MyDD :: DNC Rumbles

DNC Rumbles

by Jerome Armstrong, Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 11:00:29 AM EST

The "New Favorite" in DC (email from The Hill):

Simon Rosenberg, who currently heads the New Democrat Network, is becoming the favorite to become the next chairman of the DNC. But the former Clintonite also has a strong following among "outside" Democrats--activists who came to the party via former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean and other Internet voters who read the blogs. Rosenberg's straight talk about what the party needs to do has been remarkably consistent and his 527's effort to win Hispanic voters was more successful than expected. Also in his favor: He's a tireless fundraiser.

A much better switch than I expected.

The Hill, last Thursday they had an article that was moslty about Dean, cons and pros. Rep. Robert Matsui (D-CA), the DCCC's chair, resposible for losing ~4 Democratic seats this cycle in the House, said "We need someone who is part of the Democratic establishment.... I frankly think we should look to someone like Tom Vilsack."

Matsui was joined by Stuart Roy, a spokesman for House Majority Leader Tom DeLay (R-Texas), in opposition to Dean: "The only thing better than having Howard Dean as DNC chair is Nancy Pelosi as minority leader. They have their bases covered from San Francisco to Burlington. YEAAAHHH."

Rep. Zoe Lofgren (Calif.) and Rep. Neil Abercrombie (Hawaii) came out strongly for Dean, who is more openly campaigning for the position now:

Dean's supporters, however, said that his grassroots fundraising prowess was unrivaled. "Governor Vilsack is an admirable person, but he is currently running the state of Iowa," Rep. Zoe Lofgren (Calif.) said. "Dean is ready right now. I have told Governor Dean that I think he would be terrific. He has the experience of running a state. He has the capacity to keep involved the young people. He has shown that he is a prolific fundraiser. He has the time to do it," she added.

Zoe is right. It's hard to believe that members of the DNC (who mostly live outside of DC) are going to put the DNC into a deep freeze for the next couple of years by electing someone like Vilsack. But maybe Kerry's & the establishment are gaining on the realization that Vilsack would be a disaster as DNC Chair.

We can't just hope they make the right choice of reform over establishment, we must lobby for the change. So we are moving forward with a grassroots campaign for Howard Dean as the DNC Chair. The DraftHoward.com site is going to be the center of the netroots/grassroots effort, so sign up there to get involved.

Tags: Democrats (all tags)

Permalink :: 41 Comments :: Post a Comment

If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

I think the DNC needs to appreciate the level of dissatisfaction within the party. To that end, I think it should be made quite clear that if Dean isn't made DNC chair, he will switch to the Greens and take his followers with him. As a traditional, liberal Democrat, even if Dean doesn't endorse it, I am still heading Green if he isn't chair.

This DNC Chairmanship is about the soul of the Democratic Party. Either we are pro-business, free-trade, pro-military, and against social welfare, or we are the party of the disadvantaged, the workers, the minorities. We are either DLC psuedo-Dems or traditional liberal Democrats. I am a traditional liberal Democrat, but I place my values over my party label. If the Dems are ashamed or afraid to speak for the values I believe in, I will move to the Green party. The only thing left for me is faith; that the likes of Dean, Obama, Feingold, and Kucinich still represent most Democrats, and that eventually they will gain ascendency within the Party. The Chair is my last stand.

by spectator consumer on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 11:47:55 AM EST

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

I disagree: the Green Party has it's own agenda. However, would it makes sense to turn DFA into a new political party?

by Nanovirus on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:02:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

This is from politics1.com
Democratic Party (DNC) - After the 2002 elections, Democrats control several key governorships (including PA, MI, IL, VA, NJ, NC and WA) and many state legislatures -- but lost control of the US House in 1994, narrowly lost control of the US Senate again in 2002 (but they still hold enough seats to block much legislation), and lost control of the White House in the 2000 elections. While prominent Democrats run the wide gamut from the near democratic-socialist left (Barbara Lee, Dennis Kucinich and the Congressional Progressive Caucus) and traditional liberals (Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi and John Kerry) to the center-right (Joe Lieberman, the Congressional Blue Dog Coalition and the New Democrat Network) to the GOP-style conservative right (Charlie Stenholm and Gene Taylor), most fall somewhere into the pragmatic Democratic Leadership Council's "centrist" moderate-to-liberal style (Howard Dean, Dick Gephardt, Tom Daschle). The official DNC web site offers party news, hearing information, platform positions, links and more.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 01:29:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

Dean is actually a centrist but his campaign rhetoric caused him to be labeled a far-left liberal.

