file conservative like Frist though).  She's a little too authoritarian for my tastes (national I.D. card???)  I hope to god a strong challenger shows up in the Democrat Primaries.

I know guys are quick to say no to Hilary and much more open to giving another guy like Kerry a try but I tell ya, I can't get excited about anyone other than Hilary and Barack Obama because both of them are genuine, hardworking, smart, and have a real and intriguing story to tell the american people.

Also, if guilani or McCain run, we actually may see some right wing independent candidates which will split off and run. This will create more of a Bush/clinton/Perot type situation.

What concerns me is that Hillary Clinton, who
does have 100% name recognition (or very close)
is in the low 40's against all opponents.

Absolutely not
Difficult to imagine
would consider
yes

The only people saying she wants to run for president are the Republicans and that's because every time they bring up the subject the donations go into overdrive.

Who did that poll, Fox?  Yeah, that fits.

1. She is a liberal with a capital L. There is no way she would be able to compete in the red states where I live

2. She is a senator and senators do not win

I think Dean can reverse this trend, if he will
stop pretending to be a Democrat and if he
will start 3rd party, fighting for majority
of the people (not just a middle class).

That being said, McCain still scares the crap out of me.  I think we need to counter than by making sure Hillary is not our nominee-instead, I hope we go with Wes Clark.

Part of the Democratic party's problem IMHO is the reluctance to embrace its real star personalities with any real fervour.  It's more sophisticated to criticize arcane policy details than to just BELIEVE in someone.  It's the same mindset that leads people to look down their noses on the Red-staters and conclude they must just be dumb.  Well, a fat lot of good that's going to do - there's an election coming round in 2008 whether you like it or not. Winston Churchill once said that democracy is the worst system of government in the world - except all the others.  The truth is you have to live with the voters you've got (to paraphrase Rumsefeld).  

The GOP absolutely LOVE hero-worship - hey, they even hero-worship an incompetent rich-boy monkey !  The cult of personality is hugely significant and makes an enormous impression on all those undecideds who we spend so much time fretting about. When will people wake up to the fact that the Presidential election is not about plans or records - it's a popularity contest plain and simple.  HRC is a star, would inspire millions, and I think would win with something to spare.  You all moan about the GOP candidates - can't you see that you have a winner right there in front of you !  Go Hillary !

On Hillary: I love the comment above that her edge now, far from placing her in a favorable position vis a vis Frist and the rest, means that she'd actually get killed. She has an incredible advantage on name recognition. She had better be up at this stage.

HRC has the unique quality that she fires up their base without firing up ours. The right knows her as a mindless New Deal, tax and spend liberal--and a bitch at that (their words, not mine--I'd love a female president); the left knows she's now moved to the center and thinks of her as a "DLC-whole" (their words, not mine--I happen to be a big fan of the DLC). Plus, if you're looking at a map of Kerry's loss, where exactly do you think Hillary is going to make gains? Another New England liberal elite, not just efete but actually a woman--she'll get swept in the South and Mississippi valley. She's got that huge, failed, big-gov't heathcare reform thing hanging around her neck and looks as if she's never gone outside in her life--won't win a bit of the West.

So what do we have to fear? Who can Edwards/Bayh/Dean/Richardson/Liebermann/Webb/Warner beat and who would beat us?

Pataki would lose. Spitzer will probably take him down in the '06 gubernatorial race anyway.

Arnold can't run. Or at least he won't be able to by '08. Maybe '12. Plus he'd never make it through a primary.

McCain and Giuliani won't get through a GOP primary, though if they did, either would beat our guy badly. Upside of that is that maybe the religious right goes crazy and puts up a third party candidate: the party would split, we get the satisfaction of watching gay rights bite Rove in the ass, and the Dems walk in presidential elections for a generation.

Frist may well have the wholehearted backing of Bush and Rove, which would be bad, but I kinda like our chances against a Southerner ultra-conservative without Bush's war credentials.

Bill Owens (Gov. of CO) is getting a divorce. Not the best time to be running for Pres.

Rick Santorum: here's the guy I worry about. He's a ruthless son of a bitch, conservative as hell, wants to run, and could be just the kind of guy who could breeze through the Rep. primary, beat us and then be like a third term of Bush. Which is why I say let's beat the shit out of him in his '06 Senate race before he can get any momentum. Anybody want to go to PA?

The real problem will be when Bush and Rove get serious about backing one particular candidate. They will. They're going to want some group of folks owing them favors. I think it'll be Frist, but we'll see. Could they shove through a Giuliani candidacy, with Bush assuring the religious right that this guy will fight for their values? Maybe. Save up those Kerik stories.

Hillary would be a terrible candidate. These numbers are truly anemic. A significant majority of the country at least 53-55% does not want her to be president of the united states regardless of her beliefs.

Republicans want to get off the issues and get onto personality. Every election they try and blur the lines between many of our popular democratic economic policies, attack our softness on terrorism, and attack our moral bankruptcy. The flipflop charge and the swiftboat attacks were not about the issues, but about character. Hillary would invite character attacks all day long.

Lets stay away from abortion and gun rights, go with a mainstream reform and populist/DLC democrat from a red state and try and win. Mark Warner, Bill Richardson, John Edwards, Evan Bayh, and even Al Gore would be much better candidates. Fox wants to push Hillarys candidacy, because she would be a disaster for the democratic party. Lets actually try and win a majority of the nation rather than sneaking away with winning 70,000 votes in Ohio.