Why is the far left threatening to leave the party if he isn't chair? That's the part I don't understand. I'm not a fan of Terry McAullife but I haven't left.

Zell Miller is a traitor. Would I leave if he thought about the chairmanship? I don't know. I'm in the DLC. Don't call me a psuedo-Dem. I can't win in my red state unless I am a moderate.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:04:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (3.00 / 1)

I don't agree that the critical divide here is left vs. center, or progressive vs. conservative, or any such phrase. I think the key is: activist vs. accommodationist. This theme has reverberated around this blog site and others (especially dKos, I think). We all want a party that stops genuflecting to Republican muscle, but instead stands up for what it stands for. Especially with so many of the previous Dixiecrats gone, I think there's plenty that all (remaining) Democrats agree on (even if there are some things we don't all agree on). What we need is to fight for those things and stop caving. It is because Dean stood up to Republican bullying that he was cast by our mainstream (read: right-wing) media as a "radical." His agenda was never leftist, but was definitely activist. And that's what we need.

by Omark on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:18:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

As labels go, none are exact, and I think we limit ourselves if are fixated on any one convention. I think your activist-accommdationist dichotomy is useful and innovative. I still believe liberal-moderate paradigm has it's place as far as helping explain what's the matter, but yours is quite helpful as well.

We ought to consider your idea more fully, elaborate on it and compare it to the lib-mod view.

Great post.

by spectator consumer on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:36:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

Compared to the ADA, i disagree with them on crime but the only dems to win statewide in KY are moderates. even with the looming tide in the "New South," my friend Jonathan Miller was re-elected.

I hate being labeled and would just like to be a Democrat but we have a growing number of Conservative Democrats in KY. Unless I'm a moderate, I am unable to get elected.

Adam Smith ran in KY2, was DFA-endorsed, and still got clobbered. This was in a district that for 40 years was held by a Dem, now it's been GOP for 10 years. The seat is held by a guy who pledge 3 terms and would be finished. He just got re-elected to a 5th or 6th term.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:55:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

Yes - exactly!

by anaxamander on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 03:24:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

I thought I my post explained why I would move parties: No matter if you call it centrist, moderate, or new Democrat, it all equals pro-free trade/anti-worker, anti-social welfare spending, pro-militarism. Those issues are 100% in opposition to what I stand for. I want the Party to return back to it's traditional base, period.

Maybe the question should be, why should traditional liberal Democrats stay? Why should I stay a Democrat if the Party has changed what it stands for in the big picture, and on the practical level has lost the House for a decade and now faces a Republican Senate for the foreseeable future? If after this much losing, and more importantly, the trend, if after all this the Party still wants to promote the pro-business, pro-faith GOP-lite line...well they can do it without me.

I reiterate, this is the chance for the party to get back in shape. I believe we are nearly fatally flawed at the moment, and I think the situation demands we lay our cards on the table. We need major reformation of the Party. I fully expect this will get even more bitter and devisive, but it can't be helped. The present leadership are sellouts who are more concerned about winning and maintaining power than they are about advancing the agenda of Democrats. They need to go. If it takes a schism, so be it.

by spectator consumer on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:23:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

I don't know that Dean should go to or start another party. Third party movements have not fared too well in the past century and, even if we could buck the last century's trends, do we have the time for such a party to reach its full potential?

I do however believe that Dean should not try to be head of DNC. I think he needs to be in the party but not of the party (or is it the other way around). I think he should build his base and criticize the party from that base. I wish I could believe that the party could be reformed from within the establishment, but it seems not - especially with the news that Kerry's campaign people rejected the Dean approach to building the base. Too many vested interests, too much ego.

by problematical on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 01:05:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

You sound like an officeholder, KYDem. (If so, good for you!) I'd be interested to know what office you hold.

At any rate, I understand Democrats can't win in KY unless they're pretty moderate; but that doesn't mean the whole Democratic party should move in that direction! New England Republicans have to be moderate too, but that hasn't resulted in the GOP feeling any desire whatsoever to "move to the center."

If you're always playing the fear card, it's a pretty good sign you're not playing with a full deck!

by Mathwiz on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 04:09:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: If Dean doesn't win, he should move Green (none / 0)

I am truly flattered by that. I have yet to hold office yet unless you count my youth group. I'm only 20! I have worked a few campaigns.

Well, look at the state of the nation. It's clear that it is growing conservative and that the moderate republicans will join with the Democrats. I can't think of anyone else that can pick up the southern electoral votes.

Evan Bayh, Mark Warner, and Phil Bredesen are all popular. Bayh is the safest bet to get elected. I see Warner or Bredesen as the VP though.

I still wonder how Mitt Romney got elected.

Have a safe, healthy, and a happy Thanksgiving.
The KY Democrat
http://kydem.blogspot.com

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Tue Nov 23, 2004 at 02:14:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Matsui (none / 0)

Matsui (D-CA)

by Newt on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 11:48:54 AM EST

Simon Rosenberg (none / 0)

Simon is the guy we need.

Check out my new blog: http://kydem.blogspot.com

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:00:21 PM EST

Jesse Jackson Jr. (none / 0)

Go see www.liberaloasis.com for the following:

QUICK HIT

How 'Bout This Guy For DNC Chair?

Here's Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr. on CNN's Late Edition:

Democrats need to focus on two areas: message and organization.

We must take the time to create and articulate guiding principles that withstand the test of time.

And not just see this process as every two years and then four years and six-year election cycles.

...[Dems are] going to have to develop not just a quarterback...

We're going to have to build a winning team that includes a lot of players on the bench and a lot of races throughout the South, throughout the Western states, throughout the Midwestern states, in order to be effective...

...And we can take a play right out of the Republicans' notebook...

...Why don't Democrats fight for education of equal high quality and health care as state-ballot initiatives at the local level?

by mysteve on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:23:27 PM EST

Re: Jesse Jackson Jr. (none / 0)

Sounds reasonable, but mod Dems will balk at his name...they worship at the alter of FoxNews and don't want to pick a controversial person. As someone said, Dean isn't as anti-business/pro-worker as I would like...if he is too far left for the DNC, the DNC is too far right for me.
With that said, if somehow gets in the mix, I'll have to seriously consider him. He's certainly better than the middle of the road, human pylons the moderates are advancing.

by spectator consumer on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:30:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

What do we need? (none / 0)

I have been thinking about the Dem/Green combo...at first thought many will reject right off. Esp. the old power from the NE, however, they need progressives and are beginning to realize they are only good at loosing.
The Greens need the Dems, and the Dems need the Greens. Having Cobb request the recount in Ohio was a great PR move for UNITY. We have to have a merger or unifed front to beat the right. The powers that be in both groups really need to start a conversation that will emphasize the ideas we share rather than highlight the differences.
Just hearing one person say (here)that he is heading back to the Green Party is a indication of the discomfort many feel...this is an opportunity for folks like Dean and Rosengerg to show their stuff.
I really like the combo ticket, new and powerful.I vote for DEAN/ROSENBERG!!

by lja on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:25:05 PM EST

Re: What do we need? (none / 0)

my only beef with the green-dems combo: Ralph Nader. I cannot stand Nader. For someone who is Jewish, I cannot tolerate his Anti-Zionist views.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:59:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Texas Delegation - voting pattern (none / 0)

I talked to Sue Lovell, who's a member of the DNC from Houston. She said that the Texas delegation hadn't made up it's mind on who to support, and that the whole delegation to the DNC from Texas votes as a block to give weight to the state.

Charles Soechting is our state chair and a member of the DNC, so he seems like the key to the puzzle for the Texas votes.

He supported Edwards in the primary, but was outspoken during the election about Texas dollars going out of state for political funding.

I think the key to lobbying him is to say Dean is the only candidate who actually brought money into the state, for the DFA endorsements.

by Eric in Texas on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:48:42 PM EST

Rosenberg is fine (none / 0)

Dean would be great, but Rosenberg is reform-minded too, and perhaps more practical. I'm also warming to the idea of Dean for pres in 2008, depending on how the next couple years go...

by fwiffo on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:55:51 PM EST

Re: Rosenberg is fine (none / 0)

Rosenberg slammed Kerry for not having gone after the Hispanic votes.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 01:00:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Rosenberg is fine (none / 0)

Rosenberg is right...but democrats need total re-evaluation of positions and goals and how to achieve them in a demographic and philosphical way that is trenchant, and relates to the current divide in America. Party is loaded with poor leadership,hackish political hangers on, and a corrupt group pf kingmeisters who can't meister. They just keep getting paid huge amounts of money to lose. Dems need discipline,cleansweep in leadership, and a real understanding of how to become more inclusive in ways that Red and Blue states can understand. Democrats still haven't really figured out what exactly fatored into their loss. Self criticism and change are not an option. Rebuild.recommunicate,rebrand,rethink, and reachout!!...FAST!!

by morris1030 on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 04:02:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Rosenberg is fine (none / 0)

Agreed.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Thu Dec 02, 2004 at 11:18:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Dean is the only answer (3.00 / 1)

I'm a Dem moderate who loved KE04 and even I realize the need for a strong distinction between this current brand of republican conservatism and Democrat values. Look, the republicans make no qualms about being "out there." They figure people like you and me aren't gonna vote for them anyway so up ours. We should plot a similar course and embrace our liberal heritage and turn around and sell it to the people. we need to beat them at their own game. It won't be easy but it needs to be done.

We can no longer afford to be Republican Lite because even Dem moderates are painted as lunatics merely because of the (D) after their name. The short of it is, Dean is the perfect fit for us at this moment in history. He brings a zeal and the organization. The youngins and the greens are excited by him and that is important. Finally, don't fret what the republicans will say. My word, it is their job to tear down whomever is nominated. We aren't children looking for approval from an abusive parent. We are a proud and strong coalition of adults with a world to save and an agenda to carry it out. Let's start acting like it.

by JerrySacramento on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 12:57:42 PM EST

Re: Dean is the only answer (none / 0)

Couldn't agree more. I like how you pointed out that no matter where on the political spectrum a Democrat really IS, the right will paint him/her as a radical socialist. Basically, the republicans have a schtick, and it has worked so well, Democrats have changed themselves to try to avoid the criticisms. The problem as you point out is that the GOP smear is just a smear. You might in fact be a commie, or a pro-business, tough on crime, free-trader like Kerry...still a wacko liberal by Rush's standards. As you say, we spend our time trying to craft our message to win votes when we need to just advocate our Democratic principles. We have to be willing to lose occasionally too...things go through cycles. If you consider the tax rates Reagan cut, it really wasn't that crazy. Now, on the other hand, you have the nutballs like grover norquist in vogue. The country will swing back to the Dems provided we arent bad copies of the right, which seems to be the DLC idea.

The moderate strategy has run it's course, I wish it would have worked, but it didn't.

by spectator consumer on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 01:45:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Dean is the only answer (none / 0)

-snip- no matter where on the political spectrum a Democrat really IS, the right will paint him/her as a radical socialist.

no matter where on the political spectrum a Democrat really IS, the right will paint him/her as a radical socialist.

Ultra right wingers are calling moderate Republicans liberal. Excuse me? Liberal? I've known a liberal or two, and they ain't no liberals!

by sarany on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 01:53:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

oops (none / 0)

oops, screwed up on the quoting...

by sarany on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 01:54:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

here's a silly question (none / 0)

What exactly is the DLC chair responsible for? Is it to plot general Democratic election strategy, to be the chief fundraiser for the Dems, or both?

by dwbh on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 01:58:30 PM EST

Re: here's a silly question (none / 0)

I think you mean DNC, and the Chair of the DNC runs the party. What they do...well try to get Dems elected. Lots of debate over how you get that done.

The DLC is the Democratic Leadership Council. They are the pro-business Democrats...think Lieberman, think Clinton. The chair of the DLC works to infiltrate and undermine the central tenets of the tradiational Democratic base...workers, the poor etc. :) Okay maybe not, sometimes it just SEEMS that way.

by spectator consumer on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 02:13:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: here's a silly question (none / 0)

Obama is in the DLC. Salazar is also. Both Dem pickups are in the DLC.

Have a safe, healthy, and a happy Thanksgiving.
The KY Democrat
http://kydem.blogspot.com

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Tue Nov 23, 2004 at 02:15:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

DLC (3.00 / 1)

I honestly encourage you to visit: http://www.ndol.org/print.cfm?contentid=1926 and http://www.ndol.org/ndol_ci.cfm?kaid=86&subid=85&contentid=894

New Democrats are the modernizers of the progressive tradition in American politics. We believe in the traditional values that have always propelled the Democratic Party and we believe that the best way to further those values in a new era is to modernize our policies and programs to keep up with the changing times.

Our enduring purpose is equal opportunity for all, special privilege for none. Our public ethic is mutual responsibility. Our core value is community. Our outlook is global. And our modern means is an empowering government that equips people with the tools they need to get ahead.

New Democrat policies transcend the stale left-right debate and define a Third Way for governing based on progressive ideas, mainstream values, and innovative solutions that reflect changing times. New Democrat ideas that have become law include national service, work-based welfare reform, charter schools, community policing, an expanded earned-income tax credit, and market incentives for environmental protection.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 02:25:15 PM EST

Re: DLC (3.00 / 1)

My feelings about the failings of these DLC policies:

1. Welfare "reform"
-meaning DLC Dems will look to make cuts in welfare rather than fighting for expansion to help more of those in need. Especially anti-progressive when you consider the GOP already favors abolishing these kinds of program; why should Dems advance the same idea? Are you guys anti-social welfare spending? Or are you simply of the mind that we can't win backing welfare and willing to back "reform" in an attempt to win votes?

2. National Service
-I believe the gov't should work for the people not compel people to work for it.

3. Community Policing
-Democrats are the party of the of the oppressed and the disadvantaged, instead of working on MORE policing we need to work on ending the destructive war on drugs, which promotes violence, gangs, organized crime and ends up being used against minority populations.

4.Market Incentives for environmentalism-
Why give tax breaks to make corporations do the right thing. Considering how little we collect from corporations in tax receipts, we should look at imposing and stiffening fines and penalites.

5.Charter schools:
Anti-union ripoffs that use funds for normal public schools.

6.Earned income tax credit
The one idea you trumpet that strikes me as remotely progessive. I agree, EITCs are good.

by spectator consumer on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 02:52:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DLC (none / 0)

I'm with kydem on this. The DLC gets a bad rap because of the way From and Reed have handled some things publicly, but once you really get into what the DLC is all about ideologically, you begin to realize it's not the evil monstrosity everyone makes it out to be. I may not agree with everything they say, but it's still important to have them at the table.

That said, what the party really needs is a bottom-up rebranding not to dissimilar from what Labor went through in the nineties. I'd say the only difference would be that we're not nearly as extreme as Labor had been and our rebranding should be more image-based than ideological. (Oliver Willis' Brand Democrat idea is a good start.)

We are a party of liberals, progressives, and moderates. We don't need to kowtow to conservatives, but we do need to remind moderates why we are the better fit for them.

by Scott Shields on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 02:56:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DLC (none / 0)

I'm not so much opposed to their policies as I am to their unwillingness to stand up for those policies. The republicans fight in a scorched earth manner, and when we sit around being the "nice guys" who compliment them and offer to compromise for them, we just get used, stabbed in the back, and still called liberal for our troubles. Dean is a centrist. He's just a centrist with the strength to demand that centrist, and not radical right wing, policies prevail. And the DLCers have to get off of the corporate lobbyist money tit... it is seriously compromising their judgement.

Policy comment- I don't like Charter Schools as currently configured, I think they need much more oversight, but I can get behind alternative citizen run schools with oversight... a limited number... until they prove themselves. Last year's stats show charter school kids behind public school kids.

EITC is good policy.

Welfare reform is okay, but lifetime caps shouldn't exist and we have to, as a society, admit that we have some members who can't cut it and who don't have family to support them. Are we going to care for them or not? And, if not, then we need to be straight up about what that choice means - we're going to let them become/remain homeless, we are not going to treat their addictions or mental illnesses, we will give them health care in only the most dire emergencies, and we will imprison them and/or let them die young for lack of care.

I like national service, but I think we should either require it from all or get rid of it... it shouldn't be something that poor people have to do to get a decent education but rich people can avoid.

by anaxamander on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 03:22:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DLC (none / 0)

thanks for the feedback. I'm in the DLC myself.

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 03:24:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DLC (none / 0)

We are one party, lets not forget, and we all need to be play a little loosey-goosey with our ideology. The Third Way is viable only so far as we are able to craft a message behind it that DOESN'T make us sound like a watered down republican. Why buy diet when the real thing tastes so good? I'm not advocating a radical shift, I'm only re-iterating what most people here have said over and over again, let's get a positive message of who we are, where we come from and where we are going to lead this nation. We need to step outside of our comfort zone for real this time and invite some fresh ideas to the table. We can build on what the DLC has achieved for America.

by JerrySacramento on Mon Nov 22, 2004 at 03:21:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: DLC (none / 0)

Yes, we are one party...we need a clear message and not a crowded field in 2008.

We need a Dem in every race in the nation!

The Kentucky Democrat

by kydem on Thu Dec 02, 2004 at 11:15:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

I like simon (none / 0)

i think rosenberg would do an unbelievablely good job. i also like the idea of a two-headed dean/rosenberg deal

The Kohlman Observer: If you don't know you better ask somebody...or go to The Kohlman Observer